movingforward
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Post by movingforward on May 11, 2020 13:23:33 GMT -5
I don't know that it's a "lie"...like most things like this it's true but just has a horribly stupid definition/naming convention. In this case..."cases" or "confirmed cases" counts total people who have been diagnosed...but is labeled as "cases", without specificity, in a way that doesn't accurately reflect how things are said in the English language. For example: Nobody says "I have a case of indigestion" to mean "I have at one point in my life had indigestion even though I don't have it now". I'm not sure if it's stupidity or being intentionally deceptive when someone decided to label something "cases", and then follows that up with "well that's different than ACTIVE cases". Great news everyone, my wife is pregnant...well...she's not ACTIVELY pregnant, but she was pregnant previously in her life. It would also be helpful as we rip into "them" to have more than just "A headline just flashed on my home page". Oh, I read the short and sweet article which ripped into us for opening restaurants at 25% capacity and allowing hair salons to open. Not once did it mention active cases. Throughout it stated we have over 37,000 cases. It was completely misleading, which was exactly the intend. Let's not pretend that these little articles that pop up on yahoo and the MSN homepage are just chopped full of facts. If we wants facts we have to dig a little deeper than that but unfortunately a lot of the general public just sees these headlines and takes them at their word. Don't get me wrong, I'm not necessarily defending the governors that are opening their states. In fact, I think some of them are bat shit crazy but I also don't think the media on either side is presenting all that well these days.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on May 11, 2020 13:25:48 GMT -5
This is just an addition - not a reply to Thyme. For the family/loved ones - it might be the fear that they have "killed" their love one by saying no to an aggressive treatment (when the chance for a meaningful recovery looks bleak). There's a religious admonishment to not "murder/kill" other people. It's not just the suicide side of it. I have heard that fear (of "killing" their loved one) put into words by friends and relatives. Even when the ill/sick/dying person has a DNR and has voiced "no heroic efforts" or some other words to the effect: "I'm ok with dying". If they are asked/pressured by the hospital/doctor/who ever about overriding that DNR/wishes of the loved one - they may opt to not "kill" their loved one by going ahead with their loved one's wishes/request. It's complicated. During the whole Terry Shivo thing, I remember an interview with an ethics specialist. When asked why this doesn't happen more often, she said that it probably happens 75% of the time. She said that someone wants to follow the patient's wishes, but one or more family members protest, and the person with the MPOA doesn't want to be the one that "killed Grandma". So they back down and continue treatment. It stuck with me because my parents have made me MPOA and said specifically it was because I was the only one who would pull the plug, as my sisters are too sentimental and sensitive. My Mom would always say that I was going to kill her, and now she has made sure of it. I hope my sister doesn't give me grief when it comes time to make the decision. It won't be easy for me, even if I absolutely believe it is the correct thing to do. I can totally understand why people would chicken out. This 100%. When families agree, it is easy. When they disagree, there are problems. There is a joke that it’s always the “child from California” who causes problems. The is, someone who has not been involved up to that point, and has not seen the downhill course, comes in and changes all kind of decisions that had been made, and a more aggressive course of treatment ensues. All kinds of issues from childhood come up and complicate decision-making. Complicated, yes
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 11, 2020 13:26:22 GMT -5
It would also be helpful as we rip into "them" to have more than just "A headline just flashed on my home page". Oh, I read the short and sweet article which ripped into us for opening restaurants at 25% capacity and allowing hair salons to open. Not once did it mention active cases. Throughout it stated we have over 37,000 cases. It was completely misleading, which was exactly the intend. Let's not pretend that these little articles that pop up on yahoo and the MSN homepage are just chopped full of facts. If we wants facts we have to dig a little deeper than that but unfortunately a lot of the general public just sees these headlines and takes them at their word. Don't get me wrong, I'm not necessarily defending the governors that are opening their states. In fact, I think some of them are bat shit crazy but I also don't think the media on either side is presenting all that well these days. It would also be helpful as you rip into "them" to have more than "I read ...".
