hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Nov 21, 2019 10:53:56 GMT -5
It isn't going to make boys who don't already want to dress up like Elsa suddenly want to. Most kids won't think much if anything about it once they leave the library that day. For the (very small) number of boys out there that are getting to an age where they will start to hear it isn't okay to like pink, or have long hair, or dress up they can see that someone out there might be like them. And for the kids who don't feel that way they also have some frame of reference that it isn't a big deal. If neighbor kid Timmy comes over to play dressed up like Elsa, then we'll play real life plants vs. zombies, but Elsa Zombie has freezing powers, or whatever wacky but fun game they come up with. Of course it is! And that's fine, but it's almost definitely going to make them want to. I can't even tell you how many instances my 3-year old has decided they wanted to dress up in something they saw someone else wearing, having never seen someone wear it before. For a lot of kids, they won't have seen someone in person dressed up in something so shiny/sparkly before. Of course lots of them are going to want to dress like that even if they've never wanted to before. My wife's nieces & nephews went to some Disney on Ice thing and the next day they were ALL wearing these sparkly princess gowns the girls had. It definitely made them want to dress like that after seeing it. And that's all fine, but I disagree it isn't going to make them suddenly want to dress up like someone they're getting a first (or low number of) exposure to.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Nov 21, 2019 11:09:35 GMT -5
It isn't going to make boys who don't already want to dress up like Elsa suddenly want to. Most kids won't think much if anything about it once they leave the library that day. For the (very small) number of boys out there that are getting to an age where they will start to hear it isn't okay to like pink, or have long hair, or dress up they can see that someone out there might be like them. And for the kids who don't feel that way they also have some frame of reference that it isn't a big deal. If neighbor kid Timmy comes over to play dressed up like Elsa, then we'll play real life plants vs. zombies, but Elsa Zombie has freezing powers, or whatever wacky but fun game they come up with. Of course it is! And that's fine, but it's almost definitely going to make them want to. I can't even tell you how many instances my 3-year old has decided they wanted to dress up in something they saw someone else wearing, having never seen someone wear it before. For a lot of kids, they won't have seen someone in person dressed up in something so shiny/sparkly before. Of course lots of them are going to want to dress like that even if they've never wanted to before. My wife's nieces & nephews went to some Disney on Ice thing and the next day they were ALL wearing these sparkly princess gowns the girls had. It definitely made them want to dress like that after seeing it. And that's all fine, but I disagree it isn't going to make them suddenly want to dress up like someone they're getting a first (or low number of) exposure to. I'm sure it depends on the kid, but my point (which I think is yours too) is that it won't make them cross dressers or transgendered. My son wouldn't decide that he wanted to try on the dress play clothes even if he loved the performance. He'd practice his character voices, or his singing. My daughter on the other hand could come home and try to recreate it. Whether it was a princess, fireman, cat, etc.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Nov 21, 2019 11:13:41 GMT -5
My wife and I talked about this recently and both came to the same answer. There is no reason for a drag queen to read at story hour. I have to ask this question why do they feel the need to dress in drag to read to children? I'll ask you the same question I asked Miss T. Why not?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Nov 21, 2019 11:15:45 GMT -5
The Scot wouldn't, but in the context of a random person seeing someone wearing a skirt or kilt (random person appearing male), the random person is unlikely to know whether it's immediately a skirt or kilt. Admittedly, I'm the one who brought kilts into the discussion, the context was essentially..."You're not ok with a man wearing a womanly garment reading stories at the library...if it's a guy wearing a kilt or a skirt that looks a lot like a kilt, what's the difference?" They look (or can look) similar enough that there's little discernible difference to the random person looking, certainly most kids won't immediately know the difference. Essentially, these 2 things look pretty similar...how in the world is it ok to wear one and not the other? A guy in our neighborhood used to wear a kilt - like for every day stuff - the grocery store, taking the dog for a walk, etc. It was a dull khaki/olive color, but shaped like a kilt. To me, it seemed quite practical in the heat. It's not unusual in my area to see men wearing kilts. Not the dressy kind in plaid. But plain, solid working kilts.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Nov 21, 2019 12:56:39 GMT -5
My wife and I talked about this recently and both came to the same answer. There is no reason for a drag queen to read at story hour. I have to ask this question why do they feel the need to dress in drag to read to children?Because they want to teach children that it's OK to be different. The message would be somewhat watered down if it's just a guy reading to children.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Nov 21, 2019 15:40:46 GMT -5
My wife and I talked about this recently and both came to the same answer. There is no reason for a drag queen to read at story hour. I have to ask this question why do they feel the need to dress in drag to read to children? Ok. So you have obvioulsy thought about this. But I wonder whether you want to share whether you can also tell us whether there is a reason why a person in drag should not read at story hour?
