Anyone have a loved one that battles addiction?

[Ryan]

I come from a family of 6 kids plus my parents.  We are close in the sense that we all get along and see each other, but not close in the sense that I don't really talk with them much between visits (we all live close by).  My sister has always done her own thing, never got married, was fairly private, etc.  I knew she was on medication for depression, but was surprised a few years ago when she entered a facility for extreme depression.  My parents never told me exactly what she was there for, I just assumed it was strictly depression.  

Fast forward a couple years, she's out and seemingly making good progress.  All the sudden, she is back in treatment again.  Again, I assume for depression.  Slowly but surely, my family starts to tell me that she actually has a pretty bad gambling problem and my dad has bailed her out of debt.  They tell me this so I don't lend her money since she had been contacting me for short term loans.  Mainly struggles with gambling, but to a lesser extent drugs/alcohol.  She has had probably 3 "rock bottom" moments, including one involving the law and she can't seem to break it.  She seemed to have been doing well recently, but admitted to gambling over the last 2 months and racking up big losses.  

My parents are at a complete loss as to what to do with her, but have offered to have her move back home to get on her feet.  I told them that they should put some strict rules in place (freeze credit, close credit cards, prepaid cards only, cancel phone, and completely cutoff ties with toxic friends).  They are worried that doing so will drive her away or lead her in a worse direction.

I've been in shock the last couple days the more I hear.  My sister sounds like she goes between extreme regret and extreme delusion.  I'm worried for her, but also for my parents health as they deal with the stress of having to deal with her.  Every parameter they put in front of her, she finds a way around....all while being in treatment.  

Any advice?

[Tennesseer]

Ryan-you say you have four other siblings beside yourself and your sister.  Has your family thought of having a family intervention with your sister?  

Regarding the gambling problem:  I'm pretty sure there are support groups for families who have an addiction to gambling.  It would help your parents (and you along with your other siblings) in how to help your sister while not getting sucked into her problems.

[busymom]

I'm sorry to hear this.  Unfortunately, it sounds like your parents, while well-intentioned, are enabling her problem by bailing her out whenever she gets into trouble.  


I agree that joining a support group is a great idea.  I'm going to disagree with your parents that moving her in with them will work.  JMHO.  Based on your brief description, has she been evaluated for bipolar disorder?  That could be part of the puzzle here.


Wishing you & your family the very best.  

[giramomma]

My husband has an addiction that aligns closer to gambling (ie, process) rather than an addiction to drugs or alcohol.

I'd start with having your folks read "Boundaries" by Cloud and Townsend and "Codependent No More" by Beattie.

And a 12 step group, or therapist skilled in addiction issues would be good for your parents.

Step 1 is to realize your parents don't have to deal with her. That is their choice. Your sister is an adult with agency over her life. She is not a child who can be told who she can and cannot play with anymore.

Step 2: Folks need to understand she's not ready for recovery yet. It is what it is. You can't rush the process. She may never be ready for recovery.

Step 3: Detach with love. Your parents need to get busy living their own lives. Minding themselves is a big enough job. Or at least it should be. 

My husband wasn't ready for real recovery, even after three years of  sobriety and "doing the work." For him, that meant seeing a trained therapist, doing readings, working through a workbook, and at least trying a 12 step group. He was also present, and we were emotionally connecting.

Now, mind you, he'd probably been acting out (ie, getting high) for 15 years before he had recovery v1.  He didn't WANT to engage in his behaviors anymore.  But he had three things working against him:

1. He didn't completely accept that he is an addict

2. He didn't deal with the shame he was carrying

3. He had no plan in place for when he was tempted.

So, cue the world's longest slip. It was about 7 years. DH never did get back to full on-relapse, but he was getting close. And, of course, I had no idea of these things, until I discovered his near-relapse. You don't know how much shame a person is or isn't carrying just by looking at them. You can't really tell if a person is lying to themselves or not.

Now we are in recovery v2.  he's made it 5 years. He's stayed sober and in recovery while taking on more after my Dad died and through my breast cancer treatment.