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on May 11, 2020 13:36:27 GMT -5
Oh, I read the short and sweet article which ripped into us for opening restaurants at 25% capacity and allowing hair salons to open. Not once did it mention active cases. Throughout it stated we have over 37,000 cases. It was completely misleading, which was exactly the intend. Let's not pretend that these little articles that pop up on yahoo and the MSN homepage are just chopped full of facts. If we wants facts we have to dig a little deeper than that but unfortunately a lot of the general public just sees these headlines and takes them at their word. Don't get me wrong, I'm not necessarily defending the governors that are opening their states. In fact, I think some of them are bat shit crazy but I also don't think the media on either side is presenting all that well these days. It would also be helpful as you rip into "them" to have more than "I read ...". Lol! Well, it has disappeared from my home page. They change every time I go there. I can't find it...not really worth arguing over to me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 14:43:08 GMT -5
Wasn't it originally an average of 3 people being infected by each positive person? I can't remember...1.13 doesn't sound horrible to me but I agree it could definitely be better. I think the flu is 1 person per infected individual. Yes, according to the Germans it was originally between 3 and 4, which is why it spread so quickly. And I agree with movingforward- there are s LOT of BS numbers thrown out there by both sides- incomplete, out of context, apples to oranges...whatever suits their agendas.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on May 11, 2020 14:45:32 GMT -5
A lot of Iowa deaths have been nursing homes and now meat packing plant employees. I hope if anything comes out of all this how these places are run is investigated and reforms are put in place. We should not treat our most vulnerable as expendable nor should we be treating those on whose backs our food supply runs on like dirt. The meat packing plants scare me. We are just now seeing the meat packing plants flair up and who knows where all they traveled because we aren't doing any tracking. On top of that now Trump has mandated they stay open but since there are no repercussions if they don't ensure safety who knows how many people they and their families are exposing every day. But we are still not mass testing. So let's reopen on Monday! What is the worst that can happen?! I dunno, I'm in Iowa and the places that I can think of as being most likely to cause spread are already open...so why not? The difference between "open" and "closed" seems to be minimal at best.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on May 11, 2020 15:16:39 GMT -5
[a href="https://scri.siena.edu/2020/04/27/coronavirus-pandemic-pushes-cuomo-to-record-high-ratings-voters-trust-cuomo-over-trump-on-ny-reopen ing-78-16/"]New poll from Siena[/a] So near universal approval of wearing masks and continued Pause until there's either treatment or vaccine.
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formerroomate99
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Post by formerroomate99 on May 11, 2020 15:50:19 GMT -5
If a Republican governor had been this stupid you would never be giving him a pass like this. Not everybody was stupid enough to knowingly put highly infectious people in the middle of a crowded care facility full of vulnerable people, and staffed by people who aren’t trained to deal with this. And your solution as to what to do with the patients when the hospitals were full would have been what. They needed to move them out of the hospital. The original plan as outlined by both NY and Washington was for there to be no positive patients in either Javits or the ship. That did not work to well. We were unprepared for this is numerous ways. Isn't the first and foremost responsibility of the federal government to protect us from outside threats? I am in the northeast and am quite aware of all the challenges that are and were present in the tristate area. When the hospitals were full, they had no choice. We agree on this. But once there were other options available, and there were in early April, continuing to send Covid patients to nursing homes was unconscionable. When Javits wasn’t taking covd patients, they could’ve moved the non-Covd patients to Javits and the ship to make more room In the hospitals for Covid patients. They chose not to. That was their decision. It was a mistake. And it resulted in many deaths. It’s very interesting that on this board the many mistakes made by Democrats are given a pass, while anything short of omniscience on the part of the other side is considered a sign of bad intentions. The truth is, politicians of all stripes made some very serious mistakes, and we won’t learn from them if all we do is sit there and finger point at the other side.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on May 11, 2020 18:17:22 GMT -5
