bean29
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Post by bean29 on Nov 30, 2015 12:31:57 GMT -5
I don't think you can "suggest" someone host you, politely. Ask when a good time is to drop of presents, if you need to do that and are not inviting people over. Why not talk to your SON instead of your DIL, and ask HIM to host you? He's the one you have a direct relationship with, he's the one who you should be close enough to to forgo politeness and just let him know that you're retiring from hosting and would love an invite to an event he puts together. I totally agree. Why is this on the DIL? Why not the SON? 3 people have asked this, and so far no answer.......... Honestly I am not sure what difference this makes, my Mom could talk to my Brother about their plans, but he would discuss it with his wife first, not because he is henpecked, but because they have a good relationship. On the other hand, my MIL an DH make the plans for their family together all the time, and I don't necessarily have a lot of say in the situation. I am not the cook though. MIL and DH do all the cooking.
I do think that if cooking does not come naturally or the living space to entertain is not there, then plan to go out to dinner, breakfast or take the family to a Christmas play or movie or ice skating, or some other event as an alternative "holiday memory" for your grandchildren.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Nov 30, 2015 14:32:25 GMT -5
What about offering to show up with donuts, rolls, pizza, snacky food, or etc? With DHs fam when we lived in MO, the last 2 years, we kept food really snacky and casual so we could have more fun with playing with the kids. Plus we were leaving for IL the next morning both years so we didn't want a ton of leftovers. Keep it casual and fun. No reason to stress (unless you have food allergies). As someone with young kids, if you can come to me on Christmas and just want to see my kids, it makes things easier for sure.
Of course I just go and camp out at my mom's house (and my sister does the same), so Even though I go somewhere, we just get there and relax. I help out my mom, my DH does stuff for my dad and my parents hang out with the kids and Grandma complains about everything.
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on Nov 30, 2015 14:42:28 GMT -5
I totally agree. Why is this on the DIL? Why not the SON? 3 people have asked this, and so far no answer.......... Honestly I am not sure what difference this makes, my Mom could talk to my Brother about their plans, but he would discuss it with his wife first, not because he is henpecked, but because they have a good relationship. On the other hand, my MIL an DH make the plans for their family together all the time, and I don't necessarily have a lot of say in the situation. I am not the cook though. MIL and DH do all the cooking.
Because DILs always become the bad guy which contributes to tense relationships between MILs and DILs- case in point, the original post only mentions her DIL not cooking, not having them over for dinning, not bringing food to Thanksgiving and vetoing the Christmas hosting idea, nothing about her son. We have a firm rule in my house- you manage your own family. Sure, he talks to me about it and I have to push him into making phone calls and making things happen with his family, but he's the one that communicates and finalizes the plans. My influence is purely between us and behind the scenes.
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quince
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Post by quince on Nov 30, 2015 15:01:48 GMT -5
Yep. My husband manages his family. This means they are not receiving any more in the way of Christmas cards/gifts/information than before I came along. If they ever visit us (which they probably won't.) dude gets to take time off to host them. I'm not spending time around them without him. So far, only my family and friends know we're expecting. I think he plans to surprise his mom with a new baby during one of their Skype sessions.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 30, 2015 15:04:36 GMT -5
Honestly I am not sure what difference this makes, my Mom could talk to my Brother about their plans, but he would discuss it with his wife first, not because he is henpecked, but because they have a good relationship. On the other hand, my MIL an DH make the plans for their family together all the time, and I don't necessarily have a lot of say in the situation. I am not the cook though. MIL and DH do all the cooking.
Because DILs always become the bad guy which contributes to tense relationships between MILs and DILs- case in point, the original post only mentions her DIL not cooking, not having them over for dinning, not bringing food to Thanksgiving and vetoing the Christmas hosting idea, nothing about her son. We have a firm rule in my house- you manage your own family. Sure, he talks to me about it and I have to push him into making phone calls and making things happen with his family, but he's the one that communicates and finalizes the plans. My influence is purely between us and behind the scenes. Even though DS is living with someone very different than his usual selections, I hope she will like me as much as I like her and that DS gets off his mood about HER mother.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 15:05:14 GMT -5
We want an invitation to both houses, mostly to give the grandkids their presents.