I wasn't actually sure, for those 5 years if DH made any progress on the list. 5 years ago, DH actually did surrender to the notion that he's an addict. This time, the 12 step group worked, because of that. Because of his 12-step group, he also has a plan in place if he gets tempted. We also had a thing happen over 4th of July Weekend. DH disclosed his addiction to our older two kids, separately. And, he took full ownership of his behaviors, as well as how his behaviors negatively affected me. Not to burden the kids, but just to explain what they heard.

I'm actually ready, now, to be all in my marriage. We're 15 years out from the first day I discovered he was an addict.

So. This stuff I think takes a long time. My husband isn't particularly slow. He's a little dense sometimes, but not that slow.

From my perspective, there are some parts of addiction I understand. I'm a former self-injurer, so I get that emotional release. I understand that it stops when the underlying issues are dealt with. I get addiction in a very academic sense. I mean, literally, there are studies that have been done that show how the brain lights up as they get the hit from my husband's addiction. I understand the need to numb yourself from feeling. I did it to. But, addiction? I just don't get it.  I've tried to "get" it and I don't.

So, I have stopped trying to understand it. In the same way that I don't understand why someone would choose their mental illness over their only child and grandchildren. But, my mom would rather be alone and mentally ill than trying to get healthy and have folks in her life.

Acceptance. There's a good amount of grieving that has to be done, to get to acceptance. Grieving just isn't about when a person dies. I'm betting your parents had hopes and dreams for their kids....and being an addict isn't it. You may end up examining your relationships as well...and need to come to terms with some things to get to acceptance.

Random musings about boundaries..Boundaries are about what behaviors you will or will not tolerate. It's not about manipulating someone else to behave in a way that pleases you or you think is best. You don't even need to share out your boundaries. Like, I have a boundary that I won't let mom verbally abuse me. I don't tell her that. I just hang up the phone when she's crossing the line. "Oh, it doesn't sound like a good time to talk now. I'll catch up another time."

I also find that for myself, over time, I've switched to "I'll just deal with that if/when the time comes."  At 32, I had absolute boundaries. We also only had two kids, and we were living in a small enough place that I could have managed. And, we hadn't been married long enough for alimony to be a thing.

The problem is the boundaries didn't work at 42. And then I couldn't follow through. Problem. My word is just as worthless as my husband's.

You can always PM me if you have questions or whatever.

[toomuchreality]

Just sending hugs and strength your way. It all sounds so hard. ♡

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Gira said exactly what I was coming to say.

Your parents cannot fix your sister and neither can you. She has to do the work and even then relapse happens.

My husband gets sober but never does the actual work towards recovery. So every few years he finds a new substance.

He found alcohol after his mom died. I will give him credit this time he recognized on his own what was happening. He was honest with his doctor and in his meeting.

But he's still not doing the heavy emotional lifting that needs done.

If you want some insight I suggest reading Never Enough. It's about a neuroscientist who is a recovering addict. She devoted herself to researching the topic.

It helped me understand what goes on in DHs head biologically a lot better and accept this isn't aboutbDH just not being able to pull himself up by his bootstraps.

And it helped me get to the step where I let go. I live my own life. I'm here, I'm supportive but I've let go of the idea I can help or save him.

I didn't get a lot out of NarcAnon meetings. It felt awkward reading about people dealing with their kids robbing them at gunpoint and I'm talking about kratom.  I know logically that's not what it is about support is support but I found myself starting to rationalize that DH "isn't that bad".  I also found too much enabling and justifying going on and was trying to break away from that.

But their steps are really beneficial and it would be worth finding a local meeting if you can.  We don't have a local chapter I can find so it was online for me which was not the best.  See if you have a local chapter, they usually hold multiple meetings so you can find one that fits.  Ask your parents to attend with you.

Even if you don't attend or like the meetings I found the steps to be really valuable.  Definitely research those.

You can't destroy your lives for someone who doesn't or can't help themselves. That was the hardest truth to swallow. Some people can't and continue to enable like my MIL.

