Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2011 14:32:28 GMT -5
"And if she wants to me for someone else, the door is wide open. I might miss her for awhile but not going to commit suicide over it" Got to ask....why did you marry this woman? Better yet, why did you choose to marry at this point in your life(meaning: still in school, just getting started on career, beginning to invest for retirement, save for a home etc.)? I hope SF is reading this because your union sounds like one that fits some of his controversial descriptions of marriage...and I would have to agree with him. Because besides being a financial train wreck she is a great woman. Finances are the only thing we ever disagreed on. Everything else is great and she has alot of qualities I admire in a woman. I can see how some people might see how we don't get along, but thi is a board about money so all we post about it money. I don' post about how we are best frieds, been together for 8 years now, can talk for hours, have an amazing sex life, share the same morals/values and share the same passion for food/fitness/etc. We are making progress in that area and baby steps. Her mom has raised her to expect certain things an will take some time for her to adjust. And while she migth drive me nuts financially, I truly love the train wreck.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2011 14:45:45 GMT -5
I am not that cheap and do care about my wife feelings and safety. So I don't plan to move to the ghetto anytime soon.
I am just trying to find a middle ground between something that is affordable and that we can both live with.
Basically we are only giving up square footage really (from 2 bedroom 2 bath to 1 bedroom 1 bath) but the standard is about the same (nice appliances, hardwood floor if possible, safe area, parking, etc).
I got a job promotion and between her graduating and us moving we only had 2 weeks to find an appartment and this complex was the only one that could accomodate us in such a short time (getting the appartment ready, painting, changing carpet, etc) since most people were moving by the end of May beginning june and I needed to report to my job on June 14 (so needed to move in by that weekend).
And my last day at my old location was Friday June 11th (could not take off any earlier). So basically we only had that two weeks to find a place, one weekend to move in.
If all goes well, we are hoping not having to move for awhile and if we have to it would be because I got another promotion in which case I would not be worried since my job covers - all moving expenses - pay for the realtor to find you a place - pay for your first month rent
Her mom paid for it which is why I haven't brought it up... but the other day it dawned on me that I haven't seen that darn thing in awhile.
I rather deal with my mother in law on a daily basis instead of the option of my wife staying home.
I know myself and I know my wife... we would end up divorced within a year after the birth of that child. I would resent her for spending like we have two incomes, me having to pay her high student loans; she would resent me for limiting her spending.
With 2 incomes, there is more money to go around and keep everyone somewhat happy.
thanks and I hope the same too.
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sil
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Post by sil on Mar 17, 2011 14:54:21 GMT -5
Hi Cawiau,
I dont get to read/post as much as I'd like, so admittedly I'm not as familiar with your situation as other posters. Your last post about your wife was sweet, but frankly it sounds like your financial disagreement isnt as immediate of a problem as the way you and your wife communicate about your disagreement.
So she calls you "cheap" and it bugs you. Have you ever told her that? Do you ever call her "spoiled" to her face? Is it possible she's bothered by that label?
I tease DH all the time, both in public and private. But if he ever indicated that I was striking a nerve, I'd back off immediately. And if the two of you are teasing each other about a continuing argument that's in the undercurrent of your discussions, it's safe to say that the little jabs will come across as hurtful to both of you.
Tell your wife that the "cheap" comments bug you. If she's really just joking about it, she'll back off immediately. But if this is just a childish way of communicating her disagreement with you, expect an outburst. Then its up to you to steer the conversation to a more adult tone, by calmly stating your point of view and listening to hers.
