Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jun 6, 2012 17:55:58 GMT -5
Just my opinion here - I get that sometimes threads need to be deleted, but can they be locked with a message from a mod explaining why the deletion is occurring for a few hours so that people who were engaged in the thread but had to step away for awhile don't go crazy trying to find it?
Alternatively, could the posts at least be replaced by a quick message along the lines of "this thread has been deleted for X reason"?
It doesn't happen often, but every now and then a thread that seems perfectly civil and respectful (albeit sometimes a bit heated) goes "poof" without warning and people who were commenting on it are left to wonder and ask each other what happened, possibly even worry about the person posting in the thread. Sure, there are bad apples, but I feel that the vast majority of posters who make a real effort to be respectful and kind and constructive deserve more explanation than a thread simply vanishing with no warning at all.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Jun 6, 2012 18:15:42 GMT -5
Plus the benefit to lurkers who may be reading, but afraid to post... I know the Doxie threads inspired a LOT of action among YM-ers, I'd have to think that - even if the OP ignores/rejects advice - others reading might be helped by it...
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milee
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Post by milee on Jun 6, 2012 18:21:31 GMT -5
Totally. I know that I for one will never, ever buy myself a lifted Excursion. No matter how tempting that may be, I will resist.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jun 6, 2012 18:44:02 GMT -5
Plus the benefit to lurkers who may be reading, but afraid to post... I know the Doxie threads inspired a LOT of action among YM-ers, I'd have to think that - even if the OP ignores/rejects advice - others reading might be helped by it... the difference being, doxie has never asked us to remove her threads. I haven't been here much over the past couple days to know much about the thread y'all are referring to here, but if a poster's asked to remove a thread for reasons like that they are uncomfortable with the amount of personal information that's been posted, even if they weren't the ones to post it, we'll remove it. before I became a mod, I asked what I thought was a pretty generic question over on the tax boards, and a poster (who isn't here anymore) did some research from the clues in my OP and pretty much outed my identity - between that and other stuff I've posted here - in his reply, and wouldn't remove his posts no matter what I said or asked. one of the mods at the time removed the entire thread for me, after I think I'd asked all of them. if the OP said she'd keep you updated, I bet she will. she's been around awhile now, and probably values your opinions more than her immediate family and friends for some stuff. have faith. -chiver mod
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jun 6, 2012 18:53:15 GMT -5
Well, like I said, I understand that threads need to be deleted from time to time. Don't totally agree but I'm done questioning the mods on that one. I just feel like when people invest a huge amount of time and emotional energy in a thread, they're entitled to at least know WHY it was deleted, especially if the reason was something like "people were getting too nasty."
If nothing we said violated the CoC and a thread simply goes poof, are we supposed to assume we crossed some sort of unspoken line even if the real reason was something like "the OP asked that the thread be deleted"? Just doesn't seem right.
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Works4me
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Post by Works4me on Jun 6, 2012 18:56:14 GMT -5
Last I saw the thread had turned counter productive.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jun 6, 2012 18:57:12 GMT -5
Which in and of itself is not reason for a thread to be deleted, since threads go off-topic and counterproductive all the time.
Also, I'm not talking specifically about the stl thread (although obviously, that was the catalyst for my comment). When any long thread in which people are participating and clearly deeply invested is deleted, I feel we have the right to know why.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2012 19:02:07 GMT -5
I disagree. I think if the OP asks to have the thread deleted, and they have a good reason (and I'm sure they do, otherwise the Mods would not have agreed) they should have the thread deleted at their request.
Do keep in mind that if this community decides that delicate threads will be locked rather than deleted, there will probably be fewer posters making them.
Personally, I think somebody who creates a difficult thread should have the right to delete it. Especially since in this case it could potentially be a matter of life and death.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Jun 6, 2012 19:02:23 GMT -5
Have I ever told you how much I appreciate you explaining things nicely and never pulling the "DO NOT QUESTION THE MODS" routine? Because I really do. (Mmhmm is good about this too. They should make more of you guys.)
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jun 6, 2012 19:04:48 GMT -5
I disagree. I think if the OP asks to have the thread deleted, and they have a good reason (and I'm sure they do, otherwise the Mods would not have agreed) they should have the thread deleted at their request.
