Question for our Canadian posters

[Value Buy]

We have many threads discussing government benefits provided American citizens and whether the benefits are adequate, and how much bang we get for our buck in regards to  our social security deductions and medicare premiums, versus our income level as well as poverty levels.
I am asking if anyone would like to post their monetary benefit of services they receive from their national health system, and is it all paid into the fund by the companies they worked for without anything kicked in by you.
Also your national social security payments, is it the same way, where corporations paid your premiums while working, or did you also contribute.
Could you give your posters here in the states a monthly number of benefits your receive? I am particularily interested in your social security receipts and whether it keeps up with true inflation numbers every year or so.
Thank you

[mollyc]

I can answer some of this off the top of my head.

The monetary benefit of health service is going to depend on what is wrong with you and what your province/territory covers.  My daughter and my parents because of their ages have eye exams covered.  My husband and I have to pay because non-senior adults aren't covered in BC.  My 3 older siblings all have heart problems.  My brothers required invasive intervention so they were quite expensive on a one-time basis.  My sister problems are electric so her interventions (so far) are less expensive.

Every province funds their health system differently, ie, payroll taxes, monthly premiums.  BC is transitioning from an individual/family monthly premium to a payroll tax.

In BC it was up to the employer whether or not they paid a part or all of the employee's MSP premiums.  Some of the small logging companies I did books for would administer a MSP account but the employee paid 100% of the premium as a payroll deduction.  The benefit to the employee was, BC required individuals to pay every quarter's MSP premiums in advance but companies were invoiced once a month with payment due by month end.

[Value Buy]

Nov 12, 2018 10:53:30 GMT -5 mollyc said:

I can answer some of this off the top of my head.

The monetary benefit of health service is going to depend on what is wrong with you and what your province/territory covers.  My daughter and my parents because of their ages have eye exams covered.  My husband and I have to pay because non-senior adults aren't covered in BC.  My 3 older siblings all have heart problems.  My brothers required invasive intervention so they were quite expensive on a one-time basis.  My sister problems are electric so her interventions (so far) are less expensive.

Every province funds their health system differently, ie, payroll taxes, monthly premiums.  BC is transitioning from an individual/family monthly premium to a payroll tax.

In BC it was up to the employer whether or not they paid a part or all of the employee's MSP premiums.  Some of the small logging companies I did books for would administer a MSP account but the employee paid 100% of the premium as a payroll deduction.  The benefit to the employee was, BC required individuals to pay every quarter's MSP premiums in advance but companies were invoiced once a month with payment due by month end.

Thank you.
As you can surmise I am really ignorant of Canadian services to the people, and trying to figure out if Canada gives a better return to their citizens than we receive in the states. Are the pensions decided by Territory, or by the national government, and what would be the payout on a couple who earns, about $60,000 or so a year before retiring? At what age do you qualify for full retirement monies? Is it 66, like currently here in the states?

[Value Buy]

Medicare in the US is not free to retired people. We still pay a monthly fee that increases every year as you grow older which assumes you will need more healthcare as you age. We also can buy additional healthcare insurance that will pay partial or all costs after medicare payouts for services rendered. 
Is this the same way in Canada?
In my wife's and I cases, we are currently paying about $13,000 a year for both Medicare and additional policies. The secondary policies vary on drug payouts. My wife takes 100% coverage payout coverage, with $250 deductables on drug pricing, where I take a $500 per year deductible and I never hit the deductible.
My wife went through breast cancer and never paid a penny except the first $250 in deductibles in her first year of retirement., and I have to pay my share of the three doctor visits I do every year.

[mollyc]

CPP is the equivalent to your social security.  The employer and the employee each pay the same amount each pay.  In 2018, the maximum annual deduction amount is $2,593.80 each.  In the past, you and your employer stopped paying CPP when you started receiving CPP or when you turned 65.  A few years ago, they changed it so, unless you file with the federal government to opt-out, you still pay CPP between 65 and 70 on employment income.  Self-employed individuals are required to pay both portions of CPP.

CPP funds are governed by a separate board outside of the govt.  The last time I checked CPP funds were audited every 3rd year and reviewed the other 2.  The financial statement are posted online.

Quebec administers its own pension plan, QPP.  I don't do payroll in Quebec so I'm not even going to try to get into it.  It doesn't seem to be much different then CPP but I've never worried about the details.

[Value Buy]

Nov 12, 2018 11:18:42 GMT -5 mollyc said:

CPP is the equivalent to your social security.  The employer and the employee each pay the same amount each pay.  In 2018, the maximum annual deduction amount is $2,593.80 each.  In the past, you and your employer stopped paying CPP when you started receiving CPP or when you turned 65.  A few years ago, they changed it so, unless you file with the federal government to opt-out, you still pay CPP between 65 and 70 on employment income.  Self-employed individuals are required to pay both portions of CPP.

