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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 16:28:03 GMT -5
burns... is that really a goal of the 'tea party' ... and is it being expressed clearly and consistently by them?
And in what manner are they looking to 'return to policies tightly adhereing'... can you give me some specifics... because i don't see any logical, consistent, specifics coming from this group...
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burnsattornincan
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Post by burnsattornincan on Jan 28, 2011 16:33:17 GMT -5
can you give me some specifics...
Ms. oped, in a nutshell about 80% of the entire government structure from federal to state is unconstitutional. As a start we would need to go to that site someone posted a little while ago that lists the incredible array of federal departments and agencies. If you knew even 20% of them existed you would be doing well.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 16:41:26 GMT -5
I'm sorry... i didn't really ask for YOUR assesment, and goals (although i'm happy to hear them.) i asked if that was a belief and goal of the 'tea party' and if it is being consistently put forth by that organization...
What i would like to see is a tea party platform. Is there one? I can not derive one from what i read about the 'organization'...
You do understand that running ALL of those departments and agencies together represents only a small portion of the federal budget...
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 16:48:53 GMT -5
Any party, individual, corporation,special interest who can help organize people to ask that our elected officials be accountable to the voters has to be a good thing. Better then Egypt right now.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jan 28, 2011 16:51:57 GMT -5
Any party, individual, corporation,special interest who can help organize people to ask that our elected officials be accountable to the voters has to be a good thing.
They ARE accountable. Reps every two years, Presidents every four years, and Senators every six years. Of course, one can write or call them in between and remind them who sent them there. But one doesn't need an organization to do that......
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 16:56:07 GMT -5
I think the TEA Party is only a beginning - it is a grass roots effort in that it is the very real expression of dissatisfaction of a large amount of the public with politics as usual and a very real desire/demand for change.
At the same time it is a work/movement in progress - members are coming together to try and work out the best way for it to proceed (somewhat akin to the founding fathers as they attempted to craft our Federal government and constitution.)
I think the movement will continue and will adapt a bit.
Meanwhile the movement is not physically violent and does not encourage violence.
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 16:57:44 GMT -5
The two major groups in this country fall into two categories, Republican and Democrat and they remind of a couple school kids fighting over whether my Dad's Chevy is better then your Dads Ford. They defend their choice, show anger and stifle any intelligent debate because they are afraid it may reflect badly on "their" party. Look around for one minute and you should see that these two parties have formed a monopoly on politics in this country and every move is calculated for the advancement of their party instead of for the best interest of our country.
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 16:58:15 GMT -5
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 17:01:29 GMT -5
Almost hate to mention the word... for many of these party pumpers their politics are their "religion"... they actually believe what these people say and they think they are going to do what they say.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 17:03:47 GMT -5
very real expression of dissatisfaction
But, unfortunately, a lot of the dissatisfaction is misplaced... I mean, i hear people SAYING they are mad, and certainly any time there is high unemployment and a slow economy there will be dissatisfaction... but i hear a LOT of tea party people talking about 'my taxes'... when in fact, they get more from the government than they ever pay in (these are local people i know who align themselves with 'tea party ideals'...) and in the news i hear lots of older people align themselves with the 'tea party'... but do the whole 'get the government out of my medicare' line... they will tell you they disagree with government spending, but when you point out that the majority of spending is in ss/medi and defense and these programs will need to be cut... the balk (as do the so called politicians who represent them... how many of the freshman republicans have said... oh no... we'll cut DISCRETIONARY spending... as if that's a panacea?...
And do i don't see any actual follow thru... or intent to follow thru...
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verrip1
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Post by verrip1 on Jan 28, 2011 17:14:09 GMT -5
I think that the most intriguing aspects of this include just how much the Dems want to invest in open attacks on all things tea partyish (yeah, so I made up a word - sue me!). Perhaps among their fellow Dems, these can become rah rah, high five moments. But for everybody else, it shows them just how juvenile the Dems are. Dems can't win on comic quotes and personal insults and attacks, and right now that's their strategy.
Their own rhetoric is pushing the Dems into openly accepting the role of statists. Funny, it used to be more accurate to consider the Dems as being the Party most attuned to the vox populi. They have managed to discard that mantle completely and become the Party most attuned to promoting government for government's sake. For years they have ranted against Big Oil, Big Tobacco, Big Insurance. Now they have morphed into the Party of Big Central Control. Orwell's Big Brother.
