Of what value is life?

[countrygirl2]

That is why proposing laws to allow healthcare personnel to use personal religious reasons to deny care to a patient is such a bad idea.

I just read that, that is exactly what people who are getting rid of abortion are doing. Isn't that what they are doing when they won't prescribe abortion pills or things like that?

And not just medical people but other people out here. I don't agree with it at all, what about people like me?

And then someone like my MIL. She is back in the mental health place again trying to help her. She doesn't know son, she talks to him when there, he said he doesn't even know what she is saying. She hit another client in the back again. Tore up nurses records, sounds like tried to destroy a computer. The Admin of the Nursing home had to send her back to HARSHA again. I asked why, because the state is cracking down and making them dot every I and cross every T even though they know it's pointless. She is in a horrible situation, likely only confuses her more. It just seems at some point this should end. Maybe quit giving her any drugs and let nature take it's course.  Imagine what all this is costing and is not helping her at all.

I would like to live in a state where I could choose euthanasia, she would. As years ago she said she was ready to go, it's almost like torture.

[toomuchreality]

I really wish euthanasia was a choice in health care. The end of life can be really hard on both the living and the dying.
But it's a slippery slope, for sure.

[weltschmerz]

Jun 23, 2022 13:21:57 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

I really wish euthanasia was a choice in health care. The end of life can be really hard on both the living and the dying.
But it's a slippery slope, for sure.

It'a a choice in 10 states. It's been legal in Canada for 8 years.

[toomuchreality]

Jun 23, 2022 13:35:14 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Jun 23, 2022 13:21:57 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

I really wish euthanasia was a choice in health care. The end of life can be really hard on both the living and the dying.
But it's a slippery slope, for sure.

It'a a choice in 10 states. It's been legal in Canada for 8 years.

Hopefully, it will be in my state, before long. But I will be surprised.
I hope you are doing well, Weltz.
It was nice of your neighbor to bring you a plate of Eastern food.
Enjoy your day!

[Tiny]

Jun 18, 2022 9:35:36 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

Jun 17, 2022 19:54:50 GMT -5 tractor said:

Quick follow-up. The husband has survived and upon release from the hospital, he was arrested and charged with 21 felony counts including capital murder. No word yet if there will be a trial, but he will spend the rest of his life in jail.

I don't think he spends the rest of his life in jail unless there is a trial or plea deal.  

He also can claim he is mentally incompetent and spend his life in a mental health institution.  

Just because he's now in prison,  doesn't mean it's over in the judicial system.  

Don't assume that he won't need medical care/assistance daily - because of his failed suicide attempt.  He may not spend the rest of his life in jail - he may spend the rest of his life somehow incarcerated (mental health institution or assisted care/nursing home).  

[weltschmerz]

Jun 23, 2022 13:49:47 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

Jun 23, 2022 13:35:14 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

It'a a choice in 10 states. It's been legal in Canada for 8 years.

Hopefully, it will be in my state, before long. But I will be surprised.
I hope you are doing well, Weltz.
It was nice of your neighbor to bring you a plate of Eastern food.
Enjoy your day!

It used to be available only to those whose death was imminent. That left a lot of people suffering, so they're changing it.

DS knew a guy from his car shows. He was approved for euthanasia because he had AIDs and cancer. At the last minute, they cancelled it, saying his death was not really imminent, and that he could live for many more months.
He got into his Ferrari, poured gasoline over himself and set himself on fire.
He could no longer take the pain.

[toomuchreality]

Jun 23, 2022 14:08:05 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Jun 23, 2022 13:49:47 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

Hopefully, it will be in my state, before long. But I will be surprised.
I hope you are doing well, Weltz.
It was nice of your neighbor to bring you a plate of Eastern food.
Enjoy your day!

It used to be available only to those whose death was imminent. That left a lot of people suffering, so they're changing it.

DS knew a guy from his car shows. He was approved for euthanasia because he had AIDs and cancer. At the last minute, they cancelled it, saying his death was not really imminent, and that he could live for many more months.
He got into his Ferrari, poured gasoline over himself and set himself on fire.
He could no longer take the pain.

Stories like that are heartbreaking.
My mom had Alzheimers and my dad had cancer, when they died. The last couple of weeks were hell, in both cases. My dad could have been given morphine, or whatever it is they give. But he was old school and when the person in charge of his care/meds would ask how he was doing, he'd say "Fine", even though he really wasn't. So they wouldn't give it to him until an hour before he died. That's no way to live.

[toomuchreality]

I miss mmhmm.  

[grumpyhermit]

Jun 23, 2022 14:08:05 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Jun 23, 2022 13:49:47 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

Hopefully, it will be in my state, before long. But I will be surprised.
I hope you are doing well, Weltz.
It was nice of your neighbor to bring you a plate of Eastern food.
Enjoy your day!

It used to be available only to those whose death was imminent. That left a lot of people suffering, so they're changing it.

