Cheating? Okay. Lying? Okay. Calling an escort? GTFO.

[beergut]

 I know only some of y'all follow college football, but an interesting situation has developed in Oxford, MS at the University of Mississippi.

 Head football coach Hugh Freeze resigned yesterday, and didn't receive a settlement or the rest of his salary. The athletic director said that if Freeze had not been fired, he would have been fired for moral turpitude. 

 What makes this interesting is that Mississippi has been blatantly cheating in recruiting for years, and everyone knows it. One of their star players, Laremy Tunsil, even admitted to it in an interview after the 2016 NFL Draft. 

The NCAA has been investigating Mississippi the whole time Freeze has been in Oxford, but the administration has stood by him. Getting busted for cheating apparently didn't matter as long as he kept winning. Freeze openly lied about the cheating going on, and yet the administration continued to support him. 

 A former Mississippi head coach, Houston Nutt, has sued the athletic department and current coaches for engaging in a smear campaign against him, claiming the NCAA allegations are from his tenure prior to Freeze's arrival in Oxford. As part of the lawsuit, Nutt's lawyers received all of Freeze's telephone records from his university-issued telephone. Nutt's lawyers found a one-minute call to an escort service, which Freeze claims is a misdial. 

The athletic department then went through all of Freeze's phone records, and said they found a 'continued pattern of behavior' that is unacceptable, and demanded Freeze's resignation. Reading between the lines, they found more evidence of him calling escort services. Apparently he was dumb enough constantly do this on a university issued phone. 

The administration is trying to keep it quiet in return for Freeze leaving without demanding any financial obligations, which I'm sure Freeze's wife and family appreciates. 

I just find the mindset of the administration a little mind-boggling. Breaking the rules and blatantly cheating? That's okay. Lying about that cheating? That's okay. He beat Alabama twice, what's a little NCAA shenanigans? But call an escort? GTFO. 

I'm sure the administration is happy they found an excuse to fire Freeze and get out of paying him anything left on his contract, but the optics of the whole situation are bad. 

You have to feel sorry for his wife Jill and their kids, though. 

[alabamagal]

I think the escort call just was easy enough to prove.  The evidence just kept mounting on the other stuff.  Plus he is sanctimonious POS liar (and no I am not an Alabama fan, not even and SEC fan).  

Wife and kids will just have to deal with it, along with his loss of $5 million salary.

Between this guy and the former governor of Alabama, it is apparent that men around here have not learned their less on phone records, and havenot quite figured out what a burner phone of for!

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

I saw that yesterday. It's flabbergasting to me what college sports have become because of television and the pursuit of championships. 
Our D1 (PAC-12) college (that we root for and I attended for one of my degrees) cut a football player the other day because of a DUII. It's a new coach and people seem pleased that he's keeping the team on a short leash. We follow most of the sports--football, volleyball, both basketballs, baseball & softball, and the various running teams; obviously football is the biggest nationally. I'm okay with high standards being equally applied. 

[Green Eyed Lady]

Wouldn't firing him for cheating, etc., result in sanctions for the team? Maybe they waited to fire him for something that wouldn't result in penalties for the team or school.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Making a to-do and firing him over hiring an escort turns the attention away from the university and the team.   They are hoping people will be distracted by what the left hand is doing.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jul 21, 2017 12:07:58 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Wouldn't firing him for cheating, etc., result in sanctions for the team? Maybe they waited to fire him for something that wouldn't result in penalties for the team or school.

It did for KY.

[hoops902]

Jul 21, 2017 12:07:58 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Wouldn't firing him for cheating, etc., result in sanctions for the team? Maybe they waited to fire him for something that wouldn't result in penalties for the team or school.

It would, though a lot of schools try to "self sanction" in hopes they will avoid harsher penalties by the NCAA.

The reality is that it's hard to fire someone for cheating without actual proof that someone cheated. You don't self-sanction because of rumors and gossip. You'd have to launch an all-out investigation first.

