New flooring

[azucena]

At the top of our home improvement list is replacing the carpets in the house we moved into in 2017.  Both daughters' bedrooms are gross along with most of the basement. 

Their bedrooms aren't that big - one is about 100 sq feet, the other 125.  Most of the main level is one style hardwood flooring, but I don't want to put that in their rooms as they are still leaving wet towels, painting nails, general childhood wear and tear.  I want something that will match well with the hardwood hallway that runs right up to the bedrooms.  I need to go look in the store, but I feel stuck between laminate and luxury vinyl.  One bedroom is on the northwest side of the house and is always colder in the winter, so removing the carpet makes me worry that will get worse.  I've ordered one of those energy detectors to keep a closer eye on it this winter.  It's possible the window is leaking although it doesn't look very old.  I also wonder about putting in more insulation but I have no idea what's involved with that.

Our master bedroom which is also on the main level is 275 sq feet of carpet.  It's nicer carpet and likely has 3-5 years of life left.  I'm torn with wanting to replace this now just to get it all over with at once but obviously that drives up the cost.  The one flooring guy we've had bid so far insisted that we want matching hardwood because it's the master.  Of course hardwood is roughly double the price.  This is a home we intend to stay in for 30 years, so an eye towards resale is there but not close.  I'm not sold that it needs to be hardwood if it matches up well.

The basement carpet also must be replaced because it's gross.  It's roughly 1000 sq feet.  I don't want carpet because I feel like it's never really clean.  I do want to keep in mind that it's a basement and want to avoid colder floors if I can help it.  Durable, easy to clean, and low maintenance is also key.  I don't particularly like tile.  So, again I feel like my choices are laminate or luxury vinyl.  Thoughts?  Things to consider or avoid?

There are two spaces that could be bedrooms if we add egresses as we eventually plan.  Both logistically sit above ground level on the outside.  One has the same nasty carpet so it will be replaced.  The second is roughly 200 sq feet with the newest carpet in the house.  It likely has 5-7 years left particularly since it won't be used daily for a couple more years until we move DD12 down there after enlarging the window.  We didn't include it in the bid, but now I'm questioning if we should just go for it.  This is in direct conflict with being torn about the master which we use daily LOL.

The first bid was $12k if we tear out the carpets ourselves which is doable since DH isn't currently working.  It includes labor, material, shifting the furniture, removing baseboards and putting them back on (is this possibly going to cause painting issues?).  It was for hardwood in the master and laminate in the rest.

Second bid is happening this week.  We had the first one very itemized so we can pick and choose.

DH wants to go for it, but he always does.  I'm indecisive for lots of reasons. 

• It's a weird excuse, but my parents literally never made an improvement to our house growing up - couldn't afford it. So it always feels uncomfortable to spend money this way.
• It's a big chunk of money.
• I don't want to choose the wrong material and then regret it.
• It doesn't feel like our master and the extra bedroom downstairs are must haves, but man it would be nice to get thru all the work at once and no longer have carpet anywhere, and I'm the kind of person who really likes everything to match and be consistent.
• DH isn't working right now, and the world is chaotic so it feels wrong to spend on a want.  We are still able to save $1000/month.
• Our liquid savings is about 95k, and we're on track to hit $100k by yearend.  This would set us back.
• I won't be getting a bonus in 2021.  The past few years, I've netted about $15k, $10k of which goes into savings.

Pros

• It's an improvement DH and I both agree on and would benefit our family.
• Increases resale value
• Easier to keep clean
• Looks better
• I work really hard and deserve to benefit

Sometimes writing things out here help me see a conclusion.  I also appreciate the collective YM wisdom, so opine away.

[finnime]

By what you've written it seems that going big is the best way. You prefer and are more comfortable when things correspond; you have the means; it will be less work to maintain; it will be less disruption in the long run.

IMO this is what savings are for. If you're bordering $100k then you definitely can manage this project. In the short, medium and long term you'll be glad for it.

I've had hardwood floors throughout my homes coupled with tile in the kitchen and bathrooms. I am actively planning on replacing the berber carpet in the basement--it's gross, as you say.

It will be nice for all of you to have this done. And, now that everyone is spending more time at home, it will matter more now than ever.

[Lizard Queen]

Have you considered cork for the basement? It's warmer, and not carpet.

