Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 22, 2021 10:07:50 GMT -5
So do you know nothing about how the economy has actually done? Is it that bad? Your knowledge and not the economy. I don't give those articles much cred, because its about feels not facts. Take this snippet for example- The best rating, perhaps unsurprisingly, belonged to George W. Bush following the September 11 attacks. He was at +37 points at a time when his approval ratings on all issues were high thanks to the "rally around the flag" effect.This is a very emotional flag waving rating. In reality, two local economies took severe hits, businesses residing in the World Trade Center and D.C because of the Pentagon. In the tristate area shockwaves went through with worries about other attacks causing people to move out of NYC to NJ and other places. My employer at the time took the advantage to downsize its IT workforce and it was not the only one. The UNIX employment space never really recovered back to pre 911 levels to my knowledge (for American workers). It did also hasten money going out to IT companies in India and other countries and upped the number of H1B VISAs coming in, because allegedly the laid off American workforce was invisible or did not exist. I'm sure post 911 hurt the balance sheet of the airlines who had their planes destroyed as well. The flag industry probably made a killing, but pre 911, I wonder if they were even worth any one floor in WTC. It was pure irrational exuberance.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 22, 2021 10:16:21 GMT -5
Let us talk about the truth VB. Answer a simple question. Who won the 2020 presidential election? If you refuse to answer or give an dissembling answer, it is clear you cannot be taken seriously Cmon, that is too easy. Biden. (does not mean I have to follow the blithering idiot blindly and the liberals do not follow him either. They lead him around feeding him ice cream) Biden leads more than Trump ever did. I'm guessing you have not yet read, how often staffers and close circle peeps were getting 45 Cokes and hamburgers to sedate his rage of the moment. IMO leadership is not about getting people to follow your every move. That kind of hierarchy is only necessary in war. IMO really good leaders do what needs to be done, popularity be damned. Sure, it is good if you can get most of the people to see your POV, but a military commander rarely has that. What the MC has is obedience and that is similar to heading a worshipful cult.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 22, 2021 10:21:18 GMT -5
What Trump followers also don't get is, unifying liberals is like herding cats. Too many POVs, and they don't want to be a unified one brained mind. Some, not all, Trump followers find emotional comfort in using the one Trump group mind. It plays to their sense of belonging and they've been trained to see that as being superior. Weirdly, they don't see the irony that they are the true sheeple.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Dec 22, 2021 10:26:08 GMT -5
What Trump followers also don't get is, unifying liberals is like herding cats. Too many POVs, and they don't want to be a unified one brained mind. Some, not all, Trump followers find emotional comfort in using the one Trump group mind. It plays to their sense of belonging and they've been trained to see that as being superior. Weirdly, they don't see the irony that they are the true sheeple. At least dems 98% of the time vote in lock step on Congressional votes so they are easy to herd. Republicans, like cats, will never stay as a herd together. They splinter off as fast as possible.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Dec 22, 2021 11:35:57 GMT -5
Let us talk about the truth VB. Answer a simple question. Who won the 2020 presidential election? If you refuse to answer or give an dissembling answer, it is clear you cannot be taken seriously Cmon, that is too easy. Biden. (does not mean I have to follow the blithering idiot blindly and the liberals do not follow him either. They lead him around feeding him ice cream) Apparently too difficult for Trump and a large number of representatives, senators, and a majority of republican voters to say. Now, a harder one. Was the election "fair"
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 22, 2021 12:18:28 GMT -5
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 22, 2021 17:55:08 GMT -5
What Trump followers also don't get is, unifying liberals is like herding cats. Too many POVs, and they don't want to be a unified one brained mind. Some, not all, Trump followers find emotional comfort in using the one Trump group mind. It plays to their sense of belonging and they've been trained to see that as being superior. Weirdly, they don't see the irony that they are the true sheeple. At least dems 98% of the time vote in lock step on Congressional votes so they are easy to herd. Republicans, like cats, will never stay as a herd together. They splinter off as fast as possible. You don't really follow voting, do you, at the federal level?