So that being said if your parents chose to continue to help your sister to their own deteriment you are going to have to figure out how to make peace with that.   You should not and cannot allow yourself to get sucked into their codependency.  SHE is not "making" them do anything.  They are choosing to do it themselves and you will have to accept that they have the right to do so.    I still don't think I'm there with MIL and her actions, I may  never be.  But you have to try.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Not anymore, but was married to one, although I think with him it was more mental health issues that caused him to not have an effective "off" switch than a specific addiction.  I completely walked away from that train wreck (eventually...it took him being locked up for 6 months for ME to detox from HIM).  I let him hit rock bottom on his own to save my own sanity and I'm not sure he would have otherwise.  We're talking living in the woods, completely broke and jobless.  Not that it always happens this way, but his turnaround was amazing once he put his mind to it himself.

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Ryan

[bean29]

My Dad was bi-polar, the suggestion that your DS may have Bi-Polar disease was not out in left field.  It is common for people with untreated bi-polar disease to Gamble/drink/use drugs when they are in a bi-polar high. My DH has several family members who are Alcoholics and one or two who have issues with drugs.

I don't think your parents should let her move in.  I know they may not be able to afford it, but it would be much easier to put the deposit and maybe pay 1st/last rent for a small rental unit that it would to get her out of their house if her gambling addiction continues.  If she does not deal with her recovery, they can let a landlord be the bad guy and evict her rather that having to do it themselves.

[souldoubt]

As others said your family can try to get your sister help but bailing her out isn't helping.  A friend of mine died a few months ago of alcoholism leaving behind two school age kids.  His family had interventions where they didn't pull any punches and offered to get him help but in the end he couldn't overcome his addiction.  He was in complete denial all the way up to the day he went into the hospital when he ended up on life support for the last time.  Another friend who is 15+ years sober said that when he was an addict his addiction was the one thing he had and once he admitted it and gave it up he slowly got everything else back.  There's no grey area with an addict - a gambler can't just play the slots, an alcoholic can't have just one drink and so on.  My advice is since you've told your parents your thoughts if they continue enabling her remove yourself from the equation and don't get sucked back in.  Telling them they need to stop or aren't doing what they should is only going to strain your relationship with them. 

I have another friend who has battled a different addiction for 10+ years now.  I would swear he's bipolar given his extremes but supposedly he isn't and I'm definitely no expert.  Regardless his mom's solution has just been to support him.  He's now 40 years old, hasn't worked in over a decade and he's getting worse off every day.  At a point his mom isn't going to be able to support him because she will run out of money or won't be around anymore and he's going to end up on the streets.  His mom has good intentions but she won't push him to get help or give him an ultimatum and it's going to backfire in the end.

Good luck. 

[Tiny]

I'm sorry you are finding out about a problem that isn't new.    

My family has alcoholism that no one talks about/acknowledges.  Mostly because the big drinkers are high functioning.    I'm pretty sure it's not normal for a person to drink to slurring their words almost every night or to binge drink on the weekends -- for decades.     

My only advice is to consider getting some help for yourself.   I'm sure there's some discomfort with not having realized (or asked about) the issues with your sister - especially since it appears to be something that no one talked about for many many many years.     Don't be too hard on yourself.

[Deleted]

My brother started playing with opioids and ended up addicted to heroin. He started doing junkie type shit, and ended up locked up for a couple of years.

He got out sometime last year. Was living with a woman, she ended up kicking him out and now he’s homeless because my Mom sold my Grandmother’s house that they’d both been living in, while he was locked up.

My Mom is living in my other house, which is a whole ‘nother story, but before my brother got locked up, I made it clear to my Mom that he could NOT live there, ever. He can’t even come visit her there. I’ve been adamant about that because before he got locked up, he basically stripped my Grandmother’s house of anything he could sell, and I’m not trying to let that happen to my house.

Even with him having been a horrible person, I still feel bad that he’s homeless, and I worry about him because he’s my brother, regardless of how I feel about him. But I don’t feel bad enough to let him live at either of my houses. I’ve learned the hard way that it is very difficult to get someone out of your house if they don’t want to go, after you’ve let them stay there for an agreed upon amount of time. So, NO.