And your solution as to what to do with the patients when the hospitals were full would have been what. They needed to move them out of the hospital. The original plan as outlined by both NY and Washington was for there to be no positive patients in either Javits or the ship. That did not work to well. We were unprepared for this is numerous ways. Isn't the first and foremost responsibility of the federal government to protect us from outside threats? I am in the northeast and am quite aware of all the challenges that are and were present in the tristate area. When the hospitals were full, they had no choice. We agree on this. But once there were other options available, and there were in early April, continuing to send Covid patients to nursing homes was unconscionable. When Javits wasn’t taking covd patients, they could’ve moved the non-Covd patients to Javits and the ship to make more room In the hospitals for Covid patients. They chose not to. That was their decision. It was a mistake. And it resulted in many deaths. It’s very interesting that on this board the many mistakes made by Democrats are given a pass, while anything short of omniscience on the part of the other side is considered a sign of bad intentions. The truth is, politicians of all stripes made some very serious mistakes, and we won’t learn from them if all we do is sit there and finger point at the other side. There were no non-covid patients. When the moved the non-covid patients to habits, it wasn’t even 100. If you aren’t near nyc, and you don’t know anyone working there, you have no idea how horrific it was. Many people failed, but at the top of the list Is trump. The president’s #1 job is to protect us. He failed miserably. Any other people’s failure pales in comparison. The people who made mistakes early on are now trying. He wants to change the subject, and is still not taking it seriously. You want to blame others and give him a pass. Sorry, not buying it
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 18:44:08 GMT -5
I, personally, think every single butt sitting in a seat in the senate or House are culpable for not doing something about the current dysfunction. They should ALL go when election day rolls around...
I don't care if Mickey Mouse is the POTUS, it's dangerous for the person holding that office to stand up and spew "facts" about a public health crisis that are just blatantly false. And, the current occupant does that daily.
The Federal Government doesn't have their shit together. Until they do, we will have continual outbreaks and problems. People will die who don't need to and I see that as criminal.
Nothing has changed since day one of the stay at home orders. The virus is still there and we still have no testing/tracing programs, or apparently even plans to do so. Exposure means outbreaks because less than 1% of Americans have had COVID to date.
Outbreaks mean overwhelmed healthcare systems, great risk for healthcare providers, and deaths. We are at 80K+ now with the stay at home, where will be in a month or two after everyone's mingling around?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 19:47:44 GMT -5
While you won't get an argument from me about blunders at the top, you can't simultaneously complain about lack of testing and claim a low infection rate on the population. We just don't know without testing. One of the counties I'm tracking, Johnson County, KS, has tested 1.6% of its population and they're a pretty wealthy area with excellent medical resources. The rate of infection among the population, based on testing to date, is infinitesimally small (599 cases out of a population of 602,000) but that tells us nothing about how many have had it and how many have it now but are asymptomatic. Apparently there are mild cases out there. I'm not counting on any case I get being mild, but it happens. And, as I noted earlier, 70% of cases countrywide have not been classified as ending in death or recovery.
There's still a heck of a lot we don't know.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 20:06:52 GMT -5
I thought about this thread when I got the results from my recent CT-scan. They noted a few extraneous things like some fatty deposits in my brain that could harden and lead to a stroke and death. They weren't of concern YET, but I was being warned to change my diet, lifestyle, etc. to prevent this.
I am 66. I am going to die. Hopefully, not today or tomorrow but eventually. Maybe sooner or later.
Should the medical field just give up on me? I am no longer a productive member of society since I am retired. I spend my time reading, taking care of a lazy cocker spaniel, etc. I have several medical conditions including glaucoma and high blood pressure. Are you guys sure you should waste your $$$ and resources on someone who has basically outlived her usefulness.
