moon/Laura
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Post by moon/Laura on Jan 5, 2017 19:41:27 GMT -5
I don't think education (elementary through high school) should *ever* be the sole responsibility of the teachers. PARENTS have to help, too. I realize that's hard to do when some of those parents are immigrants who don't speak English natively. Unfortunately, though, it seems like more often, parents just don't care.
Cronewitch, it pains me to hear your story, just because I can't fathom it. You've come a long way, though. You're far from what I'd consider illiterate. Your background makes me shake my head even more though, when I see Rob (for instance) purposefully acting stupid when I know full well he's not. I see his other posts, too. I can't understand that particular pretense, I guess.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jan 5, 2017 19:58:16 GMT -5
I don't think education (elementary through high school) should *ever* be the sole responsibility of the teachers. PARENTS have to help, too. I realize that's hard to do when some of those parents are immigrants who don't speak English natively. Unfortunately, though, it seems like more often, parents just don't care. Cronewitch, it pains me to hear your story, just because I can't fathom it. You've come a long way, though. You're far from what I'd consider illiterate. Your background makes me shake my head even more though, when I see Rob (for instance) purposefully acting stupid when I know full well he's not. I see his other posts, too. I can't understand that particular pretense, I guess. My parents couldn't help me or participate in my education at all. They didn't speak a lick of English.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jan 5, 2017 20:01:28 GMT -5
Besides, they weren't educated themselves. My dad never made it past grade 4, and my mom never went to school a day in her life.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2017 20:03:24 GMT -5
I will say, though, that your grammar starts to slip as you age. I teach it for a living. I can recite page number and rule. But I embarrass myself these days with what slips through. It's not just the grammar. It was typing "Yahoo" on the other thread when I thought I was typing "Amazon." It is a form of aphasia, and I hate, hate, hate it!
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moon/Laura
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Post by moon/Laura on Jan 5, 2017 20:14:04 GMT -5
weltschmerz - hence my exception based on the parents' own skill level.
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naughtybear
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Post by naughtybear on Jan 5, 2017 20:23:25 GMT -5
As I'm getting older I forget words, I'll say that white thing, big white thing in the kitchen, keeps milk cold..... Also I will type a word and all of a sudden it just looks strange. I know it's right but I will google it anyway just to make sure. Just googled aphasia, I think I need to get to the Doc.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jan 5, 2017 20:30:18 GMT -5
weltschmerz - hence my exception based on the parents' own skill level. Nevertheless, they were very big on education, and pushed us relentlessly. Bad grades were not an option.
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suesinfl
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Post by suesinfl on Jan 5, 2017 20:39:32 GMT -5
My parents couldn't help me either. My father didn't finish the 8th grade ( don't believe he could read past a 4th grade level), although my mom did finish 12th. They just had no interest. They were born in 1926 or 27 and never read anything to my knowledge.
Someone, I have no idea who, gave me a set of Trixie Belden books in the mid 1970s and my love of reading has never stopped. When I was a kid it was nice to have a way to get away from reality.
Crone, I am amazed at what you overcame to become who you are today. You are an inspiration.
Wetz, you are also. It's amazing the obstacles some people have had to hurdle to education themselves.
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msventoux
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Post by msventoux on Jan 5, 2017 21:40:40 GMT -5
I was home schooled, and my parents really didn't help with that, nor was there any other oversight. I either figured things out on my own or didn't learn. I read a ton of books on my own, so my spelling abilities were always decent. It wasn't until I was an adult and got on the internet and started seeing so many spelling and other errors that I found myself having to stop and consider if I was using the correct word.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jan 5, 2017 21:49:17 GMT -5
While we are on the subject...I always say "X and I went to the movies" (example). I was always taught this is correct but IRL, on television, on this board, etc. I hear people saying "me and X." Did something change in the proper English language and I just missed it? This drives me nuts! I hear educated people saying it ALL the time. It is annoying as hell. ♫♫♪ Me And You And A Dog Named Boo ♪♫♫
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Jan 5, 2017 22:08:26 GMT -5
I will say, though, that your grammar starts to slip as you age. I teach it for a living. I can recite page number and rule. But I embarrass myself these days with what slips through. It's not just the grammar. It was typing "Yahoo" on the other thread when I thought I was typing "Amazon." It is a form of aphasia, and I hate, hate, hate it! I blame the internet. My parents were immigrants as well, but I loved to read. So I learned most of my grammar and spelling from exposure. Then the internet came along, and I read mostly unedited stuff written by people from a variety of backgrounds. It gets confusing after a while. I feel like I've forgotten a lot of rules along the way because of the way I learned most of it in the first place. That's why I appreciate the internet grammar and spelling police. 😉
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Jan 5, 2017 22:36:13 GMT -5
I will say, though, that your grammar starts to slip as you age. I teach it for a living. I can recite page number and rule. But I embarrass myself these days with what slips through. It's not just the grammar. It was typing "Yahoo" on the other thread when I thought I was typing "Amazon." It is a form of aphasia, and I hate, hate, hate it! I blame the internet. My parents were immigrants as well, but I loved to read. So I learned most of my grammar and spelling from exposure. Then the internet came along, and I read mostly unedited stuff written by people from a variety of backgrounds. It gets confusing after a while. I feel like I've forgotten a lot of rules along the way because of the way I learned most of it in the first place. That's why I appreciate the internet grammar and spelling police. 😉 Reading books is (or was) the major exposure to spelling and grammar for me. At least in the past, books would contain correct spelling. Lately, however, self published stuff (ebooks) can be full of errors; I'm beginning to find them in mainstream print books, too. They drive me crazy, especially the homophone errors. Discrete is not the same as discreet, and rein does not have the same meaning as reign. I really shake my head when I find errors in the school superintendent's report, or on the Smithsonian website.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 5, 2017 22:51:57 GMT -5
Stop with the lose and loose. They don't mean the same thing!