Fix the communication issue first before you try and tackle any other argument.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Mar 17, 2011 15:02:19 GMT -5
...imo, "cheap" disregards function... ;D
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Mar 17, 2011 15:03:46 GMT -5
<<< Tell your wife that the "cheap" comments bug you. >>> ...ditto... too many unintentional scars come from stabs at humor, imo...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2011 15:07:45 GMT -5
<<< Tell your wife that the "cheap" comments bug you. >>> ...ditto... too many unintentional scars come from stabs at humor, imo... I did tell her earlier and her reaction was basically the following: I don't know that I find your wife's comment insulting. Telling the realtor not to bother trying to talk you around is actually supportive in my eyes. She could have joined the realtor in trying to convince you. Even the comment about not spending all of your savings sounds accepting of your financial restraints. To me anyway. In her mind she was just telling the real estate not to waste our time since we will most likely not go for anything higher, and using me as a being cheap came to mind. And also she is not worried about us spending more than we should because she knows I will be on top of the budget and it wouldn't happen. So she did not mean to hurt my feelings. Like I said, she have been calling me cheap for years now but for some reason today it annoyed the hell out of me.
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sunuva
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Post by sunuva on Mar 17, 2011 15:34:28 GMT -5
Frugal is using a knife to scrape the last of the ketchup from the bottom of the ketchup container.
Cheap is using the ketchup condiments from the stadium for use at home later.
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reader79
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Post by reader79 on Mar 17, 2011 15:42:55 GMT -5
Why are yall hating on stockpiling ketchup packets? As long as it is Heinz (and thus of sufficient quality to actually use,) grabbing a few for later is just prudent. I keep them at work in my desk, at home for when the big bottle runs out, and in my purse in case I run into some fries..... Should I be dosing it into ziplocs instead and making homemade ones?
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Mar 17, 2011 16:24:48 GMT -5
...:::"I am not that cheap and do care about my wife feelings and safety. So I don't plan to move to the ghetto anytime soon.":::...
No, I wasn't saying you were cheap. I'm just saying I understand that in a HCOL area, numbers like $1,275 which buy houses everywhere else, won't buy much where you are.
...:::"Her mom paid for it which is why I haven't brought it up... but the other day it dawned on me that I haven't seen that darn thing in awhile.":::...
Time to check out a copy of "best crockpot recipes" from the library and leave it lying around. Or go to WIR and leave the "crockpot" thread open.
...:::"So she calls you "cheap" and it bugs you. Have you ever told her that? Do you ever call her "spoiled" to her face? Is it possible she's bothered by that label?":::...
I like it. Sounds fair to me.
I know what its like also to be very compatible with someone and love them dearly, but still come across as having problems due to a particular issue.
I really do hope it all works out. I remember your worry about her wanting to spend a bunch decorating the new apartment the same way she decorated the current one.
When you do move, and you have that money left over, get it into the hands of the intended creditor as soon as you can. If it sits there tempting either of you, it will never make it to its intended destination.
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daylight
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Post by daylight on Mar 17, 2011 16:58:58 GMT -5
Cawiau - you're not cheap, and I don't think you are frugal either. (You are frugal compared to your wife, but not generally speaking.)
Is the cc debt yours or hers? I thought I had an idea of your finances, but I can't seem to remember how you ended up with cc debt while being careful about money.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2011 20:34:50 GMT -5
Cawiau, back up. Your post about the possibility of divorce sounds like you have one foot already out the door.
You seem to love your wife, albeit that she is slightly spoiled. Don't post stuff like this online, even on an anonymous message board. It would be very hurtful if she stumbled across it, and you honestly never know.