I don’t really fool with my brother, but I’ve been in touch with him over the last couple of months, and if he presented me with a realistic plan for how he intends to get his life together, I would help him as much as I could, just because he’s my brother. But I’ve already warned him that he only has ONE shot with me trying to help him, so don’t ask for my help if he’s truly not ready. He knows me well enough to know that I meant what the fuck I said.

So we talk, but he still hasn’t asked me to do anything specific, I assume that means he’s not ready. He tells me he’s not doing drugs, but I have enough street smarts to know that just because he did time doesn’t mean he got clean. You can get drugs even in prison. That’s fact.

The interesting thing is that lately he’s stopped talking to my Mom as much because he says she’s bad for his mental health. I told him I completely understand, because I don’t have the issues he’s dealing with, and she’s bad for my mental health too. 

I’m sharing my experience, even though it might not be all that helpful to you because I don’t really have any good advice. All I know is that you absolutely can NOT help someone until they are ready to try to help themselves. You can’t love someone out of addiction, you can’t threaten or bully them out of it. They will not and probably can not change until THEY are ready to.

[Artemis Windsong]

Aug 3, 2022 23:00:33 GMT -5 Ryan said:

I come from a family of 6 kids plus my parents.  We are close in the sense that we all get along and see each other, but not close in the sense that I don't really talk with them much between visits (we all live close by).  My sister has always done her own thing, never got married, was fairly private, etc.  I knew she was on medication for depression, but was surprised a few years ago when she entered a facility for extreme depression.  My parents never told me exactly what she was there for, I just assumed it was strictly depression.  

Fast forward a couple years, she's out and seemingly making good progress.  All the sudden, she is back in treatment again.  Again, I assume for depression.  Slowly but surely, my family starts to tell me that she actually has a pretty bad gambling problem and my dad has bailed her out of debt.  They tell me this so I don't lend her money since she had been contacting me for short term loans.  Mainly struggles with gambling, but to a lesser extent drugs/alcohol.  She has had probably 3 "rock bottom" moments, including one involving the law and she can't seem to break it.  She seemed to have been doing well recently, but admitted to gambling over the last 2 months and racking up big losses.  

My parents are at a complete loss as to what to do with her, but have offered to have her move back home to get on her feet.  I told them that they should put some strict rules in place (freeze credit, close credit cards, prepaid cards only, cancel phone, and completely cutoff ties with toxic friends).  They are worried that doing so will drive her away or lead her in a worse direction.

I've been in shock the last couple days the more I hear.  My sister sounds like she goes between extreme regret and extreme delusion.  I'm worried for her, but also for my parents health as they deal with the stress of having to deal with her.  Every parameter they put in front of her, she finds a way around....all while being in treatment.  

Any advice?

My ex SIL dealt with a problem son.  She got better when she went to alcoholics anonymous support group. I don't recall the exact name of the group.  She had a drinking problem but went anyway.  Any 12-step program can direct you. The Enabler.  When helping hurts the one you love.  It's a book on Amazon.  Developing coping skills and tough love is very important to watching someone self-destruct.  Blessings to you and your family on this tough road.

Edit:  Another book - Codependent No More.

[Ryan]

Thanks for the comments and tips.  This is new info for me, so I'm just processing.  I wouldn't say that my parents are getting taken advantage of, but I think they are puzzled as to how to best help.  I would describe my mom as someone that takes the path of least resistance and then talks herself into that being the optimal way.  The rest of my family tends to follow my mom's lead because they don't want to upset her.  Me and another one of my siblings tend to be more blunt in our approach and I think the rest of them leave us out of discussions due to that.

My parents both spoke with her the other day and she expressed extreme remorse one minute and then had a more flippant "it's just money" attitude the next.  I think in her eyes, since she doesn't ask for money, my family shouldn't concern herself with how she is doing financially. She thinks because she's asking money for a good cause (rent) that it's not related to gambling...even though the reason she has no money is gambling.  You can tell she is not all there with the logic.