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 21, 2019 15:53:44 GMT -5
You know you're never getting the answer to that. Because there's no good reason for them not to be able to do so. Other than the bigotry of others who think that those who are different from them are wrong.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 21, 2019 16:46:48 GMT -5
I’m not skirting the issue. I don’t give a shit what you canadiens deal with. It’s your problem. You like to make our problems yours for some bizarre reason. Lol! Irrespective of the nationality of the person who commented on the issue, you failed to address it. "I understand. A person who kisses his wife in public is some kind of pervert, but a man who cheated on all three of his wives is someone to vote for." . You fail to understand that people who voted for him dont care about his personal life. I never said a man who kisses his wife in public is a pervert. Those are your words.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Nov 21, 2019 17:00:32 GMT -5
Lol! Irrespective of the nationality of the person who commented on the issue, you failed to address it. "I understand. A person who kisses his wife in public is some kind of pervert, but a man who cheated on all three of his wives is someone to vote for." . You fail to understand that people who voted for him dont care about his personal life. I never said a man who kisses his wife in public is a pervert. Those are your words. You did say that a man and wife didn't need to paw at each other in public when all I asked about was a kiss.
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ednkris
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Post by ednkris on Nov 21, 2019 18:44:58 GMT -5
My wife and I talked about this recently and both came to the same answer. There is no reason for a drag queen to read at story hour. I have to ask this question why do they feel the need to dress in drag to read to children? May I ask your age? People with young children right now are millennials. Many of them don't care. They want to teach their children that people are people, and sure, there are weirdos out there, but maybe they are awesome weirdos and if you meet people where they are, you may gain something from it. I'm 53 my kids are 30 and 26 said they would not let their kids go to a story hour being read by a drag queen
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ednkris
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Post by ednkris on Nov 21, 2019 18:49:48 GMT -5
My wife and I talked about this recently and both came to the same answer. There is no reason for a drag queen to read at story hour. I have to ask this question why do they feel the need to dress in drag to read to children? I'll ask you the same question I asked Miss T. Why not? We are talking about this at this moment my wife broght up a good point. She and I for that matter don't care about being Round drag queens live and let ljve, but when they purposely dress that way to read to children where they will be inquisitive and definitely not age appropriate.
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GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl
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Post by GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl on Nov 21, 2019 19:06:26 GMT -5
I'll ask you the same question I asked Miss T. Why not? We are talking about this at this moment my wife broght up a good point. She and I for that matter don't care about being Round drag queens live and let ljve, but when they purposely dress that way to read to children where they will be inquisitive and definitely not age appropriate. You do know that dressing in drag is not contagious, right? Neither is being gay/trans/questioning or black/brown/yellow or any other difference.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Nov 21, 2019 19:25:40 GMT -5
I'll ask you the same question I asked Miss T. Why not? We are talking about this at this moment my wife broght up a good point. She and I for that matter don't care about being Round drag queens live and let ljve, but when they purposely dress that way to read to children where they will be inquisitive and definitely not age appropriate. What? You do know that a child asking why that man wears a dress does not need a full on treatise on drag queens for an answer right? Just a simple "because that is what he likes to wear" would suffice and is completely age appropriate.