I explained to my daughter that I was exhausted this Thanksgiving with all the cooking and cleaning. I'm not doing it for Christmas this year. My daughter said they would LOVE to have us down on Christmas morning . . . much easier than hauling five kids 45 minutes away.
Now I need to have my daughter-in-law invite us over. No to the inviting them over for cookies or something. That still puts me in the position of hosting, I did that already.
I guess when they call to ask what the "Christmas plans" are, I'll just say let us know when you want us to drop by.
None of you were here for Thanksgiving so you have no idea what an ordeal it was to cook for people who didn't really care to be here. We aren't doing that again any time soon. We aren't angry or upset. We just aren't doing it.
May be they didn't care to be there bc you are hugely projecting what an ordeal it was for you to have them there. That's an easy answer. It's all my fault. Problem solved.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Nov 30, 2015 15:29:20 GMT -5
Honestly I am not sure what difference this makes, my Mom could talk to my Brother about their plans, but he would discuss it with his wife first, not because he is henpecked, but because they have a good relationship. On the other hand, my MIL an DH make the plans for their family together all the time, and I don't necessarily have a lot of say in the situation. I am not the cook though. MIL and DH do all the cooking.
Because DILs always become the bad guy which contributes to tense relationships between MILs and DILs- case in point, the original post only mentions her DIL not cooking, not having them over for dinning, not bringing food to Thanksgiving and vetoing the Christmas hosting idea, nothing about her son. We have a firm rule in my house- you manage your own family. Sure, he talks to me about it and I have to push him into making phone calls and making things happen with his family, but he's the one that communicates and finalizes the plans. My influence is purely between us and behind the scenes. I am not making anyone the bad guy, I am just suggesting that if she can discuss with the son, maybe she should be more frank with the DIL, because if we can not find a way to discuss something with my SIL in person, we usually don't go to my brother, we find a different solution. I do sometimes discuss things with my Brother vs. my Sister -in-law, I am just saying that I kind of expect them to take the time to discuss what they want to do and get back to me.
Both my Brother and I have attended family events without our spouses or all of our kids. Sometimes you have to do that. My SIL also will serve deli meats, and my DN had cousin's subs at one of his kids parties. Sometimes to make something happen, you need to simplify things or modify your plans.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Nov 30, 2015 15:37:01 GMT -5
Others have given good advice on how to bring it up in a casual way.
But if you're hurt, offended, bothered, or upset by something someone does, it's OK to say so. You said "it's fine" or "it doesn't bother us" or "we weren't insulted" a fair number of times in the OP, which hints to me that it does upset you. Completely understandable.
As I posted in the Thanksgiving thread, my mom does the "it's fine" thing too. By this point I have learned enough not to take her at face value when she is clearly annoyed, but that has only succeeded in taking me from "Mom is acting weird, huh" to "Great, what did I (forget to) do now?" Actually saying "DD/DIL, it really upset me when you did X, Y, Z" is exceedingly uncomfortable if you hate confrontation, but it is a lot more effective at changing the hurtful behaviors. Passive aggression usually just breeds more passive aggression.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Nov 30, 2015 15:37:49 GMT -5
Most of you would totally suck at being Dutch. It is very common for Dutch people to just stop by for a visit. And if it happens to be around meal times, you sit down and eat → you just get what you get, though no one in his right mind would bring over 5 people to visit a family of 4 at dinner time without at least plenty of food in their hands. The reason to call ahead is to make sure that you don't stand in front of a locked door with nobody home or the family just leaving. Example on how this works: Wednesday night DS2 calls and asks me if they could come visit (read stay with me) for the Thanksgiving weekend. Reason for calling was a 900 mile drive with almost 2yo DGS. I had TG plans but they arrived after I was already home again. I had just enough time to all Xmas presents into the guestroom (I sleep there when they come since that room has a twin bed) change the bedding and grab some thing that could pose a danger to an inquisitive toddler. Hosting - schmosting → just relax and have fun (and I did believe you me). So what if my home wasn't perfect? You all do know that the cutest 2014 DGS is mine, all mine right?