I think this is all related to depression because there are so many layers to it all.  I think she doesn't get enjoyment out of much, so she does the activity that gives her a rush.  I would describe her as extremely high functioning and very personable, but leads a double life.  

[giramomma]

Aug 4, 2022 19:59:10 GMT -5 Ryan said:

My parents both spoke with her the other day and she expressed extreme remorse one minute and then had a more flippant "it's just money" attitude the next.

I think this is all related to depression because there are so many layers to it all.  I think she doesn't get enjoyment out of much, so she does the activity that gives her a rush.  I would describe her as extremely high functioning and very personable, but leads a double life.  

Yup, and yup. That's what I experienced with my husband. Particularly the double life...it's part of MO with my husband's addiction.

And there are generally many layers to work through.

You also may find it useful to read up on the karpman drama triangle.

And, I would gut check the reason you are choosing to engage in discussions regarding your sister's situation.

You can love, worry, be sympathetic from afar and say "not my circus, not my monkeys."

Another resource that might be useful for you is Covey's 7 habits of highly effective people, where he talks about the circle of control, the circle of influence and the circle of concern. Really, it's the same thing as boundaries and all of that, just said another way. Here's a link if you aren't familiar with the idea.

karbonhq.com/resources/circle-of-concern-vs-circle-of-influence/

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Aug 4, 2022 19:59:10 GMT -5 Ryan said:

Thanks for the comments and tips.  This is new info for me, so I'm just processing.  I wouldn't say that my parents are getting taken advantage of, but I think they are puzzled as to how to best help.  I would describe my mom as someone that takes the path of least resistance and then talks herself into that being the optimal way.  The rest of my family tends to follow my mom's lead because they don't want to upset her.  Me and another one of my siblings tend to be more blunt in our approach and I think the rest of them leave us out of discussions due to that.

My parents both spoke with her the other day and she expressed extreme remorse one minute and then had a more flippant "it's just money" attitude the next.  I think in her eyes, since she doesn't ask for money, my family shouldn't concern herself with how she is doing financially. She thinks because she's asking money for a good cause (rent) that it's not related to gambling...even though the reason she has no money is gambling.  You can tell she is not all there with the logic.

I think this is all related to depression because there are so many layers to it all.  I think she doesn't get enjoyment out of much, so she does the activity that gives her a rush.  I would describe her as extremely high functioning and very personable, but leads a double life.  

That is what addicts do.  My husband can be extremely high functioning.   I know some of his tells but he was able to hide a relapse from me for a good six months and we're married.

And no addicts aren't logical in the way you think they should be.  If they were they would not be addicts.

I strongly encourage you to read some of the books recommended here.  I won't say that I fully understand it or what I got myself into marrying DH but by educating myself it has helped me to figure out what to do with myself in terms of his issues.

You cannot apply normal human norms and expectations on an addict.  You will drive yourself insane.

One of the most helpful things I learned after reading Never Enough is that for addicts after a certain point it is not about getting high.  It's about feeling normal.   Everyone learned at least the basics about homeostatsis in school, if not google it.

That is all the things that our body needs to be able to function in the universe.  Addiction rewires your brain.  When you do something habitually or take something habitually your brain thinks "Oh I am getting all this stuff I need from the outside, no need to make it myself" so it stops making it.   When you stop gambling or stop using you feel like garbage and your brain will do anything it can to achieve what it thinks is it's normal.  

DH has to take Prozac after years of abusing uppers because his brain has programmed itself to where it can no longer maintain what he needs on its own.  It may be decades before he can do it, if ever.  So anti-depressants are needed so he doesn't go fully off the rails again.   I think the dose needs upped personally or another one added but I cant make a grown adult take medication.

Another way to think of it that I hadn't considered is in regards to caffiene.  How many of us cannot function without a daily cup of something or a pop?  Guess what. . .you're an addict.  How do you feel when you don't have your daily cup or more?  Guess what  .you're an addict.   We just don't tend to think about it because caffiene is a societally accepted addiction.    We don't stop to think about the fact that it is a mind altering drug.   We reserve that type of talk for the illegal stuff.

