The Job Hunt Thread

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

So I ran into the same person I ran into during my interview in the hall. Decided to take a leap and introduce myself.

It was SO NICE to have someone who commiserated with me.   She said the frustrations I am feeling are not unique to the lab I work in, it's prevalent in the entire research department. She also agreed it's very hard to make friends/network since everyone is their own little island. The audio people don't associate with me (I work with animals), the cytology people don't associate with them, and so on. It makes things pretty lonely.

She's looking to leave as well but like me is having a hard time finding anything.

She said she'd heard about me and I was brought in for my expertise. I told her what it is.  She told me I have a certain amount of control b/c of that, they cannot easily replace me so assert it when I need it.

We were talking about the mirco-manging thing and she said it's a common theme throughout the department.  There are a lot of restrictions put on techs that make it really hard/frustrating to do your job. That is what I am running into.

It's nice to know I am not crazy. Cause I hear a lot of the opposite from people who work in other departments at Boys Town.   They have a lot of lifers there must be something really good about working there that I am not seeing. I've been really wondering if it was me.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

The logical place ot start is my technique b/c that is the simplest thing to correct.   However there is a pattern I noticed yesterday.  It's one strain and MALES from that strain. I haven't killed a single female.

If it was me then there shouldn't be such a tight pattern.  It should be across both sexes and all the strains I have worked with.

But they aren't interested in engaging in a conversation with me about it and what we can do to fix it.  So if they want to continue on risking more males dying at random from this strain then that is their choice not mine.

Which is part of what makes me so miserable here.  I am used to being a part of a team and my opinion at least being heard by my PIs.  That is what makes me so good at my job.

That's not the case here. I'm treated like the most entry level of technicians but then get crap when things get behind.

It was nice to know that it's not just my lab (though apparently mine ranks up there), it's an entire department thing.  All the PIs are similar in how they behave towards their staff.

I am used to going above and beyond at my job.  I am not being given the tools to do that.  The ways that I can do that will lead to me being a human doormat and another UTI.

So if average is all I am being given the ability to do then I need to start accepting that.  DH is right this is a temporary job, I don't need to give 110%.  I should be saving some of that for finding a long term job that may actually lead somewhere. 

[Wisconsin Beth]

2 things drama.
1. I would document to your PI that you've noticed it's males of that strain that are dying.  Maybe more as a side note or something in whatever reporting you do regularly.  (if that makes sense) and
2. because on the not giving 110% - I stopped doing that and now have a VERY hard time going back to busting my ass because apparently, they are fine with me NOT busting my ass.  And my energy is more sucked into my home life now.  So I'm not saying keep on giving it and getting the UTIs - I'm saying be careful. 

[Lizard Queen]

Sept 3, 2015 7:42:30 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

The logical place ot start is my technique b/c that is the simplest thing to correct.   However there is a pattern I noticed yesterday.  It's one strain and MALES from that strain. I haven't killed a single female.

If it was me then there shouldn't be such a tight pattern.  It should be across both sexes and all the strains I have worked with.

But they aren't interested in engaging in a conversation with me about it and what we can do to fix it.  So if they want to continue on risking more males dying at random from this strain then that is their choice not mine.

Which is part of what makes me so miserable here.  I am used to being a part of a team and my opinion at least being heard by my PIs.  That is what makes me so good at my job.

That's not the case here. I'm treated like the most entry level of technicians but then get crap when things get behind.

It was nice to know that it's not just my lab (though apparently mine ranks up there), it's an entire department thing.  All the PIs are similar in how they behave towards their staff.

I am used to going above and beyond at my job.  I am not being given the tools to do that.  The ways that I can do that will lead to me being a human doormat and another UTI.

So if average is all I am being given the ability to do then I need to start accepting that.  DH is right this is a temporary job, I don't need to give 110%.  I should be saving some of that for finding a long term job that may actually lead somewhere. 

I have little idea of what you are doing, but could it be that the males dying is part of your experiment results? If so, i could see not wanting to change anything.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Sept 3, 2015 9:58:53 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

Sept 3, 2015 7:42:30 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

The logical place ot start is my technique b/c that is the simplest thing to correct.   However there is a pattern I noticed yesterday.  It's one strain and MALES from that strain. I haven't killed a single female.

If it was me then there shouldn't be such a tight pattern.  It should be across both sexes and all the strains I have worked with.

