Sandra Bland's Murder May Not Be Racism- It's Worse

[Deleted]

Jul 23, 2015 15:46:35 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I just do what they tell me to do. Why is that so hard for people to understand? They don't know what kind of person they are stopping, I'm sure the adrenal starts flowing.

If I was an officer that would piss me off to. Also she made a few snarky remarks to him, I likely would have arrested them too.

Odd that in 3 days she couldn't make bail, I think you only have to post a few dollars, no family or friends would do that?

About the suicide part I don't know. Like they said today, that was state police and a local jail, guess we will have to see about that.

I feel like anytime I see a traffic stop anymore we should stop and offer the officer assistance and take videos in his defense as

everyone seems to be after the cops anymore.  What a thankless job for little money.

The thing is, citizens are people too. Maybe they had a terrible day before they got pulled over by the police and they're tone of voice isn't exactly right. Are we really expected to keep our heads down and mumble yes sir and no sir in the presence of police officers? I've been short with police officers before. I was cooperative, didn't curse or make any verbal threats or sudden moves, but my irritation was clear from my verbal responses. Should I have been arrested just because they didn't like my attitude?

There's a big to-do going on in Memphis, Tennessee about the police shooting and killing a young man that was a passenger in a car that was pulled over. I don't know the details of the story because I'm sick of hearing about the police killing people. Anyway, there was an attorney on the news talking about the rights of passengers when the police pull the car over. It seems to me, that it doesn't really matter what rights you have or what the laws say, if you run into the wrong one, the guy with the badge and the gun IS the law and you have no rights. 

So now they're "scared" of us and we don't trust them not to harm or kill us. That's not how it's suppose to be.

[Deleted]

Jul 23, 2015 15:52:07 GMT -5 imawino said:

Jul 23, 2015 15:46:35 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I just do what they tell me to do. Why is that so hard for people to understand? They don't know what kind of person they are stopping, I'm sure the adrenal starts flowing.

If I was an officer that would piss me off to. Also she made a few snarky remarks to him, I likely would have arrested them too.

Odd that in 3 days she couldn't make bail, I think you only have to post a few dollars, no family or friends would do that?

About the suicide part I don't know. Like they said today, that was state police and a local jail, guess we will have to see about that.

I feel like anytime I see a traffic stop anymore we should stop and offer the officer assistance and take videos in his defense as

everyone seems to be after the cops anymore.  What a thankless job for little money.

I haven't been following this case at all. But the bolded comment above is seriously "what the fuck?!?!" worthy. In your opinion, making snarky comments is reasonable grounds for arrest?   That is total insanity.  The whole world would be in jail.  

While I was typing my long-ass reply, imawino summed it up with just a few words. lol

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

There's actually speculation that she was dead or something was horribly wrong in her mug shot. Did you happen to see it?

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I think we need an addition to the bill of rights- the right to be left the fuck alone.  Why can't police seem to grasp that we have the right to ignore their "would you mind, please?" requests. Yeah, I do mind. Leave me the hell alone. 

They need to amend Miranda:  you have the right to be left alone. You have the right to ignore my illegitimate, erroneous, and outright illegal requests. 

It's getting to the point where if I'm in a situation where the officer is clearly losing his or her composure, I think right now it's 50/50 whether or not I just drive away.  I bet this woman wishes she gunned it.

[Value Buy]

Jul 23, 2015 21:30:28 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

There's actually speculation that she was dead or something was horribly wrong in her mug shot. Did you happen to see it?

scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/l/t1.0-9/11693991_107140212966798_699561781047563617_n.jpg?oh=1b91c264d7c3af95119b3b8b1fecb390&oe=5643D366

I think we need an addition to the bill of rights- the right to be left the fuck alone.  Why can't police seem to grasp that we have the right to ignore their "would you mind, please?" requests. Yeah, I do mind. Leave me the hell alone. 

They need to amend Miranda:  you have the right to be left alone. You have the right to ignore my illegitimate, erroneous, and outright illegal requests. 

It's getting to the point where if I'm in a situation where the officer is clearly losing his or her composure, I think right now it's 50/50 whether or not I just drive away.  I bet this woman wishes she gunned it.

When have you ever seen a nice mug shot that did not make you look guilty as heck?
Since she did call home to family after being booked, she was alive.
Or was that faked too?

[Ombud]

Why wouldn't / couldn't she make bail?? Did her family not bailing her out cause her to commit suicide?

