dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 23, 2017 19:44:51 GMT -5
Oog.
I have received the results of my 23 & Me test and have learned that I have 319 Neanderthal variants, which they say is more Neanderthal variants than 96% of people tested to date. Apparently that translates into ~4% of my DNA, but still, it's pretty cool! And probably explains a lot.
The rest just reinforced known family history. Mostly British, Irish, and German, a little Scandinavian (probably from Vikings stravaging around Britain and Ireland), a little Native American, and a small amount of unidentified (space alien?).
Actually, I have no idea if Oog is a legitimate Neanderthal name. I'm sure some linguistics scholar has done his or her thesis on the probable sounds a Neanderthal palate was capable of forming, but I haven't read it. I think Oog is a fun pseudo Neanderthal word, so I'm sticking with it.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Sept 23, 2017 19:54:25 GMT -5
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Post by empress of self-improvement on Sept 23, 2017 19:58:29 GMT -5
Al - go with Al
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 23, 2017 20:01:59 GMT -5
Thanks Tennesseer. That's interesting! I'm still gonna go with Oog, though, because it's fun to say "Oog."
Judging by the picture that accompanied the article, the mystery of where the family nose originated has been solved.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Sept 23, 2017 20:10:27 GMT -5
I am thinking Ooga would be the feminine version of Oog?
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 23, 2017 20:47:13 GMT -5
I am thinking Ooga would be the feminine version of Oog? Only if the Neanderthal language included gender markers. Since no one speaks Neanderthal anymore, we don't know whether it had gender markers. Gender markers likely begin to be codified in a language when the culture has developed differentiated gender roles. It is possible that very early humans might not have had strict gender roles. Existence was quite precarious and probably required that everyone be able to pitch in to do anything and everything just to keep from starving or being eaten by cave bears or saber tooth tigers. Also, if Neanderthal did actually have gender markers, we don't know what they were. Maybe female names all ended in "O" or "Y" sounds or chirps or squirrel noises. Or female names might, indeed, have ended in "A", but who knows? It could have been anything. We cannot necessarily establish the existence of a characteristic of an ancient protolanguage on the basis of the characteristics of a few modern languages as the etymology may not track.
Anyway, Ooga isn't as much fun to say as Oog.
I'm sticking with Oog.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Sept 23, 2017 20:58:26 GMT -5
Oog, I think you're quite brilliant.
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 23, 2017 21:30:47 GMT -5
Oog, I think you're quite brilliant. Aw, shucks.
It's all those language and linguistics courses I took (I was a professional linguist for nearly 40 years). Something was bound to stick.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Sept 23, 2017 23:05:23 GMT -5
Oog, I think you're quite brilliant. Aw, shucks.
It's all those language and linguistics courses I took (I was a professional linguist for nearly 40 years). Something was bound to stick.
I know your career. (Not in a creepy way - I just remember because it's cool.) Perhaps neanderthals get a bad rap for their intellect and that's the reason you're smarter than the rest of us.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Sept 23, 2017 23:10:15 GMT -5
Oog, I think you're quite brilliant. Aw, shucks.
It's all those language and linguistics courses I took (I was a professional linguist for nearly 40 years). Something was bound to stick.
Do you speak any other languages?
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Sept 24, 2017 7:43:17 GMT -5
Ooga sounds too much like Ooma.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 24, 2017 9:12:44 GMT -5
Do you mouth breathe and do your knuckles drag?
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 24, 2017 9:22:17 GMT -5
Aw, shucks.
It's all those language and linguistics courses I took (I was a professional linguist for nearly 40 years). Something was bound to stick.
Do you speak any other languages? When I was working, I maintained certifications in Russian, Chinese, and French. I specialized in translating scientific and technical material, so I didn't get much practice in speaking since I really never had to do it. I was never any good at speaking Chinese, probably because I was 42 when I learned it. Couldn't get the hang of hearing or reproducing the tones. Nowadays, I can only pick out isolated words and phrases in spoken Chines, though I can make myself understood at my favorite Chinese takeout spot when the lady with the reliable English isn't there, but that's only because I have looked up and practiced everything I might need to say. (Actually, now that I think of it, I haven't practiced in ages, so it is very likely that I couldn't even do that now).