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Dec 22, 2021 23:41:04 GMT -5
Cmon, that is too easy. Biden. (does not mean I have to follow the blithering idiot blindly and the liberals do not follow him either. They lead him around feeding him ice cream) Apparently too difficult for Trump and a large number of representatives, senators, and a majority of republican voters to say. Now, a harder one. Was the election "fair" It was "fair", in the sense many states eased voting rules due to the pandemic. I disagree how some states handled those procedures. Now the question is: Do I think, did it make a difference in the outcome? No. Did I like the result? No.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Dec 23, 2021 0:06:08 GMT -5
Apparently too difficult for Trump and a large number of representatives, senators, and a majority of republican voters to say. Now, a harder one. Was the election "fair" It was "fair", in the sense many states eased voting rules due to the pandemic. I disagree how some states handled those procedures. Now the question is: Do I think, did it make a difference in the outcome? No. Did I like the result? No. “Eased rules”. Yeah, how dare states make it EASIER for people to vote in a democracy. WTF is up with that? But never fear VB, your cult leader has figured out how to solve that problem. Just get the right people in place to overturn the votes of the people. As you seem incapable of acknowledging Trump’s coup attempt I can only place you on the destroy democracy side of the ledger as you sink into a cesspool of fascism.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 23, 2021 0:47:47 GMT -5
Apparently too difficult for Trump and a large number of representatives, senators, and a majority of republican voters to say. Now, a harder one. Was the election "fair" It was "fair", in the sense many states eased voting rules due to the pandemic. I disagree how some states handled those procedures. Now the question is: Do I think, did it make a difference in the outcome? No. Did I like the result? No. So you voted for trump in 2020. I don't think you would sit it out and not vote for president as your dislike of Biden in well known. Odd how you never mention any of trump's faults and criminal behavior especially leading up to January 6th, 2021, asking Georgia to lie about the state's election results to turn him into a winner instead of the big loser he is. It's a shame you and I will be long gone when historians list Trump as one of the worst if not the worst president in U.S. history.
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Post by tallguy on Dec 23, 2021 0:58:24 GMT -5
It was "fair", in the sense many states eased voting rules due to the pandemic. I disagree how some states handled those procedures. Now the question is: Do I think, did it make a difference in the outcome? No. Did I like the result? No. So you voted for trump in 2020. I don't think you would sit it out and not vote for president as your dislike of Biden in well known. Odd how you hever mention any of trump's faults and criminal behavior especially leading up to January 6th, 2021, asking Georgia to lie about the state's election results to turn him into a winner instead of the big loser he is. It's a shame you and I will be long gone when historians list Trump as one of the worst if not the worst president in U.S. history.No, that is happening already. Started VERY early on that one.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Dec 23, 2021 7:00:58 GMT -5
Apparently too difficult for Trump and a large number of representatives, senators, and a majority of republican voters to say. Now, a harder one. Was the election "fair" It was "fair", in the sense many states eased voting rules due to the pandemic. I disagree how some states handled those procedures. Now the question is: Do I think, did it make a difference in the outcome? No. Did I like the result? No. Final question. Since Biden won fair and square, trumps trump efforts to overthrow the election results, with the resultant insurrection on 1/6, which to a law and order guy like yourself must have been horrifying. If trump is nominated in 2024, are you voting for him again. Simple yes/no question. That is all we need to know to about your views on the whole cult of Biden and law and order
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 23, 2021 8:22:29 GMT -5
It was "fair", in the sense many states eased voting rules due to the pandemic. I disagree how some states handled those procedures. Now the question is: Do I think, did it make a difference in the outcome? No. Did I like the result? No. “Eased rules”. Yeah, how dare states make it EASIER for people to vote in a democracy. WTF is up with that? But never fear VB, your cult leader has figured out how to solve that problem. Just get the right people in place to overturn the votes of the people. As you seem incapable of acknowledging Trump’s coup attempt I can only place you on the destroy democracy side of the ledger as you sink into a cesspool of fascism. I would not call mailed in voting here in NJ eased rules. Its the pandemic, procedures needed to change. The process was much harder than the usual show up to the polls and vote. It was all new and required someone else to sign the outer envelope if you did not drop it off yourself. Quite a few of those ballots were thrown out because they didn't follow the brand new rules and/or they weren't able to get in touch with the voters to verify in time before the cutoff time for the election. I vote most often in the last hour or two my polling place is open. No surprise my ballot got back the last week, not two weeks prior like I planned. It was far more effort for me, and I chose to drive to a NJ dropoff ballot box instead of trust the mail that late. It was harder. If it was a usual process it would have been better, but my guess NJ is not the only state who had valid voters and had to toss their ballots because they did not follow the rules. I actually caught a resident or two using the wrong envelope as the outer one. To my knowledge, this person did NOT correct their mistake, as they said the threw it out and they weren't going to bother to contact the voting clerk to get the outer envelope. I think attempted participation was much higher than the vote total. I think the thrown out attempts are far greater than the amount of true voter fraud that has been found (and exists). That's to be expected anytime a new process is introduced. I don't think it was easier, but I think it was a great choice and should be continued. Voter participation should be greater than 50% year in year out.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 23, 2021 8:28:35 GMT -5
Here's a nice table of voter participation in WA state, who has mail in voting for awhile. One thing I noticed right away, is the amount of voters does not drop off that significantly for mid term elections. www.sos.wa.gov/elections/voter-participation.aspx
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Dec 23, 2021 12:34:52 GMT -5
Here's a nice table of voter participation in WA state, who has mail in voting for awhile. One thing I noticed right away, is the amount of voters does not drop off that significantly for mid term elections. www.sos.wa.gov/elections/voter-participation.aspx Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Dec 23, 2021 13:43:56 GMT -5
Here's a nice table of voter participation in WA state, who has mail in voting for awhile. One thing I noticed right away, is the amount of voters does not drop off that significantly for mid term elections. www.sos.wa.gov/elections/voter-participation.aspx Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎 Yeah, it works out great. In fact, we have a state that actually WANTS all of its people to vote, so much so that not only are there numerous drop boxes but the state will even pay for the postage if you do in fact mail your ballot. Get your ballot in advance, read about the issues while marking the ballot, return it when finished, and have the whole process be simple, convenient, and free for the voter along with greatly increasing participation rates and reducing overall costs due to not needing polling places everywhere. Why do other states NOT do this, unless of course they do not want everyone to vote? Must have something to do with liberal control, huh?
