Professional attire for women...

[Deleted]

What are your expectations?

We got a new Regional Vice President and she was in town last week visiting the stores in her region.

She visited my store on my day off so I did not get to meet her. We were out with a friend that is a co-manager at a sister store and I asked him how she was, how did he find her etc.

He said one thing that stick out and I even mentioned it to my wife later that evening: she was not dress professionally (and this guy is 25, a co-manager like me).

I was like what do you mean not dress professionally and he answered: she was showing too much cleavage. I just laugh and said something like: maybe she is proud of them and if she is blessed like my wife it is kinda hard to find things that cover the girls all the way.

So this is a Regional VP in charge of 30-40 stores, our boss boss boss and yet the thing that stick out to my friend was that she was showing too much cleavage.

Maybe I am not in tune with it since I am married to a woman that always had issues with her boobs since I met her and seriously considering breast reduction (42DDD). It runs in her family and 2 of her cousins and 1 aunt had it done and the only reason my wife is holding off is because she wants to be able to breast feed.

Anyway back to the conversation: I don't know how big the VP's boobs are since I did not meet her but my wife is really self conscious about hers:
- hard to find bra's that fit and they are more expensive
- dresses/shirts that fit well
- buttons popping in shirts or leaving a gap in the chest area so she tend to have to buy shirts that are 2-3 times her size

So people might think that my wife is trying to direct attention to her boobs when that is the last thing she wants to do; for that reason she doesn't wear Vnecks or anything like that. She used to be made fun of in high school and they would call them "bazooka's" so she is really self cautious about them and some day says things like: I wish I could just cut them off.

But the other thing; do we have a perception that woman in power or in charge shouldn't look sexy/hot or attractive? What would be considered the right amount of cleavage? What is too much and not enough?

Discuss!


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[midjd]

I'm not sure how to "quantify" cleavage... but I'd say more than 1" of exposed cleavage is probably too much for a professional setting. (Keep in mind I work in a conservative industry in a conservative state). Plus I think balance is the key. If you're wearing a relatively low-cut blouse, make sure your skirt hits the knee and you aren't wearing 5" stilettos. If you're wearing a short skirt, your boobs should be covered.

But the other thing; do we have a perception that woman in power or in charge shouldn't look sexy/hot or attractive? What would be considered the right amount of cleavage? What is too much and not enough?

I think women in power should be able to look as attractive as they can, or want to be - but I don't want to see 2-3" of some guy's exposed chest hair, either. Attractive /= cleavage. And I'm not sure "sexy" should be a look one strives for in the workplace, unless you're in the entertainment industry...

[Deleted]

Please don't accidentally send the OP to HR.

[Tennesseer]

Out of curiosity, you say store/stores. In general, what type of retail are you employed? Are the customers young in nature or do you have customers of all ages. Are most of the employees young(er) than most other retail type stores? Was the new boss there on official business or did she stop by on her off time?

Keep in mind how she was dressed was one person's opinion. You would have to see her yourself to form your own opinion.

[Deleted]

Nov 5, 2012 9:11:50 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Please don't accidentally send the OP to HR.

Lol

Unemployment line here I come! ;D


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[Deleted]

Nov 5, 2012 9:17:32 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Out of curiosity, you say store/stores. In general, what type of retail are you employed? Are the customers young in nature or do you have customers of all ages. Are most of the employees young(er) than most other retail type stores? Was the new boss there on official business or did she stop by on her off time?

Keep in mind how she was dressed was one person's opinion. You would have to see her yourself to form your own opinion.

Grocery Retail so our customers are consisted of all ages but mostly women; as for the workers also all ages.

The VP's or RVP's are not in the stores everyday, they are either at the zone office or corporate office so our customers don't see them often (if ever for some).

She was on official business since the General Manager was with her going around.

Again I did not meet her so cannot form an opinion; I just thought it was funny how he said it or it even crossed it mind that it was unprofessional.


