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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2015 20:21:34 GMT -5
Doesn't anyone think it is interesting that many students in the school walked out, protesting the resource officer's firing? That student must have been horribly disruptive preceding this incident to get the students to object AGAINST their classmate. Or... even if she wasn't THAT disruptive, they saw (courtesy of the many videos that an amazing number of people cannot comprehend {there was no "throwing" of the student, for one thing}) that the whole incident was still HER fault.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2015 20:26:43 GMT -5
At 7 seconds on your video is the exact same drop of her that I posted (just a different angle)... and there's no toss in your video either. There's a drop where she slips out of his grasp as she's falling... but no "toss". A horizontal 'drop' Of course she slipped out of his grasp when he launched her forward- you see what you want to see- as I predicted you are going to argue physics and semantics- anything but concede you are wrong. Believe what you want- the boss and investigators determined it was not a proper action- case closed. I don't "see what I want to see". I see what's actually there. I didn't say "horizontal" You can see in the video that her fall pivots on the back leg of the desk. And he didn't "launch her forward". You are the one seeing what you want to see... just like you are reading what you want to read.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2015 20:30:12 GMT -5
But how many of those 100 students were in classes that were disrupted by this student repeatedly and were tired of their classes being derailed by a very selfish classmate? I'd hazard a guess that those 100 students were in many or all of the classes that had experienced the problems and they were sick and tired and just waiting for someone to do something about it. That is one hell of an assumption. Is there any evidence this girl was a discipline problem?Maybe the fact that he was a coach had something to do with it. The nickname 'officer slam' doesn't help his case either. Obviously he has a reputation. No evidence the girl has one.First bolded: Umm.... yeah. There's videos all over the place that she's a discipline problem. People who aren't discipline problems don't need the "Resource Officer" called on them in the first place. Second bolded: Except for all the video evidence floating around the internet, of course. And "reputation" doesn't mean it's deserved. Unfounded gossip can create reputations perfectly fine... especially in school.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 1, 2015 20:46:15 GMT -5
You cite first hand knowledge of a consequence being given out for misbehavior. You indict this was done to one of the boys (plural) who regularly acted out. I have never figured out why people think that beating on kids "back in the day" prevented misbehavior when they tell stories about principals hitting kids for misbehavior back in the day. I didn't say it prevented misbehavior. What I said was: It rarely happened when I was in school. I also said we all knew what was waiting for us at home was worse than anything the school might deliver. The latter was intimidating! I think it would prevent misbehavior. Can you imagine if she hadn't gotten away with it? Students would be talking about what happened to little Susie when she was disruptive. It might prevent someone from thinking she's cool and got away with it so I can as well. Now they know they can act up and get someone fired. Brilliant.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 1, 2015 20:52:53 GMT -5
I didn't say it prevented misbehavior. What I said was: It rarely happened when I was in school. I also said we all knew what was waiting for us at home was worse than anything the school might deliver. The latter was intimidating! I think it would prevent misbehavior. Can you imagine if she hadn't gotten away with it? Students would be talking about what happened to little Susie when she was disruptive. It might prevent someone from thinking she's cool and got away with it so I can as well. Now they know they can act up and get someone fired. Brilliant. While I didn't say it prevented misbehavior, I didn't say it didn't prevent it, either. I don't know why I'm seeing such a difference today from what I experienced and remember. I see others here who are saying the same things I am. You're one of them, zib, so I know you get where I'm coming from. What we need to figure out is what has caused this exponential change? Is it because discipline and guidance from the home has decreased? Is it because the schools aren't handling problems effectively? Is it a combination of things causing it? I don't know. All I know is, this girl's behavior simply would not have occurred when I was in school, and there weren't any cops to be called. I tend to think it was because respect for authority was taught at home; however, with cops running amok and highly-placed officials in both government and private industry are behaving abominably and paying little if any price for doing so, it might not be so easy to teach these days.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 1, 2015 20:54:10 GMT -5
I didn't say it prevented misbehavior. What I said was: It rarely happened when I was in school. I also said we all knew what was waiting for us at home was worse than anything the school might deliver. The latter was intimidating! I think it would prevent misbehavior. Can you imagine if she hadn't gotten away with it? Students would be talking about what happened to little Susie when she was disruptive. It might prevent someone from thinking she's cool and got away with it so I can as well. Now they know they can act up and get someone fired. Brilliant. They can't act up and get someone fired unless that person acts inappropriately also. The problem is that she got an adult to act as shown in the video. It would have been one boring video if he hadn't lost it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2015 21:03:12 GMT -5