Something to think about. If I don't change my diet, lifestyle, etc., you have definitely wasted your healthcare dollars in telling me to.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on May 11, 2020 20:18:50 GMT -5
Wasn't it originally an average of 3 people being infected by each positive person? I can't remember...1.13 doesn't sound horrible to me but I agree it could definitely be better. I think the flu is 1 person per infected individual. Yes, according to the Germans it was originally between 3 and 4, which is why it spread so quickly. And I agree with movingforward- there are s LOT of BS numbers thrown out there by both sides- incomplete, out of context, apples to oranges...whatever suits their agendas. These numbers were just quoted on the news for King Co. (Seattle). Mar. 1, there were 3-4 infected per case. After social distancing and SIP (I think around 3/16?) for a month, by 4/15 it dropped to 0.69. As of 4/30, the number increased to 0.89.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on May 11, 2020 20:20:33 GMT -5
While you won't get an argument from me about blunders at the top, you can't simultaneously complain about lack of testing and claim a low infection rate on the population. We just don't know without testing. One of the counties I'm tracking, Johnson County, KS, has tested 1.6% of its population and they're a pretty wealthy area with excellent medical resources. The rate of infection among the population, based on testing to date, is infinitesimally small (599 cases out of a population of 602,000) but that tells us nothing about how many have had it and how many have it now but are asymptomatic. Apparently there are mild cases out there. I'm not counting on any case I get being mild, but it happens. And, as I noted earlier, 70% of cases countrywide have not been classified as ending in death or recovery. There's still a heck of a lot we don't know. I don't think any of us can assume we would get a mild case but this virus is such a strange beast. I found out last week that my administrative assistant's 62 year old father tested positive for COVID. He has some underlying conditions (though none that are listed as big risk factors), and I was extremely concerned for him. He has had nothing but mild symptoms and is in quarantine at his home. I am so thrilled but shocked. We all have to prepare for the worst but hope for the best.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on May 11, 2020 20:25:33 GMT -5
I thought about this thread when I got the results from my recent CT-scan. They noted a few extraneous things like some fatty deposits in my brain that could harden and lead to a stroke and death. They weren't of concern YET, but I was being warned to change my diet, lifestyle, etc. to prevent this. I am 66. I am going to die. Hopefully, not today or tomorrow but eventually. Maybe sooner or later. Should the medical field just give up on me? I am no longer a productive member of society since I am retired. I spend my time reading, taking care of a lazy cocker spaniel, etc. I have several medical conditions including glaucoma and high blood pressure. Are you guys sure you should waste your $$$ and resources on someone who has basically outlived her usefulness. Something to think about. If I don't change my diet, lifestyle, etc., you have definitely wasted your healthcare dollars in telling me to. I thought people were talking about terminally ill, bed ridden folks that are in constant pain. I don't believe anyone was referring to those with a good quality of life that happen to have a few health issues.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on May 11, 2020 21:33:34 GMT -5
At 66 and relatively good health, there is a good chance to make 80. There is a world of difference between that individual and someone in a nursing home. Or doing bypass on a 90 year old. Let’s not pretend that a lot of stupid things get done in the US healthcare system. Again, everyone complains about how much money we spend. So we should stop doing stupid, low value things. But when you say something like that, you get accused of being in favor of death panels, not treating old people, etc. all I know, is that I get paid an awful lot of money to treat people with no hope of getting better, and the best outcome is returning to a nursing home to continue their inexorable downhill course, with the merry-go-round between the hospital and nursing home until they die. If we can’t even agree that we should stop doing that, there is no hope of ever getting to a rational and less expensive system
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 11, 2020 21:56:35 GMT -5
I thought about this thread when I got the results from my recent CT-scan. They noted a few extraneous things like some fatty deposits in my brain that could harden and lead to a stroke and death. They weren't of concern YET, but I was being warned to change my diet, lifestyle, etc. to prevent this. I am 66. I am going to die. Hopefully, not today or tomorrow but eventually. Maybe sooner or later. Should the medical field just give up on me? I am no longer a productive member of society since I am retired. I spend my time reading, taking care of a lazy cocker spaniel, etc. I have several medical conditions including glaucoma and high blood pressure. Are you guys sure you should waste your $$$ and resources on someone who has basically outlived her usefulness. Something to think about. If I don't change my diet, lifestyle, etc., you have definitely wasted your healthcare dollars in telling me to. This is me. I am 75. My blood pressure is normal. My cholesterol levels are normal. I do not take any presc meds. Both my parents lived into their 90’s. Under normal circumstances. I could reasonably expect to enjoy another 15-25 years of a good life. If I get Covid 19, am I expendable? I am hearing Republicans insinuate that the answer is “yes, you are expendable.”
