Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Aug 12, 2024 13:42:03 GMT -5
What if trump's 2024 strategy to overturn the vote is to have States NOT certify their votes if he doesn't win?
trump is awfully quiet about voter fraud this year. He's not constantly squealing about election fraud. Why is that?? It sounds like he's expecting to win even if he doesn't get the votes necessary to win.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 12, 2024 13:43:25 GMT -5
It is tricky for me to develop major concern. I am an observer of the world by nature, and am a bit fatalistic. I also live quietly in a very red small town far from the population centers which make us a blue state. Unless some local boys decide they need to shoot themselves some democrats, I wouldn't be personally impacted. I am old and not physically up for soldiering. I have no guns nor plans to get one, so I would just be dead. I see anything likely to happen will be happening "out there." Worst case, I don't see a protracted scenario like in the movie Civil War pitching the whole country into chaos. I see concentrated battle zones around population centers. Major destruction would be likely. Tens of thousands dead in bombings possible. I see duration of even 6 months of serious action unlikely. The "Rebel Forces" will either win or run out of resources quickly. Unless Trump turns down the heat significantly, very unlikely, violence will come. No level of "concern" any of us might have is going to change that fact. I'm thinking much larger designated survivor type shit. Not the local idiot with a rifle and few thousand rounds. High financed heavily armed. So "designated survivor would come into play with direct assaults on the President and the line of accession. That could be anything from an idiot with a rifle and a few rounds to nuking DC. |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 12, 2024 13:56:46 GMT -5
What if trump's 2024 strategy to overturn the vote is to have States NOT certify their votes if he doesn't win? trump is awfully quiet about voter fraud this year. He's not constantly squealing about election fraud. Why is that?? It sounds like he's expecting to win even if he doesn't get the votes necessary to win. i agree that it is unnerving. and i agree that there is a plan to subvert the election afoot using election boards. if it is thrown to the house, Trump would win. i would hope that this would bring out people EN MASSE to protest that. but the other possibility is that Democrats win so overwhelmingly that it makes such "finessing" impossible. it is one thing to mess with a single state (like Ohio or Florida), it is quite another when you have to mess with ten of them. |
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 12, 2024 14:01:39 GMT -5
You don’t think the federal government is aware of arms trafficking and wouldn’t notice some attempting to bring tanks and anti aircraft weapons into the country? You don't think that it is not already here in the wrong hands and all legally. Setting aside the issue of legality. If they are in the country, I question the ability to keep their locations secret and to successful deploy them in numbers that would lead to a long term victory. Might a couple of tanks roll out the back of a semi near the White House and shoot off a few rounds? 9kay. Might locally positioned anti aircraft weapons knock out some planes that come to take out the tanks? Perhaps. But to what end? |
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 12, 2024 14:27:35 GMT -5
What if trump's 2024 strategy to overturn the vote is to have States NOT certify their votes if he doesn't win? trump is awfully quiet about voter fraud this year. He's not constantly squealing about election fraud. Why is that?? It sounds like he's expecting to win even if he doesn't get the votes necessary to win. i agree that it is unnerving. and i agree that there is a plan to subvert the election afoot using election boards. if it is thrown to the house, Trump would win. i would hope that this would bring out people EN MASSE to protest that. but the other possibility is that Democrats win so overwhelmingly that it makes such "finessing" impossible. it is one thing to mess with a single state (like Ohio or Florida), it is quite another when you have to mess with ten of them. The President of the Senate shall, in the Presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the Certificates, and the Votes shall then be counted. The Person having the greatest Number of Votes shall be the President, if such Number be a Majority of the whole Number of Electors appointed; (Article 2, section 1) By my read8ng, if the vote isn't certified, electors wouldn't be appointed, thus dropping the number needed to be a majority. In 2020, if Arizona, Georgia, and Pennsylvania had not sent Electoral College votes in, Biden would still have been elected. |
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Aug 12, 2024 17:40:11 GMT -5
What if trump's 2024 strategy to overturn the vote is to have States NOT certify their votes if he doesn't win? trump is awfully quiet about voter fraud this year. He's not constantly squealing about election fraud. Why is that?? It sounds like he's expecting to win even if he doesn't get the votes necessary to win. This is apparently exactly the plan in Georgia, where the red legislature has granted three MAGA officials the ability to refuse to certify the state vote if they think something fishy happened (like Harris gets more votes). |
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Aug 13, 2024 6:59:32 GMT -5
You don't think that it is not already here in the wrong hands and all legally. Ok the only ones who can legally have those kinds of weapons is the military. So you think the military will rise up to set Trump on the throne if Harris wins? I think you are wrong about that. Military leaders take a pledge to uphold the constitution and the duly elected president. Most very pointedly do not take political positions. You may get a few rogue groups, especially in the local national guards, but the rest of the military will stay loyal to the constitution. you are thinking about legal shit i'm not. There is a lot of money being pushed in areas that support this kind of terrorism. |
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tbop77
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Post by tbop77 on Aug 13, 2024 7:33:40 GMT -5
I don't want to believe the possibility, but I am beginning to understand. My neighbor, who used to be energetic and fun-loving, sits home day in and day out on those far right new sites. I've watched her in recent months turn angry and bitter. I invited her to lunch and a hike last week, but she HAD to watch Joe Bongino's podcast. I talked to her shortly after Harris picked Walz, her response was he is a communist. When the stock market went down last week, Harris is taking her retirement account. I do not even try to engage, you just can't.