The student was SO out of order, and should of just put her cellphone away. But she didn't. How asinine of her, as in stubborn. If she were mine, she would hate for me to take care of the matter, I can tell you that one for sure. I liked reading the idea about phoning the parents in front of the student. I really do. If I were teacher, I'd ask the class to remain patient through the process, because it may take some time. Quiet the class completely, and cause the offending student to feel the discomfort of silence while waiting for the parent(s). Then again, sending for some of these parents because of their child's behavior means little if anything to them. Their babies can do NO wrong. How is that handled? Sad, isn't it?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 1, 2015 21:26:00 GMT -5
I know. If any of us had dared to be defiant, our butts would be strung up. I know a girl who got paddled by the principal because she wouldn't stop talking in class. Bad enough but when her father found out, she literally couldn't sit down for a week. My parents told me the same thing. If they ever got a call from the school, don't bother getting off the bus. Your child's behavior reflected on your parenting skills or lack of them. Now we have parents so unworthy of anything, let alone respect, just spewing out children for whatever reason, money, something to play with, whatever, but not bothering to raise or civilize them. You see them in jammies in public. Or at midnight movies with their babies/little kids. Not got to parent a parrot but they've got children.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 1, 2015 21:27:48 GMT -5
Not enough sense to parent a parrot.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2015 22:04:50 GMT -5
Not enough sense to parent a parrot. That describes MOST parents nowadays.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2015 22:08:19 GMT -5
I know. If any of us had dared to be defiant, our butts would be strung up. I know a girl who got paddled by the principal because she wouldn't stop talking in class. Bad enough but when her father found out, she literally couldn't sit down for a week. My parents told me the same thing. If they ever got a call from the school, don't bother getting off the bus. Your child's behavior reflected on your parenting skills or lack of them. Now we have parents so unworthy of anything, let alone respect, just spewing out children for whatever reason, money, something to play with, whatever, but not bothering to raise or civilize them. You see them in jammies in public. Or at midnight movies with their babies/little kids. Not got to parent a parrot but they've got children. No kidding. If I'd EVER needed to be disciplined in school, I would have BEGGED the teacher to BEAT me... if the would just not tell my parents. I didn't fear my parents... but... when I got punished (on the rare times that I DID get punished) it was... shall we say... memorable. Back when and where I was growing up, public disruptions by kids were few and far between... because the parents actually understood how to discipline their kids... and the kids knew they would get it when they got home if anyone else had to discipline them.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Nov 2, 2015 4:37:04 GMT -5
Probably the hundred grateful the officer didn't take the billis-approved approaches of either a) pissing away the rest of their instructional time by waiting the student out, or b) delighting the Internet with a farcical video of the officer and principal trying to port the girl, desk and all, down to the principal's office. The full video footage clinched it for me. He tried pulling her out of the desk and she violently resisted before she was flipped. There is absolutely no way the man should have been fired for this. Paul is right. This is the school and the authorities, fearful of the mob, hoping to keep their arses out of the fire by taking the easy way out. The only good news is that, since this officer apparently excels at his job, he probably won't have too much trouble being hired by a school that deserves him.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 9:42:12 GMT -5
... Probably the hundred grateful the officer didn't take the billis-approved approaches of either a) pissing away the rest of their instructional time by waiting the student out, or b) delighting the Internet with a farcical video of the officer and principal trying to port the girl, desk and all, down to the principal's office. ... You might be correct that the unsanctioned walk out during class time was a show of commitment to educational excellence and respect for authority by a group of American youth. It might also have been a protest against the firing of a football coach just because of some stupid female underclassman.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Nov 2, 2015 10:23:28 GMT -5
I think welfare in its current form is destroying productivity and all that jazz. If there were more of a steps and tiering system, I don't think it would negatively affect productivity as much. The welfare system needs a complete overhaul to create independent and productive citizens while giving them a little help. 99 weeks of unemployment is completely insane IMO. I would like to see the system overhauled as well. Not to make it puntative (as I'm sfraid Republicans would do) but, as M12.0 suggests, to create steps to help people get out of poverty. I know we don't live in Denmark, but I was impressed by the way they handle the situation when someone loses their job. Step 1 -unemployment for 90 days Step 2 - if after 90 days they still haven't found a job, they are tested for aptitude and skills and required to enroll in a training program in order to continue receiving benefits (the training is free) They also have very inexpensixe, high quality daycare. Even someone making only minimum wage can make ends meet because a hugh percentage of their paycheck isn't going to daycare.
