Îts áll about the jobs; Detroit population decreas

[Opti]

TRAVERSE CITY, Mich. — Hammered by the auto industry's slump, Detroit saw its population plummet 25 percent over the past decade, according to census data released Tuesday that reflects the severity of an economic downturn in the only state whose population declined since 2000.

The statistics show that the Motor City's population fell to 713,777 in 2010, compared to 951,270 in 2000. Although a significant drop was expected, state demographer Ken Darga said the number is "considerably lower" than the Census Bureau's estimate last year.


.."That's just incredible," added Kurt Metzger, a demographer with a Data Driven Detroit, a nonprofit that collects statistics used by area planners. "It's certainly the largest population loss percentage-wise that we've ever had in this city."

Detroit's population peaked at 1.8 million in 1950, when it ranked fifth nationally.

Read more at: www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42220834/ns/us_news-life/?GT1=43001

Wonder if PBP will notice this as he appears to blame population decreases on democratic politicians. Its interesting to me that the population peaked in 1950. I would have thought it would be later like the 60's or 70's when
American cars were still king.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

Heavily unionized industry like autos, steel, etc. and the regions and cities where these industries used to be are all in shambles.
These are typically lean heavily to the left.
It is not just rust belt regions that are losing population, states like NY, NJ, CA, etc. all heavy democratic strongholds are also experiencing flight.

[Opti]

I agree Detroit is hurting in part due to the union workforce factor. But I also think the product line, i.e. none of the big three really have a segment killer like the Toyota Camry or Honda Accord in the passenger car segment.
That part of the problem has to do with top management and the designers not giving the American vehicle public what they want. Another part of course is due to the credit collapse which fueled the buy a new car always frenzy which killed off many dealers including the third biggest which I believe was based in Florida.

In this case the politics IMHO is a side note as the union contracts are mostly governed by the car companies and the unions not state or local officials.

[Opti]

More tidbits from the article:
"The census figures clearly show how crucial it is to reinvent Michigan," Gov. Rick Snyder said. "It is time for all of us to realign our expectations so that they reflect today's realities. We cannot cling to the old ways of doing business."

That marks Michigan's first drop in black residents since statehood, and a historically significant change for a state that was long a magnet for blacks leaving the South to escape discrimination and seek jobs, said William Frey, a Brookings Institution demographer.

It's also a trend elsewhere, Frey told NBC News.

"When we look at the cities that have the highest concentrations of African Americans, more than half of them are showing declines in the populations of those African Americans," Frey said.

[phil5185]

I agree Detroit is hurting in part due to the union workforce factor. But I also think the product line, i.e. none of the big three really have a segment killer like the Toyota Camry or Honda Accord in the passenger car segment.
That part of the problem has to do with top management and the designers not giving the American vehicle public what they want.

The common denominator is the Union - a high population of unskilled workers that draw near-double pay. Management tries to find ways to keep the company alive in that adversarial environment - move production to MX, buy parts offshore, avoid auto design changes, etc. Management cannot keep the company profitable under the constraints of double pay, pay for labor-pools of closed factories, etc.
Most other industries - steel, cement, machining, castings - have progressed. Either moved off shore, out of state, became non-union.
Auto Labor (and Detroit) will need to shift with the times - or live with the result.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

It is also interesting because the University of Michigan is one of the top universities in the US. Many of their programs are amongst the top rated....
With that much brain power in the state, one would think the state would be flourishing in R&D and other high end fields.(eta)

[lisaa]

Mar 23, 2011 13:23:12 GMT -5 Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ said:

It is also interesting because the University of Michigan is one of the top universities in the US. Many of their programs are amongst the top rated....
With that much brain power in the state, one would think the state would be flourishing in R&D and other high end fields.(eta)

One goes to Michigan in order to get a comparatively inexpensive, respected engineering degree. Not in order to live in Michigan. You find a job and leave after graduation.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

One goes to Michigan in order to get a comparatively inexpensive, respected engineering degree. Not in order to live in Michigan. You find a job and leave after graduation.

True. They would probably stay in the state if there were opportunities.
Wouldn't newly minted engineers be interested in working in big manufacturing facilities such as auto plants? The answer seems to be no...it is a dying industry.

[workpublic]

Did anyone say where they were going?

to the suburbs around the losing pop. cities. which in turn are now starting to degrade.

www.osc.state.ny.us/localgov/pubs/research/pop_trends.pdf

www.economyincrisis.org/content/dozens-us-cities-losing-half-their-population

www.amny.com/urbanite-1.812039/the-lost-generation-nyc-losing-young-people-to-cheaper-cities-1.2607878

finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/111709/us-cities-running-out-of-people

[shelby]

"Most other industries - steel, cement, machining, castings - have progressed. Either moved off shore" WOW about sums it up nicely. Screw you american workers I got mine.

[Opti]

Mar 23, 2011 13:47:17 GMT -5 lisaa said:

Mar 23, 2011 13:23:12 GMT -5 Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ said:

It is also interesting because the University of Michigan is one of the top universities in the US. Many of their programs are amongst the top rated....
With that much brain power in the state, one would think the state would be flourishing in R&D and other high end fields.(eta)

One goes to Michigan in order to get a comparatively inexpensive, respected engineering degree. Not in order to live in Michigan. You find a job and leave after graduation.

My guess is most of the engineering jobs are in the auto industry or their
suppliers. I interviewed with a firm in Michigan after one of my college degrees and they were a supplier to the auto industry.

[workpublic]

GM has to lay off some workers in NY because they have a parts shortage, the parts are made in japan.

[Deleted]

Mar 23, 2011 18:26:10 GMT -5 Opti said:

Mar 23, 2011 13:47:17 GMT -5 lisaa said:

One goes to Michigan in order to get a comparatively inexpensive, respected engineering degree. Not in order to live in Michigan. You find a job and leave after graduation.

My guess is most of the engineering jobs are in the auto industry or their
suppliers. I interviewed with a firm in Michigan after one of my college degrees and they were a supplier to the auto industry.

Is that company still in business?

[Deleted]

Mar 23, 2011 11:37:13 GMT -5 Opti said:

Its interesting to me that the population peaked in 1950. I would have thought it would be later like the 60's or 70's when
American cars were still king.

The Metro Detroit area continued to grow well past the 70s - but most of the growth was in the surrounding suburbs. Although we talk about the Big 3 and the auto industry being in "Detroit," only GM is headquartered within the city limits and most of the factories are in surrounding communities.

(see also: 1967 riots)

[angel007]

That's exactly right craftysarah....of the nearly 10 Million population of Michigan, just over 700k actually live in Detroit...

[zibazinski]

Probably most of the city residents either work for the city like fire, police, who HAVE to live in the city because it is required for their jobs. Of course they work around that by having their families live in the suburbs and a bunch rent a house or apt for their "city" address. The rest probably don't work and never did.

[Urban Chicago]

Anyone remember in the 90's when Michigan was constantly airing commercials begging people to come and work/live there, particularly people who could do computer jobs?

So glad I was skeptical!

[zibazinski]

Oregon has the same issues. Most Oregon grads go to Washington to get jobs because there are so few for them in that state.