Time to start thinking about college

[alabamagal]

Oct 27, 2017 8:34:21 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Anyone here have kids that did dual enrollment (PSEO)?  I'm beginning to see one of the drawbacks of our private high school choice.  They only allow PSEO classes to be taken on a part-time basis as ALL required high school courses must be taken.  While the area public schools allow you to basically just go to college full-time and get high school credit for it.  Broken foot friend just sent his stepson off to college this fall with 47 credits already.  He's already a sophomore and the entire first year of credits were free.  You don't even have to buy books.   Seems like a great way to cut 25% off the college bill. 

I have known some kids who have done that and got through school in less than 4 years.  A lot of it depends on the major and how the college program is structured.  For programs like engineering, there is typically a set of engineering classes that must be taken in a structured order, and having some credits really doesn't help all that much, other than to lighten your course load.  It may help non-STEM majors more than STEM.

My DD was able to finish a semester early with one dual enrollment class and 2 AP class credits (Biology major).  My boys both had some credits starting college, but it took them longer due to changing majors/changing schools/double majors.

That said, I don't think there is anything bad about the dual enrollment program, especially if it is free!

[Deleted]

Oct 27, 2017 10:33:21 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

Oct 27, 2017 8:34:21 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Anyone here have kids that did dual enrollment (PSEO)?  I'm beginning to see one of the drawbacks of our private high school choice.  They only allow PSEO classes to be taken on a part-time basis as ALL required high school courses must be taken.  While the area public schools allow you to basically just go to college full-time and get high school credit for it.  Broken foot friend just sent his stepson off to college this fall with 47 credits already.  He's already a sophomore and the entire first year of credits were free.  You don't even have to buy books.   Seems like a great way to cut 25% off the college bill. 

I have known some kids who have done that and got through school in less than 4 years.  A lot of it depends on the major and how the college program is structured.  For programs like engineering, there is typically a set of engineering classes that must be taken in a structured order, and having some credits really doesn't help all that much, other than to lighten your course load.  It may help non-STEM majors more than STEM.

My DD was able to finish a semester early with one dual enrollment class and 2 AP class credits (Biology major).  My boys both had some credits starting college, but it took them longer due to changing majors/changing schools/double majors.

That said, I don't think there is anything bad about the dual enrollment program, especially if it is free!

Yeah, you're right.  If DS goes into Engineering it really wouldn't help him finish early because they are required to take a heavier load just to finish in 4 and the tuition is the same if you take 12 credits up to 18 or 19 a semester so it's not saving tuition either.  It might help in him keeping his sanity if those gen eds are out of the way though.

Broken foot friend's son was going into Psychology.  They said if he goes summers he could finish in 2 years. 

I did look into it for him next year as a junior to just take a class or two maybe but it probably isn't an option anyhow.  The public university requires a 3.77 GPA for admittance to PSEO as a Jr. which he doesn't have, and while the private college only requires a 3.50 GPA which he would meet, they limit to 25 students a year and it's a competitive admission process, so in reality you probably need a lot higher than that.  The GPA requirement for the public university drops to 3.5 as a senior so maybe his final year when there are only a few required high school classes anyhow.

Otherwise we might just need to focus on AP and PACC courses Jr. and Sr. year. 

[alabamagal]

AP classes are pretty tough to get credit.  The students have to be super motivated to study for the test, because it is all about the one test.  None of my kids were super motivated in high school.  They got good grades, but school was pretty easy for them.  My first 2 kids took AP English and got an A in the class by got a 2 on the exam.  When my youngest was in 11th grade, the school switched over to a dual enrollment system and it was taught by the same teacher that previously did AP English.  I asked the teacher if the class was any different and she said it was pretty much the same.  So youngest got to take it as Dual Enrollment and got an A and didn't have to take the AP Exam.

My son the actuary only got a 3 on the Calculus AP Exam, so he took Calculus first year in college.  Sometime in his first year, he realized he was really good at math and was much more motivated and got all A's from that point on.

[milee]

Woke up thinking about the irony that artificial intelligence (AI) is most likely to be developed by people that will have no concept of the potential social implications.  Scary.