[Deleted]

I saw the full video last night. That cop was WAY out of line. She was annoyed but she even expressed that civilly. There was no reason for him to order her to put out her cigarette or get out of the car. No legal reason that is. Then to threaten to tazer her was absurd.

[Deleted]

Jul 23, 2015 14:14:00 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

It appears from the video that he told her to get out of the car because she refused his order to extinguish her cigarette which was, by the way, a quite common order.   Most people here would never think about stuff like this because they would never do it, but there have been a whole bunch of incidences of officers intentionally burned when they step up the window to collect information like a driver's license, registration, etc. The driver with the cigarette may intentionally burn the officer, intentionally flick it at the officer...and I would imagine it hurts. He told her to put out her cigarette for that reason. She refused and got all stupid and she got arrested.   What happened after that is being investigated but it appears that part is pretty clear. 

He already had all her info. And I think if she was going to burn him she would have done it as he was trying to drag her out of the car.

[violagirl]

I read the transcript of the arrest. I am not from the US, and I am white so I probably have a different perspective than she did.

I was pulled over by the police a few weeks ago, when I saw the lights go on I was like that cant' be for me, I wasn't speeding or anything, but pulled over and yep, it was me they were after. The beginning of our conversation was not completely unlike the one she had. He asked a couple of questions, told me I was pulled over because my inspection sticker was two months over due. I didn't know that, promised to take care of it right away. He wrote me a $180 ticket, which was kind of crappy, but technically I was in the wrong. The ticket says you can go to court if you don't think you should pay. So that is always an option. He said he could have my car towed, but it looked like I was on my way to work so he let me go and I assured him I was going to go right away to have it taken care of. He wished me a good day, I bade him farewell and left. If I disagreed with the ticket, then I would have just gone to court, not attempt to fight on the side of the road. 

From the transcripts, it appears she already was ready for a fight before he said a word, which in turn escalated his response to her. I dont' know if what he did was right, most people are kind of ticked off when pulled over, especially if they do not feel they deserve a ticket, so you would think he is used to being on the receiving end of some degree of belligerence. I didn't watch the video, so I didnt' see if she signed the ticket and returned it to him (which is what you have to do here probalby the same in US?) at that point, he could have told her to have a good day and left. 

If I had acted less respectfully toward the officer, would he have pulled me from my car? He legally had the right to have my car towed so, I guess he could have. 

I am not sure any part of the stop in her case was racially motivated which seems to be what many people think. It looked like two people who got their backs up and one side had the gun. I think there were several points where either one of them could have de-escalated the emotions, but chose not to. 

When he came back to the car and said are you ok? She could have said yes, I'm just mad at getting a ticket. When he asked her to put our her cigarette, she could have done it. So I can see why he responded the way he did. Everything he told her to do, she resisted. 

Worst case scenario she was pulled over because he was racist. It is not logical to me that in that situation the best route would be to go out of my way to antagonize someone who may already have an issue. Especially, if that person is in a position of authority. 

I would like to understand what she was thinking. 

[ArchietheDragon]

Jul 24, 2015 12:10:50 GMT -5 violagirl said:

I would like to understand what she was thinking. 

Since she is dead, that will be tough. 

[Shooby]

I think the cops absolutely killed Eric Garner. In this case I don't. She had issues. Yeah the cop was a jerk. That isn't murder.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I do think there should be an investigation, after all she did die on their watch.  So it's important to figure out why that happened and prevent it from happening again as best they can.

But I am not convinced they killed her.  You can't know who is going to commit suicide and who isn't unless they tell you.  She may not have been as fine as the people who knew her thought she was.

I'll wait to see how the investigation pans out before handing down judgment on either party involved.

[Deleted]

Jul 24, 2015 14:17:22 GMT -5 Shooby said:

I think the cops absolutely killed Eric Garner. In this case I don't. She had issues. Yeah the cop was a jerk. That isn't murder.

I think the cop that arrested her should be punished for unlawful confinement and excessive force. He had no business threatening to taze her, ordering her out of the car or arresting her. Dying in jail is a separate issue and I think different people are responsible.

ETA - I would even charge the cop with assault.

[imawino]

Jul 24, 2015 13:50:35 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I will wait to see Paul write what bad happened to his kids when he tells them not to respect police and just drive away.

They will get arrested or possibly shot but it will be the cops fault. Remember what you are saying Paul.

Again, seriously??  So can you clarify if your belief is that they "should" arrest and/or kill Paul's kids if they behave disrespectfully, or just that they "will"?   

[Icelandic Woman]

I heard on the news this morning that an independent coroner has ruled her death a suicide. So no murder happened here.