I've been retired for 6 years, and my active vocabulary has largely faded now, I can still dredge up some Russian and French when I need to communicate with someone in the ER where I volunteer or with my neighbor's parents, who are Russian. I can still read Russian and French. I tried to read a Chinese newspaper the other day, but it was a hopeless cause as I didn't have a dictionary handy and couldn't remember many of the characters. It's like any other skill, it needs to be used or it just goes away.
I studied some other European languages, but I only maintained certifications in 3 since the testing and continuing education requirements to maintain the certs were pretty onerous and time-consuming. There was a significant financial incentive for maintaining certs, but I hit the salary cap with 3 languages, so there was nothing to be gained by certifying in more.
Aside from the really great people I got to work with, being able to earn a good living by doing something that I enjoyed and was actually good at was the very best part of my career. And it all happened because I decided to join the Air Force. I had studied French through middle school, high school, and college, but everything else happened because of the Air Force.
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 24, 2017 9:26:00 GMT -5
Do you mouth breathe: Only when my allergies are really bad. and do your knuckles drag? No, but I'm lumpy, socially awkward, and kinda weird and goofy, so I've got that going for me.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Sept 24, 2017 9:38:17 GMT -5
How cool!
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Sept 24, 2017 10:54:37 GMT -5
The thread title made that Carlie Rae Jepson song stick in my head.
Hey, i just met you, and this is crazy, but here's my number, call me maybe?
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Sept 24, 2017 10:55:46 GMT -5
I am thinking Ooga would be the feminine version of Oog? Only if the Neanderthal language included gender markers. Since no one speaks Neanderthal anymore, we don't know whether it had gender markers. Gender markers likely begin to be codified in a language when the culture has developed differentiated gender roles. It is possible that very early humans might not have had strict gender roles. Existence was quite precarious and probably required that everyone be able to pitch in to do anything and everything just to keep from starving or being eaten by cave bears or saber tooth tigers. Also, if Neanderthal did actually have gender markers, we don't know what they were. Maybe female names all ended in "O" or "Y" sounds or chirps or squirrel noises. Or female names might, indeed, have ended in "A", but who knows? It could have been anything. We cannot necessarily establish the existence of a characteristic of an ancient protolanguage on the basis of the characteristics of a few modern languages as the etymology may not track.
Anyway, Ooga isn't as much fun to say as Oog.
I'm sticking with Oog.
HERESY!!!!!!! But in all seriousness, thank you for that explanation. I learned something today!!!!
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Sept 24, 2017 11:13:05 GMT -5
I am thinking Ooga would be the feminine version of Oog? Only if the Neanderthal language included gender markers. Since no one speaks Neanderthal anymore, we don't know whether it had gender markers. Gender markers likely begin to be codified in a language when the culture has developed differentiated gender roles. It is possible that very early humans might not have had strict gender roles. Existence was quite precarious and probably required that everyone be able to pitch in to do anything and everything just to keep from starving or being eaten by cave bears or saber tooth tigers. Also, if Neanderthal did actually have gender markers, we don't know what they were. Maybe female names all ended in "O" or "Y" sounds or chirps or squirrel noises. Or female names might, indeed, have ended in "A", but who knows? It could have been anything. We cannot necessarily establish the existence of a characteristic of an ancient protolanguage on the basis of the characteristics of a few modern languages as the etymology may not track.
Anyway, Ooga isn't as much fun to say as Oog.
I'm sticking with Oog.
Further, is it even likely all Neanderthals spoke a common language?
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 24, 2017 11:35:58 GMT -5
Only if the Neanderthal language included gender markers. Since no one speaks Neanderthal anymore, we don't know whether it had gender markers. Gender markers likely begin to be codified in a language when the culture has developed differentiated gender roles. It is possible that very early humans might not have had strict gender roles. Existence was quite precarious and probably required that everyone be able to pitch in to do anything and everything just to keep from starving or being eaten by cave bears or saber tooth tigers. Also, if Neanderthal did actually have gender markers, we don't know what they were. Maybe female names all ended in "O" or "Y" sounds or chirps or squirrel noises. Or female names might, indeed, have ended in "A", but who knows? It could have been anything. We cannot necessarily establish the existence of a characteristic of an ancient protolanguage on the basis of the characteristics of a few modern languages as the etymology may not track.