But they aren't interested in engaging in a conversation with me about it and what we can do to fix it.  So if they want to continue on risking more males dying at random from this strain then that is their choice not mine.

Which is part of what makes me so miserable here.  I am used to being a part of a team and my opinion at least being heard by my PIs.  That is what makes me so good at my job.

That's not the case here. I'm treated like the most entry level of technicians but then get crap when things get behind.

It was nice to know that it's not just my lab (though apparently mine ranks up there), it's an entire department thing.  All the PIs are similar in how they behave towards their staff.

I am used to going above and beyond at my job.  I am not being given the tools to do that.  The ways that I can do that will lead to me being a human doormat and another UTI.

So if average is all I am being given the ability to do then I need to start accepting that.  DH is right this is a temporary job, I don't need to give 110%.  I should be saving some of that for finding a long term job that may actually lead somewhere. 

I have little idea of what you are doing, but could it be that the males dying is part of your experiment results? If so, i could see not wanting to change anything.

I thought of that too but wouldn't that be part of the whole hypothesis stuff in the grant?  Which I'm assuming Drama would have been given and read but then again...

[ArchietheDragon]

Sept 3, 2015 10:11:40 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Sept 3, 2015 9:58:53 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

I have little idea of what you are doing, but could it be that the males dying is part of your experiment results? If so, i could see not wanting to change anything.

I thought of that too but wouldn't that be part of the whole hypothesis stuff in the grant?  Which I'm assuming Drama would have been given and read but then again...

maybe the subject of the experiment is really Drama...

[Wisconsin Beth]

maybe the subject of the experiment is really Drama...

[Lizard Queen]

Sept 3, 2015 10:11:40 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Sept 3, 2015 9:58:53 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

I have little idea of what you are doing, but could it be that the males dying is part of your experiment results? If so, i could see not wanting to change anything.

I thought of that too but wouldn't that be part of the whole hypothesis stuff in the grant?  Which I'm assuming Drama would have been given and read but then again...

I don't know, but they want her to be as unbiased as possible, which would mean less information available to her.

[Lizard Queen]

Sept 3, 2015 10:18:59 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

maybe the subject of the experiment is really Drama...

  . (Poor Drama!   

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

It's not part of the project for them to die, trust me.  I know when animals are supposed to die b/c I have to collect their ears. That means perfusion which is best done BEFORE they are dead as a doornail.

Another one died this morning.  I am about ready to cry I am so frustrated over it all.    Nobody wants to talk to me about it or let me have an opinion.  So here I sit with another dead animal on my hands hoping they don't decide to take it out on me and fire me.

[ArchietheDragon]

Sept 3, 2015 10:38:13 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

It's not part of the project for them to die, trust me.  I know when animals are supposed to die b/c I have to collect their ears. That means perfusion which is best done BEFORE they are dead as a doornail.

Another one died this morning.  I am about ready to cry I am so frustrated over it all.    Nobody wants to talk to me about it or let me have an opinion.  So here I sit with another dead animal on my hands hoping they don't decide to take it out on me and fire me.

If your supervisor starts measuring your ears, RUN!

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Sept 3, 2015 10:38:13 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

It's not part of the project for them to die, trust me.  I know when animals are supposed to die b/c I have to collect their ears. That means perfusion which is best done BEFORE they are dead as a doornail.

Another one died this morning.  I am about ready to cry I am so frustrated over it all.    Nobody wants to talk to me about it or let me have an opinion.  So here I sit with another dead animal on my hands hoping they don't decide to take it out on me and fire me.

I'm sorry about this, Drama.  It is really hard when a study animal dies (especially when it's an $8000 monkey), and I can't imagine having to deal with this on a regular basis.  

Do you have access to the old data?  Can you go back and look at the previous tech's data to see if she had the same sort of problem?  There should be some sort of written record, and I've always gotten the past tech's data to see how they did things so maybe some digging on your own will demonstrate that others had this same problem too.

I'm kind of hamstrung as to why the PI's are not willing to deal with something that is obviously not working.  Research animals are expensive and losing 50% of a study means that they study no longer has the power in order to get valid statistics unless they accounted for a 50% loss from the beginning of the study.  Some mice ARE cheaper such that you can account for this, but I know that some mice can be expensive too, depending on breed (it's been a long time since I have needed to order animals).