Dems should make their motto "We have met the enemy and he is us", and replace the symbolic donkey with Pogo (with helmet & holding rifle).
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 17:14:20 GMT -5
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 17:15:55 GMT -5
I think that the most intriguing aspects of this include just how much the Dems want to invest in open attacks on all things tea partyish (yeah, so I made up a word - sue me!). Perhaps among their fellow Dems, these can become rah rah, high five moments. But for everybody else, it shows them just how juvenile the Dems are. Dems can't win on comic quotes and personal insults and attacks, and right now that's their strategy. Their own rhetoric is pushing the Dems into openly accepting the role of statists. Funny, it used to be more accurate to consider the Dems as being the Party most attuned to the vox populi. They have managed to discard that mantle completely and become the Party most attuned to promoting government for government's sake. For years they have ranted against Big Oil, Big Tobacco, Big Insurance. Now they have morphed into the Party of Big Central Control. Orwell's Big Brother. Dems should make their motto "We have met the enemy and he is us", and replace the symbolic donkey with Pogo (with helmet & holding rifle). Good post!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 17:17:27 GMT -5
Most Tea Party members (& the people that would vote for the Tea Party) are or were Republicans. The Tea Party could very possible split the Republican vote & make both candidates un-electable. The main reason that didn't happen in the last election is that a huge number of people hated the Democratic parties actions. If they don't screw up again they will probably stay in office.
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verrip1
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Post by verrip1 on Jan 28, 2011 17:21:08 GMT -5
Guess what Tex. Culling out old-style Repos is as important to them as dumping the Democrats. Think of it as a two stage process.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Jan 28, 2011 17:22:48 GMT -5
What people are accusing Dems of being that ?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 17:24:05 GMT -5
I actually don't 'watch' news... i have no cable... i meant read.... and i DID meet a lot of people just like this... medicare/ss demographics, who wanted less spending, but not on THEIR programs, at health care rallies and debates.... the Specter one was the most tense... it was the only political thing ever that i did not take my kids to, and am glad i didn't it got a bit heated several times... so i'm not just talking out of turn...
I also know a lot of people who are 'down with government'... but would not be able to live without their food stamps and medicaid and WIC and EITC... so their stated goals... and the reality of their choices, are decidedly different...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 17:25:15 GMT -5
I've heard a lot of people say that dems/libs are 'just scared' of Bachmann/Palin, etc... If you try to say something about their platform... someone always seems to respond about how 'scared' everyone is...
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steff
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Post by steff on Jan 28, 2011 17:46:35 GMT -5
I'm not "scared" of Palin, I disagree with her political views. I wouldn't vote for her because of that. I don't "hate" her, I'm not "jealous" of her being pretty or any of the other 1000000 reasons folks come up with. I'm polar opposite of her beliefs and politics and would never vote for someone whose views are so opposite what I beleive and support.
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reasonfreedom
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Post by reasonfreedom on Jan 28, 2011 17:48:18 GMT -5
Well I don't think Liberals are scared at all. Main example is Obama, look at his campaign "Change and Hope". Seriously when I see something like that I am thinking that guy has some cahooonaas(probably slaughtered the spelling on that word). The funny thing is that it worked, seriously what reasonable person would vote for something that is inevitable and is the last resort for trying to get something accomplished.
Now the tea party was a great idea, though I thought unions were too until the human corruption slaughtered both ideals. I thought the tea party was based of a grass roots campaign. I was part of the Ron Paul campaign and thought the tea party was a spin off of it. I did a lot of research on RP and found him to be one of the most reasonable politicians that I have researched. Granite a lot of people think that removing the Fed reserve is crazy( I would think it difficult, but not crazy), but JFK wanted to the same thing(correct me if I am wrong on that). I think the tea party grew too big and has been hijacked in a sense. When I say hijacked I mean by like Palin associating here self and other republicans with the group. Bachmann I don't know much about besides the news article, but everybody says stupid things every once in a while. Just look a GWB he was a horrible speaker and fumbled a lot. Al Gore said he " took the initiative of creating the internet"(I believe I got that right) I haven't found any evidence that he did. I guess my point is that people tend to get caught up in the moment and say crazy things.