Anyway, Ooga isn't as much fun to say as Oog.
I'm sticking with Oog.
Further, is it even likely all Neanderthals spoke a common language? Yet another good question! I expect it would have depended on how isolated the groups they lived in were from one another. Now that I've discovered a kinship with Neanderthals and therefore an interest in learning more about them, I will definitely add that to the list of things to research. I try to keep learning new things in an effort to stave off brain mush as long as possible and just recently I was thinking that maybe I should take another stab at trying to understand algebra. Neanderthals sound like a lot more fun than algebra.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Sept 24, 2017 11:57:09 GMT -5
We could be cousins, Dannylion! Although the % of Neanderthal isn't as high in my family. My brothers Neanderthal names would most likely be "moe", "larry", and "curly".... I'd like to go by Dot.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Sept 24, 2017 12:11:57 GMT -5
No idea how much Neanderthal I may have in me, but you may call me "Erg". (Cause I say it all the time.)
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GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl
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Post by GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl on Sept 24, 2017 12:19:41 GMT -5
Do you speak any other languages? When I was working, I maintained certifications in Russian, Chinese, and French. I specialized in translating scientific and technical material, so I didn't get much practice in speaking since I really never had to do it. I was never any good at speaking Chinese, probably because I was 42 when I learned it. Couldn't get the hang of hearing or reproducing the tones. Nowadays, I can only pick out isolated words and phrases in spoken Chines, though I can make myself understood at my favorite Chinese takeout spot when the lady with the reliable English isn't there, but that's only because I have looked up and practiced everything I might need to say. (Actually, now that I think of it, I haven't practiced in ages, so it is very likely that I couldn't even do that now).
I've been retired for 6 years, and my active vocabulary has largely faded now, I can still dredge up some Russian and French when I need to communicate with someone in the ER where I volunteer or with my neighbor's parents, who are Russian. I can still read Russian and French. I tried to read a Chinese newspaper the other day, but it was a hopeless cause as I didn't have a dictionary handy and couldn't remember many of the characters. It's like any other skill, it needs to be used or it just goes away.
I studied some other European languages, but I only maintained certifications in 3 since the testing and continuing education requirements to maintain the certs were pretty onerous and time-consuming. There was a significant financial incentive for maintaining certs, but I hit the salary cap with 3 languages, so there was nothing to be gained by certifying in more.
Aside from the really great people I got to work with, being able to earn a good living by doing something that I enjoyed and was actually good at was the very best part of my career. And it all happened because I decided to join the Air Force. I had studied French through middle school, high school, and college, but everything else happened because of the Air Force.
Damn. Wished I'd known about this career when I was trying to figure out what I wanted to be when I grew up for the first time. This would have been right down my alley.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Sept 24, 2017 13:02:51 GMT -5
Do you speak any other languages? When I was working, I maintained certifications in Russian, Chinese, and French. I specialized in translating scientific and technical material, so I didn't get much practice in speaking since I really never had to do it. I was never any good at speaking Chinese, probably because I was 42 when I learned it. Couldn't get the hang of hearing or reproducing the tones. Nowadays, I can only pick out isolated words and phrases in spoken Chines, though I can make myself understood at my favorite Chinese takeout spot when the lady with the reliable English isn't there, but that's only because I have looked up and practiced everything I might need to say. (Actually, now that I think of it, I haven't practiced in ages, so it is very likely that I couldn't even do that now).
I've been retired for 6 years, and my active vocabulary has largely faded now, I can still dredge up some Russian and French when I need to communicate with someone in the ER where I volunteer or with my neighbor's parents, who are Russian. I can still read Russian and French. I tried to read a Chinese newspaper the other day, but it was a hopeless cause as I didn't have a dictionary handy and couldn't remember many of the characters. It's like any other skill, it needs to be used or it just goes away.