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

These are outbred mice so I am assuming then are cheaper than a knock out strain but I have never worked with these mice before so I don't know how exactly they are priced.

Wouldn't do me any good to go thru the old tech's data.  She was working on guiena pigs.   They said they haven't worked with this strain in a long time so I'd have to do some digging, there m ight be data.


I don't know what is going on either, you'd think they would be way more concerned since we've lost 29% of our stock already.    My guess is since they intend to breed them they don't really care since we can make more?

I am reminding myself it's not my fault this is working out the way it is.   I'm only here for 2 years, it's their decision if they want me to spend it chasing my tail or not.

It's not that I don't care.  It's incredibly frustrating to me when I lose an animal for no good reason.   I just don't know what to do about it since no one wants to listen. 

It was the same way in SR when their PCR wouldn't work.  I wanted to check the primers to see if they got damanged during transport, they said no. The research coordinator proved I was extracting DNA and wanted to check the primers/PCR solutions.  They said no it all worked in California so it should automatically work in Nebraska.

The former tech was supposed to help train me but when I requested help she informed me I shouldn't need to ask her questions. I should have been able to gleam everything I needed from her notes (which were written in a way that only she could follow them of course).

Eventually that blew up in my face big time.   BUT it did land me in the College of Pharmacy where I enjoyed five years.

Hopefully this don't blow up on me cause I'd rather not be unemployed.   DH is right though I need to start focusing elsewhere.   I'm going to do my job to the best of my ability but I am not going to waste time banging my head against the wall for fun.

[tcu2003]

You're still checking to see what's out there, right drama? I'm pretty sure you are - based on everything you've shared, I'd be continuously looking so you can hopefully get out of there sooner rather than later. I hope something shakes free soon and more openings and opportunities appear. I know you said most things have dried up right now.

[mojothehelpermonkey]

When I worked with mice, the non-transgenic ones were generally pretty cheap (<$10 each). The main expense was housing them. I would think the wasted time and effort would be a bigger concern for your PIs though.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Yeah I am still looking.  It would be dumb not to keep my resume active if I could be out of here by 2017.  I need as long as i can get.

Mojo I agree with you.  If an animal dies, it dies.   It's the wasted time and effort that is pissing me off b/c on top of that I have to wait for MORE animals.  If I could get my own I'd still be frustrated by all the deaths but much less resentful b/c I could pick up and carry on quickly.

ETA: I guess the package I signed for this afternoon is a new vital sign monitor.  It will monitor everything unlike now where all I can watch is heart rate.   That should make my life A LOT easier and maybe I can solve the mystery as to what is going on with these mice.

[debthaven]

Drama, I think you are right to still look for another job, but you are still young so I think you also have to look at the big picture, in terms of certification. When I last brought this up you mentioned C (can't remember the other letters). I honestly can't imagine you'd be happy doing that. 

What about the radiology tech position you had mentioned before? 

At your age you probably have 25-30 more years of work. PLEASE don't be short-sighted about this. If you have a relatively short training opportunity to get yourself into a better position, please consider it. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Radiology tech isn't a good one right now unles I can make DH move.  Around here all the radiology tecs are on call/part time.   The two programs I found are $30k+ so that isnt' going to be a good ROI when I already have $28k from my original bachelor's.  Especially in a market that is just as bad as my own.

I mentioned a CNA which doesn't pay shit but I am not qualified to get into the BSN program (GPA sucked and I am missing too many pre-reqs) so they suggested I go the long way around.  If I can I am hoping to get Boys Town to pay for it but need to wait six months.  I also need to look into if they have night rotation available.  They have night classes but I didn't see anything about night rotations.

The other one is hte Medical Tech program.  Which would cost me $4500 on top of having to take three pre-reqs I don't already have.   The market isn't good for them either right now and I'd have to quit my job to do that program.  So I am going to wait and see what happens in regards to the CNA and if they won't pay for that get them to pay for the three pre-reqs I need since I can justify they would serve me in my current positon (stats, biochem and immunology).

Phelbotomy is the third one.  Which also requires I not work during the duration of the program.   That is $900.  I didn't get in on the first round but was selected as an alternate.  I got offered the slot the day after I started here. So I figure if I can get in once I can get in again.

For now it's keep looking and see what is out there. 

[Ava]

I have a question regarding my current job.

When they moved us one hour away several people quit. There were 4 openings in another department, at one pay level higher than mine.

