973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 11:04:30 GMT -5
So I was channel hopping last night and came across a new reality show about Abby and Brittany Hensel who are conjoined twins tlc.howstuffworks.com/tv/abby-and-brittany/videosOne of the things they talked about was they were applying for teaching jobs since they are graduating college with degrees in early education. They mentioned that they are applying for 1 position since they can be in two rooms but that they hoped to negotiate later for more money since they actually have two degrees and feel they can actually do more than one person. So what do you think? Would you pay them more than 1 salary? Discuss. ;D
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kindthatjingles
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Post by kindthatjingles on Aug 30, 2012 11:06:57 GMT -5
Do they have one Social Security number or two?
This is a tough one.. HTH would that work?
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frep
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Post by frep on Aug 30, 2012 11:10:45 GMT -5
I would not pay them more than 1 salary. How can they be "in two rooms"?
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ontrack
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Post by ontrack on Aug 30, 2012 11:33:44 GMT -5
I watched the previous 1 hour specials on them. It really is fascinating how they coordinate. Each controls 1 arm and 1 leg, and they coordinate enough to ride a bike, swim, etc. I'm sure they have 2 SS numbers, because they have two separate drivers licenses.
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frep
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Post by frep on Aug 30, 2012 11:33:50 GMT -5
Absolutely they deserve more then one salary. There are two people there. Sowhat they are in the same room. Unless they are doing piece work they are doing more work then one can.as teachers one can watch the progress of one or the class while the other does something else. I find all the comments about these women being a 'two headed woman' and comments like that ignorant. Who hard is it to understand the difference between two conjoined women and a single woman? I understand that one can be grading a test while the other is answering questions. To me it comes down to, they are still just teaching one class of kids. They're just more efficient at it than a normal teacher.
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jitterbug
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Post by jitterbug on Aug 30, 2012 11:47:35 GMT -5
They mentioned in the show that they paid for 1 1/2 education, which I think was actually kind of fair! Yes, they have two brains, but they are taking up the space of one person and they can't EVER take their education to two separate places. I also think that would be a fair wage, too - because they aren't able to perform 100% as two separate people, so it's not really like you can get two for the price of one. However, I can see where schools can't afford to PAY for two teachers in one class. So I think a wage of 1.5 would be pretty fair on both sides.
I think the girls are amazing. Their attitudes are awesome!
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 11:56:58 GMT -5
I guess it depends on the district. My kids district doesn't have two teachers in a class unless they have to for special ed students. I am not sure they would qualify for that anyway since that teacher has to be able to do one on one seperate from the rest of the class. They can't seperate. They are always going to be standing in one place and if they both talk it would be talking over each other not one in the front of the class and one in the back type of thing.
I can't see my kids district paying them any more than the standard contract for the teacher position period. I don't understand how they could do two seperate teacher positions either.
It really is enough to give you a headache.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2012 11:59:26 GMT -5
Aren't they legally 2 distinct human beings? So, not sure how they would pay them. It is an unusual circumstance for sure. I think the show is great because it is inspiring to show others that even if the odds are stacked against you, you can still have a good life.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 12:09:51 GMT -5
Aren't they legally 2 distinct human beings? So, not sure how they would pay them. It is an unusual circumstance for sure. I think the show is great because it is inspiring to show others that even if the odds are stacked against you, you can still have a good life. Shooby they didn't go into how the pay would be paid but I would guess they would pay them each half under their own SS number. I have know people who had "job sharing" arrangements with other people in which two different people shared one FT job and each put in half the time doing half the jobs work. They said that they never worked exactly half the time so the employer really did get more than 1 ft employee for that price but that is how job sharing works. From all I have ever heard there is no way teachers in the contracts to pay teachers based on effeciency or how good a job they do. I don't think a 2nd BA helps around here either. I know they have pay raises for things like 15 or 30 credits towards a masters, a masters, and PHD but not a second BA.
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frep
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Post by frep on Aug 30, 2012 12:29:53 GMT -5
So you understand that there are two women there doing more work then one can do, but you think under their special circumstances they should only get paid one for the work of one? I look at it as there job is to teach a class. One class. I don't see it as them doing more work than one can do. They could just do it quicker. Their job would be to teach 20 kids math. I'm sure you wouldn't argue that one teacher couldn't teach 20 kids math. To me the difference is the two of them could do prep work, grade tests, etc, twice as fast as a regular teacher. If I usually pay the neighbor kid $20 to mow my lawn and it takes him 40 minutes, if he brings his friend to help one day and finish in 25 minutes I'm not going to pay them $30.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2012 13:01:44 GMT -5
Good point, they are teaching one class. And, the position they applied for is probably a single position at the school district and the job description is specifically spelled out.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 30, 2012 13:50:47 GMT -5
Yes, but a teacher can't unilaterally believe that adding another teacher would be beneficial to the classroom, and then expect the school to just pay that person a salary. They applied for ONE job in ONE classroom. The school can afford to hire ONE teacher. If they require to be paid for TWO people, then they will be eliminated from the list of potential candidates because they do not fit the salary requirements. Maybe they could just hire Brittany, and Abby can just read a book or listen to her iPod or something.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 13:53:21 GMT -5
If you pay some kid $10 to mow your lawn and he brings his friend and they mow the lawn and edge then yard you might pay more. Two teachers would be providing more face time to each student. Unless you are suggesting that teachers only have certain tasks to perform and after that the time at work is free? I would think most free time at school is interacting with students. I look at it as there job is to teach a class. One class. I don't see it as them doing more work than one can do. They could just do it quicker. Their job would be to teach 20 kids math. I'm sure you wouldn't argue that one teacher couldn't teach 20 kids math. To me the difference is the two of them could do prep work, grade tests, etc, twice as fast as a regular teacher. If I usually pay the neighbor kid $20 to mow my lawn and it takes him 40 minutes, if he brings his friend to help one day and finish in 25 minutes I'm not going to pay them $30. But how do you decide to pay them more? Can another teacher decide to spend their lunch working with students one on one to make them read better? Is that worth more? Say one teacher decides to do more individualized plans for all the students, does that get extra money? Who gets to decide and how does the district budget for it? I know I couldn't have done that at any job I ever worked for. I wish I could have and just told them that means I have to get paid more. ;D Their problem is that they don't want or need two teachers in that classroom. All they want or need is the one that they are interviewing for. It is the teachers job to do that and how effeciently or not they do it doesn't change the fact that it is still only 1 job that they would be filling not two regardless of their circumstances.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Aug 30, 2012 14:20:32 GMT -5
They have TWO hands only, so really can only help one student at a time. And are they really going to talk at the same time?? What difference does it make how many degrees they have?