If there isn't a certain definite choice that you like for the replacement, then I would just do the "have-to's". It would suck to replace a lot for big money, and find that you don't even like the choice.

Personally, I'm all for cozy carpet in the bedroom. It's just our master left, the other bedrooms were changed to laminate years ago. My kids aren't fond of the laminate, but they are dirty little pigs, so it's okay for now. We recently replaced a big portion of our floor with luxury vinyl that looks like wood, kitchen, dining, and bedroom hallway. I love the look, but hate, hate, hate the feel on my feet. I have to find my slippers constantly because of that.

If you're staying in your house a long time, get what you like and find comfortable. It doesn't matter what other people think.

[buystoys]

I'm on the side that says to just do it all at once and have the mess over and done with.  Yes, it will cost some money, but you will have a home you enjoy more because of it.  DH didn't want to do the hall when we redid the eat in kitchen.  I insisted because it seem silly to me to skip a hallway when the price wouldn't be that much in the overall picture.  I'm so glad we did it and so is he.

I like the idea of cork for the basement.  Some of the laminates are really nice.  I don't know if it would save you some money to do a laminate in the master?  Do you have your materials already picked out?

Whichever you choose, good luck with the project!

[justme]

So Home Depot, and maybe other places, have this laminate that's 100% waterproof. I don't know if you have water issues in your basement, but I know someone that sometimes does and put this in there because if there is water all they do is pop up the floor, dry everything out, and then lay the flooring back down. There's no glue or anything.

On costs - when I was looking at it a few years ago all my quotes were around 50/50 - meaning the labor cost about the same price as the materials. This was for a 1100sf condo - so I was looking at around $3500 for the laminate and the labor was I think a bit over $3500.

[laterbloomer]

I'm big on having the same flooring throughout a house with the exception of kitchens and bathrooms. I'd get the hardwood then refinish it after they move out. You can do that with hardwood.

[azucena]

I think part of the problem is that I don't know how to determine what flooring I'd prefer.  I know I don't like carpet (always seems dirty).  I know I don't like tile - too cold and I don't like cleaning the grout lines.  Beyond that I like the look of hardwood but am never quite sure how to care for it.  I'm also not sure that I like it enough to pay the difference.  The idea about refinishing it later is okay - I just know that I would be irritated with the kids in the meantime which doesn't seem fair.

I had no idea cork was an option.  I'll need to look up cost, durability, how to clean.

LQ - why don't you like the feel of the luxury vinyl?  Is it because it's replicating the grainy texture of wood?

Fortunately, we don't have water problems in the basement, and we've been here long enough through lots of rain and also snow melting.

Appreciate the conversation so far - thanks.

[Lizard Queen]

Oct 9, 2020 9:22:16 GMT -5 azucena said:

I think part of the problem is that I don't know how to determine what flooring I'd prefer.  I know I don't like carpet (always seems dirty).  I know I don't like tile - too cold and I don't like cleaning the grout lines.  Beyond that I like the look of hardwood but am never quite sure how to care for it.  I'm also not sure that I like it enough to pay the difference.  The idea about refinishing it later is okay - I just know that I would be irritated with the kids in the meantime which doesn't seem fair.

I had no idea cork was an option.  I'll need to look up cost, durability, how to clean.

LQ - why don't you like the feel of the luxury vinyl?  Is it because it's replicating the grainy texture of wood?

Fortunately, we don't have water problems in the basement, and we've been here long enough through lots of rain and also snow melting.

Appreciate the conversation so far - thanks.

Cork is a green option. Not cheap, but it would be a great insulator. If I ever get around to doing my basement, it will be a top option for me.

My friend redid her kitchen with top end stuff, and used luxury vinyl for her floor. I like hers much less than the one we got. The grain has a plasticky feel to it. Hers feels like it has a lot more grooves closer together, and sometimes gives you a zippy sound walking across it. My choice has a rustic oak look, and there is less of that grain, but I still feel it a bit. I like to walk barefoot, but my feet get really cold. Different vinyls have different feels regarding temperature retention as well. Our kitchen used to have really ugly vinyl, but it was thick. We replaced it with thinner stuff, and it felt ice-cold in comparison. The mass of it holds the heat. Our planks are thick--not cheap at all, but whatever it's made of makes it feel a little on the cold side. I grew up with hardwood floors, and I don't think it feels as hard or as cold as hardwood. BTW, back in the 70's and 80's a lot of people covered up hardwood floors with wall to wall carpet. All these things go in and out of style, which is why I say just get what you like if you're planning to be there a long time.