It's just given me a glimpse into how people become radicalized.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Aug 13, 2024 7:35:44 GMT -5
Ok the only ones who can legally have those kinds of weapons is the military. So you think the military will rise up to set Trump on the throne if Harris wins? I think you are wrong about that. Military leaders take a pledge to uphold the constitution and the duly elected president. Most very pointedly do not take political positions. You may get a few rogue groups, especially in the local national guards, but the rest of the military will stay loyal to the constitution. you are thinking about legal shit i'm not. There is a lot of money being pushed in areas that support this kind of terrorism. Legalish RW terrorism like the Proud Boys? |
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 13, 2024 8:46:47 GMT -5
Ok the only ones who can legally have those kinds of weapons is the military. So you think the military will rise up to set Trump on the throne if Harris wins? I think you are wrong about that. Military leaders take a pledge to uphold the constitution and the duly elected president. Most very pointedly do not take political positions. You may get a few rogue groups, especially in the local national guards, but the rest of the military will stay loyal to the constitution. There is a lot of money being pushed in areas that support this kind of terrorism. Hmmm? The post was in response to: You don’t think the federal government is aware of arms trafficking and wouldn’t notice some attempting to bring tanks and anti aircraft weapons into the country? You don't think that it is not already here in the wrong hands and all legally. So you were talking legal shit. I am just attempting to understand what others see as possibilities. You are now using "terrorism". Tanks and anti-aircraft weapons are tools of a more traditional type of warfare, so a shift. I am not seeing clarity, perhaps just unfocused concerns for mayhem. I will let it go at that and not push. Thanks for sharing thoughts. |
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Aug 13, 2024 8:56:56 GMT -5
It is tricky for me to develop major concern. I am an observer of the world by nature, and am a bit fatalistic. I also live quietly in a very red small town far from the population centers which make us a blue state. Unless some local boys decide they need to shoot themselves some democrats, I wouldn't be personally impacted. I am old and not physically up for soldiering. I have no guns nor plans to get one, so I would just be dead. I see anything likely to happen will be happening "out there." Worst case, I don't see a protracted scenario like in the movie Civil War pitching the whole country into chaos. I see concentrated battle zones around population centers. Major destruction would be likely. Tens of thousands dead in bombings possible. I see duration of even 6 months of serious action unlikely. The "Rebel Forces" will either win or run out of resources quickly. Unless Trump turns down the heat significantly, very unlikely, violence will come. No level of "concern" any of us might have is going to change that fact. I'm thinking much larger designated survivor type shit. Not the local idiot with a rifle and few thousand rounds. High financed heavily armed.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Aug 13, 2024 9:04:45 GMT -5
The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed by the blood of patriots from time to time
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 13, 2024 9:35:03 GMT -5
To expand: Yet where does this anarchy exist? Where did it ever exist, except in the single instance of Massachusets? And can history produce an instance of a rebellion so honourably conducted? I say nothing of it’s motives. They were founded in ignorance, not wickedness. God forbid we should ever be 20. years without such a rebellion. The people can not be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions it is a lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... And what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it’s natural manure. link A most interesting offering from our nation's past. So many parallels. |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 13, 2024 11:25:25 GMT -5