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jambo101
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Post by jambo101 on Nov 2, 2015 11:50:22 GMT -5
While the kid may have been disruptive in some manner the video just shows her sitting at her desk,was it really necessary for some uniformed thug to come in and beat her up for whatever disruption she was causing?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Nov 2, 2015 13:44:24 GMT -5
I have posted it, and a LOT like it before. What I have been told is effectively, "I don't really have the time to get myself fully informed on the topic, but I am going to maintain my baseless criticisms of your posts". is this an irony free zone? Apparently it is. I had to try though. I won't bother again...
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 2, 2015 14:29:24 GMT -5
While the kid may have been disruptive in some manner the video just shows her sitting at her desk,was it really necessary for some uniformed thug to come in and beat her up for whatever disruption she was causing? How would you feel if it had been YOUR kid in that class whose education was being disrupted? Why does one kid get to disrupt 30 others?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 14:42:30 GMT -5
While the kid may have been disruptive in some manner the video just shows her sitting at her desk,was it really necessary for some uniformed thug to come in and beat her up for whatever disruption she was causing? How would you feel if it had been YOUR kid in that class whose education was being disrupted? Why does one kid get to disrupt 30 others? I would have preferred that the uniformed individual had modeled deescalation skills that did not result in physical contact. I feel that educational presentation would have more than worth the lost subject material not covered during that time period. The one kid gets to disrupt because we refuse to pay a tax rate that allows for one on one tutoring for all students.
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jambo101
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Post by jambo101 on Nov 2, 2015 15:22:13 GMT -5
While the kid may have been disruptive in some manner the video just shows her sitting at her desk,was it really necessary for some uniformed thug to come in and beat her up for whatever disruption she was causing? How would you feel if it had been YOUR kid in that class whose education was being disrupted? Why does one kid get to disrupt 30 others? When i went to school there were occasional disruptions in class which the teacher and or principal dealt with, i'll presume the same was true during my 2 kids education, whatever the disruption might have been i never felt it would have warranted some uniformed thug trying to solve the problem by throwing a kid across the class room then beating the kid up. Rather than have my kids witness such barbaric behaviour by some one posing as an authority figure i'd rather them go through an occasional class room disruption. Maybe you can remind me of what the nature of the disruption was to merit such a response.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Nov 2, 2015 16:31:07 GMT -5
I can't access the article here at work, so I'm going by my memory but, as I recall:
1. The girl had her phone out in class. This is against class rules. It apparent to anyone with a brain why this is against the rules. 2. The girl was told to hand her phone over after being caught breaking the rules. 3. The girl refused to do so - stating something along the lines of "I only had it out for a quick second." 4. The teacher told her she would have to leave class for refusing direction. 5. The girl refused to leave class. 6. The teacher called administration. 7. The administrator directed the girl to leave class. 8. The girl refused. 9. The Resource Officer was called. 10. He directed the girl to leave class. 11. The girl refused. 12. The girl found out what it means to do as your told when your told to do so.
