Possibly getting divorced - financial scenarios

[giramomma]

Nov 30, 2022 22:54:46 GMT -5 laterbloomer said:

I'm having a hard time understanding a situation where you love each other dearly. have no problem sharing space and doing the nesting thing, you are both going to do everything you can to keep babybird in place...but you can't stay married because something is so deal breaker wrong that it can't be resolved. Oh, and you can do the nesting thing but you can't live in the same house right now.

Just thinking about DH not being in my life...like I can't breathe.

Addictions are complex. People are not just their addiction, any more than I am just one of my roles...

And I don't have have unconditionally accept DH's addictive behaviors. I have no say in the choices he makes.

I'm probably confusing you with someone else, but I thought you had a good bit of sobriety under your belt. If you are who I'm thinking of, I would think you'd be able to conceive of a situation where someone might not accept active addictive behaviors but still love someone.

[haapai]

Dec 1, 2022 12:34:14 GMT -5 finnime said:

With what you've added, Firebird , the picture is much more clear.

Here's a thought: maybe your husband would be willing to wait for you to refinance the house and buy him out for another 3, 4, or even 5 years if you split the equity at sale time with him. That way he benefits from the property increase in value, which is a rather safe investment for him if he thinks of it that way. My oldest DB did this with his X, and it worked out well. He got half the equity when she sold it after their middle child reached 18.

Best wishes to you.

I'm not so sure that is quite the solution that you think it is.  I'd want to excel and graph it out, but in this case, it sure sounds like such an agreement would leave Firebird unable to refinance on her own no matter how much interest rates dropped unless her income increased dramatically or she had a windfall.  One half of the amount that she paid down the mortgage would be going to her ex.  One half of any increase in the value of the house would be due to her ex if she refinanced.  She might even find herself forced to sell when the deadline hit and getting so little from the proceeds of the sale that she cannot afford to buy anywhere near where her parents live or even rent there. 

[minnesotapaintlady]

My uncle didn't come out until his 40's after he had 5 kids.  Now I have two uncles and his ex-wife and him still love each other, but it is what it is.  I can really think of a lot of reasons and have lived through two of them.  Ok, one.  I honestly wouldn't care if Ex 2.0 got hit by a bus tomorrow outside of the fact that Carrot would be upset.

[haapai]

I probably should either know this or have asked this sooner.  Firebird, does your husband have any family in the area?

[Firebird]

I probably should either know this or have asked this sooner. Firebird, does your husband have any family in the area?


Unfortunately, no 

I'm not so sure that is quite the solution that you think it is. I'd want to excel and graph it out, but in this case, it sure sounds like such an agreement would leave Firebird unable to refinance on her own no matter how much interest rates dropped unless her income increased dramatically or she had a windfall. One half of the amount that she paid down the mortgage would be going to her ex. One half of any increase in the value of the house would be due to her ex if she refinanced. She might even find herself forced to sell when the deadline hit and getting so little from the proceeds of the sale that she cannot afford to buy anywhere near where her parents live or even rent there.


Yeah, it's definitely complex.  Just came from counseling, and DH and I agreed not to make any permanent decisions until March.  We both need some space and breathing room (not to mention some more counseling sessions with our therapist, who's pretty damn amazing at what she does). 

I think I can probably hang here with my parents until March.  That sounds like forever right now, but I really am working hard at just taking things one day at a time (and so is DH).  We've both calmed down a whole lot from the frantic "stay/go/stay/go/stay" back and forth that was a major part of our reality a month ago.  It's a relief knowing that we don't have to decide anything RIGHT THIS SECOND. 

[justme]

Dec 1, 2022 14:52:30 GMT -5 haapai said:

Dec 1, 2022 12:34:14 GMT -5 finnime said:

With what you've added, Firebird , the picture is much more clear.

Here's a thought: maybe your husband would be willing to wait for you to refinance the house and buy him out for another 3, 4, or even 5 years if you split the equity at sale time with him. That way he benefits from the property increase in value, which is a rather safe investment for him if he thinks of it that way. My oldest DB did this with his X, and it worked out well. He got half the equity when she sold it after their middle child reached 18.

Best wishes to you.