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[Deleted]

I have a friend that gets accused of showing too much cleavage as well. It frustrates her. Most fashionable clothing is made for women with no bust so when she puts in on she has cleavage. I've been shopping with her. It's a fact. So she either shows some cleavage, dresses like Amy from the Big Bang Theory or spends way more money on her wardrobe. She shows the cleavage. She is not being indecent by any stretch of the imagination (no pun intended)

[Deleted]

Nov 5, 2012 9:24:25 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

I have a friend that gets accused of showing too much cleavage as well. It frustrates her. Most fashionable clothing is made for women with no bust so when she puts in on she has cleavage. I've been shopping with her. It's a fact. So she either shows some cleavage, dresses like Amy from the Big Bang Theory or spends way more money on her wardrobe. She shows the cleavage. She is not being indecent by any stretch of the imagination (no pun intended)

Sounds like what my wife goes through every day. And it is even worse for dresses:
- fit her body but boobs are just about to bust out
- fit the boobs (not showing cleavage) but the rest of the dress looks like it was made for someone 2-3 times her size and she is swimming in it.


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[Tennesseer]

Nov 5, 2012 9:24:25 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

I have a friend that gets accused of showing too much cleavage as well. It frustrates her. Most fashionable clothing is made for women with no bust so when she puts in on she has cleavage. I've been shopping with her. It's a fact. So she either shows some cleavage, dresses like Amy from the Big Bang Theory or spends way more money on her wardrobe. She shows the cleavage. She is not being indecent by any stretch of the imagination (no pun intended)

No matter how this woman dresses, be it a blouse or turtle neck sweater, her bosom is going to be very prominent.

Maybe she needs to wear Cat Woman eye glasses to draw attention away from her chest.

[thyme4change]

There is a difference between dressing to be attractive and dressing sexy. I tend to err on the side of too conservative when I'm being professional. But, if a guy noted that she was showing too much, and thought it was too much - then it was too much. I never want to leave a business meeting and have two of the guys talk about my boobs. Never. Just as if it would be an epic fail if any man left the room and two women noted that his pants were so tight we now know how big his package is.

[midjd]

There is a difference between dressing to be attractive and dressing sexy. I tend to err on the side of too conservative when I'm being professional. But, if a guy noted that she was showing too much, and thought it was too much - then it was too much. I never want to leave a business meeting and have two of the guys talk about my boobs. Never. Just as if it would be an epic fail if any man left the room and two women noted that his pants were so tight we now know how big his package is.

It's hard enough to get some people to take me seriously because of my age (even on YM )... I wouldn't want to make it more difficult by dressing provocatively.

Cawaiu, about how old is this manager?

[Deleted]

I never want to leave a business meeting and have two of the guys talk about my boobs.

That happens to big busted women all the time, no matter what they are wearing. Guys talk about boobs, especially big ones.

[Deleted]

Nov 5, 2012 10:01:47 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

I never want to leave a business meeting and have two of the guys talk about my boobs.

That happens to big busted women all the time, no matter what they are wearing. Guys talk about boobs, especially big ones.

Hey the first thing I noticed about my wife when I me her 10 years ago was her boobs. And I could not even see them as in cleavage since she was living school and had a uniform on; but it was obvious she had big boobs.

Not lips, face, legs, smile or anything... It was the boobs!


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[Deleted]

Nov 5, 2012 9:58:06 GMT -5 midjd said:

There is a difference between dressing to be attractive and dressing sexy. I tend to err on the side of too conservative when I'm being professional. But, if a guy noted that she was showing too much, and thought it was too much - then it was too much. I never want to leave a business meeting and have two of the guys talk about my boobs. Never. Just as if it would be an epic fail if any man left the room and two women noted that his pants were so tight we now know how big his package is.

It's hard enough to get some people to take me seriously because of my age (even on YM )... I wouldn't want to make it more difficult by dressing provocatively.

Cawaiu, about how old is this manager?

I would guess early 40's from what I can gather; a bit on the young side to be a VP but old enough to have the qualifications to be a VP.

When I read her bio (yes my job does a career bio on their website for all the big wigs that get promoted and funny they don't do it for the small guys at the stores... Who cares about Joe that got promoted to first clerk or department manager) she has been in the business for 20 some odd years .


