This guy has got it right.

[tallguy]

I am saddened and afraid for America because of Donald Trump and his right-wing Republican MAGA movement.  I am most saddened and frightened, however, by sincere and honest people being pulled into this cult-like movement.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This conduct by Trump and MAGA candidates frightens me, but what is most troubling is all the people who have been caught up in this dangerous movement who I know to be good, honest, truly patriotic citizens, capable of knowing right from wrong.  The country needs these people, many who identify as Republican because of past loyalty, or family and community ties, to tune out the barrage of right-wing propaganda from FOX News and right-wing blogs and radio, to tune back in the respected journalism Trump labeled as “fake news” so he could discredit reports of his misdeeds.  Find out what is happening here.  The once respectable Republican Party is now Trump’s show, disregarding his every violation of law and decency.  And so, to many who now vote Republican, I ask — is this really who you are?  The country needs an honest Republican Party and only by honest people withdrawing support from Trump and MAGA candidates can it return to constructive, truthful, and positive messaging and America can then heal.

link

[Tennesseer]

There were some sincere and honest people in Jonestown too.  When they saw their members injecting or voluntarily being injected with cyanide, they wanted no part of it.  They were unfortunately injected against their will.  Others were hunted down and killed so word of what was taking place on November 18, 1978 would not reach the outside world.

Jim Jones was a cult leader.  So is trump.  Anyone who tells his followers, “Just remember, what you're seeing and what you're reading is not what's happening," is a cult leader.

[pulmonarymd]

I venture to say that is who the majority of them are. All the same ones have been ex-communicated

[billisonboard]

I think there is a sizable part of the electorate caught in a difficult position. They either voted for someone other than Trump in an early primary or they are in a state which voted too late to stop his nomination. They legitimately don't support the policy positions of Harris. What are they to do? An option would be to not vote but that would be tough for those who take pride in civic engagement. Wonder if there is a reasonable third party option to steer them towards?

[mollyanna58]

I voted third party in 2016 because I couldn't vote for either Trump or Clinton. A Clinton supporter chastised me that voting third party was enough to throw the election to Trump.

[tallguy]

Sept 22, 2024 13:07:49 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

I think there is a sizable part of the electorate caught in a difficult position. They either voted for someone other than Trump in an early primary or they are in a state which voted too late to stop his nomination. They legitimately don't support the policy positions of Harris. What are they to do? An option would be to not vote but that would be tough for those who take pride in civic engagement. Wonder if there is a reasonable third party option to steer them towards?

Yes, who will take up the banner of Ross Perot?   

[tallguy]

Sept 22, 2024 13:19:50 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

I voted third party in 2016 because I couldn't vote for either Trump or Clinton. A Clinton supporter chastised me that voting third party was enough to throw the election to Trump.

You can't always vote "For."  Sometimes you have to vote "Against."  Sad, but true.

[happyhoix]

Sept 22, 2024 13:23:14 GMT -5 tallguy said:

Sept 22, 2024 13:19:50 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

I voted third party in 2016 because I couldn't vote for either Trump or Clinton. A Clinton supporter chastised me that voting third party was enough to throw the election to Trump.

You can't always vote "For."  Sometimes you have to vote "Against."  Sad, but true.

Most of my voting history has been voting against someone, sadly. 

[djAdvocate]

Sept 22, 2024 13:19:50 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

I voted third party in 2016 because I couldn't vote for either Trump or Clinton. A Clinton supporter chastised me that voting third party was enough to throw the election to Trump.

you can tell your friend that is complete bullshit.

first of all- fun fact- 3rd parties draw equally from the GOP and from Democrats, generally speaking.  so without a detailed analysis of how YOUR VOTE in YOUR STATE impacted the race, i rate this as not only false, but cruel.

second, there was a significant swing in the last few days from "undecided" to Trump.  now, it could be that a bunch of undecided people just suddenly said "I like Trump".  but i think it is more plausible that the Comey intervention caused them to go against Clinton.

and yeah, i can back that suspicion up.