[alabamagal]

Jul 21, 2017 13:08:49 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

Jul 21, 2017 12:07:58 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Wouldn't firing him for cheating, etc., result in sanctions for the team? Maybe they waited to fire him for something that wouldn't result in penalties for the team or school.

It would, though a lot of schools try to "self sanction" in hopes they will avoid harsher penalties by the NCAA.

The reality is that it's hard to fire someone for cheating without actual proof that someone cheated. You don't self-sanction because of rumors and gossip. You'd have to launch an all-out investigation first.

Cheating is hard to prove.  Calling an escort service is pretty easy to prove.  I heard at first he claimed it was a wrong number .

[zibazinski]

Totally ridiculous. So what if he did?

[dannylion]

Well, that makes sense. Associating with an escort is clearly the worst possible transgression. It could lead to dancing!

Cheating and lying? Probably not much danger of dancing happening there.

[For those who are too young to remember, there are several versions of how "it could lead to dancing" became a thing, but my (decades old) recollection is that a person from a very conservative community where dancing was prohibited was asked in an interview why she objected to premarital sex.  Her response was that "it could lead to dancing," because apparently the community was so fixated on the evils of dancing that it superseded premarital sex in their minds as a sinful activity.  The story is almost certainly aprocryphal.]

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Cheating = NCAA recruiting violations

It is easier to fire someone for something that doesn't touch NCAA recruiting violations in order for the whole program not to be penalized.  Had they fired him for cheating on the NCAA violations, the program would be paying the penalty for the next few years.

[alabamagal]

Jul 21, 2017 15:08:15 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Cheating = NCAA recruiting violations

It is easier to fire someone for something that doesn't touch NCAA recruiting violations in order for the whole program not to be penalized.  Had they fired him for cheating on the NCAA violations, the program would be paying the penalty for the next few years.

Well technically he quit.

I'm sure it was "If you don't quit, we will fire you" kind of deals.

[beergut]

Jul 21, 2017 15:08:15 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Cheating = NCAA recruiting violations

It is easier to fire someone for something that doesn't touch NCAA recruiting violations in order for the whole program not to be penalized.  Had they fired him for cheating on the NCAA violations, the program would be paying the penalty for the next few years.

They have already self-sanctioned for NCAA violations, barring themselves from a postseason bowl this coming season. They've already admitted to committing NCAA violations, and couldn't hide it since a former player openly admitted to taking money on the day of the 2016 NFL Draft.

The morals clause in coaches contracts these days allows for a coach to be fired for cause if he is found guilty of violating NCAA rules. Mississippi could have fired Freeze for that.

I suspect the failure to use a burner phone to handle his private business was really the last straw. Boosters who make arrangements to pay players aren't going to trust someone who isn't smart enough to use a burner phone to handle extra-legal affairs.

[giramomma]

Jul 21, 2017 14:22:48 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Totally ridiculous. So what if he did?

Well...I dunno. At least here at the university, using state property to obtain sexual gratification is generally a big no-no and gets you fired.

I'd pretty much assume that that's a no-no all around, in general, even in the private sector.

At this point, we also don't know if he used any university funds to pay for said escort....even if it was just for her dinner..

We had a very popular basketball coach at our state flagship. Right after he left, it was confirmed that he had fairly lengthy affair and brought the woman with him on several recruiting trips. He was found of no wrong doing. But that stuff costs money to investigate. Then the woman decided to sue our institution. More costs incurred..

My comparative lit professor was arrested for posing as a minor and soliciting one. He used his work computer to send out naked pictures of himself and other men. I know this was a bigger issue, because of the solicitation of a child..but, still. It's a no-no to send out naked pictures of yourself using work technology.

[beergut]

Jul 21, 2017 14:22:48 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Totally ridiculous. So what if he did?

 Prostitution is illegal in Mississippi.

 Using your university-issued phone to break the law is not only reckless, it's unbelievably stupid. 

[beergut]

Jul 21, 2017 18:28:05 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Jul 21, 2017 14:22:48 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Totally ridiculous. So what if he did?