So I applied. The department I applied to has, over the years, hired employees from my department doing the job I'm currently doing.

I get the interview with the two managers in that department. They tell me they are surprised at the amount of applicants they have.

A couple of weeks later I ask one of them for feedback and he tells me they are still interviewing.

Two more weeks go by and I ask the other one if they have reached any decisions. He tells me they are done interviewing and are now deciding.

Another two weeks or so go by. I show up to work and both managers are walking around introducing the three new outside hires to everyone. One position is still listed as open.

I never got any feedback from these two managers. They never gave me any reason for not hiring me. I have the basic training to start on that job, including the computer system they use. I recently got my MBA which proves I am willing and able to learn, as I told them in the interview.

I told my manager that I only found out I hadn't been selected because they introduced me to the new employees. He said that was very bad form on their part and they should have given me some sort of feedback. It all looks very murky to me.

I am upset. One part of me wants to take the easy way out and let it go, and another part of me wants to go to HR with this so they can look into it a little further. I think one of the new hires is related to one of our top managers because I saw them talking and discussing personal stuff three days after she started here.

We are not talking about a small company where nepotism is to be expected. This is a big entity with thousands of employees.

Am I overreacting? Should I let this go?

[kjto1]

Ava, do people know that you are planning to move to Florida?  That could be the reason.

[Lizard Queen]

Hey, my last job they didn't post any positions internally. If it were a position of any consequence, I'd only find out from an email in the morning shortly before the new person came in to start, in some cases the email came before interviewees came in. Sometimes I'd spot a want-ad for a place suspiciously like my company. The email would come shortly afterward. That was a shitty place to work.

[Ava]

Sept 3, 2015 20:22:55 GMT -5 kjto1 said:

Ava, do people know that you are planning to move to Florida?  That could be the reason.

It's not general knowledge. My manager is aware of my plans but he doesn't have any notion of a time frame. All he knows is that at some point I'll be moving.

Anyway, in case I got the job I would have remained here a couple of years, while I took the CPA parts. I wasn't applying in order to quit six months later.

[flamingo]

Ava, based on your other posts, I'd let it go. You are planning to move to Florida, this is not a forever job for you, there is no reason to stir the pot. And while I agree they should have told you that you didn't get the position, I'm not sure they've done anything that HR can look into/investigate. So I definitely wouldn't go to HR about it.

I'd keep plugging away at work, and plot my escape to Florida as quickly as possible, if I were you.

[Ava]

Sept 3, 2015 20:40:18 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

Hey, my last job they didn't post any positions internally. If it were a position of any consequence, I'd only find out from an email in the morning shortly before the new person came in to start, in some cases the email came before interviewees came in. Sometimes I'd spot a want-ad for a place suspiciously like my company. The email would come shortly afterward. That was a shitty place to work.

That's very demoralizing and I'm sure it wasn't easy to work there. I don't like that sort of environment at all.

So far, I've applied to two jobs internally. The first was located in Houston. That was a really good job. I fit the description almost perfectly except that they wanted the candidate to have UCC experience. I don't have that. Guess what; I applied and was turned down in February. They are still posting that job. In all these months they could have trained me.

Now for this recent job I wasn't even rejected or given any sort of feedback or explanation. The managers just showed up with the three new outside hires a few days ago.

I am upset. I am almost certain I won't escalate this because I'm not confrontational at all and I run away from conflict (especially with people you see every day). But it has left a very bitter taste in my mouth.

Conclusion; I'm not applying for any more internal jobs.

[Ava]

Sept 3, 2015 20:55:06 GMT -5 flamingo said:

Ava, based on your other posts, I'd let it go. You are planning to move to Florida, this is not a forever job for you, there is no reason to stir the pot. And while I agree they should have told you that you didn't get the position, I'm not sure they've done anything that HR can look into/investigate. So I definitely wouldn't go to HR about it.

I'd keep plugging away at work, and plot my escape to Florida as quickly as possible, if I were you.

I think you are right.

I just started the two classes I need to sit for the Florida CPA. My current manager is accommodating my schedule so I can take the one that's only offered in the morning. Believe me, I am very grateful for that. He has proven himself to me, as a manager, over the time I've been working for him. I am glad to have him, and I also like the team I'm part of. It's a very good group.

The job I applied for, though, pays way better and I need to keep saving in order to move. And it's good to move up the food chain.