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 18:34:11 GMT -5
I'm not "scared" of Palin, I disagree with her political views. I wouldn't vote for her because of that. I don't "hate" her, I'm not "jealous" of her being pretty or any of the other 1000000 reasons folks come up with. I'm polar opposite of her beliefs and politics and would never vote for someone whose views are so opposite what I believe and support. Read more: notmsnmoney.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=politics&action=display&thread=2482&page=2#ixzz1CNL8NE8LGreat statement and I agree with you - and I think our politics are very opposite each other - but I try hard to vote for candidates that reflect my values. I also resent any and all comments that criticism of the current administration is because of racism (not accusing you - but have heard it too many times) I would be much more receptive of a message on why Palin (substitute a conservative name here) is wrong (but maybe not stupid) and then followed up with a more logical, a better, a different view point on the subject. (hopeful that is coherent)
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 19:40:12 GMT -5
Not my choice for President but a nice family lady who has acheived more then most. Case closed
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Post by marjar on Jan 28, 2011 19:43:08 GMT -5
I also resent any and all comments that criticism of the current administration is because of racism (not accusing you - but have heard it too many times) I would be much more receptive of a message on why Palin (substitute a conservative name here) is wrong (but maybe not stupid) and then followed up with a more logical, a better, a different view point on the subject. (hopeful that is coherent) I disagree with Sarah's stand on abortion, creationism in schools, gay marriage, and the environment, among other issues. Her position on these issues are anathema to mine.
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 20:02:23 GMT -5
That's cool you have very different views but why the constant name calling and mud slinging? It's strikes me as very funny that the people who speak out against talk radio seem to be the ones who just keep the name calling going.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 20:02:34 GMT -5
"Not my choice for President but a nice family lady who has acheived more then most. Case closed"
See... i can't agree at all... I think she is an opportunist, who has been given copious opportunities in life and has squandered most of them. I do not find her to be a mother i would care to emulate.
She IS seizing the opportunity to make a lot of money at the moment, so i'm not ready to consider her a bad capitalist... but other than that... but i'm not entirely sure (given what i've read about her spending habits) that she's sustain her wealth past her breif celebrity.
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 20:14:06 GMT -5
Pretty typical description of the modern politician. She like most of us probably has many things she don't deserve and probably has done and said many things she regrets. I don't consider her a viable candidate for president so take her for what she is. I even watched several episodes of her Alaska show and she appeared to have a great family bond, she participated in many activities that the typical family would do and has accomplished more then I could ever hope to. So I say good for her and wish her the best. Now if she has a dark side and has been involved in criminal activity, she gets charged and convicted then I would also so good for her, she got what she deserved.
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 20:17:57 GMT -5
See... i can't agree at all... I think she is an opportunist, who has been given copious opportunities in life and has squandered most of them. I do not find her to be a mother i would care to emulate. Read more: notmsnmoney.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=politics&thread=2482&page=2#ixzz1CNmDoRGhHer opportunities in life have been self generated - unless you know something that I do not know - she put herself thru school, worked hard and worked her way up the political ladder in Alaska (until McCain chose her for a running mate) I don't see where she had an advantage over anyone else And after he chose her - she has definitely paid her dues - and if she still has a platform it is because there are people in this country that want to hear her - the left has tried extremely hard to shut her down - so I think she has earned her place
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2011 20:29:11 GMT -5
Earned her place as what? Exactly? ... as an entertainer like Glen Beck... sure... other than that i don't see that she's earned anything.
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rockon
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Post by rockon on Jan 28, 2011 20:32:10 GMT -5
oped whats with the attitude? She became Governor of Alaska, she was a vice presidential nominee. These things weren't given to her and not many people achieve this much.
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 28, 2011 20:39:16 GMT -5
Earned her place as what? Exactly? ... as an entertainer like Glen Beck... sure... other than that i don't see that she's earned anything. Her "place" is whatever it is based on the sheer force of her life and her personality. She isn't famous because she inherited anything. If she is constantly in the news and in the headlines - it is because the press, the media and the public keep her there. That is because she has something. I could go out and do the same thing Sarah is doing but I would never be noticed and I would not get the press. Why - she has something. (and apparently a lot of people are afraid of "it") might just be charisma and some leadership ability Whatever "it" is - it is hers - she's earned it as much as others in the news - if she hadn't - we would quit hearing about her
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