I also get issues with my back standing on hard floors. We have some of those mats in the kitchen due to that, but I feel like going barefoot on the other hard floors feel hard on my ankles and knees. This probably makes me sound like a physical wreck, but I'm not at all. Just a highly sensitive person, and I notice these things before they get so bad that I need medical attention for them.

So anyway, I'm constantly looking for footwear to wear inside even in the summer, which is annoying.

[Lizard Queen]

BTW, I mentioned to my DH that maybe we should replace the really cheap laminate we had put in the 2 bedrooms, with this luxury vinyl for continuity. (It would be easy to do.) He said he doesn't love this stuff, so it doesn't make him want even more of it.

[debthaven]

If you like the look of hardwood (I do!) personally I'd go for that. I agree that carpet is dirty. 

We finally got rid of the last carpeting last year (the last 2 bedrooms with carpet). We had good oak laminate installed.

We left the carpeting on the cement stairs to the basement, for safety reasons. But ALL the rest is gone! 

We're in the process of looking for flooring for a rental ... we're going with tiles that look like polished concrete. That could be an option for the basement (with rugs). 

[stillmovingforward]

Do it all now!
Make sure you get laminate or vinyl that is rated for below grade in the basement though. Pay the extra money, if that's what it takes.
If the floors are cold, you can always put down area rugs. Those are easier to clean and the kids can get what they want, within reason. And they aren't as expensive as whole room carpeting.
Excellent move having the bids detailed. I always recommend that!
Thinking outside the box can be fun. I actually have OSB sheets down as flooring in my kitchen. Super inexpensive, it was fast and easy to do, and it's amazing how good it looks. If I was redoing a whole house, i'd do it all in OSB. I first saw it at a funky high end resturant and loved it. I've seen designs painted on them but mine is plain. Lots of low gloss varnish for protection.
DH was against it at first. He was informed that I would NEVER vacuum carpet as I hate it. We had at least 4 kids at that time, a cat, a bunny, and a big dog. He caved.

[alabamagal]

If you are planning to stay in your house, get what you want. Don’t worry about fashion or resale. You also might want to consider if you have a traditional style or modern house.

We bought a 1980s traditional style house last year. We relaxed the run down carpet with hardwood in main living area and nice soft carpet in bedrooms. We don’t have kids at home. If your house is modern style, there are some nice luxury vinyl products.

Hardwood is actually super easy to care for. We have shedding dogs and sweep or use Roomba frequently. Other than that just clean up spills. I never plan to go back to carpet in main part of house.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

I would do all hardwood upstairs.  Even if your kids leave wet towels on the floor, they really are remarkably resistant to this and you can always get them refinished.  

Downstairs, we are grappling with the same issue.  It is much cooler downstairs, and carpeting warms it up.  The stairs downstairs are also carpeted, and we are reluctant to exchange those for hardwood......especially as we are older.  The carpet the previous owner put in was very expensive, so a good cleaning of it really might be sufficient, especially as it contains 2 guest bedrooms, a bath and den which are only used if we have people staying here.  

[stillmovingforward]

My stairs are very steep (it's an old house) and my DH has walking issues but no one has ever fallen on our stairs. Maybe we're used to it but I never thought that hardwood stairs would be a hazard.
Hmmm? Are they truly a hazard or is it perception (truly want to know, not being snarky)?

[debthaven]

stillmovingforward I don't think they're a hazard per se, but IF you fall, obviously the carpet would cushion the fall to some extent. I think with Mich's history, she's understandably particularly scared of falling. 

We have two oak staircases here too. My Dad had a terrible fall here many years ago and broke 3 ribs.  We still have both wooden staircases though.

[Lizard Queen]

Wood staircases can be incredibly slippery, as can carpet.

[buystoys]

Yeah, I fell down our the carpeted stairs in our Westchester house more than once.  I'd slip at the top (they were very narrow stairs) and just fall down to the bottom.  Fortunately DH had a hand rail put in.  Otherwise I'd probably have fallen on the projector TV!