DS is one of those kids who has huge imbalances in their intelligence types and levels.  At 12 or 13, he was unhappy that the image of a car in a computer program (taught himself to program) he was writing didn't navigate turns smoothly; he didn't have enough mathematical background to program a smooth radius turn.  So he taught himself enough calculus to enable his program to do what he wanted it to do.  Last Christmas he became interested in how to use algorithms to suggest investing strategies - what quants do for investing firms - and asked for some weird books, many of them foreign, on various advanced math concepts he'd need to make models to test.  From this collection of odd books (worst Christmas gift ever IMO) he taught himself enough stochastic calculus to write some of the investing algorithms he's been interested in and is currently doing that for an investment firm.  In other words, he has a history of being able to grasp and use advanced concepts.

On the other hand, basics of human interaction often elude him.  He's not quite as outrageous as Sheldon in the Big Bang Theory, but has similar imbalances of being intelligent enough from a mathematical standpoint to be a leading theoretical physicist but simultaneously not having enough emotional intelligence to navigate simple human interactions.

But Sheldon and my son are the exact types of people who have the greatest chance of developing AI.  DS has been talking about a phD in AI or similar concepts because he believes that will be the future of how quants develop investing strategies.

As a parent, I'm glad that he might not be living in my basement and is excited about work that will probably keep him gainfully employed.  But as a human being, I'm terrified that someone who struggles so much with empathy will be the person who develops AI systems.  I woke up in a panic thinking about the Terminator movies.  Stress.  I think I just need this college app thing to be over.  

[tractor]

Welcome to the future

[Deleted]

Daughter made honor roll first marking period, missed distinguished by a point and said now that she knows that is a thing... 

But... she isn’t being challenged at all. Helping her pick classes, I was thinking, wow big adjustment, don’t go too hard when there is sooo much new to learn about. But she’s made the switch easily. But then maybe it’s easy because the academics aren’t really a factor.

and I think going to school was a social/fun thing ... she chose classes she was interested in and not a ‘program’ or even a grade level, because she took what fit into what she hadn’t done and wanted to do. 

Im not sure how much this might limit her though? I mean she can do some harder things next year, but by senior year if you are going traditional, things are basically set already. 

The only real thing I wish I’d done differently is Bio. I think they have 3 levels of bio and while I was thinking Bio would be regular and honors and AP harder, I think Bio is actually like ordering a small when the grande is regular? It seems easy. PA tests in bio... so it has to be considered rigorous enough to pull proficient? But I’m thinking it’s just teaching the test? 

She doesnt want to stem though from what I can tell? She wants a Theater/interpreter/accounting degree? 

[tractor]

Oct 31, 2017 4:21:44 GMT -5 milee said:

Woke up thinking about the irony that artificial intelligence (AI) is most likely to be developed by people that will have no concept of the potential social implications.  Scary.

DS is one of those kids who has huge imbalances in their intelligence types and levels.  At 12 or 13, he was unhappy that the image of a car in a computer program (taught himself to program) he was writing didn't navigate turns smoothly; he didn't have enough mathematical background to program a smooth radius turn.  So he taught himself enough calculus to enable his program to do what he wanted it to do.  Last Christmas he became interested in how to use algorithms to suggest investing strategies - what quants do for investing firms - and asked for some weird books, many of them foreign, on various advanced math concepts he'd need to make models to test.  From this collection of odd books (worst Christmas gift ever IMO) he taught himself enough stochastic calculus to write some of the investing algorithms he's been interested in and is currently doing that for an investment firm.  In other words, he has a history of being able to grasp and use advanced concepts.

On the other hand, basics of human interaction often elude him.  He's not quite as outrageous as Sheldon in the Big Bang Theory, but has similar imbalances of being intelligent enough from a mathematical standpoint to be a leading theoretical physicist but simultaneously not having enough emotional intelligence to navigate simple human interactions.

But Sheldon and my son are the exact types of people who have the greatest chance of developing AI.  DS has been talking about a phD in AI or similar concepts because he believes that will be the future of how quants develop investing strategies.

As a parent, I'm glad that he might not be living in my basement and is excited about work that will probably keep him gainfully employed.  But as a human being, I'm terrified that someone who struggles so much with empathy will be the person who develops AI systems.  I woke up in a panic thinking about the Terminator movies.  Stress.  I think I just need this college app thing to be over.  