[djAdvocate]

Sept 22, 2024 13:23:14 GMT -5 tallguy said:

Sept 22, 2024 13:19:50 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

I voted third party in 2016 because I couldn't vote for either Trump or Clinton. A Clinton supporter chastised me that voting third party was enough to throw the election to Trump.

You can't always vote "For."  Sometimes you have to vote "Against."  Sad, but true.

and that choice could not be starker this time. 

on the one hand, you have an institutionalist that will uphold the rule of law.

on the other hand, you have a lawless renegade that will burn it all down.

it really is a pretty simple choice.

[chiver78]

Sept 22, 2024 13:32:05 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Sept 22, 2024 13:23:14 GMT -5 tallguy said:

You can't always vote "For."  Sometimes you have to vote "Against."  Sad, but true.

Most of my voting history has been voting against someone, sadly. 

in general elections, same. I've usually been able to find candidates I actually support for my primary votes.

[djAdvocate]

Sept 22, 2024 13:21:18 GMT -5 tallguy said:

Sept 22, 2024 13:07:49 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

I think there is a sizable part of the electorate caught in a difficult position. They either voted for someone other than Trump in an early primary or they are in a state which voted too late to stop his nomination. They legitimately don't support the policy positions of Harris. What are they to do? An option would be to not vote but that would be tough for those who take pride in civic engagement. Wonder if there is a reasonable third party option to steer them towards?

Yes, who will take up the banner of Ross Perot?   

they either vote for a post-policy America, or they vote to keep that aspect of America intact.

again, it is not a difficult position, as bills states.  it is pretty simple.

i have no love for Harris.  but i DO love our institutions and our promise embodied by the preamble of the constitution.

[Pink Cashmere]

It’s going to take a minute to get to my point, but I promise it’s pertinent to this thread. 

Mister and I went to a big car show. At these car shows, many of the owners are happy to chat about their cars.

One car we were looking at, the BIL of the owner came over and started telling us all about the car. The owner had his Dad order it for him while the owner was in the Army during the Vietnam war. He still has all the original paperwork from the purchase, and everything on the car is original, and he told us all the stuff about the car that makes it such a gem. It was all interesting. He says he goes to the car shows with his BIL because he likes talking to people and BIL is shy.

The man talking to us was a white man, a 79yo Army veteran. After telling us about the car, he got on race stuff, and how we are all human, the color of our skin doesn’t matter. These days when strangers come out of the blue with that, it makes me wary. People have done that before, but I have trust issues these days. Well, I guess that was his way of easing into politics and the upcoming election. He wanted to assure us that the reason he wouldn’t vote for Kamala Harris had nothing to do with her skin color, but because she’s crazy and when Trump was President, everything was peaceful and stable.

He switched subjects so fast after having talked for 10 or 15 minutes about the car and its owner, that I was caught off guard. But not so much that I was willing to engage in that conversation, so I ended the conversation and Mister and I moved on.

The thing is, he seemed to really believe what he said about why Trump is the better candidate. My spidey senses went off when he first got on the race and human thing, but he seemed sincere about that too, even though I wondered why he even went there. But that was just his way of getting to what he wanted to say about Trump. Those last few minutes ruined all the good vibes from the stories about the car and its owner.

Mister and I just wanted to look at all the awesome cars and chat with some of the owners about their cars, I didn’t want to talk about race or politics and definitely did not want to debate about Trump. I was just really surprised by what he said, and it made me wonder if there is an alternate universe or something that people are operating in, where Trump is good for our country. I can’t make it make sense. 

[Opti]

Sept 22, 2024 14:27:24 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

It’s going to take a minute to get to my point, but I promise it’s pertinent to this thread. 

Mister and I went to a big car show. At these car shows, many of the owners are happy to chat about their cars.