Now imagine how you feel without your daily cup of coffee times a thousand.  That is how your sister feels.   When you feel that way your body thinks it is literally dying and will do whatever it takes to get you back to "normal".

It's not my husband chasing the high.  It's my husband chasing normal.   It takes major effort and thought for him to do it sober unlike me who does it without thinking.    That doesn't make what happens any less heart breaking or frustrating for me as his wife but it's made me more compassionate in some ways and also accept that it's not something totally in our control.  I cannot willpower DH into feeling normal like I do when sober.   It is something that may take the rest of his life.   That's why they say take it one day at a time when you are an addict.

[swamp]

I regularly deal with addicts in my work. 

We say, "addicts gonna addict" when they engage in lying, criminal behavior, or self destructive behavior when it appears that those actions are completely illogical. 

You cannot force someone to get help, they  have to make the decision on their own, and they won't make that decision until they hit their own version of rock bottom.  For some people, losing a job, a spouse, or family relationships is sufficient motivation to change.   Some just end up dead.  Most are in the middle. 

What can you do?    Be emotionally there, be supportive.  Help them find the professional supports they need.  Drive them to meetings and appointments.  Feed them.   Don't give them money.  

[Artemis Windsong]

With caffeine, a person can walk down to zero in 3 to 4 days.  With other addictions that will not work.

[NastyWoman]

Aug 5, 2022 16:08:50 GMT -5 Artemis Windsong said:

With caffeine, a person can walk down to zero in 3 to 4 days.  With other addictions that will not work.

Maybe it takes that long. Give me a bad cup of coffee and I will abstain for the rest of my stay be it a few days or a month.  So maybe I am not really addicted? However, I really, really like the flavor of black, lightly sweetened coffee so, like chocolate, it will stay part of my life's little pleasures 

[Deleted]

I had a former friend that seemed to be addicted to sugar. She wanted to lose weight for many years, but her weakness was sweets. When she described how she felt if she didn’t eat any sweets, I Googled it and it seems that that can be a real addiction. Who knew? I certainly didn’t.

Even though that kind of addiction can wreak havoc with your physical health, I feel like it’s not as bad as some other addictions that ruin your physical health, but also your mental health, and for the worst addictions (imo) your whole life.

[laterbloomer]

Don't soften their bottom and take care of yourself. It's not up to you or your parents to fix her problems. I hope for their sake they don't send good money after bad. Paying her debts just let's her gamble more. She has proven she is going to spend everything she can snd then some. Don't let it be your money. You will lose a lot of money and she won't get any better.

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Aug 5, 2022 17:56:10 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

I had a former friend that seemed to be addicted to sugar. She wanted to lose weight for many years, but her weakness was sweets. When she described how she felt if she didn’t eat any sweets, I Googled it and it seems that that can be a real addiction. Who knew? I certainly didn’t.

Even though that kind of addiction can wreak havoc with your physical health, I feel like it’s not as bad as some other addictions that ruin your physical health, but also your mental health, and for the worst addictions (imo) your whole life.

Yes, processed sugar is addicting. There is now much research documenting it and much explanation for what it does to the human body. What's most unfortunate is our (US) government perpetuated processed sugar as being healthy, and our economy perpetuated a need for processed foods being "better" and "easier" for us. 

Signed, 
The girls who just ate an entire bag of Dark Mint Milanos

[Deleted]

Not happy endings, but my Ex was an alcoholic and a cousin had multiple substance abuse issues. Cousin lived in Ohio when I was in NJ so I heard things only second-hand.

People have mentioned mental illness and many times alcohol or other addictions are an attempt at self-medication. The Ex may have had bipolar disorder- his Jungian analyst said no, the Menninger Clinic (his sister paid for it) said yes. I spent too much time propping him up and enabling him. I know that now. I was in a difficult position- he didn't want a divorce (why should he? we lived in a nice house and my income paid the bills so he could stay home and get drunk), we had a child and we were in a HCOL area. After a bad health scare (platelet count tanked, he fell and had a giant purple bruise on his back that lasted forever because his blood wouldn't clot, skin tone was yellowish), a good doctor talked him into AA and therapy. That worked for awhile but then he started sneaking alcohol again. Long story but addicts can be ingenious in getting what they crave.

