Apple phones and the FBI

[Value Buy]

When authorities raided the apartment in Brussels a few days ago they found about 100 new, unused cellphones.

I would like to know whether they were Apple phones or another brand.

I am hoping they were Apple.

Apple management should tell us how many phones they have sold that have gone to terrorists.

Since they gather our data for their benefit, they could easily tell us how many terrorists are using them and what countries/cities they are currently in.
OF COURSE, IT IS ABOUT PRIVACY........
And yet they datamine our phones constantly for their own use.

[Value Buy]

The government can seize your computer and datamine it to use the data against you.
But cellphones, you have rights?

How many pedophile groups are now using cellphones to communicate and pass data between them? And they are free to do it as long as they buy the encryption package
And yet if you own a Toshiba, Compaq computer etc, your toast.

Am I seeing this theory incorrectly?

[Tennesseer]

I don't own an IPhone but when a new owner is initializing their IPhone, is there a category list where you check off profession and hobbies like:

Teacher
Farmer
Bus Driver
Terrorist
Store Clerk
Groundskeeper
etc.

[Value Buy]

Mar 22, 2016 16:33:49 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

I don't own an IPhone but when a new owner is initializing their IPhone, is there a category list where you check off profession and hobbies like:

Teacher
Farmer
Bus Driver
Terrorist
Store Clerk
Groundskeeper
etc.

lol, the encryption service is the canary in the coal mine.
And I agree all these categories can include terrorists, whether religious or agnostic.

My theory is once you slaughter a bunch of civilians and are caught, your right to break the law using encryption is no longer valid. You used it to break the law and invalidated the contract you had.

[Tennesseer]

Mar 22, 2016 16:38:03 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Mar 22, 2016 16:33:49 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

I don't own an IPhone but when a new owner is initializing their IPhone, is there a category list where you check off profession and hobbies like:

Teacher
Farmer
Bus Driver
Terrorist
Store Clerk
Groundskeeper
etc.

lol, the encription service is the canary in the coal mine.
And I agree all these categories can include terrorists, whether religious or agnostic.

My theory is once you slaughter a bunch of civilians and are caught, your right to break the law using encription is no longer valid. You used it to break the law and invalidated the contract you had.

But you are thinking in the line of American law. American laws don't apply outside of our country.

[Value Buy]

Mar 22, 2016 16:56:28 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Mar 22, 2016 16:38:03 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

lol, the encryption service is the canary in the coal mine.
And I agree all these categories can include terrorists, whether religious or agnostic.

My theory is once you slaughter a bunch of civilians and are caught, your right to break the law using encription is no longer valid. You used it to break the law and invalidated the contract you had.

But you are thinking in the line of American law. American laws don't apply outside of our country.

Or, I guess California?

[justme]

First, encryption is not illegal. Second, I don't have an iPhone but on my android I can select whether or not to send what information to the manufacturer. Third, there are plenty of third parties that cell iPhones where Apple would have no clue who bought them, especially if they haven't been turned on and set up yet. Fourth, there's probably the same level of encryption for computers that phones have you probably just have to pay for it.

[Value Buy]

Mar 22, 2016 17:50:15 GMT -5 justme said:

First, encryption is not illegal. Second, I don't have an iPhone but on my android I can select whether or not to send what information to the manufacturer. Third, there are plenty of third parties that cell iPhones where Apple would have no clue who bought them, especially if they haven't been turned on and set up yet. Fourth, there's probably the same level of encryption for computers that phones have you probably just have to pay for it.

I never said encryption was illegal.
I said the act they perpetrated were illegal, therefore voiding their privacy rights to the encryption.
As far as computers, it seems for the most part, FBI is able to hack the computers.
Might be the people arrested did not have encryption on them. IDK

[justme]

Mar 22, 2016 19:51:13 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Mar 22, 2016 17:50:15 GMT -5 justme said:

First, encryption is not illegal. Second, I don't have an iPhone but on my android I can select whether or not to send what information to the manufacturer. Third, there are plenty of third parties that cell iPhones where Apple would have no clue who bought them, especially if they haven't been turned on and set up yet. Fourth, there's probably the same level of encryption for computers that phones have you probably just have to pay for it.