One car we were looking at, the BIL of the owner came over and started telling us all about the car. The owner had his Dad order it for him while the owner was in the Army during the Vietnam war. He still has all the original paperwork from the purchase, and everything on the car is original, and he told us all the stuff about the car that makes it such a gem. It was all interesting. He says he goes to the car shows with his BIL because he likes talking to people and BIL is shy.

The man talking to us was a white man, a 79yo Army veteran. After telling us about the car, he got on race stuff, and how we are all human, the color of our skin doesn’t matter. These days when strangers come out of the blue with that, it makes me wary. People have done that before, but I have trust issues these days. Well, I guess that was his way of easing into politics and the upcoming election. He wanted to assure us that the reason he wouldn’t vote for Kamala Harris had nothing to do with her skin color, but because she’s crazy and when Trump was President, everything was peaceful and stable.

He switched subjects so fast after having talked for 10 or 15 minutes about the car and its owner, that I was caught off guard. But not so much that I was willing to engage in that conversation, so I ended the conversation and Mister and I moved on.

The thing is, he seemed to really believe what he said about why Trump is the better candidate. My spidey senses went off when he first got on the race and human thing, but he seemed sincere about that too, even though I wondered why he even went there. But that was just his way of getting to what he wanted to say about Trump. Those last few minutes ruined all the good vibes from the stories about the car and its owner.

Mister and I just wanted to look at all the awesome cars and chat with some of the owners about their cars, I didn’t want to talk about race or politics and definitely did not want to debate about Trump. I was just really surprised by what he said, and it made me wonder if there is an alternate universe or something that people are operating in, where Trump is good for our country. I can’t make it make sense. 

If he doesn't realize Trump is crazy, I wonder about how he sees RL in general. Maybe it was some new talking point for the GOP that makes them think you would change your vote. I remember Trump's presidency being not even close to peaceful and stable. Chaos in the news almost every day, and Trump caused it. 

[djAdvocate]

yes. and it is an indefensible universe. it is not based on facts. it is based on fears.

it is also probably impenetrable. that is why it has to be crushed. if it is crushed, they will have nowhere to go. they can either retreat or change. most will retreat.

i think the best answer to the "race doesn't matter" proposition is- "yes, if you are white". otherwise, it matters. and white people can't possibly understand that as fully as non-whites can. i won't bother explaining it to you. you know.

i hope Kamala crushes Trump. it is the only way forward.

[tallguy]

Sept 22, 2024 14:27:24 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

It’s going to take a minute to get to my point, but I promise it’s pertinent to this thread. 

Mister and I went to a big car show. At these car shows, many of the owners are happy to chat about their cars.

One car we were looking at, the BIL of the owner came over and started telling us all about the car. The owner had his Dad order it for him while the owner was in the Army during the Vietnam war. He still has all the original paperwork from the purchase, and everything on the car is original, and he told us all the stuff about the car that makes it such a gem. It was all interesting. He says he goes to the car shows with his BIL because he likes talking to people and BIL is shy.

The man talking to us was a white man, a 79yo Army veteran. After telling us about the car, he got on race stuff, and how we are all human, the color of our skin doesn’t matter. These days when strangers come out of the blue with that, it makes me wary. People have done that before, but I have trust issues these days. Well, I guess that was his way of easing into politics and the upcoming election. He wanted to assure us that the reason he wouldn’t vote for Kamala Harris had nothing to do with her skin color, but because she’s crazy and when Trump was President, everything was peaceful and stable.

He switched subjects so fast after having talked for 10 or 15 minutes about the car and its owner, that I was caught off guard. But not so much that I was willing to engage in that conversation, so I ended the conversation and Mister and I moved on.

The thing is, he seemed to really believe what he said about why Trump is the better candidate. My spidey senses went off when he first got on the race and human thing, but he seemed sincere about that too, even though I wondered why he even went there. But that was just his way of getting to what he wanted to say about Trump. Those last few minutes ruined all the good vibes from the stories about the car and its owner.