I agree with you that it was excessive, but that's what happens when you act like the rules don't apply to you. I don't feel sorry for her, but I don't think his firing was unreasonable. That concrete wall could have done some real damage had she hit her head.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 16:40:57 GMT -5
... 12. The girl found out what it means to do as your told when your told to do so. ... Yes she did learn. A man grabs you and throws you around. The male students also learned what to do when a girl doesn't do as she is told. EDIT: I should have added in this case they also learned that there is a consequence that the male is subjected to although some think that he shouldn't.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Nov 2, 2015 17:35:12 GMT -5
... Probably the hundred grateful the officer didn't take the billis-approved approaches of either a) pissing away the rest of their instructional time by waiting the student out, or b) delighting the Internet with a farcical video of the officer and principal trying to port the girl, desk and all, down to the principal's office. ... You might be correct that the unsanctioned walk out during class time was a show of commitment to educational excellence and respect for authority by a group of American youth. It might also have been a protest against the firing of a football coach just because of some stupid female underclassman. Nice try, but the walk-out was provoked, and it doesn't disrupt other students' learning. ... 12. The girl found out what it means to do as your told when your told to do so. ... Yes she did learn. A man grabs you and throws you around. The male students also learned what to do when a girl doesn't do as she is told. Another nice try (I commend your thoroughness in scouring the pot for an argument), casting this a man-on-women issue. I guess it all balances out in your world: The woman is an idiot who will beat her kid in future because a police officer flipped her. But she'll be married to an idiot husband who will beat her in future because he once witnessed a police officer flip a woman. That will be mom's punishment for beating her kid. But who will punish dad? Not to worry. When the kid grows older, he'll see the video of his mom being flipped by a police officer online and this will inspire him to beat his dad. That way the whole situation balances out. In my world: if the male students in the class go on to become police officers, may they also go on to take similar action against men and women alike in similar circumstances.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 2, 2015 17:37:57 GMT -5
How would you feel if it had been YOUR kid in that class whose education was being disrupted? Why does one kid get to disrupt 30 others? When i went to school there were occasional disruptions in class which the teacher and or principal dealt with, i'll presume the same was true during my 2 kids education, whatever the disruption might have been i never felt it would have warranted some uniformed thug trying to solve the problem by throwing a kid across the class room then beating the kid up. Rather than have my kids witness such barbaric behaviour by some one posing as an authority figure i'd rather them go through an occasional class room disruption. Maybe you can remind me of what the nature of the disruption was to merit such a response. She was NOT thrown across the class, nor was she beaten up. Please look at the video rather than just listen to the rhetoric. The nature of the disruption was that she had her cell phone out. She was told repeatedly to put it away and she ignored the teacher. She was told to leave the classroom, and she was ignored. An administrator was called and she ignored the administrator. So the next time a student refuses to put their cell phone away, this means that they can ignore the authorities? What sort of example does THAT set for the rest of the class? Why do you think that if this sort of disruption wasn't dealt with, it wouldn't have occurred again by the same student - or another one - who thought that they could get away with playing with their cell phone during class?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 2, 2015 18:07:11 GMT -5
When i went to school there were occasional disruptions in class which the teacher and or principal dealt with, i'll presume the same was true during my 2 kids education, whatever the disruption might have been i never felt it would have warranted some uniformed thug trying to solve the problem by throwing a kid across the class room then beating the kid up. Rather than have my kids witness such barbaric behaviour by some one posing as an authority figure i'd rather them go through an occasional class room disruption. Maybe you can remind me of what the nature of the disruption was to merit such a response. She was NOT thrown across the class, nor was she beaten up. Please look at the video rather than just listen to the rhetoric. The nature of the disruption was that she had her cell phone out. She was told repeatedly to put it away and she ignored the teacher. She was told to leave the classroom, and she was ignored. An administrator was called and she ignored the administrator. So the next time a student refuses to put their cell phone away, this means that they can ignore the authorities? What sort of example does THAT set for the rest of the class? Why do you think that if this sort of disruption wasn't dealt with, it wouldn't have occurred again by the same student - or another one - who thought that they could get away with playing with their cell phone during class? What do you call it then-two-handed bowling? He let go of her and her body continued across the floor.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 18:21:33 GMT -5