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 23, 2021 14:21:22 GMT -5
Here's a nice table of voter participation in WA state, who has mail in voting for awhile. One thing I noticed right away, is the amount of voters does not drop off that significantly for mid term elections. www.sos.wa.gov/elections/voter-participation.aspx Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎 Its also good for certain workers and job categories. If you only have in person voting on one day, people who work double shifts or do two jobs often don't have a time they can actually vote. I know at least several people I used to work with, who did not vote for Hillary, because of that. Luckily, she won the state, but her grand total might have been higher if what I noticed held true for other nursing facility staff (especially maintenance, CNAs, food service, etc.)
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Post by weltschmerz on Dec 23, 2021 14:47:14 GMT -5
Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎 Its also good for certain workers and job categories. If you only have in person voting on one day, people who work double shifts or do two jobs often don't have a time they can actually vote. I know at least several people I used to work with, who did not vote for Hillary, because of that. Luckily, she won the state, but her grand total might have been higher if what I noticed held true for other nursing facility staff (especially maintenance, CNAs, food service, etc.) Our hospital employers are obliged BY LAW to give every worker a couple of hours off (paid) to go vote.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Dec 23, 2021 15:31:58 GMT -5
Its also good for certain workers and job categories. If you only have in person voting on one day, people who work double shifts or do two jobs often don't have a time they can actually vote. I know at least several people I used to work with, who did not vote for Hillary, because of that. Luckily, she won the state, but her grand total might have been higher if what I noticed held true for other nursing facility staff (especially maintenance, CNAs, food service, etc.) Our hospital employers are obliged BY LAW to give every worker a couple of hours off (paid) to go vote. I’ve always liked the Aussie version. www.nytimes.com/2018/10/22/world/australia/compulsory-voting.amp.html
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Dec 25, 2021 20:03:24 GMT -5
It might just be me. But every time I hear anyone decry anything that assists in voting, whether it’s value buy whining about vote by mail, or entire repo-Con states electing a variety of voter suppression laws, I just immediately label them as (choose one or more) fascist, racist, anti-democratic, or anti-American. They make it so bleedin’ obvious don’t they.
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Post by tallguy on Dec 25, 2021 20:07:39 GMT -5
It might just be me. But every time I hear anyone decry anything that assists in voting, whether it’s value buy whining about vote by mail, or entire repo-Con states electing a variety of voter suppression laws, I just immediately label them as (choose one or more) fascist, racist, anti-democratic, or anti-American. They make it so bleedin’ obvious don’t they. Yes they do, and it's NOT just you. "Deplorables" was not only an understatement, but it applies to a much larger number of people than Hillary Clinton ever meant it to.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Dec 25, 2021 21:30:55 GMT -5
Here's a nice table of voter participation in WA state, who has mail in voting for awhile. One thing I noticed right away, is the amount of voters does not drop off that significantly for mid term elections. www.sos.wa.gov/elections/voter-participation.aspx Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎 Trump only complained about changes in the voting rules in states where he lost. And in the states where he lost, he only wanted to throw out the votes in urban counties with lots of minority votes. It was his excuse for losing - corrupt voting in the liberal urban areas- because either he thinks there is no corruption in red areas, or, more likely, he doesn’t care about corruption in red areas. How any rational adult does not recognize what he was attempting to do is beyond me.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Dec 25, 2021 22:12:38 GMT -5
Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎 Trump only complained about changes in the voting rules in states where he lost. And in the states where he lost, he only wanted to throw out the votes in urban counties with lots of minority votes. It was his excuse for losing - corrupt voting in the liberal urban areas- because either he thinks there is no corruption in red areas, or, more likely, he doesn’t care about corruption in red areas. How any rational adult does not recognize what he was attempting to do is beyond me. Today's Republicans, or more precisely those remaining in and continuing to support the party of Trump, are fundamentally either blind, stupid, racist, or corrupt. Rational thinking is not something for which they are known. There is certainly a subset of conservatives who are principled and thoughtful, and I have no problem with them, but they are not Trump supporters and should not be lumped in with those fools.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Dec 25, 2021 22:21:05 GMT -5
I will reserve judgment on your last point. If they vote for that pos in 24, they are no better than that other group you outlined. Too many of them will say the right thing, then hold their nose and vote for trump because they “cannot” vote for a godless liberal
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Dec 25, 2021 22:57:42 GMT -5
