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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2015 20:50:48 GMT -5
There is a reason homeschooling is booming hickle. And why in response more schools are offering blended programs.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2015 21:13:02 GMT -5
There is a reason homeschooling is booming hickle. And why in response more schools are offering blended programs. What do you mean by 'booming'? I do not know much about home schooling, but I did not think it was very prevalent. My guess is less then 5% of students and only that high because you said 'booming'. I really would guess less then 2%. Am I far off? I guess I could google it though. What are blended programs? Are they more self structured? I wish my granddaughters would be made to do extra learning on their own, but their mothers don't agree. One is learning spanish, but only because one set of grandparents are from El Salvador and speak that. One granddaughter wanted to take 3 or 4 AP classes and the school recomended less then that. I suggested learning something on her own, but she (the granddaughter) wanted the prestige of so many AP classes. None of the three read as much as their mothers did, but I think that is because of internet. Books were such easy company 20 years ago, now there is even easier company. thank you for answering my questions.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2015 21:27:35 GMT -5
Hickle, homeschooling is about 3.4% right now. It's increase like 60% over the last decade though, and is rising 5-8% a year depending on localities and statistics I've found. Those stats also don't always count all homeschoolers.
Blended. Most schools around here allow you to go in to the school just for certain classes if you choose. Most colleges around here allow you to dual enroll and run other programs. You can 'blend' an education between public/private/home...
Rukh. I need to find a computer.. If I don't get there tonight I'll answer tomorrow...
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on Sept 20, 2015 22:23:55 GMT -5
I think the ability of k-12 to prepare a student for the future depends on the school. My kids got/are getting a great education at their school. Except that I think going to college is given too much emphasis and several of the teachers/administrators make it sound too hard to get in. As in; one wrong step and your doomed for the rest of your life. I've worked with our supervisors to hire basic production workers. All I want is what a basic school wants: show up on time, go to lunch on time, don't come in under the influence, play nice in the sandbox. We would teach the workers EVERYTHING else they needed! We provided ALL tools and small classes to advance with further skills! The highest reason we fired/let someone go............lack of desire to show up on time I interviewed people for some of the higher jobs requiring a college education. A portfolio was nice but I really needed to see that diploma. It proved that you 'learned to troubleshoot and make an intelligent guess' as well as how to navigate red tape. In my industry, there is a need to work undirected on projects. But that is after you have proven to be a reliable worker on directed projects. There is too much money and time involved in assuming someone's portfolio is not fabricated. And my DD1 went to college with a GED. Actually, she got into college with no diploma or GED. She had to get one later in order to get a job............3 years of college and had to get a GED in order to get a basic retail job.............
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on Sept 20, 2015 22:27:15 GMT -5
She's still in college........... in case something thinks she dropped out for a retail job..............
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Sept 21, 2015 10:09:37 GMT -5
The other issue is the practical vs pure education aspect of college degrees. And, we've had this conversation before and I am definitely on outlier on opinion. There is a zeitgeist that wants a college degree to seamless move into a particular job that immediately offers a good return on the money invested. Certainly, the portfolio approach may do well in that respect and I think there are a lot of jobs currently that are using specific short-term and practical learning ops with a certifying exam for a lot of jobs. I have always regarded a 4 year degree as just a basic, well rounded, able to hold your own in conversation exposure to a broad array of basic knowledge and the ability to work with ideas, some that you may not agree with. History, foreign language, hard and social sciences, a bit of math and english, etc. I'm with you there as an outlier. When it gets down to 'learning the basics needed for a "job" - I think one's college education is generally about the foundation knowledge needed for a job - what the job specific words mean, what are the basic principles and how should they be applied, what basic "work" stuff looks like, how it fits into a bigger whole, ie how to navigate thru and how what it is you are studying/learning works in a Perfect World. Unfortunately, the real working world is messy - the basic principles/skills/whatever you learned in College/school ARE important and are at the base of 'work' - but being able to applying those principles/skills/whatever you learned to make sense of the 'imperfect' working world is the skill you need.