Mister and I just wanted to look at all the awesome cars and chat with some of the owners about their cars, I didn’t want to talk about race or politics and definitely did not want to debate about Trump. I was just really surprised by what he said, and it made me wonder if there is an alternate universe or something that people are operating in, where Trump is good for our country. I can’t make it make sense. 

It's not an alternate universe, but it is a land of delusion.  Any clear and rational look at Trump will show you exactly what so many of us see.  Any real examination of causes, effects, reasons, motivations, etc. will show you exactly what the Republican Party has become.  People who don't or can't do that (or refuse to do that) will never see it, and will not even entertain the notion much less admit it. 

Some less-polite observers might say that they have their heads up their a**es, but I would never do that....

[happyhoix]

Sept 22, 2024 14:27:24 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

It’s going to take a minute to get to my point, but I promise it’s pertinent to this thread. 

Mister and I went to a big car show. At these car shows, many of the owners are happy to chat about their cars.

One car we were looking at, the BIL of the owner came over and started telling us all about the car. The owner had his Dad order it for him while the owner was in the Army during the Vietnam war. He still has all the original paperwork from the purchase, and everything on the car is original, and he told us all the stuff about the car that makes it such a gem. It was all interesting. He says he goes to the car shows with his BIL because he likes talking to people and BIL is shy.

The man talking to us was a white man, a 79yo Army veteran. After telling us about the car, he got on race stuff, and how we are all human, the color of our skin doesn’t matter. These days when strangers come out of the blue with that, it makes me wary. People have done that before, but I have trust issues these days. Well, I guess that was his way of easing into politics and the upcoming election. He wanted to assure us that the reason he wouldn’t vote for Kamala Harris had nothing to do with her skin color, but because she’s crazy and when Trump was President, everything was peaceful and stable.

He switched subjects so fast after having talked for 10 or 15 minutes about the car and its owner, that I was caught off guard. But not so much that I was willing to engage in that conversation, so I ended the conversation and Mister and I moved on.

The thing is, he seemed to really believe what he said about why Trump is the better candidate. My spidey senses went off when he first got on the race and human thing, but he seemed sincere about that too, even though I wondered why he even went there. But that was just his way of getting to what he wanted to say about Trump. Those last few minutes ruined all the good vibes from the stories about the car and its owner.

Mister and I just wanted to look at all the awesome cars and chat with some of the owners about their cars, I didn’t want to talk about race or politics and definitely did not want to debate about Trump. I was just really surprised by what he said, and it made me wonder if there is an alternate universe or something that people are operating in, where Trump is good for our country. I can’t make it make sense. 

You’re a better woman than I am. I keep my mouth shut around coworkers and family members to avoid creating drama, but some random dude trying to explain to me how peaceful it was under Trump, I would have had to ask him just how fucking peaceful J6 was.

My inner bitch is struggling to not be so inner, lately.

[Pink Cashmere]

Sept 22, 2024 14:48:26 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Sept 22, 2024 14:27:24 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

It’s going to take a minute to get to my point, but I promise it’s pertinent to this thread. 

Mister and I went to a big car show. At these car shows, many of the owners are happy to chat about their cars.

One car we were looking at, the BIL of the owner came over and started telling us all about the car. The owner had his Dad order it for him while the owner was in the Army during the Vietnam war. He still has all the original paperwork from the purchase, and everything on the car is original, and he told us all the stuff about the car that makes it such a gem. It was all interesting. He says he goes to the car shows with his BIL because he likes talking to people and BIL is shy.

The man talking to us was a white man, a 79yo Army veteran. After telling us about the car, he got on race stuff, and how we are all human, the color of our skin doesn’t matter. These days when strangers come out of the blue with that, it makes me wary. People have done that before, but I have trust issues these days. Well, I guess that was his way of easing into politics and the upcoming election. He wanted to assure us that the reason he wouldn’t vote for Kamala Harris had nothing to do with her skin color, but because she’s crazy and when Trump was President, everything was peaceful and stable.