Our only hope is that ultra intelligent kids like yours can interact with moderately smart kids like mine as they plot to overtake the world, with some compassion 😬

[Deleted]

I’m relistening to Enders Game. It’s one of my favorites, but I’m especially drawn to the Peter parts this time, and his plotting from age 12 to rule the world... ‘The world is always a democracy in times of flux and the man with the best voice will win.’

[MJ2.0]

Oct 31, 2017 7:25:57 GMT -5 oped said:

Daughter made honor roll first marking period, missed distinguished by a point and said now that she knows that is a thing... 

But... she isn’t being challenged at all. Helping her pick classes, I was thinking, wow big adjustment, don’t go too hard when there is sooo much new to learn about. But she’s made the switch easily. But then maybe it’s easy because the academics aren’t really a factor.

and I think going to school was a social/fun thing ... she chose classes she was interested in and not a ‘program’ or even a grade level, because she took what fit into what she hadn’t done and wanted to do. 

Im not sure how much this might limit her though? I mean she can do some harder things next year, but by senior year if you are going traditional, things are basically set already. 

The only real thing I wish I’d done differently is Bio. I think they have 3 levels of bio and while I was thinking Bio would be regular and honors and AP harder, I think Bio is actually like ordering a small when the grande is regular? It seems easy. PA tests in bio... so it has to be considered rigorous enough to pull proficient? But I’m thinking it’s just teaching the test? 

She doesnt want to stem though from what I can tell? She wants a Theater/interpreter/accounting degree? 

becoming proficient in a foreign language - especially Chinese or Arabic - will help her no matter what she does.

[milee]

Schools in your area may be very different than schools here, but by the time you're in high school here there is no way you'd be able to take courses that would get you close to proficient in any language if you're just starting at that point.   The language courses just don't progress that quickly.  Both my boys have been taking "Chinese" (using the term loosely since there are many dialects, but generally Americans are referring to Mandarin) at school since 4th grade.  It's a slowwwww process... with all the characters to learn it would be really tough to become proficient in just a few years in the normal school system.  No idea if Arabic is faster, since our school stopped offering it and the boys weren't interested anyways., but maybe?

[Deleted]

My son has been learning Mandarin since he was 7 and his Dad married a woman from Shanghai.  He sucks at it.  His half brother and sister are quite proficient at both Mandarin and English at ages 3 and 5.  They'll have it made. 

[MJ2.0]

I'm thinking she'd also major in that language in college.

[milee]

Oct 31, 2017 7:25:57 GMT -5 oped said:

Daughter made honor roll first marking period, missed distinguished by a point and said now that she knows that is a thing... 

But... she isn’t being challenged at all. Helping her pick classes, I was thinking, wow big adjustment, don’t go too hard when there is sooo much new to learn about. But she’s made the switch easily. But then maybe it’s easy because the academics aren’t really a factor.

and I think going to school was a social/fun thing ... she chose classes she was interested in and not a ‘program’ or even a grade level, because she took what fit into what she hadn’t done and wanted to do. 

Im not sure how much this might limit her though? I mean she can do some harder things next year, but by senior year if you are going traditional, things are basically set already. 

The only real thing I wish I’d done differently is Bio. I think they have 3 levels of bio and while I was thinking Bio would be regular and honors and AP harder, I think Bio is actually like ordering a small when the grande is regular? It seems easy. PA tests in bio... so it has to be considered rigorous enough to pull proficient? But I’m thinking it’s just teaching the test? 

She doesnt want to stem though from what I can tell? She wants a Theater/interpreter/accounting degree? 

Maybe it doesn't translate directly because she is entering with credits from homeschooling, but what "grade" is she in high school?  In other words, how many years does she have left at the traditional high school?  Is it a school that offers plenty of advanced courses?

Also, I'm sure you know and are on top of this, but if she wants to go to one of the selective colleges, they have preferences that are often more advanced than what most states require to graduate from high school.  Florida's language requirement is a good example since MJ brought up languages.  Don't remember the exact FL requirement, but think it's something like you only need 2 years of a foreign language to get a FL high school diploma, yet most selective colleges want to see 4 years or demonstrated proficiency (again, paraphrasing example, probably not exact.)  

[Deleted]

She’s a junior. She had 2years of Latin, mostly as vocab and structure development. She is in French 2 right now. Doing immersion summers she’ll be in 4 next year and France or sone other French speaking country the summer after graduation.