Yes I agree that this police officer is not one of the good ones and yes there are bad apple's in every bunch but there lots of very good ones doing a very difficult job.

It is apparent from Paul's dislike of all police that one pissed in his cornflakes at some point in his life to cause him to have such disdain for them but here is an example of a good one.

www.today.com/news/police-officer-shares-meal-homeless-man-nobody-wants-eat-alone-t34466

[sarcasticgirl]

Jul 23, 2015 16:37:18 GMT -5 @patstab said:

You know we are raising a bunch of young people that have no respect for teachers, no respect for parents, no respect for any

kind of authority. She also used some f you words, I would NEVER say something like that to any of the listed people. That's a

lot of whats happening in this country, total lack of respect for anyone.

So now what? We don't let police stop anyone anymore, those guys are not perfect and they see so much from what I've read

they can do nothing about. I guess we need to get rid of all authority.

There will be a big pay out of money as usual.

I want to see how the investigation plays out, won't matter, the family and others won't agree with it and even if they are found

innocent there will be civil suits for big dollars. Why would I as  cop take a chance on stopping someone that smarts off to me

and even mess with it.  I would let them all go, why put my job on the line.  He will lose his rightly or wrongly and end his career.

I must see things from another angle, in all the cases I've read about, if these folks had just complied with the police they would still be alive, that's what I see. I didn't see him asking anything demeaning, rude, or anything other then please put out your cigarette.

I don't care what your position is... The president... The pope... Whatever and You try and Lord your "authority" over me and threaten me with physical violence? Dropping the F bomb is the most polite thing I would do.

Why is it that he doesn't have to be polite or respectful because he is an officer? His attitude was disgusting and reaked of a little man on a power trip.

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[zibazinski]

Well, the fact of the matter is you don't bring your mouth and attitude to a gun fight. You're going to lose. Deal with the issue after the fact not during.

[Ombud]

The officer has the legal right to ask her to step out of the car in the USA. Maybe not in other countries but it happened on US soil. When she escalated it, he had the right to arrest her. She was asked on intake if she was suicidal at that time and said 'no.' She then committed suicide after a phone call on her cell.

Why wasn't her cell phone locked up so that she couldn't have a distressful call unobserved?

If intake did not follow policy & procedures, then P&P need to be changed

[sarcasticgirl]

Yes, but what was the point of trying to get her out of the car after you've already done everything you needed to do? Except possibly to be a prick and exert power over someone.

I have respect for the position and authority but when the person is clearly abusing it, all respect is gone.

Why is the onus on the non trained, non uniformed civilian to be respectful yet it is okay for someone who has sworn to serve and protect and should have gone through appropriate training to threaten to "light you up"?!?! I am sorry, that is simply INAPPROPRIATE On all levels here


And in case you were wondering there is a middle ground between this sort of behavior and total anarchy and dissolution of all authority. I am not quite sure why people have to be so ridiculously extreme.

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[djAdvocate]

Jul 25, 2015 9:17:22 GMT -5 Ombud said:

The officer has the legal right to ask her to step out of the car in the USA. Maybe not in other countries but it happened on US soil. When she escalated it, he had the right to arrest her. She was asked on intake if she was suicidal at that time and said 'no.' She then committed suicide after a phone call on her cell.

Why wasn't her cell phone locked up so that she couldn't have a distressful call unobserved?

If intake did not follow policy & procedures, then P&P need to be changed

i understand the need of the officer to feel safe.  but given how many people are getting killed for little or no reason these days, i think the time has long since come where we should be questioning some of these "needs".

[Ombud]

She wasn't killed, she committed suicide after a phone call

[djAdvocate]

Jul 25, 2015 11:53:19 GMT -5 Ombud said:

She wasn't killed, she committed suicide after a phone call

i wasn't talking about Bland, bro.  sorry if you misunderstood that, but i DID say "people", not "individual".

[Ombud]

Gotcha

An error occurred in this case when intake did not secured her cell.

Wonder who she called? PD knows that. Why dn family post bail? Still many unanswered questions

[Value Buy]

Jul 24, 2015 12:10:50 GMT -5 violagirl said:

I read the transcript of the arrest. I am not from the US, and I am white so I probably have a different perspective than she did.