CPP funds are governed by a separate board outside of the govt.  The last time I checked CPP funds were audited every 3rd year and reviewed the other 2.  The financial statement are posted online.

Quebec administers its own pension plan, QPP.  I don't do payroll in Quebec so I'm not even going to try to get into it.  It doesn't seem to be much different then CPP but I've never worried about the details.

Thanks again.
Are the payouts varied by each person's income level? People making more get paid more, and if so, what is the largest payout currently available every month?
If you earn a sufficently large income yearly in retirement, does the government reduce some of your monthly payout?

[mollyc]

Nov 12, 2018 11:05:31 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Nov 12, 2018 10:53:30 GMT -5 mollyc said:

I can answer some of this off the top of my head.

The monetary benefit of health service is going to depend on what is wrong with you and what your province/territory covers.  My daughter and my parents because of their ages have eye exams covered.  My husband and I have to pay because non-senior adults aren't covered in BC.  My 3 older siblings all have heart problems.  My brothers required invasive intervention so they were quite expensive on a one-time basis.  My sister problems are electric so her interventions (so far) are less expensive.

Every province funds their health system differently, ie, payroll taxes, monthly premiums.  BC is transitioning from an individual/family monthly premium to a payroll tax.

In BC it was up to the employer whether or not they paid a part or all of the employee's MSP premiums.  Some of the small logging companies I did books for would administer a MSP account but the employee paid 100% of the premium as a payroll deduction.  The benefit to the employee was, BC required individuals to pay every quarter's MSP premiums in advance but companies were invoiced once a month with payment due by month end.

Thank you.
As you can surmise I am really ignorant of Canadian services to the people, and trying to figure out if Canada gives a better return to their citizens than we receive in the states. Are the pensions decided by Territory, or by the national government, and what would be the payout on a couple who earns, about $60,000 or so a year before retiring? At what age do you qualify for full retirement monies? Is it 66, like currently here in the states?

CPP is Federal.  QPP is provincial.  You can receive reduced CPP between 60 and 65.  Full funding starts at 65.  Every year you put off receiving CPP between 65 and 70, you get an increase over the amount you would have earned at 65.

CPP is calculated based on your annual contributions between the ages of 18 to 65.  The worst 8 or 10 years are deducted from the amount.  Everyone's pension is calculated individually so a couples combined income wouldn't matter.

The maximum payout in 2018 is $1,134.17/month.  The average is $673.10 (as of July 2018).

Individuals also qualify for OAS generally at 65.  The maximum in 2018 is $586.66.  I must confess that I am a bad YMer and haven't worked with any of this for myself so I can't give more details on how this is calculated.  I am pretty sure that one of the calculations for OAS is how much other income you have.  This is based on the number of my parents' friends complaining about OAS being clawedback because they make too much from their pensions.

[mollyc]

I suspect that whether or not Canada or the US gives a better return is dependent on an individual's own circumstances and social philosophy.

Virgil has commented on how unfair our system is to his parents.  Most of our current active Canadian posters seem to prefer our system to the U.S.  When we were on MSN (more accessible to random people), there were some posters who felt overtaxed and/or hated our medical system.

I think we get more bang for the buck but that's my circumstances.  My husband and I have 100s of relatives scattered over the country.  For me, whether I'm using the services or not, it is likely that one of my relatives are.  

My daughter and I were in the hospital for almost a week after she was born because of our issues.  All I had to pay for was the TV (for DH).

When I went on Maternity Leave, I received more EI income than my employers and myself had paid in to that point.  DD's 17 and I've had higher paying jobs so I may have caught up by now.

I also have only a small amount of my income taxed as the 2nd tier.  It could be none but I voluntarily refuse to claim my husband as a dependent and I have only used non-refundable tax credits for our daughter.  This is my choice because I know if I die first, my husband will become the responsibility of the government.

Even African publications have called my city "the little city in the middle of nowhere".  As limited as this makes some of our medical options, we still seem to have no less than small places in the US.

[mollyc]

Nov 12, 2018 11:14:44 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Medicare in the US is not free to retired people. We still pay a monthly fee that increases every year as you grow older which assumes you will need more healthcare as you age. We also can buy additional healthcare insurance that will pay partial or all costs after medicare payouts for services rendered. 
Is this the same way in Canada?
In my wife's and I cases, we are currently paying about $13,000 a year for both Medicare and additional policies. The secondary policies vary on drug payouts. My wife takes 100% coverage payout coverage, with $250 deductables on drug pricing, where I take a $500 per year deductible and I never hit the deductible.
My wife went through breast cancer and never paid a penny except the first $250 in deductibles in her first year of retirement., and I have to pay my share of the three doctor visits I do every year.