She also has a baseline in ASL and will likely do that more.

Honestly, her dream job would probably be keeping the books for a theater company and asl big the show or something like that.

I’m sure there would need to be further language study. I’m not an everything by 18 kind of person. I doubt she’ll go high powered school? Concordia offers the summer programs? Im not sure what their normal language programs are like? I guess I have some research... to assign

[Deleted]

The school offers plenty of advanced courses, she just isn’t currently taking them only one year left... I think she might next year.

[giramomma]

Does her HS have an internship program? If she has a little extra time her senior year, that might be something to look into.

Does the school offer any business classes. Our HS offered a basic accounting class....

What about FBLA or J/A

DS wants to be a small business owner (although it's for vintage toys/game shop..I know...I know....But I know it won't stick. I wanted to be a pediatrician or OT at his age.) Though, his freshman year, we are only suggesting he take an Honors course in something he enjoys (history). The rest, just take normal classes and get your feet wet.

We hope he joins FBLA or JA or whatever. And maybe gets enough courses in that he can do an internship for part of senior year.

[Deleted]

I'm not sure about internships. She is taking accounting now and loves it. She only has 6 in her class, and is easily tops apparently. The only Accounting 2 kid is in there with them, and he moves at his own pace, so i'm guessing if she wants another year, she can do it pretty much like self paced guided study, and so should be able to quite a bit if she wants to...


She's a youngish kid with a late June birthday... so i'm guessing if she takes a year after high school but before college to intern she could if she wanted? Again, I guess I always assumed non traditional college approach, the idea of a traditional approach is suddenly, and probably too late, throwing me for a loop  

[giramomma]

Oct 31, 2017 14:11:02 GMT -5 oped said:

I'm not sure about internships. She is taking accounting now and loves it. She only has 6 in her class, and is easily tops apparently. The only Accounting 2 kid is in there with them, and he moves at his own pace, so i'm guessing if she wants another year, she can do it pretty much like self paced guided study, and so should be able to quite a bit if she wants to...


She's a youngish kid with a late June birthday... so i'm guessing if she takes a year after high school but before college to intern she could if she wanted? Again, I guess I always assumed non traditional college approach, the idea of a traditional approach is suddenly, and probably too late, throwing me for a loop  

I'm betting she could.

While not quite the same..DH had a roommate that got his undergrad in 3 years, and then took a year to work as an errand boy at a law firm while studying for his LSAT.

Does your school system allow for dual enrollment? I'm wondering if she might be able to take a course or to at a technical college (mine offers 2 year accounting degrees completely online)...her senior year. That might open up some intern opportunities for her as well.

[cyanne]

Oct 27, 2017 8:34:21 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Anyone here have kids that did dual enrollment (PSEO)?  I'm beginning to see one of the drawbacks of our private high school choice.  They only allow PSEO classes to be taken on a part-time basis as ALL required high school courses must be taken.  While the area public schools allow you to basically just go to college full-time and get high school credit for it.  Broken foot friend just sent his stepson off to college this fall with 47 credits already.  He's already a sophomore and the entire first year of credits were free.  You don't even have to buy books.   Seems like a great way to cut 25% off the college bill. 

My son did it. He went to the U of MN with almost two years of credit completed while doing PSEO at community college. He graduated from the U at age 20 saving us almost two years of tuition, room and board and books!!!

[tractor]

So far so good, four applications with three acceptances. The fourth one should make a decision by the end of next week. Now we’re only left to decide which one makes the most sense for him to attend.

[milee]

Either my son has secretly been reading the board and stumbled on that random post about that one college I thought was worth the full price and would pay for... or the Universe has decided to give me one of those "be careful what you wish for" lessons, but...

DS just got into his first choice college - UChicago.

The good news is - it's a perfect fit for him and also what he wants to do.
The bad news is - I will probably have to sell a kidney to pay for it.  

[chapeau]

Dec 18, 2017 18:16:30 GMT -5 milee said:

Either my son has secretly been reading the board and stumbled on that random post about that one college I thought was worth the full price and would pay for... or the Universe has decided to give me one of those "be careful what you wish for" lessons, but...

DS just got into his first choice college - UChicago.

