Bob Ross
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Post by Bob Ross on Mar 15, 2011 22:16:15 GMT -5
Here's the story:
A few days ago, we had a snow / rain storm, and when I woke up in the morning, I found water leaking through my guest room ceiling. There was drywall spotting and a slow drip at first, originating from a screw hole where the smoke detector was attached, but once I opened that hole up some, the drip got heavier, and ended up a steady stream by the evening. It subsided once the rain stopped. I went up on the roof, but couldn't locate the problem area. Best as I can tell, the water is draining off the top floor flat roof, and some seems to be going into the wall instead of into the gutter which leads to the lower floor flat roof. The gutter downspout exit, as well as the wall are directly above the guest room ceiling entry point.
Anyways, I call a couple of friends of mine, who own a roofing company, to come and take a look at it. I trust them more than any stranger, but at the end of the day, they're still in business to make a buck. They take a look and can't find any obvious culprit either, but their analysis is the same as mine. They also proceed to take a look at my roof as a whole, and suggest that it's time that I get a new roof.
Like I said, the roof is a flat roof, and is covered with an asphalt-like compound. They estimated it to be about 10 years since the top layer was applied, and said there seems to be four to five layers total on there. The top layer does look pretty worn. There aren't any obvious cracks yet, but there areas for water to pool, uneven surfaces, veins running through portions of it, patches, and a lot of what they called "crystalization"...basically it looks like hundreds of pebbles have been dug out of the surface, leaving pits. From our vantage point, they were able to point out neighbors' roofs that have been done well, and others that haven't, and it didn't take an expert to see the difference. My roof doesn't look like one of the good ones.
Anyways, they gave me a ballpark estimate for a new roof of much better quality which they said should last 15 years, plus new gutters, drywall repair in the guest bedroom, and replacing the ugly asphalt shingle fasod in the front of the house with slate. That last part I've been wanting to have done eventually...just not quite yet. The total cost would be approx. $4k to $5k.
They also said they could just try to find the leak and fix it, replace the drywall, fix the flash around the gutter which was done poorly, and put another topcoat on the roof, but that would only be a stop-gap solution and I'd probably have another problem within a year or two. That would cost approx $800 to $1200.
I'm leaning towards just saying screw it and going with the new roof, as I'm worried about what could happen if there's other roof leak related problems going on within my walls and not just this one that I can see. Plus it sounds like I'll end up needing a new roof at some point in the next few years regardless. Still, that's a lot of unexpected money to spend. I have the money, but it will put a nice dent in my EF.
What do you think? When it comes to roof leaks and water damage, is it best to play it safe?
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on Mar 15, 2011 22:54:25 GMT -5
Flat roofs suck.
$5000 is reasonable if they're doing anything with real slate.
That's why you have an emergency fund.
Is there any way to replace the flat roof with a sloped one? Build a new roof system with a slope on it? If you get snow, I can't see why they'd ever put a flat roof on. You probably had an ice dam that prevented the water to drain into the gutter system.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2011 23:04:54 GMT -5
My experience with leaks and roofs are very limited, and I don't know much about flat roofs. That said, they only do a max of two layers in the South. If you roof again, you have to tear off or the weight of the roof under snow could cause damage. (That's what I was told.) A tear-off increases the cost of the roof.
I paid $7000 to reroof my house about 18 months ago. But it's an A-frame with a carport and sunroom that are roofed. I point that out because my house is only 1600 square feet on the main floor, but the roof was a lot larger. They also had to tear-off and repair some decking (not much).
It sounds like you are getting a lot for your money, but it would depend on how many squares they are talking about.
I do know that you can't tell where the leak is from where it emerges. Water travels downward and not necessarily in a straight path. So it can be very difficult to find a small leak, but it can do a lot of damage.
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olderburgher
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Post by olderburgher on Mar 16, 2011 7:39:10 GMT -5
Like the old saying: You'll get what you pay for. Put a band-aid on the damn thing and you'll fix it and the interior plasterboard several more times in the next 12-18 months or do it right. Home repair isn't just a fresh coat of paint to hide a scar it is repair to maintain value and yeah I type this while waiting for my roofer to arrive to fix the leak in my flat garage roof.
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Mar 16, 2011 8:14:51 GMT -5
I agree with 2kids10horses. Flat roofs are usually a bad idea. Converting to a sloped roof might be better. If you go down that route, think about if you would want to add storage space or living space or vaulted ceilings because fixing the roof won't really increase the value or functionality of your house and if you're going to spend that kind of money, you might want to spend just a little bit more and have something that adds value or functionality. That being said, I have no idea how your house compares to others in the neighborhood or how long you plan to own the house and maybe just sticking with a flat roof is the way to go. Your friend should be able to help you price different options and a real estate agent could help you decide what's worth spending money on if you were going to resell.
If you already have water dripping down in your house, you might also find that you have a mold problem up in the ceiling or walls you don't know about. If you have to fix the drywall anyway, you might want to cut out a good sized chunk so you can inspect it.
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Havoc
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Post by Havoc on Mar 16, 2011 8:17:14 GMT -5
Under the circumstances you've described, I would bite the bullet and do the new roof.
On the financial side, spending $1k now on a fix only to have to spend 5k in two years isn't a great option (altho still an option if you just don't have the $$$ at hand). It sounds like a pretty fair price for the amount of work they are doing for you, and it is *great* to have someone you trust doing the work. I have had my fill of shoddy contractors.
On the emotional/peace-of-mind side, you don't want to be worrying about possible leaks that you can't see everytime you get a good rain over the next few years. An established mold colony within your walls is not a good neighbor, and a mold claim against your homeowners insurance is a kiss of death in many states (insurance co. drops you, which goes on your "insurance history" that companies share with each other, making your future insurability more difficult/more expensive).
