Sugar 'n' spice vs. snakes 'n' snails

[Firebird]

What gender stereotypes do you hold in spite of yourself? Do they ever creep up on you in unexpected ways? How do they impact your family relationships?

I was going to be more specific but I think I'll just see where the initial question goes first...

[swamp]

boys are stupid.

[midjd]

First off - I love snakes ;D

Do you mean gender stereotypes we embody, or ones we believe? But I'll answer both.

Embody
I don't generally like to get dirty;
I'm not good at lifting heavy things;
I don't like hunting, fishing, or anything that involves killing animals;
I like babies and the color pink ;D

Believe
Hmm, this one is harder. I will say that I have a natural knee-jerk "PEDO!" reaction when I see an older man playing with an unrelated small child. I don't like it, but it's there.

I try to make an effort to say "he or she" if I'm not sure of the gender, but many of my coworkers, upon hearing the name Judge ____ or Senator _____ will assume it's a male.

Similar to Apple and Sheila - DH works with a mechanic named Billie, and until I saw the name spelled out, I had just assumed it was a guy.

[sheilaincali]

I work in a male dominated field and should know better but I am still frequently surprised to see women on the jobsites as laborers. Most of the women in our industry tend to be office/management type people not crew members on the project.
I fully expect DH to take out the trash every week and mow the lawn because I tend to think of those more as "his" jobs.

[Apple]

I work in a "skilled trade" and am damn good at it. I'm mechanical and logic minded so it's worked out well. I still expect all guys to be better at stuff than me (tools, figuring out how to improvise, figuring out how to put something together) because I'm a girl. But most of them aren't and it's been shown many times. Yet I still expect it.

[shanendoah]

I don't know that I hold any stereotypes about myself (or DH). However, I do occassionally find us falling in to stereotypical gender roles.
For example, when my father visited and helped us rewire much of our house, he and DH did most of the work while I made lunch and cleaned upstairs, or ran to the store for supplies they needed. Am I capable of learning electrical wiring? Yes? Should I have been paying as much attention to it as DH? Probably. Was I interested- not really. But it did really split us genderwise, which I noticed and was a little bugged by.
I am the social organizer for our family. DH always asks me what we have planned. Again, this isn't so much because I'm the "woman" but because he's an introvert with a really bad memory. We'd never go anywhere if he were in charge, because he would forget even the things that he wanted to do.
There are some nights when I'm really tired and feeling like being a "girl" (my words)- generally that means that I want to lie on the couch and just watch DH play a video game. Though in my defense, this not only gives DH and I something to talk about, most of the newer games are far more interesting than what's on TV, which is what I'd be doing if I weren't watching him play.

[Apple]

Lol, sheila--I'm ON the crew and I'm still surprised when I see women on a crew

[thyme4change]

I'm always surprised when I'm working with a man who gets really emotional about things. Although, I'm never surprised when women don't get emotional.

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

I don't really think in terms of rigid gender roles anymore, and as someone who grew up just as Title IX was coming into law, am absolutely thrilled that sports are no longer divided by gender until late elementary school or so. My kids see nothing novel or weird about girls playing baseball instead of softball or Pop Warner football instead of cheering or coed hockey teams or girls simply being athletic. Unfortunately/Fortunately () it changes in late elementary to single sex teams. Yes, statistically speaking, boys will likely be bigger and stronger than girls, but in many sports skill is far more important than size so sometimes the division is archaic.

Other than that, because I didn't have a daughter, there are many stores and many departments in stores that I simply don't venture into. But, that's not a stereotype, just never needed to go there.

[Firebird]

I think my big one is that I inherently expect women to be weaker. Isn't that pathetic? It's not like I don't know plenty of incredibly strong women - hell, I consider myself pretty strong. But it sneaks up on me.

I think it has to do with the emotional = weak paradigm I'm still fighting off. I was raised to believe that showing emotion was a weak thing to do. And since I'm a pretty emotional person, I often FELT weak. I'm still learning not to confuse the two.

(Then again, why do I automatically link "weak" emotion-showing with women as well? It's kind of interesting that I do consider emotional to be a "generally female" trait, even though the most stoic person I know is a woman, and one of the most emotional is a man.)