The good news is - it's a perfect fit for him and also what he wants to do.
The bad news is - I will probably have to sell a kidney to pay for it.  

Congratulations!?!

Based on your descriptions of your son, I suspect he developed an algorithm that predicted your feelings about UChicago. Or he’s lurking. 🤫

[Deleted]

Dec 18, 2017 18:16:30 GMT -5 milee said:

Either my son has secretly been reading the board and stumbled on that random post about that one college I thought was worth the full price and would pay for... or the Universe has decided to give me one of those "be careful what you wish for" lessons, but...

DS just got into his first choice college - UChicago.

The good news is - it's a perfect fit for him and also what he wants to do.
The bad news is - I will probably have to sell a kidney to pay for it.  

Awwww....I was hoping he'd be a Gopher!

[milee]

Dec 18, 2017 20:11:47 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Dec 18, 2017 18:16:30 GMT -5 milee said:

Either my son has secretly been reading the board and stumbled on that random post about that one college I thought was worth the full price and would pay for... or the Universe has decided to give me one of those "be careful what you wish for" lessons, but...

DS just got into his first choice college - UChicago.

The good news is - it's a perfect fit for him and also what he wants to do.
The bad news is - I will probably have to sell a kidney to pay for it.  

Awwww....I was hoping he'd be a Gopher!

      Me, too. 

[dee27]

Dec 18, 2017 18:16:30 GMT -5 milee said:

Either my son has secretly been reading the board and stumbled on that random post about that one college I thought was worth the full price and would pay for... or the Universe has decided to give me one of those "be careful what you wish for" lessons, but...

DS just got into his first choice college - UChicago.

The good news is - it's a perfect fit for him and also what he wants to do.
The bad news is - I will probably have to sell a kidney to pay for it.  

Congrats to your son!

[milee]

tractor
Annie7
And anyone else with graduating high school seniors applying to college...

It's close to final decision time.  What were the final results and where are your kids going?  Are we all selling kidneys or did your kids get some good $$$? 

[Annie7]

Milee,

Thanks for thinking of me. DS2 did early decision to Duke and got in. So, he's going there. Absolutely no $ received

They have a payment plan where you can pay in 5 month installments for each semester. I'm going to sign up for that. This way I can cut up my kidney in pieces rather than sell the entire thing

Congrats on your son getting into UChicago.

[Deleted]

Apr 11, 2018 8:04:26 GMT -5 Annie7 said:

Milee,

Thanks for thinking of me. DS2 did early decision to Duke and got in. So, he's going there. Absolutely no $ received

They have a payment plan where you can pay in 5 month installments for each semester. I'm going to sign up for that. This way I can cut up my kidney in pieces rather than sell the entire thing

Congrats on your son getting into UChicago.

No FA to Duke?  As in you're on the hook for then entire 70K/year?  Ouch. 

[Annie7]

MPL,

Unfortunately yes - on the hook for the entire 75K/year. DS1 went to Princeton and he was given nearly 20K/year in FA. They have a very good aid system. So, it's going to be an adjustment to shell out this much now for DS2.

Oh well, we'll deal with it hopefully. Our parents paid for our education even if it was not in this country/much cheaper. I want to pay it forward.

DS1 did good in college. He did not just party around because he had no financial skin in the game. He worked hard, took every opportunity provided and is now working at one of the top companies in the world. He is financially independent and living with friends in Manhattan. So, I don't believe that not having skin in the game will cause the student to go awry. It's all a matter of knowing your kid and what they've learnt from our teachings of value. Each kid is different. So what worked for DS1 might not work for DS2 or other kids.

DS2 is aware of the enormity of this. Some of his friends are constrained by money while making a decision about college. So he knows he's fortunate to not have to worry about that. He had asked me before he applied ED whether we were ok with paying. So, I am hoping he will not squander this gift.

But rice and beans for the next 4 years here

[tractor]

Thanks for bringing this back up. After being accepted to four universities, and denied by his first choice (Michigan), he’s decided on Michigan Tech. As it turned out, it was the last school he applied to, last school he visited, and first school he really fell in love with when we were there. Fortunately, they were also the one school that offered the best aid.

All said and done, it will cost us @ $12,000/year for him to attend (at least in the short term). It’s a great school, I’m happy with his choice, and he is to. Let the adventure begin.