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Post by bobbysgirl on Mar 17, 2011 22:56:37 GMT -5
Don't let your new body image interfere with your view of the young woman you married. This would be a big mistake.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2011 23:53:33 GMT -5
Cawiau, back up. Your post about the possibility of divorce sounds like you have one foot already out the door. You seem to love your wife, albeit that she is slightly spoiled. Don't post stuff like this online, even on an anonymous message board. It would be very hurtful if she stumbled across it, and you honestly never know. My wife knows how I feel about divorce and I don't mean it as having a foot at the door. We work on our issues and try to resolve them. But she knows I grew up in a household were my father was both verbally and physically abusive towards my mother and I witness it and she felt that she had to stay in it because of me. My wife due to her catholic roots feels the same and if we were to have kids and the marriage was not working, she would do the same as my mother did: stay in the marriage because of our kids. As she told me once, she would have no problem sacrificing her happiness for her kids. But I feel different as I was the kid for whom the mother stayed in the marriage long after she should have left. I was young but not stupid, death nor blind. Till this day my mom cannot believe that I remember witnessing my dead slapping her around and me having to go run crying for help because I thought he was going to kill her. Yes I was 3-4 but it scared me for life and yes 22 years later I still remember that day clearly, every detail to what I was wearing and to why the fight started : over one of my shirt that I lost. My dad wanted me to go find it and my mom thought it was not worth it (we were visiting my mom's family and yes he had the audacity to start beating her in my grandmothers house). So yes at 25 I don't speak to my father unless I have to and I honestly don't care for the guy; it kills my mom because she feels whatever he did he did to no, not me. But I see it different because whatever he did to her he did to me because I heard it all, witness it all and can't just wake up and forget it. So my wife knows I would refuse to stay in a relationship that I was totally miserable in or to the point where I resent her, and even worse stick around because of the kids. That doesn't mean I would not be willing to give it a chance. She has this romantic idea of love/marriage in her life while I saw the other side of it where someone can claim to love you and beat you senseless that same day. I love her but thanks to my childhood I will have that little reservation inside thinking something might/will rock the boat one day and the fairy tale will end. She knows it and it hurts her at times because she feels that I never truly feels that she loved/loves me a 100%. But those are my demons to deal with and they are not about money
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2011 0:03:59 GMT -5
Don't let your new body image interfere with your view of the young woman you married. This would be a big mistake. Body image? My wife is HOT in my eyes and I have not been able to keep my hands off her since the time she gave me permission to put them on her (8 years and counting). Like I said, our finances are the only issue we usually butt heads over and my new body image has nothing to do with it. Heck I am fat/obese now compared to when my wife met me, so if anyone would be doing the dumping due to body image it would be my wife. She prefers the slim/lean look while the moment I found bodybuilding in college I never looked back. You can ask my wife and it's no secret: she prefers the old me at 160 lbs compared to me now at about 260 (heaviest was 335) and 200-210 when I lean down. I did promise her to go to as low at 185-190 for our trip in August
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2011 0:11:36 GMT -5
Is the cc debt yours or hers? I thought I had an idea of your finances, but I can't seem to remember how you ended up with cc debt while being careful about money. The credit card is hers and under her name. Until recently (last december I think) we had separate finances it and I stayed away from the credit card because it frustrated me every time we talked about it. Now that we combined our finances and I am somewhat in the driver seat my goal is to pay that little devil as fast as possible. The balance only went down a few hundreds since we have been married because my wife thought paying the minimum was ok without thinking how long it would take (and interest dollars) to pay it off at that rate. On the good side, she has not added any debt to our financial spread sheet since we got married (we paid for her grad school with savings/some financial aid and 2 grants/scholarships). Goal is to be cc debt free by Jan-Feb 2012.
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patchwork150
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Post by patchwork150 on Mar 18, 2011 6:36:07 GMT -5
You are a smart man. I like your honesty, and I like that you don't get very upset by some of the other posters. I've posted topics about DH's and my financial balancing act, and have gotten similar responses. Some people hear 1 negative thing about someone and blow it up. It's so easy to skew someone's opinion about another person they have never met, especially when they don't get the whole story.
I think you guys will be OK. She's made some mistakes, like most of our spouses. Thankfully both of you (like DH and I) are working through your issues prior to having children!
Karma to you ;D for a good attitude and manners
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Politically_Incorrect12
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With a little faith, we can move a mountain; with a little help, we can change the world.
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Post by Politically_Incorrect12 on Mar 18, 2011 9:49:35 GMT -5
I have to ask, have you two actually sat down to discuss a budget that allows for things like entertainment, shopping, etc? Or have you been pretty much dictating what you will allow?