I didn't say they shouldn't - I think people SHOULD have their threads deleted upon request. But what's the matter with replacing the thread with something short and sweet like "OP requested thread be deleted"? That's all I'm asking for, in essence. A quick word of explanation - doesn't have to be super specific - so we're not all sitting there wondering "Was it something I said? Do I need to worry I'm going to be banned? Is she in trouble?"
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jun 6, 2012 19:10:36 GMT -5
And anyway, all of this is just my opinion. Which is why I prefaced it by saying so.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Jun 6, 2012 19:16:33 GMT -5
Message deleted by mmhmm. Since the thread was deleted at the request of the OP, it's probably not a good idea to repost particulars from the thread. Thanks.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jun 6, 2012 19:36:19 GMT -5
What thread is gone?
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jun 6, 2012 19:58:02 GMT -5
Which in and of itself is not reason for a thread to be deleted, since threads go off-topic and counterproductive all the time. Also, I'm not talking specifically about the stl thread (although obviously, that was the catalyst for my comment). When any long thread in which people are participating and clearly deeply invested is deleted, I feel we have the right to know why. okay, so where it gets tough is that things don't ever get totally wiped out. they just get moved to areas of the board that are not at all publicly accessible. so we really can't leave you a path to follow as to why some certain thread got (re)moved or why. I have posed the question as to whether we can leave a generic message in place that the thread has been removed instead of it just going poof! I honestly don't know if that's possible, based on what I've seen from the times I've moved threads - we're generally just given an option to leave a note that such-and-such thread has been moved <here> with a link....and as I just said, that link isn't going to be useful to you guys.....so we don't tend to leave it. if it's possibly to leave a thread title w/o the identity of the OP, that would totally be ideal. I'll look into it and will push for that if possible, but no guarantees. I disagree. I think if the OP asks to have the thread deleted, and they have a good reason (and I'm sure they do, otherwise the Mods would not have agreed) they should have the thread deleted at their request. Do keep in mind that if this community decides that delicate threads will be locked rather than deleted, there will probably be fewer posters making them. Personally, I think somebody who creates a difficult thread should have the right to delete it. Especially since in this case it could potentially be a matter of life and death. I totally agree, debthaven. I really think that's why we do things the way we do.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jun 6, 2012 19:58:11 GMT -5
Have I ever told you how much I appreciate you explaining things nicely and never pulling the "DO NOT QUESTION THE MODS" routine? Because I really do. (Mmhmm is good about this too. They should make more of you guys.) aw, thanks. <3 I'll make sure mmhmm sees this too. honestly, I see no reason to not explain anything I can that isn't private info. it's not like it's going to hurt anything, and I've always found that people tend to respond better when they don't feel like they are being snowed over. I know that a lot of posters feel like we're the police most of the time, when all we're trying to do is stay within the confines of our host site's rules, and offer common decency to our posters. I don't see any value in treating you guys and ladies like school kids, so why wouldn't I explain what I can. your thoughts are much appreciated, though. thank you
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milee
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Post by milee on Jun 6, 2012 20:04:23 GMT -5
"aw, thanks. <3 I'll make sure mmhmm sees this too." Wow, you are gullible. Don't you see she's just trying to avoid being banned?!?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2012 20:06:45 GMT -5
I think this thread has defeated the effectiveness of deleting the first thread. With post 11 and debtheaven saying it is a matter of life and death I have all the pertinent info and I never saw the first thread.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 6, 2012 20:19:44 GMT -5
Thanks, MidJD, for the lovely compliment. We do try to clarify things if needed. It's not always possible to make things completely clear, but we do the best we can. It's nice to know it's appreciated!
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 6, 2012 20:20:44 GMT -5
" I have posed the question as to whether we can leave a generic message in place that the thread has been removed instead of it just going poof! I honestly don't know if that's possible, based on what I've seen from the times I've moved threads - we're generally just given an option to leave a note that such-and-such thread has been moved <here> with a link....and as I just said, that link isn't going to be useful to you guys.....so we don't tend to leave it. if it's possibly to leave a thread title w/o the identity of the OP, that would totally be ideal. I'll look into it and will push for that if possible, but no guarantees."