I'm not so sure that is quite the solution that you think it is.  I'd want to excel and graph it out, but in this case, it sure sounds like such an agreement would leave Firebird unable to refinance on her own no matter how much interest rates dropped unless her income increased dramatically or she had a windfall.  One half of the amount that she paid down the mortgage would be going to her ex.  One half of any increase in the value of the house would be due to her ex if she refinanced.  She might even find herself forced to sell when the deadline hit and getting so little from the proceeds of the sale that she cannot afford to buy anywhere near where her parents live or even rent there. 

I think that plan only works when one doesn't want to live there forever. Like stay in the house until all the kids graduate, but then downsize to a condo or a smaller house that's easier to obtain

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2022 14:52:30 GMT -5 haapai said:

]I'm not so sure that is quite the solution that you think it is.  I'd want to excel and graph it out, but in this case, it sure sounds like such an agreement would leave Firebird unable to refinance on her own no matter how much interest rates dropped unless her income increased dramatically or she had a windfall.  One half of the amount that she paid down the mortgage would be going to her ex.  One half of any increase in the value of the house would be due to her ex if she refinanced.  She might even find herself forced to sell when the deadline hit and getting so little from the proceeds of the sale that she cannot afford to buy anywhere near where her parents live or even rent there. 

This can all be negotiated. It can depend on who made the down payment and how big it was, the time between divorce and sale of the house, who paid for major maintenance during that period, whether both spouses got to occupy it as part of "nesting", etc. It doesn't have to be precise. I agreed to 40% of the equity when I divorced; the Ex had put up the down payment from an inheritance.  In our case, though, we sold the house at the time of the divorce.

Firebird, your counselor sounds wonderful.  I'm glad you both have her for support.

[Opti]

Dec 1, 2022 16:44:24 GMT -5 Firebird said:

I probably should either know this or have asked this sooner. Firebird, does your husband have any family in the area?


Unfortunately, no 

I'm not so sure that is quite the solution that you think it is. I'd want to excel and graph it out, but in this case, it sure sounds like such an agreement would leave Firebird unable to refinance on her own no matter how much interest rates dropped unless her income increased dramatically or she had a windfall. One half of the amount that she paid down the mortgage would be going to her ex. One half of any increase in the value of the house would be due to her ex if she refinanced. She might even find herself forced to sell when the deadline hit and getting so little from the proceeds of the sale that she cannot afford to buy anywhere near where her parents live or even rent there.


Yeah, it's definitely complex.  Just came from counseling, and DH and I agreed not to make any permanent decisions until March.  We both need some space and breathing room (not to mention some more counseling sessions with our therapist, who's pretty damn amazing at what she does). 

I think I can probably hang here with my parents until March.  That sounds like forever right now, but I really am working hard at just taking things one day at a time (and so is DH).  We've both calmed down a whole lot from the frantic "stay/go/stay/go/stay" back and forth that was a major part of our reality a month ago.  It's a relief knowing that we don't have to decide anything RIGHT THIS SECOND. 

I really hope the time helps. It is sad even though not surprising that your niece put such a strain on your marriage. I hope you both use your time now to deal with what was buried then. I wish you good luck and my only financial suggestion is that renting a room is usually not a fun thing to do unless you luck into a good situation. (Most are not.)

[Firebird]

It wasn't DN's fault. DH and I were/are responsible for our own decisions (and plenty of the issues in our marriage predate the addition of DN to our family anyway).

We've had a hellish few years, that's true, but our relationship with DN has been going downhill for a long time, mostly for reasons she can't fully understand right now. It's extremely complex, and I neither judge nor blame her for responding to DH and I (and her many traumas) the way she has. It cut the heart out of me when she left the way she did, but I get it. I hope the rift isn't permanent, but I would be surprised if it ended anytime soon.

I don't want to get into the whole story on here, because it's not all my story to tell, but I will say this - it can be downright excruciating to love someone else's child as much as you love your own.

[laterbloomer]

If you are getting along so well why can't you cohabitate until March?

[Firebird]

Dec 2, 2022 9:29:52 GMT -5 laterbloomer said:

If you are getting along so well why can't you cohabitate until March?

Maybe we can. We'll see how the next few weeks go. It depends a bit on how the boundaries we discussed yesterday play out in real life.

I'm absolutely not opposed to moving home, if it can work for both of us.