If you haven't both sat down, it is probably a good idea to just sit down to a budget that you both can agree on. It is no fun to have a budget when one person is pretty much dictating how the money is going to be spent.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2011 10:18:53 GMT -5
You are a smart man. I like your honesty, and I like that you don't get very upset by some of the other posters. I've posted topics about DH's and my financial balancing act, and have gotten similar responses. Some people hear 1 negative thing about someone and blow it up. It's so easy to skew someone's opinion about another person they have never met, especially when they don't get the whole story. I think you guys will be OK. She's made some mistakes, like most of our spouses. Thankfully both of you (like DH and I) are working through your issues prior to having children! Karma to you ;D for a good attitude and manners Thank you and Karma back. I see how they can see we are destined for ruins but this is a Money board so I post about nothing more than money and it is just happens that it is the big thing in our house. I came from a place where I saw my mom struggled to make a living after she left my dad, I saw family members make poor choices financially, etc so finances are important to me. Her she never witness that, her mom worked the same company right out of college till she retired last year, and never denied her daughter anything since she was her only child. We just come from two different places and we are making progress to get on the same page.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2011 10:25:09 GMT -5
I have to ask, have you two actually sat down to discuss a budget that allows for things like entertainment, shopping, etc? Or have you been pretty much dictating what you will allow? If you haven't both sat down, it is probably a good idea to just sit down to a budget that you both can agree on. It is no fun to have a budget when one person is pretty much dictating how the money is going to be spent. We made a budget together recently and I let her add up the numbers and decide how much we should be spending on each category. I basically gave her all the bills, our net income and we were working on a spreadsheet together. The issue for us is not paying bills, she is pretty good at paying her bills on time. What we have had issues with is: -> why it is better to pay more than the minimum payment on cc (no longer an issue since I am paying it now) -> Just because you can afford it does not mean you have to. The debt side we have under control, the savings is what we are tackling now. Basically let's say we save combined $1,000/month now, she wants to save maybe $100 if any (her famous words from her mother: It's ok if we have no savings now because we are young, Oh yeah and it's ok to have debt, everyone has debt.) and spend the rest. I am willing to cut back to maybe $900 since we already have a category for fun money that she feels is not enough. We need to find a middle ground.
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patchwork150
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Post by patchwork150 on Mar 18, 2011 11:48:03 GMT -5
^ Dh and I have similar issues, based on how we were raised and the way we are. I am a planner, he is a live in the moment person. We're working through it, but it's harder for me I think because I am more frugal than my husband, and I handle the finances. I don't want to force my hubby to do anything, I wish he would be 100% on board with me. He wants to spend more $ on things than I do. He has a weekly allowance of $100 approximately to do what he wants with- I want to reduce it. I give myself almost nothing to make up for what I want us to save...
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Mar 18, 2011 11:50:12 GMT -5
...:::"We need to find a middle ground.":::...
A very difficult goal when one person wants to "enjoy life now" and one wants to "save for the future". If you really have $1k/month left over, I have a feeling you are not going to convince her to save $900 out of it. You might just have to meet at $500 in order to keep the peace. Although it may not be the ideal outcome in either of your mind, its very hard to argue that 50/50 isn't fair to everyone involved.
It is way better to save less than you want to and stick to it, than to save too aggressively and then blow all the savings and then some when she is sick of "being good" and wants something to show for it.
I do hope that one day she thanks you for being rigid and reigning her in. Recall I started a thread about that topic and too many people chimed in that it was being "controlling".
It is NOT FUN being the "den mother" and trying to do the "right" or "good" thing, when everyone else is pestering you to do the "fun" thing. Its not fun at ALL.
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azphx1972
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Post by azphx1972 on Mar 18, 2011 16:39:27 GMT -5
Have you considered going through something like Financial Peace University with her? Just a thought.
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MN-Investor
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Post by MN-Investor on Mar 18, 2011 17:37:03 GMT -5
One question and one comment.