Um, simple solution, as I can't believe that this happens all that often to begin with. You move the thread off to invisible-land, and whoever moves it titles a "new thread" on the same board with whatever information they think is relevant to tell people. Thread "I'm cheating on my spouse" is asked by the author to be deleted. Mod moves it to the invisible land where no one can see it and takes 30 seconds to create a thread titled "I'm cheating on my spouse" with an OP about why the thread was deleted.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jun 6, 2012 20:28:26 GMT -5
"aw, thanks. <3 I'll make sure mmhmm sees this too." Wow, you are gullible. Don't you see she's just trying to avoid being banned?!? no, not really - nothing I've ever seen from her has been ban-worthy. I've banned plenty, even if you haven't seen it.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Jun 6, 2012 20:32:28 GMT -5
Oh hush Milee, don't out me! I really do appreciate the efforts at clarity. I'm on the board of directors of our roller derby team and lately there have been a few situations (usually when we're enforcing some little-known rule) in which I've thought, "man, this must be what it's like to be a YM mod!" It's hard to walk that line between democracy and "be quiet, we know what's best," especially when you're subject to rules beyond your control. But I know it does make people feel better when they have some context for things or a clear picture of why certain things are done. (We've learned that the hard way, a bit...)
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jun 6, 2012 20:33:29 GMT -5
" I have posed the question as to whether we can leave a generic message in place that the thread has been removed instead of it just going poof! I honestly don't know if that's possible, based on what I've seen from the times I've moved threads - we're generally just given an option to leave a note that such-and-such thread has been moved <here> with a link....and as I just said, that link isn't going to be useful to you guys.....so we don't tend to leave it. if it's possibly to leave a thread title w/o the identity of the OP, that would totally be ideal. I'll look into it and will push for that if possible, but no guarantees." Um, simple solution, as I can't believe that this happens all that often to begin with. You move the thread off to invisible-land, and whoever moves it titles a "new thread" on the same board with whatever information they think is relevant to tell people. Thread "I'm cheating on my spouse" is asked by the author to be deleted. Mod moves it to the invisible land where no one can see it and takes 30 seconds to create a thread titled "I'm cheating on my spouse" with an OP about why the thread was deleted. yeah, not so much. even if we put the same title (which opens US up to whatever judgments were in the original thread if anyone isn't reading closely ), we're still gonna have to copy/paste everyone else's posts up to that point. quite frankly, if someone is that upset with the thread they started, I'd just as soon leave it alone. like I said, I raised the question as to whether we can change the messages available - so that we might be able to leave a generic one that it's gone poof!
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 6, 2012 21:03:02 GMT -5
I guess I am the only one who thinks that this practice is a bit......well, I can't find the right word for it, so I am going to say "wrong". People post all kinds of personal info on here, old YM, etc ALL.THE.TIME. I guess unlike the drunken phone call to an ex, this kind of thing can be "taken back".
Are we not adults? Do we really need our mods/parents to keep pushing a rewind button for us?
I don't get emotionally involved in threads, especially the ones that go round and round and round, but I've seen some posters pouring their heart and soul into their advice and suggestions and it just seems kind of disrespectful to them to delete the entire thread per request of one person.
And btw, I actually suggested to Stl to stop posting so much info if she was considering divorce, and I was promptly called judgmental and my suggestion was ignored. Oh well......