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 11, 2020 22:13:38 GMT -5
I thought about this thread when I got the results from my recent CT-scan. They noted a few extraneous things like some fatty deposits in my brain that could harden and lead to a stroke and death. They weren't of concern YET, but I was being warned to change my diet, lifestyle, etc. to prevent this. I am 66. I am going to die. Hopefully, not today or tomorrow but eventually. Maybe sooner or later. Should the medical field just give up on me? I am no longer a productive member of society since I am retired. I spend my time reading, taking care of a lazy cocker spaniel, etc. I have several medical conditions including glaucoma and high blood pressure. Are you guys sure you should waste your $$$ and resources on someone who has basically outlived her usefulness. Something to think about. If I don't change my diet, lifestyle, etc., you have definitely wasted your healthcare dollars in telling me to. I thought people were talking about terminally ill, bed ridden folks that are in constant pain. I don't believe anyone was referring to those with a good quality of life that happen to have a few health issues. But this is what happens much of the time. We can't question quadruple bypass on a bedridden 90 year old because it means we support euthanasia on people when they retire.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 11, 2020 22:18:21 GMT -5
I thought about this thread when I got the results from my recent CT-scan. They noted a few extraneous things like some fatty deposits in my brain that could harden and lead to a stroke and death. They weren't of concern YET, but I was being warned to change my diet, lifestyle, etc. to prevent this. I am 66. I am going to die. Hopefully, not today or tomorrow but eventually. Maybe sooner or later. Should the medical field just give up on me? I am no longer a productive member of society since I am retired. I spend my time reading, taking care of a lazy cocker spaniel, etc. I have several medical conditions including glaucoma and high blood pressure. Are you guys sure you should waste your $$$ and resources on someone who has basically outlived her usefulness. Something to think about. If I don't change my diet, lifestyle, etc., you have definitely wasted your healthcare dollars in telling me to. This is me. I am 75. My blood pressure is normal. My cholesterol levels are normal. I do not take any presc meds. Both my parents lived into their 90’s. Under normal circumstances. I could reasonably expect to enjoy another 15-25 years of a good life. If I get Covid 19, am I expendable? I am hearing Republicans insinuate that the answer is “yes, you are expendable.” What I hear is a questioning of what should all of us be required to do to minimize the possibility that you get it in the first place.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 11, 2020 22:40:52 GMT -5
This is me. I am 75. My blood pressure is normal. My cholesterol levels are normal. I do not take any presc meds. Both my parents lived into their 90’s. Under normal circumstances. I could reasonably expect to enjoy another 15-25 years of a good life. If I get Covid 19, am I expendable? I am hearing Republicans insinuate that the answer is “yes, you are expendable.” What I hear is a questioning of what should all of us be required to do to minimize the possibility that you get it in the first place. How about following CDC recommendations? Is that asking too much?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 11, 2020 22:52:04 GMT -5
What I hear is a questioning of what should all of us be required to do to minimize the possibility that you get it in the first place. How about following CDC recommendations? Is that asking too much? Personally, I am good with that.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 7:53:30 GMT -5
This is me. I am 75. My blood pressure is normal. My cholesterol levels are normal. I do not take any presc meds. Both my parents lived into their 90’s. Under normal circumstances. I could reasonably expect to enjoy another 15-25 years of a good life. If I get Covid 19, am I expendable? I am hearing Republicans insinuate that the answer is “yes, you are expendable.” The way it was explained in some of the podcasts I've listened to, the consideration is "quality of life years" left. If treating whatever someone has means they'll live another 6 months but be miserable, should they be given aggressive treatment? Athul Gawande's book posed the question, "What, to you, is living?" One guy said that as long as he could eat chocolate and watch football, he'd be happy. I have far higher standards (and they may change as I age). If there's a possibility that after treatment I'd have diminished mental acuity, would be bedridden, would feel sick or be in constant pain for the rest of my life, well… let me go. Two contrasting stories from my own family. Ten years ago we got the call that my Ex was in a hospital in FL with multiple organ failure, brought on by his years of alcohol abuse. DS was 25 and he was next of kin so had to make the decisions. The hospital staff was very clear: if the Ex stopped breathing and was revived he'd probably exist in a permanent vegetative state. I will be forever grateful that all of us- DS, my Ex's sister and DS' pastor, who is a close friend, all said the same thing- "let him go". They moved him to the hospice floor and he died soon after that. He was 64. Then there's my great-niece. They determined from a sonogram that she had an underdeveloped heart chamber and might not survive the birth. They weren't sure if it was operable. My niece went through with the pregnancy, they put the baby through all kinds of tests after she was born, and said, "Yeah, we can fix this". She's 9 now and has had 3 surgeries. I think she's done now. She's a lively, smart little girl with few limitations on her activities although I suppose at some point they'll tell her no marathons or triathlons. Totally different decision- I don't even want to think about the cost but she's got a full, high-quality life ahead of her.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 12, 2020 8:55:38 GMT -5