Was the decision to move to a less expensive apartment with a maximum cost of $1,300 a mutually agreed upon decision made between two people in a loving partnership, or was it a unilateral decision made by one person and only grudgingly accepted by his partner? [This is not to imply that the decision is a bad decision, just to point out that important decisions about where a couple lives and how much it costs should entail a discussion of alternatives.]
Usually using terms like "cheap" is manipulative. "Cheap" has negative connotations. Your wife is attempting to make you feel guilty by implying that there is plenty of money available, but you are arbitrarily choosing to selfishly not spend that money.
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on Mar 19, 2011 13:24:06 GMT -5
"RENT is just too DAMN high!"
LOL! Have you heard that guy? He's too much!
Back on point. Make a deal: If you can save $300 a month in reduced rent, agree to budget $100 for extra nights out in the local restaurants. It's a win-win:
You get to put $200 more away in savings/debt repayment, whatever.
She gets to have $100 more spent on her... so she won't feel that you're so cheap.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2011 23:09:31 GMT -5
- We picked the amount $1,300 because that is what it would have costs us to downgrade to 1 bedroom in our current complex. Actually $1,295 for a 1 bedroom / 1 bath here. But my wife did not like the idea of the bathroom being located in our bedroom and if we had a guest they would need to go thru our bedroom to use the bathroom. So I use that amount as a guideline for us to get another apartment, I will not pay more then I would pay here.
- No need to worry about my wife, she is actually way too excited right now about moving. It dawned on her she will get a new place to decorate so she is really happy. She saw a few places today and for one of the apartments she said: I can see us living here, this will go here, this will go there. She has been bugging me about that apartment and she wants it. The agent will get back to us monday, it fits her (my wife) artistic side and have exposed brick, open space/loft style living. Actually she is wishing we could be moving sooner so she could start decorating.
- I am really liking the idea of splitting the difference and give her more money to spend each month. But here is the thing, my wife gets $200/month to spend right now (while I only give myself $80 to make up the difference ) and every time it runs out or she forgets her cash at home, she just charge it on the debit card. So it's not like I nickel and dime her for everything, if I did, I would have been mad that I saw 4 different charges this week which are considered personal expenses and would have come out of her allowance. But all 4 came to under $30 and based on the days, I am guessing she forget her cash at home again.
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Post by buzzy on Mar 20, 2011 3:56:16 GMT -5
cawiau you would be my ideal man if you weren't already taken! You don't have a clone by any chance do you? I'll give you karma as soon as I figure out how. This is my very first post - after a couple of years' lurking. There have been many topics that I wanted to reply too, but always held back, but this time I just had to do it! I think you're awesome
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Nazgul Girl
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Post by Nazgul Girl on Mar 20, 2011 7:19:46 GMT -5
Well, Carl, I believe that you and your wife will make it based on the facts that you two genuinely love each other, you have many things in common, and you discuss more things with each other than most couples do over forty years together. That being said, if anything did happen, and I hope it doesn't, if there are a lack of hot Haitian women after you, and buzzy doesn't snag you up, I'll be next in line if I'm single. LOL. You have a lot of wonderful qualities. And I buy my own diamonds and already have my own crockpot.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 20, 2011 8:42:26 GMT -5
I don't know. I'm not sure I'd want to be with a guy that was HOTTER than me!!!!!! ;D
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happyscooter
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Post by happyscooter on Mar 20, 2011 8:47:29 GMT -5
Maybe someone said this already but I think 'cheap is when you use someone else for their money and frugal is when it's your money.' I am making NO sense this morning.
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stats45
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Post by stats45 on Mar 20, 2011 10:11:13 GMT -5
I think the difference between cheap and frugal can also be about hurting yourself, not just about hurting other people.
For example, cheap would be not getting regular physicals while frugal would be getting preventative medical care. Cheap would be never having any life experiences that require money (like travel), but frugal would be carefully using money to meet your goals.
I think cheap is just about not spending money at any cost, while frugal is about maximizing your utility from your money.
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