I studied some other European languages, but I only maintained certifications in 3 since the testing and continuing education requirements to maintain the certs were pretty onerous and time-consuming. There was a significant financial incentive for maintaining certs, but I hit the salary cap with 3 languages, so there was nothing to be gained by certifying in more.
Aside from the really great people I got to work with, being able to earn a good living by doing something that I enjoyed and was actually good at was the very best part of my career. And it all happened because I decided to join the Air Force. I had studied French through middle school, high school, and college, but everything else happened because of the Air Force.
Yes, with languages, it's use it or lose it. I don't use my Russian much since my parents passed away, and the other day, I found myself struggling to remember the Russian word for "umbrella".
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Anne_in_VA
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Post by Anne_in_VA on Sept 24, 2017 13:43:41 GMT -5
I have the same problem remembering my French. I haven't used it in so long, I can only pick out some words now. I think I'll take a Spanish class when I get ready to retire, maybe brush up on my French. I used to work with someone who was originally from Paris and she said my French and accent were very good for an American.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Sept 24, 2017 15:11:04 GMT -5
When I was working, I maintained certifications in Russian, Chinese, and French. I specialized in translating scientific and technical material, so I didn't get much practice in speaking since I really never had to do it. I was never any good at speaking Chinese, probably because I was 42 when I learned it. Couldn't get the hang of hearing or reproducing the tones. Nowadays, I can only pick out isolated words and phrases in spoken Chines, though I can make myself understood at my favorite Chinese takeout spot when the lady with the reliable English isn't there, but that's only because I have looked up and practiced everything I might need to say. (Actually, now that I think of it, I haven't practiced in ages, so it is very likely that I couldn't even do that now).
I've been retired for 6 years, and my active vocabulary has largely faded now, I can still dredge up some Russian and French when I need to communicate with someone in the ER where I volunteer or with my neighbor's parents, who are Russian. I can still read Russian and French. I tried to read a Chinese newspaper the other day, but it was a hopeless cause as I didn't have a dictionary handy and couldn't remember many of the characters. It's like any other skill, it needs to be used or it just goes away.
I studied some other European languages, but I only maintained certifications in 3 since the testing and continuing education requirements to maintain the certs were pretty onerous and time-consuming. There was a significant financial incentive for maintaining certs, but I hit the salary cap with 3 languages, so there was nothing to be gained by certifying in more.
Aside from the really great people I got to work with, being able to earn a good living by doing something that I enjoyed and was actually good at was the very best part of my career. And it all happened because I decided to join the Air Force. I had studied French through middle school, high school, and college, but everything else happened because of the Air Force.
Yes, with languages, it's use it or lose it. I don't use my Russian much since my parents passed away, and the other day, I found myself struggling to remember the Russian word for "umbrella". Does it have any relation to parasol, by any chance?
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Sept 24, 2017 16:10:38 GMT -5
Oog.
I have received the results of my 23 & Me test and have learned that I have 319 Neanderthal variants, which they say is more Neanderthal variants than 96% of people tested to date. Apparently that translates into ~4% of my DNA, but still, it's pretty cool! And probably explains a lot.
The rest just reinforced known family history. Mostly British, Irish, and German, a little Scandinavian (probably from Vikings stravaging around Britain and Ireland), a little Native American, and a small amount of unidentified (space alien?).
Actually, I have no idea if Oog is a legitimate Neanderthal name. I'm sure some linguistics scholar has done his or her thesis on the probable sounds a Neanderthal palate was capable of forming, but I haven't read it. I think Oog is a fun pseudo Neanderthal word, so I'm sticking with it. You're multi-lingual, right? If memory serves me right, you speak several languages and used them in the course of your employment. So, are you going to add another one if it turns out Oog the Ancestor actually grunted, growled and bleated like, well, a Neanderthal? Or heck...just go find some dude living in a backwoods trailer driving a pickup truck with wheels bigger than his outhouse. Ask him a question and listen for the response. It will probably clue you in on what your ancestor sounded like.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Sept 24, 2017 16:18:29 GMT -5
Yes, with languages, it's use it or lose it. I don't use my Russian much since my parents passed away, and the other day, I found myself struggling to remember the Russian word for "umbrella". Does it have any relation to parasol, by any chance? No, although some words are similar in French and Russian, like nightmare, coat, pineapple, avant garde, bureau, etc. Umbrella is "zontik".