I wonder how kids are going to respond to them, especially when they first see them. I very much admire people who overcome whatever obstacles and succeed, but in their situation I don't know if picking early education as a profession was a good choice....
Lena
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frep
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Post by frep on Aug 30, 2012 14:22:34 GMT -5
If you pay some kid $10 to mow your lawn and he brings his friend and they mow the lawn and edge then yard you might pay more. Two teachers would be providing more face time to each student. Unless you are suggesting that teachers only have certain tasks to perform and after that the time at work is free? I would think most free time at school is interacting with students. I look at it as there job is to teach a class. One class. I don't see it as them doing more work than one can do. They could just do it quicker. Their job would be to teach 20 kids math. I'm sure you wouldn't argue that one teacher couldn't teach 20 kids math. To me the difference is the two of them could do prep work, grade tests, etc, twice as fast as a regular teacher. If I usually pay the neighbor kid $20 to mow my lawn and it takes him 40 minutes, if he brings his friend to help one day and finish in 25 minutes I'm not going to pay them $30. Would they really get more face time though? I know when I was in school I never had a problem being able to get a moment to ask a teacher a question. There wasn't exactly a long line of students waiting to ask questions where there just wasn't enough time for it.
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Bob Ross
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Post by Bob Ross on Aug 30, 2012 14:29:44 GMT -5
I want to know how they do the nasty.
I'm sure that Tucker Max would be up to the challenge.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 14:38:18 GMT -5
These young women are sure doing a wonderful job with their situation. That said - I'm not sure how this would work out with getting a job. Yes - they are two people, but they can't each get their own job, they have to be together. Even if a particular class required 2 teachers, I'm not sure these two could fill the role of two teachers. For younger years, you usually have one teacher leading the students, one int he back to make sure stragglers don't get out of the group. They can't work 2 study or project groups at either end of the class room, etc. They could grade papers or tests at twice the speed, but that's about it. They could each be having independent conversations with students (or parents), but it would not be able to touch on confidential or sensitive info, and it might be a bit distracting for other kinds of conversations. They are much closer than even two people standing next to each other. I sure do wish them well, and hope they can find a job where both feel productive. I just don't see them each being able to perform an entire job on their own. They will have to collaborate as they have always done. Looks like one is getting engaged - i'm not sure how that is going to work either.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 30, 2012 14:40:28 GMT -5
Only the one with the left hand can get engaged.
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ontrack
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Post by ontrack on Aug 30, 2012 15:59:07 GMT -5
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 30, 2012 16:04:40 GMT -5
(psst...we don't call them "Siamese twins" anymore.)
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ontrack
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Post by ontrack on Aug 30, 2012 16:07:53 GMT -5
I only used that term because that particular pair made the term famous (they were from Siam), and used it about themselves. Obviously it's not PC to use that term in general.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Aug 30, 2012 16:08:34 GMT -5
...I'd like to think that a pair of positions opens up for them, for which they are uniquely suited to fill, so that they can both be employed... I wouldn't expect that to happen in a public school classroom...
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 16:09:28 GMT -5
They also had two almost completely separate bodies. They were only attached by a small patch of skin at the side. These girls are essentially sharing one body. No way for one of them to do much without the other being directly involved, let alone the fact that they only have one uterus etc.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 30, 2012 16:10:35 GMT -5
So, they will be their own child's aunt?
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 16:14:35 GMT -5
So, they will be their own child's aunt? I would think they would both be the child mother. How would you know whose child it was since they only have one set of organs from the intestines down?
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Aug 30, 2012 16:15:42 GMT -5
So, they will be their own child's aunt? How do you politely wonder if the nerves required to enjoy procreating go to both brains or just the one? <<hoping she just did>>
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 30, 2012 16:18:59 GMT -5
The concept of possession and ownership must be totally different when you share most of a body.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Aug 30, 2012 16:19:54 GMT -5
So, they will be their own child's aunt? How do you politely wonder if the nerves required to enjoy procreating go to both brains or just the one? <<hoping she just did>> Well they only have one set of everthing down there so I'm not sure it makes a difference really. It is not like one can just ignore it. This really is more than I want to think about.
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jaya3300
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Post by jaya3300 on Aug 30, 2012 16:22:53 GMT -5
If they get pulled over for speeding, who gets the ticket?
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Aug 30, 2012 16:23:43 GMT -5
How do you politely wonder if the nerves required to enjoy procreating go to both brains or just the one? <<hoping she just did>> Well they only have one set of everthing down there so I'm not sure it makes a difference really. It is not like one can just ignore it. This really is more than I want to think about. ...well, the state is going to have to figure out something, since they have two IDs and one uterus... who would you put on the birth cert?
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