Lena
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 6, 2012 21:21:10 GMT -5
" I have posed the question as to whether we can leave a generic message in place that the thread has been removed instead of it just going poof! I honestly don't know if that's possible, based on what I've seen from the times I've moved threads - we're generally just given an option to leave a note that such-and-such thread has been moved <here> with a link....and as I just said, that link isn't going to be useful to you guys.....so we don't tend to leave it. if it's possibly to leave a thread title w/o the identity of the OP, that would totally be ideal. I'll look into it and will push for that if possible, but no guarantees." Um, simple solution, as I can't believe that this happens all that often to begin with. You move the thread off to invisible-land, and whoever moves it titles a "new thread" on the same board with whatever information they think is relevant to tell people. Thread "I'm cheating on my spouse" is asked by the author to be deleted. Mod moves it to the invisible land where no one can see it and takes 30 seconds to create a thread titled "I'm cheating on my spouse" with an OP about why the thread was deleted. yeah, not so much. even if we put the same title (which opens US up to whatever judgments were in the original thread if anyone isn't reading closely ), we're still gonna have to copy/paste everyone else's posts up to that point. quite frankly, if someone is that upset with the thread they started, I'd just as soon leave it alone. like I said, I raised the question as to whether we can change the messages available - so that we might be able to leave a generic one that it's gone poof! Actually I meant just posting the title and your own OP which says "this thread was deleted due to......" and locking it. No recreating the entire thread. Just something to address people's issues of not knowing if it's gone or whatever. Just a locked thread of the same title with 1 post indicating what happened.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 6, 2012 21:26:56 GMT -5
Stuff happens, folks. Sometimes, someone will post something very personal. That person might be feeling depressed at the moment and they're just venting. Once they've had a bit to get their emotions under control, they realize they've said a lot more than they wished to say about their personal life. We've all done it, at one time or another, whether when posting or talking to friends/coworkers. Nobody's perfect, and nobody's immune. Seems to me, a person should be able to request that information be removed from the message board. Heck, we're fortunate to be able to do that for someone who just had a bad moment, or several. Wish I could take back some of the garbage I've been known to SAY! Yes, there are often pearls of wisdom in this sort of thread. There's no reason why someone else can't start a thread based on a pearl of wisdom they find. As long as it doesn't mirror the other person's story, or refer to it in such a way that it brings that person to the fore again, that shouldn't be problematic. The same situations (or similar) can be discussed in a hypothetical manner and nobody gets hurt. I think that's the most important thing to think about ... not whether we know what happened, and not whether we're included in the decision, but whether we can avoid someone being hurt.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jun 6, 2012 21:30:27 GMT -5
So if I post something personal in a thread that someone else starts, can I ask that the entire thread be deleted? I don't see how that's any different if it saves me from being hurt after I say something I wish I hadn't.
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Post by stl76 on Jun 6, 2012 21:44:08 GMT -5
"And btw, I actually suggested to Stl to stop posting so much info if she was considering divorce, and I was promptly called judgmental and my suggestion was ignored. Oh well......" Actually it was your post that made me ask the thread to be removed. I am sorry it turned into such a big deal. I asked for it to be removed and it happened very quickly, only if everybody else worked as fast as the mods if i hadnt given so much info (which i did because people kept asking questions) i wouldnt have asked for it to be removed but as somebody pointed out it already seems to be a moot point because somebody already mentioned my plans (incorrectly) and even where i was from. My StBX is very good with computers.
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Post by maryjane on Jun 6, 2012 22:07:37 GMT -5
Stl, don't worry about it. Seriously. We will all get over having our pearls of wisdom removed. The important thing is protecting yourself and your child. Asking to have that thread deleted was an act of self protection.
Please note that most people on this board were supportive and most people on this thread support your right to have it deleted. Most people are playing around with the best way to notify people of a deleted thread, not questioning your right (or other posters) to have it deleted. As mmhmm pointed out no one is perfect.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 6, 2012 22:14:59 GMT -5
So if I post something personal in a thread that someone else starts, can I ask that the entire thread be deleted? I don't see how that's any different if it saves me from being hurt after I say something I wish I hadn't. The difference is, hoops, you can delete your own post. A poster cannot delete their own thread once a response has been posted. mmhmm, Administrator
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 6, 2012 22:19:06 GMT -5
"And btw, I actually suggested to Stl to stop posting so much info if she was considering divorce, and I was promptly called judgmental and my suggestion was ignored. Oh well......" Actually it was your post that made me ask the thread to be removed. I am sorry it turned into such a big deal. I asked for it to be removed and it happened very quickly, only if everybody else worked as fast as the mods if i hadnt given so much info (which i did because people kept asking questions) i wouldnt have asked for it to be removed but as somebody pointed out it already seems to be a moot point because somebody already mentioned my plans (incorrectly) and even where i was from. My StBX is very good with computers. Waaaaiiit a minute! Someone has reposted your plans and where you're from? Is that what you're saying, stl? If so, please let us know where this post is! Nevermind. I found it and the post has been removed. mmhmm, Administrator
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