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DagnyT
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Post by DagnyT on Jan 5, 2017 23:20:31 GMT -5
I was home schooled, and my parents really didn't help with that, nor was there any other oversight. I either figured things out on my own or didn't learn. I read a ton of books on my own, so my spelling abilities were always decent. It wasn't until I was an adult and got on the internet and started seeing so many spelling and other errors that I found myself having to stop and consider if I was using the correct word. Why did your parents home school you if they didn't help you or give you oversight? I home schooled my children, so I know it is a big job, and I also know that children can teach themselves with very little oversight when they are motivated to do so. I just find it really sad that your parents would do this to you.
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Jan 5, 2017 23:25:44 GMT -5
all the sudden people think they are English scholars cause they can spot someone misusing there, their, and they're. I never see them correcting anything else.
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msventoux
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Post by msventoux on Jan 5, 2017 23:48:14 GMT -5
I was home schooled, and my parents really didn't help with that, nor was there any other oversight. I either figured things out on my own or didn't learn. I read a ton of books on my own, so my spelling abilities were always decent. It wasn't until I was an adult and got on the internet and started seeing so many spelling and other errors that I found myself having to stop and consider if I was using the correct word. Why did your parents home school you if they didn't help you or give you oversight? I home schooled my children, so I know it is a big job, and I also know that children can teach themselves with very little oversight when they are motivated to do so. I just find it really sad that your parents would do this to you. A number of factors: remote living making it difficult to get to a school, a not entirely misplaced distrust of the local school district, but mostly my father's belief that an education wasn't really necessary. Boys could go into the trades, and girls were supposed to get married and have kids. My mother did what she could by making reading material readily available, but wasn't any help when it came to math and sciences, and the Christian based curriculum they chose wasn't very good in those areas either. Fortunately, old outdated college textbooks could be had at used book stores for less than a dollar, so some of them became good resources. Probably not what most kids would choose to go look at during a rare trip into town.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jan 5, 2017 23:53:26 GMT -5
all the sudden people think they are English scholars cause they can spot someone misusing there, their, and they're. I never see them correcting anything else. Who are the sudden people?
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Jan 6, 2017 0:34:28 GMT -5
My folks couldn't help, I'm not sure if mom made it through 8th grade, not her fault her folks didn't care, kept her home to help with the 10 other kids.
Dad was a smarta** and quit in 11th grade, he always regretted it.
I liked school, had some good teachers, but English was hard for me. I can spell, though not as good as I used to, and sometimes use the wrong words. I will generally reread it and see them and fix, but sometimes I miss.
I see too and to misused
Lose, loss, loose, and I have been guilty
Yes I think of their as belonging to there a place and they're, they are so I'm ok with that
and I remember I before e except after c
My husband is dyslexic and struggles, he certainly isn't dumb but people thought he was because of that, computers with spell check was his savior, he flourished with them. He still has an awful time spelling.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2017 9:03:27 GMT -5
While we are on the subject...I always say "X and I went to the movies" (example). I was always taught this is correct but IRL, on television, on this board, etc. I hear people saying "me and X." Did something change in the proper English language and I just missed it? This drives me nuts! I hear educated people saying it ALL the time. It is annoying as hell. I'm hearing it from BBC announcers in podcasts now! I always thought the BBC was the gold standard when it came to speaking The Queen's English. It makes me cringe.
I was raised with a rigorous grounding in grammar in parochial schools, as were my parents. Dad would point out split infinitives in drafts of his manager's reports when he was working. (Example: "It is important not to forget..." is correct. "It is important to not forget..." is a split infinitive.) The seventh-grade nun, in particular, really drilled it into us and I appreciate it. One former classmate, whom I always considered an academic equal, constantly includes "would of" and "could of" in her FaceBook posts. DH majored in English Lit. in college. I miss being able to watch TV with him and point out grammatical errors.
Spelling- it's a gift and I have it. Just a few years ago I was on a Corporate Spelling Bee team and we won one year- lots of fun. English is a mishmash of words from other languages, though, so there are no consistent rules. I've known some really intelligent people who couldn't spell.