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flamingo
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Post by flamingo on Nov 30, 2015 15:52:17 GMT -5
My mom has been pretty passive-aggressive with me this holiday season regarding visiting/not visiting and who is doing the traveling for this maybe visit. They live 5 hours away. My vacation time is already booked through the end of the year. We are all going to my sibling's college graduation in December, so they will see me then. Then I have a vacation planned with my DH over Christmas. I know my mom wants me to say that I will travel to them. Eventually she'll offer to pay my plane fare if I'll come. I've offered numerous times for them to come here and I'll pay for their hotel (though they have plenty of money; money isn't the issue). I'm not actually sure what her issue is, other than she's mad that I'm not picking up on her subtle hints.
I still wouldn't go see my parents in December, but it would be so helpful and much less stressful to just know what they want. I think that's the secret. Just say what you want. Nicely of course, but the worst that happens is they say no to your suggestion. But it takes the guesswork and stress out of it.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Nov 30, 2015 16:12:51 GMT -5
SS, looking at it from the outside, it seems like a lot of your problems stem from the fact that everything changes every year, and you never know what to expect from one year to the next. It seems like you're always at everybody's mercy, for lack of a better word.
Can you talk to your kids and try to come up with a new Christmas tradition between you and them that would suit them and their spouses?
I know that my parents often brought food over to my sister's house when her kids were little. We're Jewish so it's easy to pick up a dozen bagels, lox, cream cheese, etc, and have an "instant brunch". All my sister had to do was make coffee and tea and cut up a couple of tomatoes and onions.
That probably wouldn't work very well on Christmas morning, but then again, maybe it would?! You could bring bagels (or something else), Christmas cookies, and the gifts in the morning. Maybe a cake or two that your kids like (either store-bought or made at home.)
I know you have a LOT more people involved that we did/do, but DH is Christian, so we celebrate Christmas. We only have the kids and the kids' significant others and their families, but somehow we spent a decade or more with the kids going off (wherever, to their dad's, to their SO's families, to friends) for Christmas Eve, and then we hosted them all at home for Christmas Day. For the kids who are at home on Christmas Eve, we do a "Jewish Christmas Eve", i.e. a movie and Chinese food LOL. Maybe you could take the older kids out on Christmas Eve, and at the same time, drop the gifts off and have some time with the younger ones? Again, just a thought.
Again, I realise there were fewer people involved. I know it's much harder for you because you have so many grandkids ... but maybe you can start your own tradition? Christmas Eve, or Christmas morning? or snack time on Christmas Day? If you show up with brunch / cookies / gifts for the grandkids at a convenient time for all of you, and your kids don't live too far from each other, I don't see how that could go wrong. As the grandkids get older maybe your son and daughter can take turns?
Just my thoughts. :-)
ETA I know that with 4 kids it is very likely that I will one day be in the same boat, the in-laws will be demanding and I'll be the good egg, so I will cave, because who wants to INSIST that their kids spend the holiday with them?! But I like to think that I will try to think outside the box, and create our own, albeit different traditions.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 16:24:52 GMT -5
Others have given good advice on how to bring it up in a casual way. But if you're hurt, offended, bothered, or upset by something someone does, it's OK to say so. You said "it's fine" or "it doesn't bother us" or "we weren't insulted" a fair number of times in the OP, which hints to me that it does upset you. Completely understandable. As I posted in the Thanksgiving thread, my mom does the "it's fine" thing too. By this point I have learned enough not to take her at face value when she is clearly annoyed, but that has only succeeded in taking me from "Mom is acting weird, huh" to "Great, what did I (forget to) do now?" Actually saying "DD/DIL, it really upset me when you did X, Y, Z" is exceedingly uncomfortable if you hate confrontation, but it is a lot more effective at changing the hurtful behaviors. Passive aggression usually just breeds more passive aggression. No, it doesn't upset me. You guys read too much into things. When you type stuff on here, you are trying to explain stuff that you normally don't even think twice about. You try to anticipate what people will say. You also tend to repeat stuff from thread to thread so that it sounds like you think about it a lot. I honestly don't. However, many of you try to project your family dynamics on to my family dynamics. That's not really fair.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Nov 30, 2015 16:31:53 GMT -5
I don't think Mid is being unfair, I think she's just reading between the lines. FWIW, I read the same thing she does, that you're hurt.