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 24, 2017 17:32:43 GMT -5
Oog.
I have received the results of my 23 & Me test and have learned that I have 319 Neanderthal variants, which they say is more Neanderthal variants than 96% of people tested to date. Apparently that translates into ~4% of my DNA, but still, it's pretty cool! And probably explains a lot.
The rest just reinforced known family history. Mostly British, Irish, and German, a little Scandinavian (probably from Vikings stravaging around Britain and Ireland), a little Native American, and a small amount of unidentified (space alien?).
Actually, I have no idea if Oog is a legitimate Neanderthal name. I'm sure some linguistics scholar has done his or her thesis on the probable sounds a Neanderthal palate was capable of forming, but I haven't read it. I think Oog is a fun pseudo Neanderthal word, so I'm sticking with it. You're multi-lingual, right? If memory serves me right, you speak several languages and used them in the course of your employment. So, are you going to add another one if it turns out Oog the Ancestor actually grunted, growled and bleated like, well, a Neanderthal? Or heck...just go find some dude living in a backwoods trailer driving a pickup truck with wheels bigger than his outhouse. Ask him a question and listen for the response. It will probably clue you in on what your ancestor sounded like.
That's an interesting idea, Nancy. However, I have always considered it a measure of good sense to avoid venturing into any environment where the primary impression is that one could begin to hear the music from "Deliverance" at any moment.
I might venture into perusing scholarly publications on the putative characteristics of Neanderthal language, which would present perils of its own, scholarly publications being what they are, but that's probably as adventurous as I will likely choose to be at this point in my life.
Given the choice, I believe I would rather encounter an actual Oog (as long as I could stay upwind from him/her).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2017 18:26:18 GMT -5
I am thinking Ooga would be the feminine version of Oog? Only if the Neanderthal language included gender markers. Since no one speaks Neanderthal anymore, we don't know whether it had gender markers. Gender markers likely begin to be codified in a language when the culture has developed differentiated gender roles. It is possible that very early humans might not have had strict gender roles. Existence was quite precarious and probably required that everyone be able to pitch in to do anything and everything just to keep from starving or being eaten by cave bears or saber tooth tigers. Also, if Neanderthal did actually have gender markers, we don't know what they were. Maybe female names all ended in "O" or "Y" sounds or chirps or squirrel noises. Or female names might, indeed, have ended in "A", but who knows? It could have been anything. We cannot necessarily establish the existence of a characteristic of an ancient protolanguage on the basis of the characteristics of a few modern languages as the etymology may not track.
Anyway, Ooga isn't as much fun to say as Oog.
I'm sticking with Oog.
It's true that we don't know what the linguistic markers would be. But I am certain that there were always differentiated gender roles from Day 1. It's a little crude, but she has a hole, and he has something to fill it. She has the baby and has to nurture it (breast feeding), and so he has to take care of her. I doubt Neanderthal Woman was a feminist and did it all. Silly sidenote: I have a plot outline for a book called Neanderthal Girl. I am going to write it one day.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Sept 25, 2017 21:45:10 GMT -5
Oog.
I have received the results of my 23 & Me test and have learned that I have 319 Neanderthal variants, which they say is more Neanderthal variants than 96% of people tested to date. Apparently that translates into ~4% of my DNA, but still, it's pretty cool! And probably explains a lot.
The rest just reinforced known family history. Mostly British, Irish, and German, a little Scandinavian (probably from Vikings stravaging around Britain and Ireland), a little Native American, and a small amount of unidentified (space alien?).
Very cool, Dannylion. DD1 shared her 23 & Me report with me, and it's interesting the way the different regional ancestral DNA is scattered around the chromosomes. I'm curious where the Neanderthal is located, in just one segment, or distributed (not that I'd know what it means, of course). DD1 had one tiny speck of Asian (orange) in a sea of shades of blue-European.
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