DS knew a guy from his car shows. He was approved for euthanasia because he had AIDs and cancer. At the last minute, they cancelled it, saying his death was not really imminent, and that he could live for many more months.
He got into his Ferrari, poured gasoline over himself and set himself on fire.
He could no longer take the pain.

of all the options available to take your own life, setting myself on fire would be near the very bottom of that list. 

While I fully support the decision of a person to end their own life, being American, I do also have qualms knowing how rapidly our system of predatory capitalism and turn things to shit faster than you can imagine. It's the same reason why, while I support stricter gun laws, any mention of "police interviews" as part of that process make me pause since I know racists will find a way to exploit it. 

[laterbloomer]

Jun 5, 2022 19:13:24 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

Jun 5, 2022 19:07:26 GMT -5 tractor said:

I understand they have a duty to perform care, but given the circumstances, can't they get a pass? I know it's harsh, but so is shooting your wife and kids in their home.

I am guessing they don't have a choice, just like the police and EMTs at the site of the shooting didn't get to just say, "Nah, why bother". 

I don't think that should be the rule. Who are we to over rule someone's wish to die?

[mollyanna58]

Jun 30, 2022 21:39:34 GMT -5 laterbloomer said:

Jun 5, 2022 19:13:24 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

I am guessing they don't have a choice, just like the police and EMTs at the site of the shooting didn't get to just say, "Nah, why bother". 

I don't think that should be the rule. Who are we to over rule someone's wish to die?

Forgetting about this particular case, are you saying medical personnel shouldn't try to save anyone who attempts suicide?  Many people who survive an attempt are thankful later.

[Tennesseer]

Jul 1, 2022 9:35:48 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

Jun 30, 2022 21:39:34 GMT -5 laterbloomer said:

I don't think that should be the rule. Who are we to over rule someone's wish to die?

Forgetting about this particular case, are you saying medical personnel shouldn't try to save anyone who attempts suicide?  Many people who survive an attempt are thankful later.

Many who attempt suicide are hoping someone finds them before it is too late. The non-violent suicide attempts are a good example. Shooting oneself in the head or jumping off highway bridges into on-coming traffic are good examples of those who do not wish to be stopped.

[TheOtherMe]

Jul 1, 2022 11:19:13 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jul 1, 2022 9:35:48 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

Forgetting about this particular case, are you saying medical personnel shouldn't try to save anyone who attempts suicide?  Many people who survive an attempt are thankful later.

Many who attempt suicide are hoping someone finds them before it is too late. The non-violent suicide attempts are a good example. Shooting oneself in the head or jumping off highway bridges into on-coming traffic are good examples of those who do not wish to be stopped.

Correct.  

Here we have people get on the bridge over the Mississippi every couple of months.  Most do not end up jumping.  It's a big time cry for help.  

Due to funding cuts at the state level and closures of facilities as a result, it's extremely difficult to find a bed unless it's a crisis.  I think some here go on the bridge so they can get a bed and get help.  

[tallguy]

Jun 23, 2022 13:35:14 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Jun 23, 2022 13:21:57 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

I really wish euthanasia was a choice in health care. The end of life can be really hard on both the living and the dying.
But it's a slippery slope, for sure.

It'a a choice in 10 states. It's been legal in Canada for 8 years.

The State of Washington passed theirs by citizen initiative in 2008.  It passed with 58% of the vote.  Sometimes it is better to just let the people speak, and get politicians out of it. 

[weltschmerz]

Jun 30, 2022 20:34:58 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Jun 23, 2022 14:08:05 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

It used to be available only to those whose death was imminent. That left a lot of people suffering, so they're changing it.

DS knew a guy from his car shows. He was approved for euthanasia because he had AIDs and cancer. At the last minute, they cancelled it, saying his death was not really imminent, and that he could live for many more months.
He got into his Ferrari, poured gasoline over himself and set himself on fire.
He could no longer take the pain.

of all the options available to take your own life, setting myself on fire would be near the very bottom of that list. 

While I fully support the decision of a person to end their own life, being American, I do also have qualms knowing how rapidly our system of predatory capitalism and turn things to shit faster than you can imagine. It's the same reason why, while I support stricter gun laws, any mention of "police interviews" as part of that process make me pause since I know racists will find a way to exploit it. 

He did it right in front of the hospital, as a political statement.

[pulmonarymd]

Jun 6, 2022 13:27:32 GMT -5 Artemis Windsong said:

I say die.  Delaying treatment at the scene.

A paramedic told me once that every hospital has it's own Dr. Kavorkian.  Assisted but not direct cause of death.

Urban myth. There is no such thing. Care is given as per standards unless a patient or his family request otherwise.

As someone who deals with death and dying on a frequent basis, there is a moral hazard to having us make these decisions. A human life is a valuable thing. It should not be ended without due consideration. In emergency situations, many times all the facts are not available, and erring on the side of continued appropriate care is right. We have pledged to care for people to the best of our ability, and to not dong my best would be morally difficult for me. In the case of suicide, it is frequently an impulsive act, and most people who survive are grateful that we did not let them die.