[azucena]

I think the stairs depend on how slippery the wood surface is.  The carpet provides some traction and is also cushion if you do fall.  We pulled up the carpet on the stairs in our old house and found relatively nice hardwood under it.

I'm anticipating that the stairs under this carpet will be a little beat up.  I kind of want to experiment with painting the backs as I've seen on decorating shows.  Since it's the basement, we can experiment and have fun.  I figure we'll sand/finish the steps and maybe put on some kind of low profile treads for traction.

stillmoving - do you have pictures of the OSB?  or a link to a similar look?  I'm intrigued for something like the basement bedrooms.

It's encouraging to see so many people saying to go for it all.  Might be just the shove that I needed.

[Tiny]

Just an aside I haven't read the whole thread...
if you put in vinyl or laminate flooring in the bedrooms - you could put an area rug over it. Spend the money to buy a rug pad that will not stick to the flooring (I would read reviews and such to find out which "doesn't stick" actually doesn't stick) between a area rug and the padding - you will have the warmth and quiet you want.
I would check on line for rugs that would fit your kids room - even if it's a few inches short from the walls. Most of the pads that go under them can be cut to size.

The plus is that in a few years when your kid wants to update their room - you can paint the walls and either remove the rug/padding or just replace it with some color/style your kid likes.

I've got original hardwood floors I was "stuck" on the idea that a "oriental" style area rug with no pad (because it would become one with the floor and I didn't want that) was the only way to go. And then I went down the rabbit hole of area rugs and reviews of rug pads (with pictures) and found an awesome contemporary inexpense area rug AND a pad (that cost as much as the rug) for my living room. Yeah, i'll have to replace the rug in a couple more years (and maybe the pad - I have elderly barfy cats)  but it was so much less expensive (I spent $500 on both the rug and pad - 10 * 12 size) than putting in carpeting or dealing with an expensive oriental rug (lowest priced wool rugs were over 1K) and barfy cats.

I did the same thing for my dining room - I scored a synthetic rug for $180.00 at Sam's club (8*10) and then bought a pad ($250).   It was 'stain resistant' and so far the cat barf hasn't been an issue.  The rug has a limited live span (as do my cats) so it was a good solution. 

[TheOtherMe]

My house has engineered hardwood floors in the living room and hallway.  Someday I'm going to get something to match in the 3 bedrooms.

I have an area rug.  One of the reasons I did that is barfing from Lucy.  I ended up getting a washable area rug that comes up from the padding to be washing.  Lucy didn't find the rug an attractive place to barf.     She preferred anywhere else in the house.  

Another runner type rug in the hallway.  That is what I walk on so it doesn't seem cold in the winter.

[bookkeeper]

Do all the flooring at once.  You will not regret the update.  I chose a DuraCeramic tile for our kitchen remodel.  It is warmer than ceramic tile, but very easy to clean.  Comes in many colors and sizes and can be installed with or without grout lines. We had a hang out room for our teenagers in the basement.  We painted the concrete floor with an epoxy paint and rolled out area rugs.  Big rain coming?  No problem, roll up the rug and get the shop vac out.  We also liked to use the basement area for projects, so the painted floor was way more durable/repaintable.

Our older son had allergies, so we put a laminate in his bedroom.  Smooth floors are so much cleaner than carpet, you won't regret the money spent.

When we were trying to decide between products, the sales lady directed us to churches and public buildings that had installed the products we were considering.  I found it helpful to see a large area of the flooring installed before ordering for our home.

[Deleted]

Most of the flooring in the house was shot when my husband died.  He had multiple accidents, the dog had multiple accidents, and it was just plain old.  The carpet was at least 15 years old if it had been replaced the day before I moved in.  (It hadn't been.)  We had replaced the dining room and kitchen with ceramic tile, but it was so poorly installed that entire tiles came out after the grout broke.  And it really hurts your feet and knees.

I did pretty much the entire house with luxury vinyl planks.  Exceptions were the sunroom (good ceramic tile and really what we need out there), the basement (again, good ceramic tile and fine down there), and vinyl in the bathrooms.  One bathroom's vinyl was replaced by more vinyl from HD; the other one was simply left alone.  The reasoning there was that I would someday update/fix these bathrooms, and the new flooring would be destroyed.  So why pay for it?