He switched subjects so fast after having talked for 10 or 15 minutes about the car and its owner, that I was caught off guard. But not so much that I was willing to engage in that conversation, so I ended the conversation and Mister and I moved on.

The thing is, he seemed to really believe what he said about why Trump is the better candidate. My spidey senses went off when he first got on the race and human thing, but he seemed sincere about that too, even though I wondered why he even went there. But that was just his way of getting to what he wanted to say about Trump. Those last few minutes ruined all the good vibes from the stories about the car and its owner.

Mister and I just wanted to look at all the awesome cars and chat with some of the owners about their cars, I didn’t want to talk about race or politics and definitely did not want to debate about Trump. I was just really surprised by what he said, and it made me wonder if there is an alternate universe or something that people are operating in, where Trump is good for our country. I can’t make it make sense. 

You’re a better woman than I am. I keep my mouth shut around coworkers and family members to avoid creating drama, but some random dude trying to explain to me how peaceful it was under Trump, I would have had to ask him just how fucking peaceful J6 was.

My inner bitch is struggling to not be so inner, lately.

It was enough for me in that situation, to cut him off and end what had previously been an interesting conversation and walk away to continue enjoying the car show and my day. It wasn’t at all about keeping my mouth shut, it was about not letting some random person kill my vibe in that moment.

[djAdvocate]

Sept 22, 2024 17:40:44 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

Sept 22, 2024 14:48:26 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

You’re a better woman than I am. I keep my mouth shut around coworkers and family members to avoid creating drama, but some random dude trying to explain to me how peaceful it was under Trump, I would have had to ask him just how fucking peaceful J6 was.

My inner bitch is struggling to not be so inner, lately.

It was enough for me in that situation, to cut him off and end what had previously been an interesting conversation and walk away to continue enjoying the car show and my day. It wasn’t at all about keeping my mouth shut, it was about not letting some random person kill my vibe in that moment.

as much as a hate to say it, you risk violence with these folks in situations where they feel comfortable enough to express themselves, generally speaking.  unless you are up for it, moving along is probably best.

[happyhoix]

Sept 22, 2024 17:40:44 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

Sept 22, 2024 14:48:26 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

You’re a better woman than I am. I keep my mouth shut around coworkers and family members to avoid creating drama, but some random dude trying to explain to me how peaceful it was under Trump, I would have had to ask him just how fucking peaceful J6 was.

My inner bitch is struggling to not be so inner, lately.

It was enough for me in that situation, to cut him off and end what had previously been an interesting conversation and walk away to continue enjoying the car show and my day. It wasn’t at all about keeping my mouth shut, it was about not letting some random person kill my vibe in that moment.

That’s why you’re a better woman than I am 

[Tiny]

If you typically vote republican or democrat and don't like either candidate - isn't voting for a third party the same as NOT voting? I have a hard time believing that a third party would magically have all the things (policies, moral stands, religion whatever) a voter who "cannot" vote republican or democratic this election because both sides are so bad.

Isn't that vote for a third party a thrown away "feel good" vote?? Wouldn't it better to think beyond oneself and vote for the greater good? Isn't that what elections are about? You can't get everything you want.



Does who we vote for just come down to "who has the best head of hair?" to paraphrase a very old Scott Adams joke (about what quality men who climb the corporate ladder all have that singularly identifies that they are the best leaders (even if they can barely talk, walk, or think - good hair = great leader)

[billisonboard]

Sept 23, 2024 9:25:55 GMT -5 Tiny said:

If you typically vote republican or democrat and don't like either candidate - isn't voting for a third party the same as NOT voting? I have a hard time believing that a third party would magically have all the things (policies, moral stands, religion whatever) a voter who "cannot" vote republican or democratic this election because both sides are so bad.

Isn't that vote for a third party a thrown away "feel good" vote?? Wouldn't it better to think beyond oneself and vote for the greater good? Isn't that what elections are about? You can't get everything you want.