I will reserve judgment on your last point. If they vote for that pos in 24, they are no better than that other group you outlined. Too many of them will say the right thing, then hold their nose and vote for trump because they “cannot” vote for a godless liberal Or like Chris Christie, saying they are doing it for conservative ideals. I'd like to know when over-throwing the federal government became a "conservative" idea, and not something certain people were certain Muslims were going to do. They were awful concerned when a Muslim might do this, but suddenly they are helping Trump destroy the country ... it is a good thing?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 26, 2021 0:18:44 GMT -5
Trump only complained about changes in the voting rules in states where he lost. And in the states where he lost, he only wanted to throw out the votes in urban counties with lots of minority votes. It was his excuse for losing - corrupt voting in the liberal urban areas- because either he thinks there is no corruption in red areas, or, more likely, he doesn’t care about corruption in red areas. How any rational adult does not recognize what he was attempting to do is beyond me. Today's Republicans, or more precisely those remaining in and continuing to support the party of Trump, are fundamentally either blind, stupid, racist, or corrupt. Rational thinking is not something for which they are known. There is certainly a subset of conservatives who are principled and thoughtful, and I have no problem with them, but they are not Trump supporters and should not be lumped in with those fools. Many are all.
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Post by djAdvocate on Dec 26, 2021 16:13:58 GMT -5
as I have said before, I don't think it is racist, generally speaking.
they are acting this way because in their hearts they know they are actually inferior. that they can't compete on a level playing field. so, the only way they can win is to have the advantage of 400 years of oppression.
it is actually the opposite of racism, which posits superiority. the ONLY aspect of it that is racist is those that actually think they DISERVE to have the advantage, even though they are inferior. most are just afraid of losing it.
this is the cry of the weak. this is the hungry infant. this is not how the powerful behave. the powerful are quiet, because they have every confidence they will prevail, so they have nothing to worry about.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Dec 27, 2021 19:37:55 GMT -5
as I have said before, I don't think it is racist, generally speaking. they are acting this way because in their hearts they know they are actually inferior. that they can't compete on a level playing field. so, the only way they can win is to have the advantage of 400 years of oppression. it is actually the opposite of racism, which posits superiority. the ONLY aspect of it that is racist is those that actually think they DISERVE to have the advantage, even though they are inferior. most are just afraid of losing it. this is the cry of the weak. this is the hungry infant. this is not how the powerful behave. the powerful are quiet, because they have every confidence they will prevail, so they have nothing to worry about. Yep and nothing distracts those weak stupid people better than pointing out someone they can consider lower on the ladder. Never realizing they won't get a slice of that pie or a seat at the table.. Just crumbs they fight for like rabid dogs.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Dec 28, 2021 12:58:54 GMT -5
Here's a nice table of voter participation in WA state, who has mail in voting for awhile. One thing I noticed right away, is the amount of voters does not drop off that significantly for mid term elections. www.sos.wa.gov/elections/voter-participation.aspx Yes, billsonboard, tall guy, and myself have had mail in voting for years. Not a thing wrong with it, although I do miss in person voting up at the no longer there local church. The church ladies always had a bake sale! Vote and then go home and have some goodies.😎 Yeah, not getting the "I voted" sticker is strange since I have always worn it proudly. However, the advantages of mail voting far outweigh the disadvantages IMO. We left on 10/27 before a pretty significant local election, for Greece. We were able to drop our ballots into the mail a week before election day. When I was in KY, I lucked out because my polling place was the clubhouse of my apartment complex. It took me a whopping 10 min to walk over and vote before leaving for work. In TX, it was at the university where I could run over during lunch and vote. I have never had to drive to another location, find a parking place or wait in a line for hours to vote. If I was an hour late, my job wasn't going to dock my pay. I was lucky in that for ME voting was easy and I appreciate the privilege that not everyone has. Voting by mail does even the playing field considerably.
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busymom
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Post by busymom on Dec 28, 2021 13:11:38 GMT -5
I will reserve judgment on your last point. If they vote for that pos in 24, they are no better than that other group you outlined. Too many of them will say the right thing, then hold their nose and vote for trump because they “cannot” vote for a godless liberal I find it amusing that some in the GOP consider the Democratic Party to be "godless liberals" when it's known to everyone that Biden is a practicing Catholic, while who knows the last time Trump was inside of a church, unless it was to get out the vote for himself.
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