[Firebird]

I feel like I'm walking around with a rock in the pit of my stomach all the time. The ups and downs of this process are such a bitch. Living apart from DH really sucks, especially this close to Christmas.

... things eventually get better, right? Please tell me things eventually get better.

[debthaven]

Yes it gets better. But it takes a while. My lawyer told me it would take 2 years. (My ex wanted the divorce, I didn't.)

She was right.

[Deleted]

Dec 12, 2022 16:29:31 GMT -5 Firebird said:

I feel like I'm walking around with a rock in the pit of my stomach all the time. The ups and downs of this process are such a bitch. Living apart from DH really sucks, especially this close to Christmas.

... things eventually get better, right? Please tell me things eventually get better.

Yes, they certainly can.  My situation was different form yours- my husband was alcoholic, verbally abusive, controlling and financially irresponsible (among other things).  When I was free of him DS and I moved to a smaller house that felt like home immediately and life was peaceful.  Freed of the Ex's extravagant spending, my finances were under control.  I met second DH shortly after my divorce but we waited 6 years to marry.  He was a true partner, a great stepfather to DS, and we shared the same financial priorities.  We never had an argument- really.  He died 6 years ago- he was 15 years older.  Life is still very good.  I'm financially secure, DS is a wonderful young man and I love my DDIL and grandchildren.

DH, who'd also been divorced, used to say, "It's better to come from a broken home than to live in one".

I wish you peace.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Dec 12, 2022 16:29:31 GMT -5 Firebird said:

... things eventually get better, right? Please tell me things eventually get better.

Most definitely, but it might take awhile.  Honestly some of the best years of my life were following my first divorce after I got back on my feet, but I agree with the 2 year thing. 

My second divorce was just a THANK GOD I'M OUT OF THAT MISTAKE, relief.  The only time better was the 6 months he was in jail.

[Firebird]

Dec 12, 2022 16:58:03 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Dec 12, 2022 16:29:31 GMT -5 Firebird said:

I feel like I'm walking around with a rock in the pit of my stomach all the time. The ups and downs of this process are such a bitch. Living apart from DH really sucks, especially this close to Christmas.

... things eventually get better, right? Please tell me things eventually get better.

Yes, they certainly can.  My situation was different form yours- my husband was alcoholic, verbally abusive, controlling and financially irresponsible (among other things).  When I was free of him DH and I moved to a smaller house that felt like home immediately and life was peaceful.  Freed of the Ex's extravagant spending, my finances were under control.  I met second DH shortly after my divorce but we waited 6 years to marry.  He was a true partner, a great stepfather to DS, and we shared the same financial priorities.  We never had an argument- really.  He died 6 years ago- he was 15 years older.  Life is still very good.  I'm financially secure, DS is a wonderful young man and I love my DDIL and grandchildren.

DH, who'd also been divorced, used to say, "It's better to come from a broken home than to live in one".

I wish you peace.

Aw, Athena, I'm so sorry for your loss 💔 Thank you for the kind words. I'm glad life has turned around for you.

[Firebird]

Dec 12, 2022 18:43:41 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Dec 12, 2022 16:29:31 GMT -5 Firebird said:

... things eventually get better, right? Please tell me things eventually get better.

Most definitely, but it might take awhile.  Honestly some of the best years of my life were following my first divorce after I got back on my feet, but I agree with the 2 year thing. 

My second divorce was just a THANK GOD I'M OUT OF THAT MISTAKE, relief.  The only time better was the 6 months he was in jail.

I've actually been reading through some old YM threads and happened to be in the middle of yours when I saw this post. What you went through was so gut-wrenching 💔 I'm really glad things have gotten better for you.

How are your kids doing, by the way?

[Firebird]

Dec 12, 2022 16:54:00 GMT -5 debthaven said:

Yes it gets better. But it takes a while. My lawyer told me it would take 2 years. (My ex wanted the divorce, I didn't.)

She was right.

Two years sounds like forever right now, but I know it isn't really.

Separation is almost unheard of in my family, so all this is totally foreign to me. Obviously I do know that plenty of people come out the other side, a lot of them are coming out of the woodwork right now to say so and I'm frankly astounded that they all survived! It feels like I got in a bad car accident at the end of October and I've been having that same accident every day since.

And this is with us being nice...