I was pulled over by the police a few weeks ago, when I saw the lights go on I was like that cant' be for me, I wasn't speeding or anything, but pulled over and yep, it was me they were after. The beginning of our conversation was not completely unlike the one she had. He asked a couple of questions, told me I was pulled over because my inspection sticker was two months over due. I didn't know that, promised to take care of it right away. He wrote me a $180 ticket, which was kind of crappy, but technically I was in the wrong. The ticket says you can go to court if you don't think you should pay. So that is always an option. He said he could have my car towed, but it looked like I was on my way to work so he let me go and I assured him I was going to go right away to have it taken care of. He wished me a good day, I bade him farewell and left. If I disagreed with the ticket, then I would have just gone to court, not attempt to fight on the side of the road. 

From the transcripts, it appears she already was ready for a fight before he said a word, which in turn escalated his response to her. I dont' know if what he did was right, most people are kind of ticked off when pulled over, especially if they do not feel they deserve a ticket, so you would think he is used to being on the receiving end of some degree of belligerence. I didn't watch the video, so I didnt' see if she signed the ticket and returned it to him (which is what you have to do here probalby the same in US?) at that point, he could have told her to have a good day and left. 

If I had acted less respectfully toward the officer, would he have pulled me from my car? He legally had the right to have my car towed so, I guess he could have. 

I am not sure any part of the stop in her case was racially motivated which seems to be what many people think. It looked like two people who got their backs up and one side had the gun. I think there were several points where either one of them could have de-escalated the emotions, but chose not to. 

When he came back to the car and said are you ok? She could have said yes, I'm just mad at getting a ticket. When he asked her to put our her cigarette, she could have done it. So I can see why he responded the way he did. Everything he told her to do, she resisted. 

Worst case scenario she was pulled over because he was racist. It is not logical to me that in that situation the best route would be to go out of my way to antagonize someone who may already have an issue. Especially, if that person is in a position of authority. 

I would like to understand what she was thinking. 

There is a good possibility she was pulled over because (I assume) she had out of state license plates. She had just accepted a job in Texas, but I would think she had Illinois plates on the car.
Makes for an easy pull over, not upsetting a local , but an out of stater, but then he was letting her off with just a warning rather than a ticket, so I am not sure what was the reasonng.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jul 23, 2015 15:46:35 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I just do what they tell me to do. Why is that so hard for people to understand? They don't know what kind of person they are stopping, I'm sure the adrenal starts flowing.

If I was an officer that would piss me off to. Also she made a few snarky remarks to him, I likely would have arrested them too.

Odd that in 3 days she couldn't make bail, I think you only have to post a few dollars, no family or friends would do that?

Being snarky is not reason to arrest someone.

Her bail was $5000, which seems excessive for what happened.  However, many people do not have that kind of money hanging around.  There is a period of time where I could not have come up with $5000 either.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jul 25, 2015 13:36:37 GMT -5 @patstab said:

Was that the total bail or she just had to pay a part. Don't they have bail bondsmen? I see them all over around jails.

Even 10% can be a strain for some people.  Someone needs to organize this and he family was in IL.  Not everyone can jump in a car and drive hundreds of miles at a moment's notice.

[zibazinski]

I'd get in a car and drive hundreds of miles to help someone I cared about. Sounds like she alienated everyone with her mouth. I'd be interested in knowing who she called that told her to F off.

[zibazinski]

I'm not positive but why did she kill herself after the phone call? Called an ex, called her parents, who did she call and what was said that sent her over? Will we ever know?

[Ombud]

They already know who she called but won't know what was said

[sarcasticgirl]

A Lawyer Gave Us the Blunt Truth About Sandra Bland's Arrest

www.attn.com/stories/2498/sandra-bland-arrest-lawful?utm_source=email&utm_medium=direct-share&utm_campaign=shares

www.attn.com/stories/2498/sandra-bland-arrest-lawful?utm_source=email&utm_medium=direct-share&utm_campaign=shares

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[Deleted]

Jul 26, 2015 13:22:30 GMT -5 sarcasticgirl said:

A Lawyer Gave Us the Blunt Truth About Sandra Bland's Arrest

www.attn.com/stories/2498/sandra-bland-arrest-lawful?utm_source=email&utm_medium=direct-share&utm_campaign=shares

www.attn.com/stories/2498/sandra-bland-arrest-lawful?utm_source=email&utm_medium=direct-share&utm_campaign=shares

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using proboards

That's interesting reading and I think it raises some very important questions and issues. It is concerning to me the amount of deference some police officers expect us to show them. How far are we willing to let that go? I know no one wants to deal with a jerk while they're just trying to do their job, but being a jerk isn't against the law and if your job requires you to deal with the public, you're going to run across some jerks.