Then again, I am quite certain that my son and DDIL would see zero problems with taking their kids to a library where a drag queen was reading stories.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Nov 21, 2019 19:30:41 GMT -5
It isn't going to make boys who don't already want to dress up like Elsa suddenly want to. Most kids won't think much if anything about it once they leave the library that day. For the (very small) number of boys out there that are getting to an age where they will start to hear it isn't okay to like pink, or have long hair, or dress up they can see that someone out there might be like them. And for the kids who don't feel that way they also have some frame of reference that it isn't a big deal. If neighbor kid Timmy comes over to play dressed up like Elsa, then we'll play real life plants vs. zombies, but Elsa Zombie has freezing powers, or whatever wacky but fun game they come up with. Of course it is! And that's fine, but it's almost definitely going to make them want to. I can't even tell you how many instances my 3-year old has decided they wanted to dress up in something they saw someone else wearing, having never seen someone wear it before. For a lot of kids, they won't have seen someone in person dressed up in something so shiny/sparkly before. Of course lots of them are going to want to dress like that even if they've never wanted to before. My wife's nieces & nephews went to some Disney on Ice thing and the next day they were ALL wearing these sparkly princess gowns the girls had. It definitely made them want to dress like that after seeing it. And that's all fine, but I disagree it isn't going to make them suddenly want to dress up like someone they're getting a first (or low number of) exposure to. These two posts sparked several different thoughts in me. First, lots of the old ideas that distinguished/separated the sexes have broken down with the kids in school now. Cool guys wear pink, it's a thing. And sometimes I think more boys have long hair than the girls, who might just have a quite short haircut. Two of my 3 boys have long hair right now (oldest went short only because it's easier with sports/power tools for safety reasons), they all have super curly hair, so it's above their shoulders mostly, unless you tug a ringlet out to full length. Of their friends, Matt, Donovan, Brad, Stone, Slate immediately come to mind that all have long straight hair. Those are just the ones I know by sight. Slightly different thought: someone asked my boss why there weren't any dress up clothes for the girls at the library, just ones for the boys. Boss was taken aback; she thought she'd chosen gender neutral outfits, and girls and boys equally enjoy them: veterinarian, police officer, firefighter. So this mom thought girls can't even pretend to be those things?
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Nov 21, 2019 19:42:35 GMT -5
Of course it is! And that's fine, but it's almost definitely going to make them want to. I can't even tell you how many instances my 3-year old has decided they wanted to dress up in something they saw someone else wearing, having never seen someone wear it before. For a lot of kids, they won't have seen someone in person dressed up in something so shiny/sparkly before. Of course lots of them are going to want to dress like that even if they've never wanted to before. My wife's nieces & nephews went to some Disney on Ice thing and the next day they were ALL wearing these sparkly princess gowns the girls had. It definitely made them want to dress like that after seeing it. And that's all fine, but I disagree it isn't going to make them suddenly want to dress up like someone they're getting a first (or low number of) exposure to. These two posts sparked several different thoughts in me. First, lots of the old ideas that distinguished/separated the sexes have broken down with the kids in school now. Cool guys wear pink, it's a thing. And sometimes I think more boys have long hair than the girls, who might just have a quite short haircut. Two of my 3 boys have long hair right now (oldest went short only because it's easier with sports/power tools for safety reasons), they all have super curly hair, so it's above their shoulders mostly, unless you tug a ringlet out to full length. Of their friends, Matt, Donovan, Brad, Stone, Slate immediately come to mind that all have long straight hair. Those are just the ones I know by sight. Slightly different thought: someone asked my boss why there weren't any dress up clothes for the girls at the library, just ones for the boys. Boss was taken aback; she thought she'd chosen gender neutral outfits, and girls and boys equally enjoy them: veterinarian, police officer, firefighter. So this mom thought girls can't even pretend to be those things? Lol! My son's best friends in school were named Wu, Aki, Haruto, Lev and Ajit.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Nov 21, 2019 19:43:49 GMT -5
May I ask your age? People with young children right now are millennials. Many of them don't care. They want to teach their children that people are people, and sure, there are weirdos out there, but maybe they are awesome weirdos and if you meet people where they are, you may gain something from it. I'm 53 my kids are 30 and 26 said they would not let their kids go to a story hour being read by a drag queen I understand. I said "Many" not "all". There will always be dragqueenaphobes.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Nov 21, 2019 20:03:18 GMT -5
These two posts sparked several different thoughts in me. First, lots of the old ideas that distinguished/separated the sexes have broken down with the kids in school now. Cool guys wear pink, it's a thing. And sometimes I think more boys have long hair than the girls, who might just have a quite short haircut. Two of my 3 boys have long hair right now (oldest went short only because it's easier with sports/power tools for safety reasons), they all have super curly hair, so it's above their shoulders mostly, unless you tug a ringlet out to full length. Of their friends, Matt, Donovan, Brad, Stone, Slate immediately come to mind that all have long straight hair. Those are just the ones I know by sight. Slightly different thought: someone asked my boss why there weren't any dress up clothes for the girls at the library, just ones for the boys. Boss was taken aback; she thought she'd chosen gender neutral outfits, and girls and boys equally enjoy them: veterinarian, police officer, firefighter. So this mom thought girls can't even pretend to be those things? Lol! My son's best friends in school were named Wu, Aki, Haruto, Lev and Ajit. Yeah, names are funny. Stone and Slate are brothers; their older brothers are Clayton and Colton (or Clay and Cole(Coal?) for short. Their mom is a geologist. It's the unisex names that I sometimes find challenging - Skyler, Jayden, Alex, Raylee, Justin, Cameron, Sam, ugh, there's several more I can't come up with now, but I know kids of both sexes with all those names (or variant spellings). I'm not always sure which pronouns to use! ETA: remembered a few more: Tracy, Carey
