How stupid is Putin ... picking a war with Ukraine

[Opti]

just because he wants some land "back">

Discuss, but I found this old but goodie from days gone by

<<< In Sun Tzu's "Art of War" he warns against engaging an enemy "on deadly ground." This is a territory from which escape is impossible. Under such circumstances the choices are stark": "Win or die." The person who already has nothing is a very dangerous person. If he is going to die, you will too. >>>



...and Sun Tzu would say that staking territory beyond your borders, and then killing "them" over it, is not the same as protecting your own turf to the death...



so let's call this what it really is, shall we?






People with nothing brings to mind the French Revolution etc.

[Opti]

OK, wrong Discussion thought. Quote was pulled from a 2012 thread I accidentally found. So old that mmhmm posted on it. 

I say if Trump gets re-elected the Ukraine War ends quickly in a flurry on back door deals that favor Russia.
And I think both will be alive when that happens.

Agree, disagree?

[billisonboard]

Disagree. I don't see it as a bilateral situation that could be ended by a Trump and Putin deal. No support from the US would likely lead to the Ukraine's defeat, but not an immediate end to the war. Europe is too invested for that to happen.

[Opti]

Jul 2, 2024 8:45:27 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Disagree. I don't see it as a bilateral situation that could be ended by a Trump and Putin deal. No support from the US would likely lead to the Ukraine's defeat, but not an immediate end to the war. Europe is too invested for that to happen.

There's the sticky wicket. If Trump is elected he is considered to be the US, or representing the US. However, as we know the Commander in Chief basically gives the go or no go signals on military ops. She or he does not create the ops, do the research yada yada.

The Sec of State will deal with the political fallout more than influencing on military actions. So it is DoD that drives it ...
and generally Congress approves it.

SPOILER: Click to show

So yes the Deal no Deal will basically both leaders doing go no go decisions.
Putin has literally killed much of his military mgmt team .
Trump has alienated demoted far too many of his, thinking he knows better about military matters than they do.

[billisonboard]

Jul 2, 2024 9:01:41 GMT -5 Opti said:

Jul 2, 2024 8:45:27 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Disagree. I don't see it as a bilateral situation that could be ended by a Trump and Putin deal. No support from the US would likely lead to the Ukraine's defeat, but not an immediate end to the war. Europe is too invested for that to happen.

There's the sticky wicket. If Trump is elected he is considered to be the US, or representing the US. However, as we know the Commander in Chief basically gives the go or no go signals on military ops. She or he does not create the ops, do the research yada yada.

The Sec of State will deal with the political fallout more than influencing on military actions. So it is DoD that drives it ...
and generally Congress approves it.

SPOILER: Click to show

So yes the Deal no Deal will basically both leaders doing go no go decisions.
Putin has literally killed much of his military mgmt team .
Trump has alienated demoted far too many of his, thinking he knows better about military matters than they do.

Hmmm. There are no US military operations taking place in Ukraine, although I won't rule out small scale covert missions. Our involvement is financial and the providing of military hardware. If that support ends, other countries similar support will likely be inadequate for Ukraine to survive for the long-term.