So use the EF, then find some ways to save a little more or make a little more to build it back up...
Good luck!
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Post by isabella on Mar 16, 2011 8:35:54 GMT -5
What I would do ... how long are you planning to stay in this house? If long term I would consider the option of changing the roof from flat to sloped and possibly look at shingles with a longer life span than the approx. 15 years. The labor costs to put a 15 yr roof on will be the same as a 50 yr (expected life span 25'ish plus years depending on climate/conditions of your region. Check with your roofer) Things to consider will be if you are going to sell in the near future ... mortgage companies and homeowners insurance companies look to have at least 2 years on a roof for the next homeowner to get coverage and a loan. Roofs are considered maintenance items, upgrades don't necessarily increase value as far as asking for a higher selling price to recover the expense.
eta ... I would replace the roof, other leaks more than likely will develop as the roof continues to deteriorate and further water damage to interior just gets to be a pain as well as costly. Good luck.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2011 8:43:39 GMT -5
"Flat roofs suck" Or as my contractor friends say "All flat roofs leak". That said, it sounds like someone got a lot of use out of that roof if the last coat lasted 10 years. I think you need a new roof at this point too. It would be interesting to see what it would cost to get a sloped roof. I would only do it if you plan on being in the house for 10 years or longer. I've seen some interesting things done including sloping only one side and putting in a wall of windows at the high side. Sure lightens up a dark house or you can put a loft in the upper space.
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Clifford
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Post by Clifford on Mar 16, 2011 8:47:22 GMT -5
What does your homeowner's insurance policy say? Often if there is a traceable event (such as a severe storm), then the policy may cover roof repair/replace for a deductible (mine is $1K). Especially with interior damage, I would file a claim and see what happens. If they say yes, it gets fixed for much less out of pocket. If they say no, then get it fixed properly on your dime.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Mar 16, 2011 10:25:18 GMT -5
A couple of things: 1.) the roof could have been leaking for a very long time before it became obvious to you (the indoor waterfall). Moisture over time can cause all sorts of damage. 2.) sometimes it's hard to trace a leaking roof... My roof leaked (quite spectacularly!) but the water was traveling nearly 15 feet along the eves to the outer wall and then puddled on a sheet of plywood (part of the attic floor) which redirected the water in a cascade between the studs of an interior wall... only to show up as a cascade in the basement... no obvious water damage on the first floor. And the leak was no where near the plywood or where the water was flowing thru the wall.
Where am I going with this... the leak may have been leaking for months - so it may not have been caused by the current storm and sometimes the roof isn't leaking over the area where you see the interior problem.
What's the life span of flat roofs like the one you have in the area you live? How does your roof's age compare to that? Any extenuating circumstances that would cause more 'wear' on the roof - extreme weather over the years? Tree overhanging it? Is it possible the layers of roof under it shorten it's life?
If the roof is atleast midway thru it's suggested life time, and with the multiple layers under it, and if I was going to get atleast 5 years of 'use' out of the new roof... I'd probably go ahead and re-roof it. It's NO fun having to repair water damage - especially when it keeps happening after you think you've fixed the problem...
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kdamron
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Post by kdamron on Mar 16, 2011 10:44:08 GMT -5
This. My roof was probably 15 years when during a storm a banch from the tree next to the house fell on it (and I mean a branch on a branch on a branch - pretty high up but had around 60 rings when they got it down - tree's are old in my neighborhood). Took out a section of the brick, tore off the eaves and a few other relatively minor things. Total cost was about 15K and the insurance company paid everything but my deductible.
Even if you have to pay yourself I'd go with the new roof. As others have pointed out it appears you are getting a good price.
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 16, 2011 11:24:08 GMT -5
Bob, we once had a flat roof and nothing but problems until we went with a rubberized roof. Go for the new one. The price seems ok.
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Bob Ross
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Post by Bob Ross on Mar 16, 2011 12:18:19 GMT -5
Well, I went up on the roof this morning, and found a few gaps where the roof surface joins the flash near the suspected area of the leak that could be the culprit. I could fix those myself and see what happens, but based on all of the other factors that people mentioned, I'm guessing it'd still be best to just go ahead and replace the roof entirely.
I called my homeowners insurance company and initiated a claim, but I'm highly doubtful anything will come of that since this seems to have been caused by general deterioration and sub-par installation of the roof, and not by a specific event like a tree falling on it.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Mar 16, 2011 13:07:23 GMT -5
I share the others 'anti flat roof' sentiment. In AZ they are common (no snow loading and only 7 inches annual rain) but they almost all leak, just not enough to be a problem. They can never be perfectly flat, there will be 1/4 inch depressions or waviness. Water pooling (puddles) will be about 1/4" deep - often they find their way thru the surface before total evaporation occurs. That is especially true around the edges where the puddle is confined by flashing or some seam.
In truth, if I had one I would sell it - others may not feel that strongly.
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kdamron
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Post by kdamron on Mar 16, 2011 14:33:32 GMT -5
It can't hurt to try the insurance company! Ironically my neighbor had just been talking to me a month before about how he wished a storm would blow through so he could get a new roof because he was selling the house. He paid for his and I got mine free! Still, I'd rather not have gotten a 'free' roof in that way. Either way, a new roof sounds like the way to go. On top of everything else it sure makes the house look nice!
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Bob Ross
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Post by Bob Ross on Mar 16, 2011 15:23:09 GMT -5
It can't hurt to try the insurance company! I just did. They said no. In my situation they'd cover interior damage due to the water leak...basically the drywall repairs, but the cost of that won't be over my deductable. They'd also cover it if say, a tree fell on the roof or the wind blew it off, but not just deterioration over time. I figured as much, but thought I'd check to make sure.
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