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 21, 2019 20:14:38 GMT -5
I'll ask you the same question I asked Miss T. Why not? We are talking about this at this moment my wife broght up a good point. She and I for that matter don't care about being Round drag queens live and let ljve, but when they purposely dress that way to read to children where they will be inquisitive and definitely not age appropriate. What's not age appropriate about a man reading a book to a group of children? What do you think he's going to do?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Nov 21, 2019 20:15:39 GMT -5
I'll ask you the same question I asked Miss T. Why not? We are talking about this at this moment my wife broght up a good point. She and I for that matter don't care about being Round drag queens live and let ljve, but when they purposely dress that way to read to children where they will be inquisitive and definitely not age appropriate. You support a man who bragged about sexually assaulting women. “Grab em by the ”. So sexual assault is ok but not reading to children while wearing dresses. Got it.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 21, 2019 20:15:44 GMT -5
Lol! My son's best friends in school were named Wu, Aki, Haruto, Lev and Ajit. Yeah, names are funny. Stone and Slate are brothers; their older brothers are Clayton and Colton (or Clay and Cole(Coal?) for short. Their mom is a geologist. It's the unisex names that I sometimes find challenging - Skyler, Jayden, Alex, Raylee, Justin, Cameron, Sam, ugh, there's several more I can't come up with now, but I know kids of both sexes with all those names (or variant spellings). I'm not always sure which pronouns to use! My sister was friends with a set of twins named Colby and Brie. Why on earth would someone name their children after cheese?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 21, 2019 20:19:39 GMT -5
Yeah, names are funny. Stone and Slate are brothers; their older brothers are Clayton and Colton (or Clay and Cole(Coal?) for short. Their mom is a geologist. It's the unisex names that I sometimes find challenging - Skyler, Jayden, Alex, Raylee, Justin, Cameron, Sam, ugh, there's several more I can't come up with now, but I know kids of both sexes with all those names (or variant spellings). I'm not always sure which pronouns to use! My sister was friends with a set of twins named Colby and Brie. Why on earth would someone name their children after cheese? Their last name was Maker?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 21, 2019 20:34:14 GMT -5
. You fail to understand that people who voted for him dont care about his personal life. I never said a man who kisses his wife in public is a pervert. Those are your words. You did say that a man and wife didn't need to paw at each other in public when all I asked about was a kiss. Pawing is different than being a pervert. It’s called consideration for others, manners, politeness, good taste , being well brought up, having class. Something that seems to be missing in some people, apparently.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 21, 2019 20:35:35 GMT -5
We are talking about this at this moment my wife broght up a good point. She and I for that matter don't care about being Round drag queens live and let ljve, but when they purposely dress that way to read to children where they will be inquisitive and definitely not age appropriate. You support a man who bragged about sexually assaulting women. “Grab em by the ”. So sexual assault is ok but not reading to children while wearing dresses. Got it. Finally.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 21, 2019 21:28:27 GMT -5
Of course it is! And that's fine, but it's almost definitely going to make them want to. I can't even tell you how many instances my 3-year old has decided they wanted to dress up in something they saw someone else wearing, having never seen someone wear it before. For a lot of kids, they won't have seen someone in person dressed up in something so shiny/sparkly before. Of course lots of them are going to want to dress like that even if they've never wanted to before. My wife's nieces & nephews went to some Disney on Ice thing and the next day they were ALL wearing these sparkly princess gowns the girls had. It definitely made them want to dress like that after seeing it. And that's all fine, but I disagree it isn't going to make them suddenly want to dress up like someone they're getting a first (or low number of) exposure to. These two posts sparked several different thoughts in me. First, lots of the old ideas that distinguished/separated the sexes have broken down with the kids in school now. Cool guys wear pink, it's a thing. And sometimes I think more boys have long hair than the girls, who might just have a quite short haircut. Two of my 3 boys have long hair right now (oldest went short only because it's easier with sports/power tools for safety reasons), they all have super curly hair, so it's above their shoulders mostly, unless you tug a ringlet out to full length. Of their friends, Matt, Donovan, Brad, Stone, Slate immediately come to mind that all have long straight hair. Those are just the ones I know by sight. Slightly different thought: someone asked my boss why there weren't any dress up clothes for the girls at the library, just ones for the boys. Boss was taken aback; she thought she'd chosen gender neutral outfits, and girls and boys equally enjoy them: veterinarian, police officer, firefighter. So this mom thought girls can't even pretend to be those things? But why do costumes have to be gender neutral?