I never said encryption was illegal.
I said the act they perpetrated were illegal, therefore voiding their privacy rights to the encryption.
As far as computers, it seems for the most part, FBI is able to hack the computers.
Might be the people arrested did not have encryption on them. IDK

The reason why they can hack most computers is because people don't use failsafe encryption on them. Probably because I'm not even sure computers come with the ability to auto encrypt the whole thing. When you encrypt your phone (and actually even if you don't encrypt it I've seen the option) you have the option to select essentially an auto destruct mode. After ten failed attempts it basically turns into a brick. Cops can hack computers because most don't set up this failsafe on a computer so they can crack it by having another computer endlessly guess passwords.

It's not the encryption that's stopping them, it's the failsafe the owner enacted stopping then from cracking it with endless password attempts.

[Deleted]

It isn't just that, right, as I read they could have waited for the next cloud update and accessed there, but some fbi idiot severed that link and now not so much. But now they would actually have to write software to break the phone, software that then makes them all breakable.

I don't think I'm totally misunderstanding this?

[justme]

Not sure about the cloud info, but you're right on about the software thing. Since all phones run on the same iOS then creating a break for one creates a break for all. Even if they theoretically could keep the crack from getting in the wrong hands there's nothing to stop any of the hackers out there that would love a way into all iPhones from finding it.

To say nothing of the time and expense the government is asking Apple to take on. This isn't an issue of Apple having the key and not handing it over, this is an issue of the government making a private company build a completely new house at their own expense and hand over that key. It would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars if not millions. I don't see how the government has the right to do that to anyone.

[Jaguar]

The FBI got into the iphone, there will be no lawsuit against Apple now.

www.wsj.com/articles/fbi-unlocks-terrorists-iphone-without-apples-help-1459202353?shareToken=st5eaf7f01c49d4845b9a93b30e06389f3&mod=e2tw


money.cnn.com/2016/03/28/news/companies/fbi-apple-iphone-case-cracked/index.html


www.foxnews.com/tech/2016/03/28/fbi-breaks-into-san-bernardino-gunmans-iphone-without-apples-help-ending-court-case.html

[OldCoyote]

Two things,  The FBI knew that if they lost this, it would set a standard,  they bailed because probably would lose in the end!

Now that the FBI has the way to open this, the hackers will have that Info also, unless you are going to tell the hackers have not already invaded the FBI.

[resolution]

The Paris terrorists were using burner phones and not encryption anyway. Who do you think the FBI would really be using anti-encryption against? Hint... it wouldn't be the terrorists that just buy prepaid throwaway phones by the dozens...

arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2016/03/paris-terrorist-attacks-burner-phones-not-encryption/

[OldCoyote]

Mar 29, 2016 6:28:43 GMT -5 resolution said:

The Paris terrorists were using burner phones and not encryption anyway. Who do you think the FBI would really be using anti-encryption against? Hint... it wouldn't be the terrorists that just buy prepaid throwaway phones by the dozens...

arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2016/03/paris-terrorist-attacks-burner-phones-not-encryption/

Why would the terrorist throw the phone way,  just blow it up with yourself.

[Value Buy]

Apr 13, 2016 13:51:04 GMT -5 @anne81 said:

You learn something new every day.  Apparently there are "vulnerability acquisition firms" that buy hacks and bugs and then sell them to other parties.  That's how the FBI got into the Iphone.

www.computerworld.com/article/3055486/security/fbi-bought-exploit-from-hackers-to-access-san-bernardino-iphone.html

And yet, Apple claimed it could not be done........imagine that.
Next they will be asking the FBI how they did it so they can create a patch for the problem.........

[Value Buy]

Apr 13, 2016 14:31:24 GMT -5 @anne81 said:

Apple has already asked for it.

www.lawfareblog.com/very-definition-digital-age-chutzpah

Talk about egg on Cook's face.
An alarming claim it was impenetrable.
FBI paid for the ability to beat the phone, and should never hand it over to Apple at any price.
Let Apple buy it from the guys that broke the encryption.
Probably some teenagers in a basement somewhere