I will tell you that it wasn't a cheap project.  The house is about 1600 square feet, which the installer told me translates into about 1200 square feet of flooring.  There are what the walls take up with insulation, wiring, etc., the bathrooms, the laundry room (I was fine with vinyl there because I didn't want to mess with the w/d).  That 1200 square feet cost about $13k from Lumber Liquidators with installation.  And then there were painting costs because you are going to want to paint your baseboards to match the molding.  I ended up simply painting the whole house plus the kitchen cabinets.  I spent $20k before it was over, but about 6k was painting costs.

All that said, I love, love, love my LVP flooring.  It is easy to walk on and doesn't hurt my feet.  I have 2 area rugs . . . one in the living area and one in the guest bedroom.  I'll probably add one to the master bedroom, but I haven't figured out colors, etc. in there.  Honestly, it was the best thing I have done.  I should mention that I had to have the stairs to the basement done since it would look silly to have that carpeted when neither the main floor nor the basement had carpet.  Plus, it was stained.

Lumber Liquidators runs 0% financing all the time, but the best one was part of Black Friday.  I got 2 years.  I did pay half of the 13k out of pocket, though, because I didn't want a $500 payment even at 0%.  

[wvugurl26]

We are putting luxury vinyl tile down in our entry and half bath. It was suggested by the contractor who is a longtime friend/contractor for DH's family. We wanted tile and actually had it picked out for probably 18 months now.

Contractor pointed out we have an engineered floor joist system with 16 inch centers and you need 12 for tile. Otherwise, the first heavy thing you bring in will buckle and crack the tile. Next door neighbor did put in real tile and has gotten cracks in two rooms in the tile. Our new fridge should finally be delivered in January and DH will die if we did tile and it cracked.

I forget how many square feet we ordered but it was $900 for flooring and glue and grout. It's replacing contractor grade engineered hardwood that was badly sun faded and 20 years old.

We actually had brand new steps made for the set from the entry to main first level. They stained them to make the hardwood in our living room. Those are finally ready to install.

Kitchen is same crappy floor as entry was. It does kill my feet. I got some mats but I don't always stand on them. It's being gutted to the studs in 2022. There's too many things not right and we are flipping where the kitchen part is. It's a big combined kitchen and dining area taking up two thirds of the first floor. For that we might reinforce the floor to allow for tile. Or we do the luxury vinyl again.

There's carpet to the upstairs and in hallway and two spare bedrooms. It's going eventually. We both hate carpet and it's not good for my allergies at all.

Replace the flooring. You work hard, you deserve to enjoy your house.

[azucena]

Is Pergo a brand of flooring that sells mostly laminate?  DD12 and I went to Home Depot to browse yesterday and found a laminate that matches nicely.  Also found some pergo that I liked for the basement that I think is gray enough that DH may like it.  We had pergo in the kitchen of our old house, and I loved the way it felt underfoot and it was very easy to clean.

[wvugurl26]

It looks like they make laminate, vinyl and hardwood. Our local Lowe's and Home Depot didn't have much in the luxury vinyl selection.

We ended up going to a couple local flooring stores. We bought Congoleum Duraceramic in Thames London Mist.

[CCL]

We've had Pergo laminate in the past. It was extremely slippery when wet. I haven't found any brand of laminate that isn't slippery when wet.

We put in engineered hardwood in all the bedrooms this year. We love it. I don't think I will ever go back to carpet. Some people told us it would feel cold in the bedrooms, but it's not at all. I don't know, maybe the people who told us that have drafty, old houses?

The prices you are mentioning make me very glad that hubby is pretty handy and installed ours.

I think I'd be a little afraid of laminate in a basement. I don't think the backing would hold up to any kind of dampness. I'd think the vinyl planks would be better suited to a basement.

[happyhoix]

I only have two comments- if the basement is at all damp wood floors are not good, I’d go with tile - they have some cool wood look tile now.

Also, if you stab a Stretch Armstrong with something sharp and then throw him under the bed onto the carpeted floor his guts will leak out and form a solid plastic glob not only permanently welded to the carpet fibers, but a permanent dust catcher for any random thing that comes within a foot of it.