My mother's pension plan allows her to continue belonging to their extended health and dental plans.  My dad's did not.  Mom's premiums are automatically deducted from her pension each month.  The total deducted is significantly less than $13,000.  I think that $13,000 would be more than 50% of her annual income.  I'll see if I can look it up the next time I am at their place.

I know my parents registered for BC Pharmacare when it started.  Technically everyone in the province was supposed to but I left it for DH to do and I don't think he did.  We made too much money anyway and I have good benefits so we wouldn't have qualified for anything.  They may or may not have some of their medicines subsidized by the province.  The pharmacy submits the forms to the insurance company when they get their prescriptions so they only have to pay their portion.  If they spend enough on qualified medical services in the year, they can get a 15% non-refundable tax credit to apply to their income (up to a maximum amount).

Because mom's EH and dental are from the Municipal Pension Plan, it includes current workers so premiums are based on a wider pool of applicants then if they were buying into a Seniors plan.

When I retire I can keep my benefit plans, I will just have to pay 100%.  However if I die first, DH can only stay on the plan for 12 months.  His costs will most likely go up significantly so he will likely drop them and take his chances.

[Virgil Showlion]

Nov 12, 2018 12:29:15 GMT -5 mollyc said:

... Virgil has commented on how unfair our system is to his parents.  ...

Them and others. The socialist redistribution I can tolerate, it's the penalization of citizens with post-65 employment and post-retirement income that irk me. Especially since an absurd percentage of Canadian baby boomers fall into the category of "lived well beyond their means, spent every cent they earned, and set aside literally nothing for retirement" (even more so than Americans, according to the numbers).

But... if one doesn't want seniors dying in the gutter--and millions would, if subject to the consequences of their own carelessness--then somebody has to pay.

[weltschmerz]

"I am asking if anyone would like to post their monetary benefit of services they receive from their national health system"

Don't know. We never get a bill. With my last hospitalization, I got a bill from the hospital. $14 for the phone in my room.

[weltschmerz]

"Also your national social security payments, is it the same way, where corporations paid your premiums while working, or did you also contribute."

Yes, we all contribute. Pension premiums were deducted from my pay.

[weltschmerz]

"Could you give your posters here in the states a monthly number of benefits your receive?"

Depends on your circumstance.
If you have minor children, you get more benefits.
If you have kids in daycare, you get more benefits.
If you have a child in university, you get more benefits.
I you have a parent in a nursing home, you get more benefits.
If you're a caregiver to elderly parents, you get more benefits.

I have none of the above, so I just get my Canada Pension, my Quebec pension and my hospital pension. And my medical needs are covered.

[weltschmerz]

"I am asking if anyone would like to post their monetary benefit of services they receive from their national health system, and is it all paid into the fund by the companies they worked for without anything kicked in by you."

Everyone kicks in. Everyone. You don't even need to have a job with a company.....you can never work a day in your life, but if you're a Canadian citizen, you're medically covered throughout your lifetime.
The taxes you pay every time you make a purchase, buy gasoline, eat in a restaurant, etc., all go into a general fund, which also pays for health care.

[Value Buy]

Nov 12, 2018 18:23:28 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

"I am asking if anyone would like to post their monetary benefit of services they receive from their national health system, and is it all paid into the fund by the companies they worked for without anything kicked in by you."

Everyone kicks in. Everyone. You don't even need to have a job with a company.....you can never work a day in your life, but if you're a Canadian citizen, you're medically covered throughout your lifetime.
The taxes you pay every time you make a purchase, buy gasoline, eat in a restaurant, etc., all go into a general fund, which also pays for health care.

Do retirees have to pay into the national health system after retiring like we do for Medicare, or are you free of any monthly payment? Our Medicare premium is deducted from our social security payment automatically.

[Value Buy]

Nov 12, 2018 14:16:10 GMT -5 mollyc said:

Nov 12, 2018 11:14:44 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Medicare in the US is not free to retired people. We still pay a monthly fee that increases every year as you grow older which assumes you will need more healthcare as you age. We also can buy additional healthcare insurance that will pay partial or all costs after medicare payouts for services rendered. 
Is this the same way in Canada?
In my wife's and I cases, we are currently paying about $13,000 a year for both Medicare and additional policies. The secondary policies vary on drug payouts. My wife takes 100% coverage payout coverage, with $250 deductables on drug pricing, where I take a $500 per year deductible and I never hit the deductible.
My wife went through breast cancer and never paid a penny except the first $250 in deductibles in her first year of retirement., and I have to pay my share of the three doctor visits I do every year.