[azucena]

2 years is about right for the 4 close friends I've had who have gotten divorced. One big benefit is they are readily available for plans when the ex has the kids.

[laterbloomer]

Dec 13, 2022 5:43:14 GMT -5 Firebird said:

Dec 12, 2022 16:54:00 GMT -5 debthaven said:

Yes it gets better. But it takes a while. My lawyer told me it would take 2 years. (My ex wanted the divorce, I didn't.)

She was right.

Two years sounds like forever right now, but I know it isn't really.

Separation is almost unheard of in my family, so all this is totally foreign to me. Obviously I do know that plenty of people come out the other side, a lot of them are coming out of the woodwork right now to say so and I'm frankly astounded that they all survived! It feels like I got in a bad car accident at the end of October and I've been having that same accident every day since.

And this is with us being nice...

Divorce ranks in the top 3 of traumatic life events. You don't just lose the spouse, you lose the dream. We all get through it, because really what other option is there? But first you need to deal with the physical parting of the ways, then the emotional parting of the ways, and then finding your new path. Sending you lots of love and good thoughts.

[Firebird]

Update for anyone still following this thread...

DH and I have decided to end our journey together as romantic partners. We still love each other very much, we're very much on each other's side and will continue to be partners and family in many ways. It'll just look a bit different from here on out.

It's the right decision and it feels right; even though it was excruciating to make, we're both in a much better place with it now.

As far as the finances go, I'm moving back into the house next week (one of us will stay in the other bedroom). I know it sounds weird, but we're getting along really well these days and this is the best thing for our financial situation. We have a six month plan at the moment, which is basically "save a lot of money, start dividing finances, and then reevaluate options." We may sell, we may try the nesting thing we discussed (where we rent a small apartment and DH and I take turns staying there when we're not with Babybird).

The idea is to get into the best possible financial position for both of us before we split permanently/ make decisions about our living spaces. There's no rush.

We're telling Babybird this afternoon. I think she'll be okay (frankly, the part that will probably piss her off the most about all this is not staying at her grandparents' house half the time anymore, lol).

I appreciate everyone's good advice and kind words. This has been really hard, but we're not going to stop loving each other or being there for each other, and that means everything to me. We'll always be a family.

[debthaven]

I'm truly sorry it came to this Firebird . TBH, 6 months sounds a bit long.

I wish you all the best going forward. 

[Opti]

I wish you luck and hope your process works for both of you as you expect. How old is Babybird now?

[Firebird]

Mar 11, 2023 21:19:18 GMT -5 Opti said:

I wish you luck and hope your process works for both of you as you expect. How old is Babybird now?

She's 10. Took the news way better than I expected, maybe too well. We'll check in with her tomorrow to see if anything changes, but for now she really seems okay. Probably because barely anything has changed for her in the past few months. She knows we'll both be there, and we'll always treat each other with respect. Sometimes that's all a kiddo needs to feel secure.

[raeoflyte]

I dont want to be too Pollyanna about it, but you've made the decision so now you can move forward which is better then that in between space - at least for me. You still like each other and get along so this next chapter could be really good.

[Firebird]

Mar 12, 2023 8:18:36 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

I dont want to be too Pollyanna about it, but you've made the decision so now you can move forward which is better then that in between space - at least for me. You still like each other and get along so this next chapter could be really good.

I don't think that's Pollyanna, myself! I'm sad, don't get me wrong, but also looking forward to this next chapter in my life in many ways. Knowing DH will still be in it makes me feel much better.

[haapai]

It took me nearly nine months to buy my first house.  I rather regret that I don't have the records of where I was financially when I began the process.  I lost those records and the records of all the hair-brained disaster homes (and budgets) that I was considering when the desktop died.  It sure would be nice to have clues as to whether it was an improved financial position or improved decision-making that got me into a much more suitable house than the ones that I was considering. 

There may be something in this story that helps you.  I don't think that you'll regret taking the slow route.  Now please forgive me for the cloddish comparison between ending a romantic relationship and the much more fun business of buying a home.  Just throw dates on your records and back them up.  They'll probably come in handy. 

[souldoubt]

One of my best friends is going through a similar situation right now but they don't have a kid.  They're still living together for financial reasons but they have separate rooms.  For what it's worth they're doing a lot better now individually and as friends.  I'm sure you and your former DH will as well.