I'd be hurt too. You're always trying to accommodate everyone and getting the short end of the stick. You are not the hinge that squeaks so you're not the hinge that gets oiled.
I wouldn't be confrontational either, but I WOULD try to establish a new tradition so that I wouldn't have to go through this every year.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Nov 30, 2015 16:36:42 GMT -5
I have to announce to my family that they will either come to my house Christmas eve or celebrate the holiday without me. good luck with that. I did that with my family for Thanksgiving, as I wasn't up for travelling a good 5h round trip drive to have dinner. you'd have thought I was informing them that I was moving to the damn moon. sorry, I'm aware I'm single and don't have to plan around a spouse's family, but that doesn't mean that y'all get to dictate what I do. I'm sorry I couldn't plan to host all of you b/c I wasn't entirely sure that I wouldn't be working all weekend, but I still managed to figure out that I would actually be able to do so in time to shop for the menu. y'all decided for me, and wouldn't budge. so, I hope you enjoyed your day, I actually had a very relaxing one myself.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Nov 30, 2015 16:49:04 GMT -5
Just trying to provide another perspective. I'm sorry for misinterpreting. Good luck with whatever you decide.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 16:57:54 GMT -5
I don't think Mid is being unfair, I think she's just reading between the lines. FWIW, I read the same thing she does, that you're hurt. I'd be hurt too. You're always trying to accommodate everyone and getting the short end of the stick. You are not the hinge that squeaks so you're not the hinge that gets oiled. I wouldn't be confrontational either, but I WOULD try to establish a new tradition so that I wouldn't have to go through this every year. I didn't mean that Mid was unfair. I was referring to all the posters who were projecting their own MILs on me. There is no use trying to establish a tradition. We have tried. My son-in-law didn't even come. He was at the football game. We understood: it was the Alabama/Auburn game. We could have tried to reschedule, I guess. We no longer cared at that point. The moment had passed. It is much more honest to admit that this isn't working for us. That's much better than playing the martyr, a role I am not very good at.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Nov 30, 2015 17:06:39 GMT -5
SS, I truly hope that you can find a solution that works for you. Maybe just the kids?
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Nov 30, 2015 17:09:35 GMT -5
Could you just do a New Year's get together? The kids can get their gifts then and not have to rush off elsewhere. There's a sort of tradition of my aunt having a bonfire at her house on New Year's Eve. (Mostly when her DD is home from the UK, which will happen this year) It's probably the easiest holiday get together of the bunch. No one has to rush off elsewhere, or get home to get kids in bed so Santa can come and also sleep more than 2 hours. Or maybe have Thanksmas somewhere in between the 2 dates.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Nov 30, 2015 17:14:39 GMT -5
I didn't mean that Mid was unfair. I was referring to all the posters who were projecting their own MILs on me. There is no use trying to establish a tradition. We have tried. My son-in-law didn't even come. He was at the football game. We understood: it was the Alabama/Auburn game. We could have tried to reschedule, I guess. We no longer cared at that point. The moment had passed. It is much more honest to admit that this isn't working for us. That's much better than playing the martyr, a role I am not very good at. I might have been a little pissed off (but I also don't 'get' college football )
To be honest, your posts on the subject come off as sad about the situation more than anything. I do think you are being realistic about the holidays, but wonder if it may be time to try something else, such as the week before... Christmas in July... or some other time that isn't on one of 'the days'. It's a state of Alabama thing in particular. There's no pro sports team, just the two big college teams. That's enough. I actually got my sister to DVR the game because I had somewhere to be that I couldn't get out of. She hosted my parents and I, but didn't wait until I got home, but she did start it late (to be able to FF through commercials) so I got to see the 2nd half. Yay! You either get it, or you don't.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 17:34:07 GMT -5
Why can't you just say, "We're not cooking for Christmas this year, but we'd still like to see the kids on Christmas Day (or Christmas Eve if that works better) and bring them their gifts" and let the conversation go from there.