My mother's pension plan allows her to continue belonging to their extended health and dental plans.  My dad's did not.  Mom's premiums are automatically deducted from her pension each month.  The total deducted is significantly less than $13,000.  I think that $13,000 would be more than 50% of her annual income.  I'll see if I can look it up the next time I am at their place.

I know my parents registered for BC Pharmacare when it started.  Technically everyone in the province was supposed to but I left it for DH to do and I don't think he did.  We made too much money anyway and I have good benefits so we wouldn't have qualified for anything.  They may or may not have some of their medicines subsidized by the province.  The pharmacy submits the forms to the insurance company when they get their prescriptions so they only have to pay their portion.  If they spend enough on qualified medical services in the year, they can get a 15% non-refundable tax credit to apply to their income (up to a maximum amount).

Because mom's EH and dental are from the Municipal Pension Plan, it includes current workers so premiums are based on a wider pool of applicants then if they were buying into a Seniors plan.

When I retire I can keep my benefit plans, I will just have to pay 100%.  However if I die first, DH can only stay on the plan for 12 months.  His costs will most likely go up significantly so he will likely drop them and take his chances.

The $13,000 I referenced was our monthly Medicare deduction as well as our extra health plan we carry through United Healthcare as well as our drug plan payments. It is closer to $14,000......

[weltschmerz]

Nov 12, 2018 18:42:48 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Nov 12, 2018 18:23:28 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

"I am asking if anyone would like to post their monetary benefit of services they receive from their national health system, and is it all paid into the fund by the companies they worked for without anything kicked in by you."

Everyone kicks in. Everyone. You don't even need to have a job with a company.....you can never work a day in your life, but if you're a Canadian citizen, you're medically covered throughout your lifetime.
The taxes you pay every time you make a purchase, buy gasoline, eat in a restaurant, etc., all go into a general fund, which also pays for health care.

Do retirees have to pay into the national health system after retiring like we do for Medicare, or are you free of any monthly payment? Our Medicare premium is deducted from our social security payment automatically.

Again, every province is different. I pay for 50% of my drug costs, and that's my contribution to RAMQ.
Also, someone mentioned that I would pay about $200 at tax time.
I'll let you know. I've been retired for less than a year.

[mollyc]

That $14,000.00 is an insane number to me. In 2017, my msp, dental and extended health premiums totaled a little less than $5,350. That was the total of what my employer and I paid. I would expect my mother's cost was less because her policy is through a group with significantly more employees/pensioners then mine. However, my parents pay about 20% of their prescriptions so that can be over $3,000 per year.

[weltschmerz]

Nov 12, 2018 19:48:39 GMT -5 mollyc said:

That $14,000.00 is an insane number to me. In 2017, my msp, dental and extended health premiums totaled a little less than $5,350. That was the total of what my employer and I paid. I would expect my mother's cost was less because her policy is through a group with significantly more employees/pensioners then mine. However, my parents pay about 20% of their prescriptions so that can be over $3,000 per year.

Some seniors have private supplemental insurance policies that they had when they were working, but most don't.
I don't. Most of my friends don't.
I looked into the costs, and it was ridiculous. Sure, they pay 80% of drug costs, but I found it wasn't worth it.
I'd rather pay 50% for my medication, pay for dental and vision, and it would still be cheaper than private insurance.

[Value Buy]

Nov 12, 2018 19:48:39 GMT -5 mollyc said:

That $14,000.00 is an insane number to me. In 2017, my msp, dental and extended health premiums totaled a little less than $5,350. That was the total of what my employer and I paid. I would expect my mother's cost was less because her policy is through a group with significantly more employees/pensioners then mine. However, my parents pay about 20% of their prescriptions so that can be over $3,000 per year.

Before I retired, our family plan was about $14,000 and I paid about $450 a month and the company picked up the rest, but we also had a $2,500 per person or $4,500 total family deductible to pay up front before insurance picked up the rest.
Drugs were not very cheap for us either. If we skipped the supplemental plan on Medicare we would save thousands, but would get stuck with big bills also.
When My wife went through chemo, when finished with a treatment and checked back at the desk, all we did was verify her next treatment date while retirees without the supplemental policy were writing big checks every week for services. We knew if we were both still working that would have been us to, paying for other things not covered by the company insurance.

[Value Buy]

And we can deduct health insurance costs from our gross income at tax time, or at least in previous years. I am not sure how it goes under our new tax plan implemented for this year.

[weltschmerz]

I hated my private insurance through work.

They said they would pay 80% of supplemental costs, then in really tiny print..."*up to $25.00*.

The acupuncturist charges about $100 per session. The osteopath charges about $100 per session.

$25.00 is not 80% of $100.00.

Vision wasn't covered at all.

No, thank you. I'm not paying hundreds of dollars every month to get $25.00 back.

They badgered me for months. "You need our insurance!"

No, I don't.