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[midjd]

Well in her case, with 20 years' experience, maybe she's earned enough cred to be able to pull it off.

[thyme4change]

Well in her case, with 20 years' experience, maybe she's earned enough cred to be able to pull it off.

I doubt it. Just because she is doing well in career doesn't mean that she isn't starting to look sad and desparate by being a middle aged woman who wants men to look at her boobs. Maybe the only reason Carl's friend noticed is because he was grossed out.

[Deleted]

So I think it says more about your source of info that all he had to comment on was her boobs. Sounds like he reduced a very succesful, capable woman down to cleavage.

[Deleted]

Maybe the only reason Carl's friend noticed is because he was grossed out.

Oh no, if he is comfortable enough to comment on her cleavage he would have been comfortable enough to say he was grossed out.

[Deleted]

Nov 5, 2012 10:12:33 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Well in her case, with 20 years' experience, maybe she's earned enough cred to be able to pull it off.

I doubt it. Just because she is doing well in career doesn't mean that she isn't starting to look sad and desparate by being a middle aged woman who wants men to look at her boobs. Maybe the only reason Carl's friend noticed is because he was grossed out.

I dunno; she is married with 4 kids aged 12,10, 8 and 6.

So I am thinking she gets enough attention at home


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[hoops902]

Nov 5, 2012 10:01:47 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

I never want to leave a business meeting and have two of the guys talk about my boobs.

That happens to big busted women all the time, no matter what they are wearing. Guys talk about boobs, especially big ones.

Yeah but with some guys, either they're going to talk about your boobs, or your butt, or your lips, or whatever else. The fact that some guy noticed a woman's breasts isn't an indication that they were inappropriate. Some guys are always going to notice something.

ETA: Though I think this entire thread is just a thinly veiled excuse for Carl to talk about his wife's boobs.

[swamp]

Though I think this entire thread is just a thinly veiled excuse for Carl to talk about his wife's boobs

[thyme4change]

Though I think this entire thread is just a thinly veiled excuse for Carl to talk about his wife's boobs.

My thoughts exactly.

[justme]

Tell your wife she needs to find a good tailor. Buy the clothes to fit the boobs and then tailor in the rest to fit the body.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Carl....YOU noticed your wife's boobs despite her uniform.

Do you think that this person could possibly be doing the same thing?

Like others have said, it is not easy to find clothes where you show no cleavage. It is a fine balance to find clothes that cover enough and not look like AmyFarrahFowler...

Many times, I'll put on a sweater and when I look at myself standing up, it looks ok. It's not until I bend over where I realize that my drop shows more than I'd like.

[thyme4change]

Noticing boobs (and talking about boobs) is different from noticing cleavage and talking about cleavage. Boobs are there - not much you can do about it. How much cleavage you show is controlled by you, and likely and indicator on if you want people to notice your boobs or ignore them.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Nov 5, 2012 10:47:36 GMT -5 justme said:

Tell your wife she needs to find a good tailor. Buy the clothes to fit the boobs and then tailor in the rest to fit the body.

Exactly. My aunt used to do this for me and I had some of the best fitting clothes of my life. For me, it was buying clothes that would fit my butt, but not gape horribly at the waist.

[formerroomate99]

At my last job, the idea of professional dress was rather skanky. Skin tight pants with the thong showing, plunging necklines.
At this place, folks are more conservative and the well endowed ladies tend to just wear tents.

I do agree that a professional woman who is well endowed needs to find a good tailor. Clothes off the rack only fit a small portion of the population.

[hoops902]

::At my last job, the idea of professional dress was rather skanky. Skin tight pants with the thong showing, plunging necklines. ::

Where did you say this was and are they hiring?

[thyme4change]

LOL - after working in this place for so many years - I'm not sure I know what is professional anymore or not. Jeans and baggy t-shirts on fat girls. There was one lady who did the best with what she had, and she used to show her thong on casual friday. Not only was it totally obnoxious, it was about 5 years after that went out of style.

[swamp]

<<pulls pants up to cover thong, pulls shirt up to hide cleavage>>