[InsertCoolName]

My 1 yr old just took his diaper off and peed in the floor and then played in it. It doesn't surprise me. But had either of my daughters done something like that I would have been WTF?!?!

Not sure if that's what you mean, but gross things are what boys do.

[whoisjohngalt]

I actually expect women to be stronger - we have to be - to put up with all the male BS

I do, however, expect much more drama from women

Lena

[Formerly SK]

My 6yo DD loves Star Wars with a passion and currently wants to grow up to be Darth Maul. That said, she told me the other day that girls aren't supposed to like Star Wars so she doesn't talk about it with the girls at school - only the boys. I don't know where she picked that up but it made me sad.

[raeoflyte]

I wish to gawd that I had established what 'man work' was and that dh was supposed to do it when we got our first place together. Not because I can't or don't mow, take out the trash, etc, but because I would really like him to just own anything about house maintenance...

Stereotypes I'll have to think about, but I think I've spent too much time deconstructing gender over the years to look objectively at it. I was surprised early on how my son will insist that he's a boy (instead of a baby or a monkey or whatever random thing people call him), or how many typical boy things he likes that I really don't think we influenced him to do--and that there are typical girl things he doesn't have an interest in that we tried to make available to him.

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Jun 15, 2012 14:50:51 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

I was surprised early on how my son will insist that he's a boy (instead of a baby or a monkey or whatever random thing people call him), or how many typical boy things he likes that I really don't think we influenced him to do--and that there are typical girl things he doesn't have an interest in that we tried to make available to him.

The dolls and the Little Tykes kitchen didn't get the use the cars and trucks did. I tried. I really tried.

[shanendoah]

skinnykids: Something you might want to check out www.geekgirlcon.com/. Even if you're no where near Seattle, there's lots on the site to help show your daughter that girls can like whatever they want to.

I guess I expect women to say they don't get along with other women. They like men much better. Except that just about every woman I know has said that AND has at least one female friend that they are closer to than any man (sometimes including their husband). I think there is a perception that girls/women are supposed to be pack animals, traveling in same gendered groups, so women don't have lots of female friends think that the reason is "they are different from other women"- considering 75% of women I know tell me this, I have to call BS. We aren't all the ladies from Sex and the City, and I wouldn't get along with any of them, but it has nothing to do with them being "women" and everything to do with us not sharing interests.

[Apple]

Boy brains and girl brains are different. One isn't better than the other, and some people have a lot of traits/brains normally attributed to the other sex, but they are different.
My mom babysat hundreds of kids over decades. Both sexes would play with the stroller, but in almost every single case, the girls would put the doll in it and push it around, and the boys would turn it upside down to play with the wheels and figure how how they worked. I was one of the few exceptions--the wheels were more fun, and if I put a doll in it, it was usually to see how long it would stay in when I pushed the stroller down the stairs.

A lot of women honestly could never work in my field--but realistically, a lot of men couldn't either (and some who do, shouldn't--they just aren't good at it and I'm surprised they haven't gotten hurt yet.)

[Firebird]

I do, however, expect much more drama from women

Me too but that one, frankly, is an opinion drawn from life experience.

[shanendoah]

Maybe I know too many gay men. But if someone is going to invent drama in my current life- it's a man.
I've known women who were all about drama (and there are some on these boards I avoid interacting with because of their drama), but I don't assume that has anything to do with them being women and much more to do with individual traits of needing to be the center of some kind/any kind of attention.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I always assumed that stupid daredevil shit was boy territory. Nope, my daughter does all sorts of stupid Jackass type stunts. She has no fear. I forsee many ER trips.

[justme]

Yes, statistically speaking, boys will likely be bigger and stronger than girls, but in many sports skill is far more important than size so sometimes the division is archaic.

I'm not so sure. When I played basketball in HS every year there was a big boys vs. girls game during school. The boys team sucked, never even made it into the playoffs. The girls always made it to district and moved on to regionals a lot. The boys beat us every damn time. And a big part of the reason was because they were taller to get the rebounds, bigger to block us out, and on a whole were faster than our team (some individual girls were fast) probably due to their longer legs. I could easily see the size difference being a stark issue in basketball, football, soccer, hockey, running. Tennis and baseball maybe not so much.