Well...I dunno. At least here at the university, using state property to obtain sexual gratification is generally a big no-no and gets you fired.

I'd pretty much assume that that's a no-no all around, in general, even in the private sector.

At this point, we also don't know if he used any university funds to pay for said escort....even if it was just for her dinner..

We had a very popular basketball coach at our state flagship. Right after he left, it was confirmed that he had fairly lengthy affair and brought the woman with him on several recruiting trips. He was found of no wrong doing. But that stuff costs money to investigate. Then the woman decided to sue our institution. More costs incurred..

My comparative lit professor was arrested for posing as a minor and soliciting one. He used his work computer to send out naked pictures of himself and other men. I know this was a bigger issue, because of the solicitation of a child..but, still. It's a no-no to send out naked pictures of yourself using work technology.

 Often the potential liability created by the crime is a bigger issue than the crime itself.

 Take Bobby Petrino at Arkansas. He cheated on his wife, and was caught after a motorcycle they were riding on crashed. He lied to the athletic director about the affair, which is officially why he was fired. A bigger deal, though, is that he had arranged for his mistress to get a job in the athletic department. If she had ever been fired, she could sue him and the university for sexual harassment. Petrino's actions involving his mistress opened the university up to liability, so he was going to be fired even if he told the athletic director the truth about the affair. 

As far as Freeze goes, hanging out with prostitutes is a threat to his marriage, not to mention his job status. Imagine if someone had that information, and used it to blackmail him into shaving points on one football game so they could control the point spread. After doing that for one game, they own him, and can use him to manipulate spreads whenever they want. 

The potential for a liability is one of the big reasons an athletic department has to fire a coach when they find an issue like prostitution, because it makes the whole program vulnerable. 

[zibazinski]

Escort service can be a euphemism for prostitution. I know women that hire male escorts for events where they don't wish to appear alone like weddings where their ex husband brings his new hot wife or girlfriend.

[giramomma]

Jul 23, 2017 6:29:28 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Escort service can be a euphemism for prostitution. I know women that hire male escorts for events where they don't wish to appear alone like weddings where their ex husband brings his new hot wife or girlfriend.

Married women (to include separated but not yet divorced women?)

Dude was married.

I did a little reading on-line. Someone reported that the number for the escort service was a detroit number that was linked to a Florida escort service. I'm guessing he wasn't looking for stand in at high level events because his wife was feeling ill.

But I also don't know what high powered people do in such situations where they are expected to have a +1 and their spouse isn't that +1.

[beergut]

Jul 23, 2017 7:55:11 GMT -5 giramomma said:

Jul 23, 2017 6:29:28 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Escort service can be a euphemism for prostitution. I know women that hire male escorts for events where they don't wish to appear alone like weddings where their ex husband brings his new hot wife or girlfriend.

Married women (to include separated but not yet divorced women?)

Dude was married.

I did a little reading on-line. Someone reported that the number for the escort service was a detroit number that was linked to a Florida escort service. I'm guessing he wasn't looking for stand in at high level events because his wife was feeling ill.

But I also don't know what high powered people do in such situations where they are expected to have a +1 and their spouse isn't that +1.

 I am continually amazed at how people attempt to rationalize what he did. He wasn't looking for a +1 for a party, he was looking for some strange. 

He was a football coach, there was no social stigma to him showing up alone to parties. 

[zibazinski]

People cheat. You think his wife was clueless? This has nothing to do with anything but it's a good excuse to get rid of him.

[Artemis Windsong]

I overheard this in an amateur sport setting.  I don't care what he does as long as he keeps helping us.  That from a teacher who are held to a higher standard.  No morality clause in the club.

[hoops902]

Jul 23, 2017 10:13:15 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

People cheat. You think his wife was clueless? This has nothing to do with anything but it's a good excuse to get rid of him.

I'm not sure using your university-issued equipment to break the law is an "excuse" (specifically, the law, not some NCAA rule...the law). They've been trying to find every reason in the world NOT to fire him. If they wanted an excuse they would have just dumped him when the NCAA investigation started.