What if trump's 2024 strategy to overturn the vote is to have States NOT certify their votes if he doesn't win? trump is awfully quiet about voter fraud this year. He's not constantly squealing about election fraud. Why is that?? It sounds like he's expecting to win even if he doesn't get the votes necessary to win. This is apparently exactly the plan in Georgia, where the red legislature has granted three MAGA officials the ability to refuse to certify the state vote if they think something fishy happened (like Harris gets more votes). i think GA is the biggest problem of the (8) states that are under attack. the rest basically make it illegal to have ballots rejected at the county level. |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 13, 2024 11:27:24 GMT -5
I don't want to believe the possibility, but I am beginning to understand. My neighbor, who used to be energetic and fun-loving, sits home day in and day out on those far right new sites. I've watched her in recent months turn angry and bitter. I invited her to lunch and a hike last week, but she HAD to watch Joe Bongino's podcast. I talked to her shortly after Harris picked Walz, her response was he is a communist. When the stock market went down last week, Harris is taking her retirement account. I do not even try to engage, you just can't. It's just given me a glimpse into how people become radicalized. my dad went down this rabbit hole, but it took way longer for him. about 10 years. he was always pretty conservative, though. |
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Aug 13, 2024 11:35:09 GMT -5
This is apparently exactly the plan in Georgia, where the red legislature has granted three MAGA officials the ability to refuse to certify the state vote if they think something fishy happened (like Harris gets more votes). i think GA is the biggest problem of the (8) states that are under attack. the rest basically make it illegal to have ballots rejected at the county level. Probably true. I haven't followed as much as I should have, but I think with fair districting GA is purple. |
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tbop77
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Post by tbop77 on Aug 13, 2024 11:47:44 GMT -5
I don't want to believe the possibility, but I am beginning to understand. My neighbor, who used to be energetic and fun-loving, sits home day in and day out on those far right new sites. I've watched her in recent months turn angry and bitter. I invited her to lunch and a hike last week, but she HAD to watch Joe Bongino's podcast. I talked to her shortly after Harris picked Walz, her response was he is a communist. When the stock market went down last week, Harris is taking her retirement account. I do not even try to engage, you just can't. It's just given me a glimpse into how people become radicalized. my dad went down this rabbit hole, but it took way longer for him. about 10 years. he was always pretty conservative, though. I think there are more Rush-wannabes in the country today. |
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 13, 2024 13:54:09 GMT -5
I'm thinking much larger designated survivor type shit. Not the local idiot with a rifle and few thousand rounds. High financed heavily armed.
You optimism and confidence is either inspiring or reckless- I can’t tell which. 🥴 |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 13, 2024 20:26:25 GMT -5
What if trump's 2024 strategy to overturn the vote is to have States NOT certify their votes if he doesn't win? trump is awfully quiet about voter fraud this year. He's not constantly squealing about election fraud. Why is that?? It sounds like he's expecting to win even if he doesn't get the votes necessary to win. i agree that it is unnerving. and i agree that there is a plan to subvert the election afoot using election boards. if it is thrown to the house, Trump would win. i would hope that this would bring out people EN MASSE to protest that. but the other possibility is that Democrats win so overwhelmingly that it makes such "finessing" impossible. it is one thing to mess with a single state (like Ohio or Florida), it is quite another when you have to mess with ten of them. i just realized that there is a very plausible path to victory for Harris that doesn't involve GA. she would have to take all of the Upper Midwest states, PA and VA. i think that is currently LIKELY. but we will see how it trends out. |
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Aug 13, 2024 23:46:54 GMT -5
I pray she sweeps the country and carries the house and senate with it. And that the opportunities to fix the supreme court mess and other issues are able to happen.