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Nov 21, 2019 21:46:42 GMT -5
These two posts sparked several different thoughts in me. First, lots of the old ideas that distinguished/separated the sexes have broken down with the kids in school now. Cool guys wear pink, it's a thing. And sometimes I think more boys have long hair than the girls, who might just have a quite short haircut. Two of my 3 boys have long hair right now (oldest went short only because it's easier with sports/power tools for safety reasons), they all have super curly hair, so it's above their shoulders mostly, unless you tug a ringlet out to full length. Of their friends, Matt, Donovan, Brad, Stone, Slate immediately come to mind that all have long straight hair. Those are just the ones I know by sight. Slightly different thought: someone asked my boss why there weren't any dress up clothes for the girls at the library, just ones for the boys. Boss was taken aback; she thought she'd chosen gender neutral outfits, and girls and boys equally enjoy them: veterinarian, police officer, firefighter. So this mom thought girls can't even pretend to be those things? But why do costumes have to be gender neutral? I don't think they have to be gender neutral, but if they are they all get twice the usage, right? There's only 3 of them, we have limited space.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 21, 2019 22:23:34 GMT -5
You did say that a man and wife didn't need to paw at each other in public when all I asked about was a kiss. Pawing is different than being a pervert. It’s called consideration for others, manners, politeness, good taste , being well brought up, having class. Something that seems to be missing in some people, apparently. As I stated previously, holding hands or a peck on the cheek/lips is different than pawing.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Nov 21, 2019 22:25:04 GMT -5
You did say that a man and wife didn't need to paw at each other in public when all I asked about was a kiss. Pawing is different than being a pervert. It’s called consideration for others, manners, politeness, good taste , being well brought up, having class. Something that seems to be missing in some people, apparently. Yes, these attributes are missing in Trump, but you voted for him anyway.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 21, 2019 22:25:46 GMT -5
These two posts sparked several different thoughts in me. First, lots of the old ideas that distinguished/separated the sexes have broken down with the kids in school now. Cool guys wear pink, it's a thing. And sometimes I think more boys have long hair than the girls, who might just have a quite short haircut. Two of my 3 boys have long hair right now (oldest went short only because it's easier with sports/power tools for safety reasons), they all have super curly hair, so it's above their shoulders mostly, unless you tug a ringlet out to full length. Of their friends, Matt, Donovan, Brad, Stone, Slate immediately come to mind that all have long straight hair. Those are just the ones I know by sight. Slightly different thought: someone asked my boss why there weren't any dress up clothes for the girls at the library, just ones for the boys. Boss was taken aback; she thought she'd chosen gender neutral outfits, and girls and boys equally enjoy them: veterinarian, police officer, firefighter. So this mom thought girls can't even pretend to be those things? But why do costumes have to be gender neutral? Why do they have to be masculine or feminine depending on who's wearing them?
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Nov 21, 2019 22:39:09 GMT -5
I remember being kind of stunned at the idea of drag queens when I first got exposed to it, I'm not really sure why. Something about men being dressed up like women somehow being wrong, but don't ask me exactly why, There is no problem with women dressing up as men. Now I find it funny it ever freaked me out. I'm not aware of any other "deviant" behaviour attributed to drag queens. They are female impersonators. And some of them are so good at it, doing great impressions of Joan Rivers, Barbara Streisand, Liza Minelli etc. Of all the things to worry about in the world that doesn't make my list.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Nov 22, 2019 6:56:52 GMT -5
That's something I didn't think of. Do the Neverdragqueeners have a problem with celebrity impersonators reading to their children? Why or why not?
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