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naughtybear
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Post by naughtybear on Jan 6, 2017 9:16:11 GMT -5
Misusing to and too, your and you're, advice and advise, loose and lose.
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naughtybear
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Post by naughtybear on Jan 6, 2017 9:17:05 GMT -5
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jan 6, 2017 9:30:11 GMT -5
I used to spell really well. Since I have gotten older I now have to think about how to spell certain words. It is annoying. Sometimes if I can't sleep at night I will lie in bed spelling words in my head.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2017 9:31:51 GMT -5
Misusing to and too, your and you're, advice and advise, loose and lose. Those, I think, should be simple enough to memorize, but people are careless. A friend on FB who's passionately anti-charter school and anti-voucher posted a link to an article backed by the teacher's union noting that if vouchers and charter schools were expanded, the public schools "will loose valuable public funds..." Umm, that didn't help their case very much.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Jan 6, 2017 9:51:33 GMT -5
While we are on the subject...I always say "X and I went to the movies" (example). I was always taught this is correct but IRL, on television, on this board, etc. I hear people saying "me and X." Did something change in the proper English language and I just missed it? This drives me nuts! I hear educated people saying it ALL the time. It is annoying as hell. I'm hearing it from BBC announcers in podcasts now! I always thought the BBC was the gold standard when it came to speaking The Queen's English. It makes me cringe.
I was raised with a rigorous grounding in grammar in parochial schools, as were my parents. Dad would point out split infinitives in drafts of his manager's reports when he was working. (Example: "It is important not to forget..." is correct. "It is important to not forget..." is a split infinitive.) The seventh-grade nun, in particular, really drilled it into us and I appreciate it. One former classmate, whom I always considered an academic equal, constantly includes "would of" and "could of" in her FaceBook posts. DH majored in English Lit. in college. I miss being able to watch TV with him and point out grammatical errors.
Spelling- it's a gift and I have it. Just a few years ago I was on a Corporate Spelling Bee team and we won one year- lots of fun. English is a mishmash of words from other languages, though, so there are no consistent rules. I've known some really intelligent people who couldn't spell.
I never learned about split infinitives. Attended parochial school first through sixth grade. If I had just gone one more year, I would've learned about these things. . (Actually, going down that rabbit hole, maybe another year or 2 there would've been better for me for a couple of reasons.)
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Jan 6, 2017 10:28:34 GMT -5
Misusing to and too, your and you're, advice and advise, loose and lose. What's annoying are the self proclaimed grammar Nazis that don't know anything outside of spotting these errors.
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moon/Laura
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Post by moon/Laura on Jan 6, 2017 11:00:18 GMT -5
Well, I will never proclaim to be an expert. I'm maybe a bit better than average, but I do still make mistakes myself. For that reason, I don't nitpick too often. Although, in a thread like this, it's sort of a given.
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naughtybear
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Post by naughtybear on Jan 6, 2017 11:08:17 GMT -5
Damn, hater much. This post was sort of tongue in cheek, I can't spell definitely (damn I did just spell that right the first go around) correctly consistently or psychologist. It's and its gives me pause every time too.
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moon/Laura
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Post by moon/Laura on Jan 6, 2017 11:25:03 GMT -5
It's and its are easy enough if, when you use "it's" in a sentence, it still makes sense when you break apart the contraction.
It's cold out today/ It is cold out today = good.
The dog lost it's bone/ The dog lost it is bone = bad. Therefore, it should be "its" instead.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Jan 6, 2017 11:40:55 GMT -5
I blame the internet. My parents were immigrants as well, but I loved to read. So I learned most of my grammar and spelling from exposure. Then the internet came along, and I read mostly unedited stuff written by people from a variety of backgrounds. It gets confusing after a while. I feel like I've forgotten a lot of rules along the way because of the way I learned most of it in the first place. That's why I appreciate the internet grammar and spelling police. 😉 Reading books is (or was) the major exposure to spelling and grammar for me. At least in the past, books would contain correct spelling. Lately, however, self published stuff (ebooks) can be full of errors; I'm beginning to find them in mainstream print books, too. They drive me crazy, especially the homophone errors. Discrete is not the same as discreet, and rein does not have the same meaning as reign. I really shake my head when I find errors in the school superintendent's report, or on the Smithsonian website. YES!!! Kindle versions of some books seem to have gotten no attention whatsoever. I've read a series that started in the 80s and a bunch were converted at the same time and oh the homophone errors! These books are still getting written and I think the more recent ones are better but if I see something like vile/vial again in these things I'm going to start grammar Nazi-ing all over Amazon reviews. I think I learned most of my grammar & spelling from constant reading too, so seeing it in books really chaps my hide. I know I've committed a few sins here and I hope I get forgiven if I don't catch them all. I do try to correct them.
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naughtybear
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Post by naughtybear on Jan 6, 2017 11:52:56 GMT -5
I think my spelling is from reading a lot.
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