That is my hope, if it keeps going like it is, possible. But I'm sure the magas are digging hard and deep to find any misstep she or Walz has made. Hope they are as squeaky clean as Obama was.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Aug 14, 2024 11:04:49 GMT -5
I pray she sweeps the country and carries the house and senate with it. And that the opportunities to fix the supreme court mess and other issues are able to happen. That is my hope, if it keeps going like it is, possible. But I'm sure the magas are digging hard and deep to find any misstep she or Walz has made. Hope they are as squeaky clean as Obama was. The MAGAs can throw as much dirt as they want, but I don't see it really making a difference. Unless i find out that Harris kicks puppies for fun, I'm voting for her. If it turns out she's a serial killer, I'm still not voting for Trump. I'm sitting this one out. |
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 14, 2024 12:02:04 GMT -5
I’m not sure they really have enough time to dig something up and convince non-committed voters it is tragic. I know they are refocusing the Congressional committee that was spending their days going after Hunter Biden and looking desperately for evidence of the Biden crime family. That group is now trying to figure out how to accuse Kamala of some crime. The wheels of justice will grind too slowly for that one.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 14, 2024 12:18:09 GMT -5
that is a steep climb, but the most important office right now is the executive office. that one seems winnable for Dems at this juncture.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Aug 14, 2024 12:36:52 GMT -5
I pray she sweeps the country and carries the house and senate with it. And that the opportunities to fix the supreme court mess and other issues are able to happen. That is my hope, if it keeps going like it is, possible. But I'm sure the magas are digging hard and deep to find any misstep she or Walz has made. Hope they are as squeaky clean as Obama was. The MAGAs can throw as much dirt as they want, but I don't see it really making a difference. Unless i find out that Harris kicks puppies for fun, I'm voting for her. If it turns out she's a serial killer, I'm still not voting for Trump. I'm sitting this one out. Certainly not voting for Kennedy. I don’t know exactly what happened with that baby bear but his whole story about it seems like some kind of LSD fueled nightmare. |
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on Aug 14, 2024 13:01:09 GMT -5
I don't want to believe the possibility, but I am beginning to understand. My neighbor, who used to be energetic and fun-loving, sits home day in and day out on those far right new sites. I've watched her in recent months turn angry and bitter. I invited her to lunch and a hike last week, but she HAD to watch Joe Bongino's podcast. I talked to her shortly after Harris picked Walz, her response was he is a communist. When the stock market went down last week, Harris is taking her retirement account. I do not even try to engage, you just can't. It's just given me a glimpse into how people become radicalized. LOL, but if you mentioned about how much it was up in the past 4 years it was always "oh, that has nothing to do with the President", but the SECOND it drops. So dumb.
It's creepy as hell how much it's changing some people's personalities and how hateful and bitter they are over politics. This is how people are choosing to live?? I volunteered to do pre-security in the line for a music festival this weekend (basically prepping people for the actual professional security folks that came after me). The ONLY person to give me a hard time was a woman in her 60's or 70's dressed out in MAGA gear that refused to toss out her soda that she was trying to carry in...after walking past about 4 signs saying it was prohibited. You'd think I was trying to take away her M16. She actually told me to fuck off and kept walking. WTH? Over a half a bottle of Mountain Dew?
She got to the gate and they made her throw it.  |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 14, 2024 13:36:55 GMT -5
i read something this morning.
70% of the CORE increase in inflation is due to increases in housing costs. but that is a double edged sword, right? if you own a house on 20% margin, you have 25% MORE EQUITY in your home this year than last year. for a person making $100k/year, that would be roughly $20k, which is about 4x the rate of inflation.
in other words, if you own your home, that is an inflation hedge. and that hedge paid WAY MORE than inflation took.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 14, 2024 13:38:29 GMT -5
PS- i had to look it up, but 2/3 of Americans own their own home. in other words, 2/3 of the country made money off inflation last year.
strange, but true.
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resolution
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Post by resolution on Aug 14, 2024 14:38:37 GMT -5
PS- i had to look it up, but 2/3 of Americans own their own home. in other words, 2/3 of the country made money off inflation last year. strange, but true. People still need a place to live, so they can't actually realize the gain unless they own multiple properties or have someplace else they can go. Even if they took out a home equity loan, they would be paying higher interest rates that diminish the return. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 14, 2024 15:16:00 GMT -5
PS- i had to look it up, but 2/3 of Americans own their own home. in other words, 2/3 of the country made money off inflation last year. strange, but true. People still need a place to live, so they can't actually realize the gain unless they own multiple properties or have someplace else they can go. Even if they took out a home equity loan, they would be paying higher interest rates that diminish the return. first of all, i never suggested that people tap into equity. what i was suggesting is that they view inflation as an INVESTMENT when it is their HOUSE that is causing that inflation. and that is clearly the case right now. let me put this another way. if i were to set aside $20k this year toward my retirement, i would not have that disposable income. that would be similar to having it eaten up by inflation, if you viewed this from that standpoint. but i get it, people want to CHOOSE their devil. i am just saying that sometimes the devil chooses you. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 14, 2024 15:21:00 GMT -5
or, to put it another way, if housing prices FELL 5% last year, the "inflation" number would be deflationary.
i am betting that based on the reaction i got to my post that people would still be complaining, because the price of fruit juice is up 20%.
the conclusion i am reaching is that it might be better to just ignore people who complain about inflation. there is no winning that argument. they will just complain about the cost of eggs, ignoring all other relevant things.
meanwhile, the investor class is clamoring to buy yachts.
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