I had him removed from the house with a Restraining Order after he threatened to kill me if I didn't find someone to fix the broken A/C (it was Friday evening and I'd gotten home from work). He never slept in the house again.

His sister was my role model. She and her DH were successful entrepreneurs who could have supported him in lavish style the rest of his life. They did not. She paid for rehab-twice. The second time was in FL and the Ex stayed down there and lived on and off of social programs till he died at age 64.

My cousin couldn't fight his demons and committed suicide at age 42.

You (and your parents) need to protect yourselves. I used to say "All you can do for them isn't enough".

And when my grandchildren are old enough, with their parents; permission, I intend to caution them about addiction in the family. DDIL's brother had drug problems but is clean and happily married, so it's on both sides. DS is a teetotaller except for cooking with wine and occasionally asking to sample whatever I order at a restaurant. I get it.

[finnime]

IME addicts choose the source of their addiction over anything and anyone else, including life itself in the end, unless they are in recovery. There are people who can abuse and overuse something without a true addiction; they can stop doing it. So there are heavy drinkers who are not alcoholics, and gamblers who can walk away before they spend their daughter's college funds, and people who have random sex with anyone until they outgrow their adolescence.

An addict will do pretty much anything to anyone to get their next dose.

Real addicts can't choose. They can only be in recovery, or not. If not then their addiction will take over their life. It's hard when you love an addict who is not in recovery, because they can't love you back. The person they were before addiction has been replaced with an addict. The addiction will always be the source of meaning in their life. Until, unless, they are in recovery.

[happyhoix]

Aug 5, 2022 18:30:37 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Aug 5, 2022 17:56:10 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

I had a former friend that seemed to be addicted to sugar. She wanted to lose weight for many years, but her weakness was sweets. When she described how she felt if she didn’t eat any sweets, I Googled it and it seems that that can be a real addiction. Who knew? I certainly didn’t.

Even though that kind of addiction can wreak havoc with your physical health, I feel like it’s not as bad as some other addictions that ruin your physical health, but also your mental health, and for the worst addictions (imo) your whole life.

Yes, processed sugar is addicting. There is now much research documenting it and much explanation for what it does to the human body. What's most unfortunate is our (US) government perpetuated processed sugar as being healthy, and our economy perpetuated a need for processed foods being "better" and "easier" for us. 

Signed, 
The girls who just ate an entire bag of Dark Mint Milanos

Preach it, sister.

I periodically go chocolate free. I always loose weight. I never crave broccoli or carrots- just really good chocolate.

Eventually I decide life is hard enough without doing without the one legal thing that can give you a small burst of happiness in an otherwise shit day and get back on the sugar wagon.

Sad. I’m spineless. I guess I should be glad I never tried meth since I doubt I’d be able to stop.

[swamp]

The lengths people go to get meth is amazing.  It must be one hell of a high.   

[raeoflyte]

Aug 17, 2022 10:39:59 GMT -5 swamp said:

The lengths people go to get meth is amazing.  It must be one hell of a high.   

I had a recently sober friend tell me that nothing felt better than meth in highschool. So I made sure I never tried it.

[bean29]

Aug 17, 2022 9:06:52 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Aug 5, 2022 18:30:37 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Yes, processed sugar is addicting. There is now much research documenting it and much explanation for what it does to the human body. What's most unfortunate is our (US) government perpetuated processed sugar as being healthy, and our economy perpetuated a need for processed foods being "better" and "easier" for us. 

Signed, 
The girls who just ate an entire bag of Dark Mint Milanos

Preach it, sister.

I periodically go chocolate free. I always loose weight. I never crave broccoli or carrots- just really good chocolate.

Eventually I decide life is hard enough without doing without the one legal thing that can give you a small burst of happiness in an otherwise shit day and get back on the sugar wagon.

Sad. I’m spineless. I guess I should be glad I never tried meth since I doubt I’d be able to stop.

This is how I feel about my Caffeine Addiction.