Yeah, I'll let it go, finish the classes and plot my escape to Florida when I come back from visiting family.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I told my manager that I only found out I hadn't been selected because they introduced me to the new employees. He said that was very bad form on their part and they should have given me some sort of feedback. It all looks very murky to me.

It's really not.   Employers generally do not give feedback if you do not get a job b.c there is always the risk you could come back and sue them if you feel the reason was discrimintatory.  You can argue up and down you would have NEVER sued but they can't be sure of that. 

Going to HR demanding answers is going to make you look like a spoil sport and that you can't respect company policy.

Oh and most internal jobs already have a selected candidate.  At UNMC if it says "internal candidate" it is code for someone already has the job.   They are legall obligated though to open to EVERYONE and pretend like you have a shot at getting it to again avoid potenital claims of discrimination.

I had the weirdest work dream last night.  I went to the hood to get my mice and there were no cage lids, all the cages were open.   I look into the cage and there are a ton of mice in there that shouldn't be.  Instead of disposing of them properly I start dropping them on the floor to escape thinking they are wild mice that got into the cages since there were no lids.

My bosses come in and tell me the were breeding the mice.  Crap.  So I am running around trying to catch all the mice i just set free and hope nobody figures out I lost them.   My cover is blown when a person picks up a mouse on the ground and carries it to my bosses.   They then proceed to grill me about what happened and I deny it.  They proceed ot start looking for more mice on the floor.

Then I woke up.

[mojothehelpermonkey]

Sept 3, 2015 20:40:18 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

Hey, my last job they didn't post any positions internally. If it were a position of any consequence, I'd only find out from an email in the morning shortly before the new person came in to start, in some cases the email came before interviewees came in. Sometimes I'd spot a want-ad for a place suspiciously like my company. The email would come shortly afterward. That was a shitty place to work.

While working at one of my previous jobs, I saw a job posted on a recruiter website that sounded like my manager's position in every way. I wanted to tell him, but it was a somewhat intense, back-stabby work environment, so I was tempted to keep my mouth shut. However, he had a kid that was a senior in high school and in the process of choosing a college. The manager was smart and hard working too. It was just that the COO had it out for him. Luckily, while I was deciding what to do, my manager announced that he was leaving for a new job. (Someone else confirmed later that it wasn't a case of him quietly giving his notice earlier so they could start finding a replacement. They were planning to fire him. )

Your company could have handled this a lot better, ava, but I don't think going to HR will do any good in the long run. It sucks, but it would probably be best to let it go and look for something better somewhere else.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Easy day today my bosses were out for a good chunk of it so I had only one mouse to do and I did a lot of data crunching.

Yay three day weekend.  Things should start speeding up here soon as we round the bend towards Thanksgiving/Christmas. 

I applied for a technician job at UNMC, didn't get an interview.  Not really shocked since there is a ton of competition and I am no longer an internal candidate.  It's REALLY hard to get into UNMC from the outside which is why I was so upset about not finding another job there even a temp one.

I was lucky to get this job when I did.  I need to view it that way b/c things could be A LOT worse.  It has a lot of things that make me frustrated but it's better than trying to compete against others for an even smaller pool of jobs.

We'll see if things pick up around the beginning of next year.  The plan was regardless of how I felt about this job that I would ramp things up in 2016 as far as job hunting goes. 

[mmhmm]

I hope you're documenting the hell out of what you're learning (male mice from a certain strain are the ones dying)! Even if nobody seems to want to listen, I'd want to have a very thorough documentation of what I did and what I learned. I'm all for CYA.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

They are huge on documentation here, I am buried in paperwork on a daily basis so it's all documented.

I had my one PI watch me yesterday. I told her this is seriously stressing me out and I'd like her to look over my shoulder to see if there is anything I am doing wrong.

She didn't see anything that could indicate I am the problem.   She said I'm extremely efficient in managing my time and handling the animals.  I know what I am doing or at least it appears so visually.

So that relieved some of my frustration.  

I am hoping we can get this new monitor installed so we can see EXACTLY what is going on with these guys.  IDK which issue is coming first the afib or the difficulty breathing with the current set up. 

If I know which one is coming first I may be able to save them. I won't get the data but I can at least preserve them for future study.

It'd also give me a better idea of what is killing them.  If it's the afib then it's the xylene.  If it's difficulty breathing then it's possibly the ketamine.