I thought about this thread when I got the results from my recent CT-scan. They noted a few extraneous things like some fatty deposits in my brain that could harden and lead to a stroke and death. They weren't of concern YET, but I was being warned to change my diet, lifestyle, etc. to prevent this. I am 66. I am going to die. Hopefully, not today or tomorrow but eventually. Maybe sooner or later. Should the medical field just give up on me? I am no longer a productive member of society since I am retired. I spend my time reading, taking care of a lazy cocker spaniel, etc. I have several medical conditions including glaucoma and high blood pressure. Are you guys sure you should waste your $$$ and resources on someone who has basically outlived her usefulness. Something to think about. If I don't change my diet, lifestyle, etc., you have definitely wasted your healthcare dollars in telling me to. I thought people were talking about terminally ill, bed ridden folks that are in constant pain. I don't believe anyone was referring to those with a good quality of life that happen to have a few health issues. That's what I thought too. My grandfather was in his upper 70's when it was discovered he had a brain tumor. He entered a clinical trial for a new treatment for that particular form of brain cancer and was in remission for 7 years. His was one of the longest remissions in the study. The normal time between diagnosis and death is 3 months. Meanwhile someone my age my parents knew, in the same study with the same treatment only made it six months. My grandfather went on to beat it for another 3 years after that. It was the third time it came back that he made the decision not to see any more treatment. At the time he was being moved into hospice something happened with his intestines I can't remember what and my grandmother had him rushed to the ER. The ER doctor wanted to do immediate surgery. My grandmother and father refused. The ER doctor refused to let them leave unless they agreed to surgery so my dad called his bluff and told him to call the surgeon down. Surgeon tore that ER doctor a new one and my grandfather was made comfortable till he passed. My grandfather was in absolutely no condition to survive a surgery like that, his relatives recognized it but the ER doctor refused to budge. That was extreme live saving measures IMO that shouldn't have even been brought up. My dad said he would not have been able to live with himself if he had agreed to put my grandfather through that surgery. Grandpa was very clear about his wishes and at that point wasn't all there he would have been terrified out of his mind and likely died on the operating table. And for what so the ER doctor could make a buck? So we could say at least we could live with ourselves? He passed away peacefully in hospice a few days later. That's what I thought we were discussing, not my grandfather's initial diagnosis where he may have been in his upper 70s but was in perfect physical health otherwise.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 12, 2020 9:22:44 GMT -5
I thought people were talking about terminally ill, bed ridden folks that are in constant pain. I don't believe anyone was referring to those with a good quality of life that happen to have a few health issues. That's what I thought too. My grandfather was in his upper 70's when it was discovered he had a brain tumor. He entered a clinical trial ... ... That's what I thought we were discussing, not my grandfather's initial diagnosis where he may have been in his upper 70s but was in perfect physical health otherwise. There is also a societal benefit to having people being part of a clinical trial that should be factored into a cost/benefit analysis.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 12, 2020 9:43:38 GMT -5
They were really excited with how long my grandfather remained in remission. I didn't get to hear for obvious privacy reasons how long other patients lived in the trial. I hope it helped more people live longer lives.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on May 12, 2020 11:32:23 GMT -5
My county just hit 720 confirmed cases (expanded testing, to meet state requirements for reopening the region). Then they announce this: "County Public Health Director says the county "would continue to reach out to those who came in close, direct contact with a positive case..." but, "will no longer be doing full-scale community contact tracing as it has little to no clinical value at this point." Contact tracing is the whole point of another of the state's reopening metrics: 30 contact tracers per 100k residents. Why increase contact tracers numbers, if you are no longer doing it?