My family's Christmas Day tradition started when I was a little girl. My Grandmother wanted Santa to have gifts for her grandkids at her house too, so somehow that turned into Santa leaving gifts at my Mom's house and my Aunt's house too for everybody. We started early in the morning (with church sometimes) and went to everyone's house. Whatever SO's or spouses joined our family knew that was the tradition. The good thing was that we started so early, we also finished early so there was plenty of time to see IL's and whoever else. Once we got settled in one spot, people would come and go all day to see different members of my family.
We continued that when the grandkids had kids. Now they're all adults and we just meet at one house and bring all the gifts. The gifts are seperated into piles for each recipient and they're still from Santa, so half the time you don't really know who gave you what. I like it. My wacky brother even managed to host Christmas a few years ago, in the tiny apartment he shared with his girlfriend. It was just a week after we'd buried my Grandmother, and nobody really had the Christmas spirit, so he offered to host and was SO excited that we all agreed to come. We were stuffed in there like sardines, but so what, we were all together and my Grandmother wouldn't have wanted us to have not been together on Christmas just because we were sad.
To me, the holidays aren't really about gifts and such. They're about spending time with family. It's not a knock against anyone whose family dynamics are more complicated than mine, but I'm very grateful that my family has always managed to spend holidays together without a lot of fuss or drama. I hope your family finds a way to work it out so that it's a good day for all of you.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 17:42:13 GMT -5
Most of you would totally suck at being Dutch. It is very common for Dutch people to just stop by for a visit. And if it happens to be around meal times, you sit down and eat → you just get what you get, though no one in his right mind would bring over 5 people to visit a family of 4 at dinner time without at least plenty of food in their hands.
The reason to call ahead is to make sure that you don't stand in front of a locked door with nobody home or the family just leaving. Example on how this works: Wednesday night DS2 calls and asks me if they could come visit (read stay with me) for the Thanksgiving weekend. Reason for calling was a 900 mile drive with almost 2yo DGS. I had TG plans but they arrived after I was already home again. I had just enough time to all Xmas presents into the guestroom (I sleep there when they come since that room has a twin bed) change the bedding and grab some thing that could pose a danger to an inquisitive toddler. Hosting - schmosting → just relax and have fun (and I did believe you me). So what if my home wasn't perfect? You all do know that the cutest 2014 DGS is mine, all mine right? Maybe my Grandmother was Dutch lol. That's how her house was. People just stopped by and if she'd just cooked dinner, she'd happily share. I never did quite figure out how she always had enough food to share with whoever stopped by, but never so much that it went to waste. Obviously some of her good genes skipped over me, including the "great cook" gene.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Nov 30, 2015 17:49:21 GMT -5
Hi cousin @pinkcshmere
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Nov 30, 2015 18:09:44 GMT -5
I think it helps to have/create a plan or tradition. So you know what is expected. We always alternated if we spent Christmas at my mom's parents or dad's parents. As my siblings got older it molded to we went to my dad's parents the weekend before Christmas and then Christmas with my mom's side. Thanksgiving with my parents is actually now "birthday Saturday". That day is reserved. My brother refuses to get together with anyone Christmas day, but we reserve the 26th for the big family get together.
Now I really don't have in-laws to try to plan around and more. So, I guess I don't have to worry about that any more.
I guess my point is that it makes everything easier if you can have something that your kids to point to and say this is when we get together with Mon. Even if it is, mom comes over at 8am Christmas morning to see the kids open presents from Santa. Or New Year's Day we chill out at mom's house and get together then.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Nov 30, 2015 20:02:38 GMT -5
He is a guy. Guys don't make plans like this. The lady folk do. when i plan, I've usually effed it up, or not been decisive enough in getting all the details worked out, but, I've also effed it up if i make some deicsions without stopping to talk to DW about it.
if i could change one thing about my marriage, it would be our dynamic on family get togethers, that are the bright spot in my year, but a burden to her.