Does who we vote for just come down to "who has the best head of hair?" to paraphrase a very old Scott Adams joke (about what quality men who climb the corporate ladder all have that singularly identifies that they are the best leaders (even if they can barely talk, walk, or think - good hair = great leader)

I don't think voting is the same as not voting.

I have no problem with the idea that a third party vote is a feel good vote. My preferred candidate will carry my state with no problem but I will still vote for her because it will feel good to support her. I can understand how someone can honestly think that voting for a third party is for the greater good in this election.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Sept 22, 2024 14:27:24 GMT -5 Pink Cashmere said:

It’s going to take a minute to get to my point, but I promise it’s pertinent to this thread. 

Mister and I went to a big car show. At these car shows, many of the owners are happy to chat about their cars.

One car we were looking at, the BIL of the owner came over and started telling us all about the car. The owner had his Dad order it for him while the owner was in the Army during the Vietnam war. He still has all the original paperwork from the purchase, and everything on the car is original, and he told us all the stuff about the car that makes it such a gem. It was all interesting. He says he goes to the car shows with his BIL because he likes talking to people and BIL is shy.

The man talking to us was a white man, a 79yo Army veteran. After telling us about the car, he got on race stuff, and how we are all human, the color of our skin doesn’t matter. These days when strangers come out of the blue with that, it makes me wary. People have done that before, but I have trust issues these days. Well, I guess that was his way of easing into politics and the upcoming election. He wanted to assure us that the reason he wouldn’t vote for Kamala Harris had nothing to do with her skin color, but because she’s crazy and when Trump was President, everything was peaceful and stable.

He switched subjects so fast after having talked for 10 or 15 minutes about the car and its owner, that I was caught off guard. But not so much that I was willing to engage in that conversation, so I ended the conversation and Mister and I moved on.

The thing is, he seemed to really believe what he said about why Trump is the better candidate. My spidey senses went off when he first got on the race and human thing, but he seemed sincere about that too, even though I wondered why he even went there. But that was just his way of getting to what he wanted to say about Trump. Those last few minutes ruined all the good vibes from the stories about the car and its owner.

Mister and I just wanted to look at all the awesome cars and chat with some of the owners about their cars, I didn’t want to talk about race or politics and definitely did not want to debate about Trump. I was just really surprised by what he said, and it made me wonder if there is an alternate universe or something that people are operating in, where Trump is good for our country. I can’t make it make sense. 

He's not racist he is talking to an African American couple at a car show! 

I would have had a hard time saying "So if it isn't racism then I am guessing sexism? Because the term "Crazy" is usually used as a dig towards women"

[djAdvocate]

the fact that he said it "has nothing to do with her skin color" is a red flag and a racist trope.

[Tennesseer]

Sept 23, 2024 10:59:52 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

the fact that he said it "has nothing to do with her skin color" is a red flag and a racist trope.

The old opening line: "I'm not racist but..."

[djAdvocate]

Sept 23, 2024 9:25:55 GMT -5 Tiny said:

If you typically vote republican or democrat and don't like either candidate - isn't voting for a third party the same as NOT voting? I have a hard time believing that a third party would magically have all the things (policies, moral stands, religion whatever) a voter who "cannot" vote republican or democratic this election because both sides are so bad.

Isn't that vote for a third party a thrown away "feel good" vote?? Wouldn't it better to think beyond oneself and vote for the greater good? Isn't that what elections are about? You can't get everything you want.



Does who we vote for just come down to "who has the best head of hair?" to paraphrase a very old Scott Adams joke (about what quality men who climb the corporate ladder all have that singularly identifies that they are the best leaders (even if they can barely talk, walk, or think - good hair = great leader)

first of all, Scott Adams is horrendous.  just sayin.

and no, voting 3rd party is not the same as not voting.  it is the only way that real change happens, imo.  our failure to vote third party in this country is partially why we are where we are.  because extreme opinions have no place to reside other than in the two major parties, they end up governing.

i would rather have 20 parties than 2.  it is atrocious, imo.

having said that, there really is only one party running right now.  the other party is an anti-government insurgency.  i have been saying that for at least 8 years, now.