You might be correct that the unsanctioned walk out during class time was a show of commitment to educational excellence and respect for authority by a group of American youth. It might also have been a protest against the firing of a football coach just because of some stupid female underclassman. Nice try, but the walk-out was provoked, and it doesn't disrupt other students' learning.... You honestly believe that the lead up to and actual walk out/return didn't disrupt classes?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 18:23:40 GMT -5
When i went to school there were occasional disruptions in class which the teacher and or principal dealt with, i'll presume the same was true during my 2 kids education, whatever the disruption might have been i never felt it would have warranted some uniformed thug trying to solve the problem by throwing a kid across the class room then beating the kid up. Rather than have my kids witness such barbaric behaviour by some one posing as an authority figure i'd rather them go through an occasional class room disruption. Maybe you can remind me of what the nature of the disruption was to merit such a response. She was NOT thrown across the class, nor was she beaten up. Please look at the video rather than just listen to the rhetoric. The nature of the disruption was that she had her cell phone out. She was told repeatedly to put it away and she ignored the teacher. She was told to leave the classroom, and she was ignored. An administrator was called and she ignored the administrator. So the next time a student refuses to put their cell phone away, this means that they can ignore the authorities? What sort of example does THAT set for the rest of the class? Why do you think that if this sort of disruption wasn't dealt with, it wouldn't have occurred again by the same student - or another one - who thought that they could get away with playing with their cell phone during class? Has anyone proposed not dealing with the disruption?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 18:36:52 GMT -5
... Yes she did learn. A man grabs you and throws you around. The male students also learned what to do when a girl doesn't do as she is told. Another nice try (I commend your thoroughness in scouring the pot for an argument), casting this a man-on-women issue. I guess it all balances out in your world: The woman is an idiot who will beat her kid in future because a police officer flipped her. But she'll be married to an idiot husband who will beat her in future because he once witnessed a police officer flip a woman. That will be mom's punishment for beating her kid. But who will punish dad? Not to worry. When the kid grows older, he'll see the video of his mom being flipped by a police officer online and this will inspire him to beat his dad. That way the whole situation balances out. In my world: if the male students in the class go on to become police officers, may they also go on to take similar action against men and women alike in similar circumstances. I fully understand that the violence of this situation isn't a concern for you. I do believe that we learn what we do and what is done to us. I love the quote, "Don't worry that your children never listen to a word you say. Worry that they never miss a thing you do."
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 2, 2015 18:53:10 GMT -5
She was NOT thrown across the class, nor was she beaten up. Please look at the video rather than just listen to the rhetoric. The nature of the disruption was that she had her cell phone out. She was told repeatedly to put it away and she ignored the teacher. She was told to leave the classroom, and she was ignored. An administrator was called and she ignored the administrator. So the next time a student refuses to put their cell phone away, this means that they can ignore the authorities? What sort of example does THAT set for the rest of the class? Why do you think that if this sort of disruption wasn't dealt with, it wouldn't have occurred again by the same student - or another one - who thought that they could get away with playing with their cell phone during class? Has anyone proposed not dealing with the disruption? So you suggest that this kid just play with her cell phone the entire class period? You don't think that this is going to be a problem?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 2, 2015 19:06:57 GMT -5
Has anyone proposed not dealing with the disruption? So you suggest that this kid just play with her cell phone the entire class period? You don't think that this is going to be a problem? As I have stated previously, I think the best way to deal with a student who has dug his/her heels in is to isolate and wait them out.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 2, 2015 19:23:26 GMT -5
And exactly how do you plan on isolating a student that has dug in their heels? She's demonstrated that she refuses to leave the class, so your solution is that the entire class moves instead? And you think that's not disruptive?
Where do you think you are going to move an entire class to, to complete the lesson? Most schools don't have spare rooms as they are already overcrowded.
The student's won, regardless.
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