Dude. They are a bright spot for you because she plans them.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Nov 30, 2015 21:08:12 GMT -5
When my nieces and nephews were toddlers, somehow it was decided that our Christmas would be the Sunday after the 25th. My brother hosts unless one of us forces the issue and demands to do it. It's worked pretty well over the years, overall. As for equal time on Christmas, it's really not going to happen. But my family does gather for a couple of other holidays and those are the hills I will die on. My mil is NOT getting us on Memorial Day, Labor Day or the July 4th (or thereabouts)camping in Door County weekend. So for us, there is a balance of sorts. It's not equal but it does seem fair. Or at least no one is complaining about it to me. As for Thanksgiving, dh has dietary issues and it's just easier to stay home. My family doesn't do much for it anyway and while mil does, we're off the hook for the most part due to the dietary stuff.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Dec 1, 2015 12:36:35 GMT -5
Some of us can't stand large groups of people, even if it's all people we love. It's mentally exhausting. I don't like hosting anyone, even just my parents.
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HoneyBBQ
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Post by HoneyBBQ on Dec 1, 2015 13:08:01 GMT -5
He is a guy. Guys don't make plans like this. The lady folk do. when i plan, I've usually effed it up, or not been decisive enough in getting all the details worked out, but, I've also effed it up if i make some deicsions without stopping to talk to DW about it.
if i could change one thing about my marriage, it would be our dynamic on family get togethers, that are the bright spot in my year, but a burden to her.
Of course you should check with the wife and make sure you did it right! But when it comes to the 'management' and discussion part, you could do that with your side of the family.
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Dec 1, 2015 13:58:30 GMT -5
Honestly I am not sure what difference this makes, my Mom could talk to my Brother about their plans, but he would discuss it with his wife first, not because he is henpecked, but because they have a good relationship. On the other hand, my MIL an DH make the plans for their family together all the time, and I don't necessarily have a lot of say in the situation. I am not the cook though. MIL and DH do all the cooking.
Because DILs always become the bad guy which contributes to tense relationships between MILs and DILs- case in point, the original post only mentions her DIL not cooking, not having them over for dinning, not bringing food to Thanksgiving and vetoing the Christmas hosting idea, nothing about her son. We have a firm rule in my house- you manage your own family. Sure, he talks to me about it and I have to push him into making phone calls and making things happen with his family, but he's the one that communicates and finalizes the plans. My influence is purely between us and behind the scenes. I got to this point five years ago. It was one thing when DH was working and I didn't have paid employment. But after flying across the country on our dime to take care of MIL after an operation with my thank you being run ragged and DH and family being told that I was drinking two bottles of wine a night ( oh I could have used THAT! ) I told DH and his aunts that I would never do that to myself again. Now the family is seeing what a narcissist she is. But I'm still a bad DIL. Too "f"ing bad. I'm the one who managed the B-day, M-day, Christmas presents, et cetera. I don't mind still doing that but DH is retired and he can make the quarterly visits. He's a good son, calls her every week but she's stubborn and crazy and there's nothing we can do at this point except wait for the inevitable crisis which will land her in assisted living.
MIL has done a fabulous job of turning my favorite holiday into something I dread.
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cktc
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2013 22:15:31 GMT -5
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Post by cktc on Dec 1, 2015 14:38:26 GMT -5
Do you get along well enough with your DIL's family to tag along to their dinner? Thanksgiving is usually more inclusive than Christmas, but in my circles hosts generally include immediate-extended family for both holidays.
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Deleted
Joined: Oct 7, 2024 6:16:59 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2015 17:29:26 GMT -5
Do you get along well enough with your DIL's family to tag along to their dinner? Thanksgiving is usually more inclusive than Christmas, but in my circles hosts generally include immediate-extended family for both holidays. Were you talking with me? I don't think her mom did anything for Thanksgiving; that's why we invited her to our house. However, my DIL does do something with her mom's extended family somewhere in that timeframe. I can't even figure out how to get my DIL to ask us over so I don't think inviting ourselves to their extended family event would work either. When they call . . . which someone will . . . I'll just say, "Oh, great! We've been meaning to call to work out when we could bring the kids their presents." Thanks for that suggestion, someone. We actually are taking my son/DIL out to a comedy club show on NYE. We do that every year. So it's not like we have to do something for Christmas as long as the kids get their presents from us. DH puts a lot of effort and $$$ into those stockings. They are really important to him.
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