[thyme4change]

Sept 23, 2024 9:25:55 GMT -5 Tiny said:

If you typically vote republican or democrat and don't like either candidate - isn't voting for a third party the same as NOT voting? I have a hard time believing that a third party would magically have all the things (policies, moral stands, religion whatever) a voter who "cannot" vote republican or democratic this election because both sides are so bad.

Isn't that vote for a third party a thrown away "feel good" vote?? Wouldn't it better to think beyond oneself and vote for the greater good? Isn't that what elections are about? You can't get everything you want.



Does who we vote for just come down to "who has the best head of hair?" to paraphrase a very old Scott Adams joke (about what quality men who climb the corporate ladder all have that singularly identifies that they are the best leaders (even if they can barely talk, walk, or think - good hair = great leader)

The collective ‘they’ know who is voting and for whom. Yes, voting 3P is not going to put a different guy in office this cycle, but if you don’t vote at all - nobody will try and adjust their party to court you.

My son didn’t want to vote for either of the two old grumps that were running a few months ago. He did agree that he would still vote, and write someone in. The only way the parties will know you are displeased is if you vote for Jill Stein or write in Mickey Mouse. Otherwise, a vote is a vote. They don’t know if you hung 19 Trump flags and bought his bible and followed him around the country to go to every rally or if you voted for Trump accidentally because you don’t know how to read. A vote is a vote.

They also don’t know if you didn’t vote because you don’t like the candidates or because you got in a car crash on the way to the polls and were in the hospital.

Voting matters, even if you don’t vote for the winner or the runner up. It is all part of the statistics that drive the parties.

That said - getting a bill passed through Congress has no correlation to their popularity. Our system is corrupt. Thanks Citizens United for fucking our country up the a-hole with a giant dildo, and not even using any lube.

[movingforward]

My father, who has voted republican his entire life, will not be voting in this election. He has voted in every election for almost 60 years but doesn't want to vote any longer. He says Trump has completely ruined the republican party. He also has huge problems with all the mass shootings and the Republicans neglectful attitude to address this issue. 

For some reason he can't bring himself to vote democrat...I think it may just go back to his southern roots and that he is "supposed" to vote Republican. 

At any rate, he said he is just not going to vote.

[thyme4change]

Sept 24, 2024 14:21:59 GMT -5 movingforward said:

My father, who has voted republican his entire life, will not be voting in this election. He has voted in every election for almost 60 years but doesn't want to vote any longer. He says Trump has completely ruined the republican party. He also has huge problems with all the mass shootings and the Republicans neglectful attitude to address this issue. 

For some reason he can't bring himself to vote democrat...I think it may just go back to his southern roots and that he is "supposed" to vote Republican. 

At any rate, he said he is just not going to vote.

Can you work on him a little bit?

I will take the 1/2 win, but I’d love a full conversion. Here we have propositions - so even if we get someone to vote on a couple of those, it could be a win. And since you are already filling out the ballot - you may as well punish Trump and end his reign of chaos and terror.

[tallguy]

Sept 24, 2024 14:21:59 GMT -5 movingforward said:

My father, who has voted republican his entire life, will not be voting in this election. He has voted in every election for almost 60 years but doesn't want to vote any longer. He says Trump has completely ruined the republican party. He also has huge problems with all the mass shootings and the Republicans neglectful attitude to address this issue. 

For some reason he can't bring himself to vote democrat...I think it may just go back to his southern roots and that he is "supposed" to vote Republican. 

At any rate, he said he is just not going to vote.

Tell him to go back to his REAL southern roots.  When he was growing up the South was reliably Democratic.  Even against Eisenhower!