[Firebird]

First off - I love snakes ;D

Forgot to say, I love snakes too! I wanted to get a king snake but DH wouldn't go for it. I am also the resident spider-killer in our house.

[Firebird]

Maybe I know too many gay men. But if someone is going to invent drama in my current life- it's a man.

I know quite a few gay men also. Women are ALWAYS the center of the drama. Thinking back on the last couple dramatic episodes in my life, there was always a women or six starting them.

I'm not saying it's impossible for a guy to start drama, just that (in my experience) it's definitely not the norm.

[Firebird]

I guess I expect women to say they don't get along with other women. They like men much better. Except that just about every woman I know has said that AND has at least one female friend that they are closer to than any man (sometimes including their husband).

I've noticed this one too. It's interesting to notice what stereotypes we insist we DON'T fit. I'm always loathe to describe myself as sensitive (even though I really am, quite) because it's one of those annoying girly traits and I don't want to be written off as a stereotypical chick.

Then again, sometimes you just don't fit the profile. I really DO hate shopping

[thyme4change]

Nope, my daughter does all sorts of stupid Jackass type stunts. She has no fear. I forsee many ER trips.

My daughter was pretty fearless until she was 4 or 5. I thought for sure she was going to be crazy - but she snapped out of it, and is now very controlled and appropriate.

My son, however...we average 1.5 trips per year to the ER. The two in two weeks for two totally isolated incidents really gave me heartburn.

[teen persuasion]

Jun 15, 2012 15:00:13 GMT -5 shanendoah said:

Maybe I know too many gay men. But if someone is going to invent drama in my current life- it's a man.
I've known women who were all about drama (and there are some on these boards I avoid interacting with because of their drama), but I don't assume that has anything to do with them being women and much more to do with individual traits of needing to be the center of some kind/any kind of attention.

The younger of my brothers was at the center of family drama when we were kids. He's the third of 4 kids. We always commented that it was his place in the family that made him different from the rest of us.

My younger daughter is the drama teen in the family; she was also third of 4 for a long time (now third of 5). It's just her personality.

So I don't tie the drama thing to gender at all. Then again, I work w/ a lot of "drama" teens.

[midjd]

I find that men (or at least the men in my life) are the dramatic ones.

To use roller derby as an example - we have about 40 women from all walks of life, and we all get along pretty fabulously. The ONLY times we've had a drama issue is when one of the husbands/boyfriends (or our male coach) decides to stir some shit for no apparent reason. The girls are pretty mellow. Maybe it's all the hitting

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I call my brother the "drama king". He's way more melodramatic than I am.

[teen persuasion]

I think that kids are less likely to hold w/ a lot of the stereotypes older generations grew up with. The teen boys I know aren't afraid to do silly girly things (DS2 and other guys graduating last year were given a princess party by a female friend - funny seeing the guys w/ tiaras and purses, etc.), wear makeup, dress up in tights or grass skirts or tutus, etc. The girls just as likely to be into sports as the guys (and often tougher), and enjoy playing the villain roles (we were pretty scared at L's Hyde - she was seriously beating a dummy in one scene).

[quince]

Women are more likely to enjoy shopping and make-up. Men are more likely to enjoy fun things.

I do my best not to maintain stereotypes- because even if MOST men are like X and MOST women are like Y, actual individual people deserve to be evaluated on their own. I'm friends with more men than women- this is because a lot of my interests align more closely with men I've met than women I've met. Comic books, video games, and table-top role-playing. This also means it would be hard to maintain stereotypes about women, because the women I associate most with are not stereotypical.

It's a little jarring to me listening to a group of women at work talk about purses, weddings, or babies for half an hour.

I'm actually working to be OK with the places where I do/will/might fall into gender stereotypes. I should do something because I want to, not because someone says I should, or shouldn't.

My family is very open to people doing what they damned well please, and as a result, I'm just about reaching the end of my rope with SO's family's more normative gender expectations. Grr.