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Tiny
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 21:22:34 GMT -5
Posts: 13,368
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Post by Tiny on May 12, 2020 11:53:29 GMT -5
I thought restaurants had really narrow profit margins. Will allowing them to open with a 25% capacity really help them? Even if they still do "carry out"? Is it even worth it in the Big Picture to open a restaurant even at 50% capacity? Will they still be able to met all their expenses?
I realize that restaurants in areas that have "seasons" and where it's "off season" now - probably would be ok with 25% capacity... that's probably what they typically have during off season. And as such work their financials around those highs and lows of income.
Let's assume it restuarants in an area that doesn't have a "season" - how is being sort of open while still bleeding money (in the form of expenses) going to help them long term?
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Deleted
Joined: May 1, 2024 3:05:09 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 11:59:55 GMT -5
My county just hit 720 confirmed cases (expanded testing, to meet state requirements for reopening the region). Then they announce this: "County Public Health Director says the county "would continue to reach out to those who came in close, direct contact with a positive case..." but, "will no longer be doing full-scale community contact tracing as it has little to no clinical value at this point." Contact tracing is the whole point of another of the state's reopening metrics: 30 contact tracers per 100k residents. Why increase contact tracers numbers, if you are no longer doing it? The Public Health Officer here in my county mentioned people who had direct, extended contact with positive cases are notified and asked to watch for symptoms. They said it wasn't possible to notify stores they shopped in, other shoppers, etc... and that they can't legally make someone quarantine at home even if they are positive or believed to have been exposed. They will be called every day for 14 days and encouraged not to leave home or expose others. I really do think the US is going for herd immunity with no/few tests, but that just isn't being openly shared with the public.
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thyme4change
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 26, 2010 13:54:08 GMT -5
Posts: 40,409
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Post by thyme4change on May 12, 2020 12:01:44 GMT -5
It is possible that people who claim to be religious have doubts. Or, they have doubts that they were "good enough", so they may want a little longer to please god as insurance they will make it to heaven. Also, the whole 'gift of life' deal, where suicide will put you immediately into hell, so is refusing treatment the same as suicide? Religion can give some really fucked up messages. Or some people, religious or not, are just very attached to their old people and don't want them to go. If my father had survived his third round of cancer, he would have been the first person on the planet to survive that type an stage. I knew from the get go that an unathletic office worker wouldn't be the first person to beat the cancer. It didn't stop my mom from driving him all over the country for treatment. Faith had nothing to do with it. He was the love of her life, and she didn't want to loose him. In the end, the treatments gave him an extra 5 months. I wasn't saying that wasn't true. There are many reasons why people want to try anything to live.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 47,246
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 12, 2020 12:05:10 GMT -5
Reading about places here they said it depends. For some of the larger restaurants it doesn't make sense to reopen at 25-50% capacity because they are still paying overhead for a building that holds double that. On top of that to open their dining rooms will require they hire/bring back staff which increases their payroll expenses. Quite a few are choosing to remain take out/delivery only for the time being because they've got the system down and are able to squeak by. Others like places are having troubles keeping afloat as take out/delivery only. Even having 25% of people return to the dining area will allow them to keep going awhile longer. Then some are choosing not to open because they don't want to risk the potential litigation if a customer or newly returned to work server gets sick, they will stick with the set up they have now. Others are choosing to open but it's the owners themselves working the dine in area. One said it's his business, he'll take the risk, he's not going to ask his servers to protect his business from going under. So it seems to be a case by case basis for places around here. We'll see at the end of this who survives.
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