A long time ago, as an 'experiment', my department hired a really bright recent graduate to be a Junior Developer. He knew his stuff - coding stuff, database stuff, some web stuff. He wasn't expected to 'hit the ground running' - he didn't have much work experience (or experience with IT stuff outside of home and school). But, he seemed to have all the right foundation knowledge to be able to quickly make the transition. Unfortunately, he didn't cope well with the mild chaos that was our existing code/database/web stuff.
It's one skill set to 'know' your stuff - and another skill set to be able to 'use' your stuff in a meaningful way.
School teaches the "know" part and some of the "use" part.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Sept 21, 2015 13:02:52 GMT -5
I'm not sure I agree that public education should be about job training. Education should be about teaching kids to read, write, do math, do science, technology and such.
Later on, vocational training makes sense, but mostly it should focus on building a solid foundation.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 17:52:51 GMT -5
Honestly. most of the disconnect between education and job listings comes from our weird push to have every kid get a BA/BS. Community colleges tend to do a really good job of offering certificates in specific areas that local employers want. At the community college I went to the people doing the welding certification program were getting job offers before they completed the certificate, and the starting salaries were pretty decent. Every school counselor and parent is telling kids to get a BA in liberal arts instead. Did your education better prepare you for working as an employee or as a entrepreneur? I think people being able to self-direct and learn as they go is what is going to be needed in the future. If that is a personal question you do not want to answer, then don't. I always respected your risk taking and your generous sharing of your experiences.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Sept 21, 2015 20:08:39 GMT -5
If my kids don't want to pursue a 4 year degree, that's fine. However, I'm not going to encourage them to go to a 2 year school to be a welder so they can earn 25-35K/year. I don't consider this a good job..
A two year accounting associates degree pays more.
I'm sure plumbers and electricians get paid more than 25K-35K/year. Shit, even the starting salary for a bus driver is more than a welder, and with overtime, there's always a few bus drivers that pull in over 100K.
We have begun talking to our oldest about what kind of lifestyle he wants to live, and what kind of jobs will support that lifestyle. He wants to travel the world. He wants to have a car and a house. Living with 5 other people to keep his expenses down does not appeal to him. He's going to have to steer clear of jobs that pay under 40K, college degree or not.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 20:18:16 GMT -5
If my kids don't want to pursue a 4 year degree, that's fine. However, I'm not going to encourage them to go to a 2 year school to be a welder so they can earn 25-35K/year. I don't consider this a good job.. A two year accounting associates degree pays more. I'm sure plumbers and electricians get paid more than 25K-35K/year. Shit, even the starting salary for a bus driver is more than a welder, and with overtime, there's always a few bus drivers that pull in over 100K. We have begun talking to our oldest about what kind of lifestyle he wants to live, and what kind of jobs will support that lifestyle. He wants to travel the world. He wants to have a car and a house. Living with 5 other people to keep his expenses down does not appeal to him. He's going to have to steer clear of jobs that pay under 40K, college degree or not. welders get paid a lot more the 25 to 35k a year.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 20:18:49 GMT -5
The neighbor boy graduated from welding tech high school last year, 30K starting with benefits. He gets a lot of overtime in addition. It's not a bad start.... And he only had that year of vo-tech... He also did get his pipeline welding cert, I'm sure he could make more there if he wanted to leave town.
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on Sept 21, 2015 22:27:48 GMT -5
Welding is a field that is expanding rapidly. There are more people retiring than starting. A welder with a few years experience can make $25 to $30 per hour in our area. Another area is aviation maintenance. We can't find enough people fast enough and more people are retiring faster than young people are taking the classes. This is a good, high paying field that people don't think about. Really, 2 year or vo-tech degrees are great for most people. But so many people don't know what is out there and how good the money is in what category. Esp as the colleges aren't always honest about this (personally, I think this is due to not having teachers who were in the industry for a while).
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on Sept 21, 2015 22:35:30 GMT -5
Welders that I know have the option of jobs that allow them to travel a lot, some jobs you never leave the town, others you can travel all the time. So do aerospace workers once they have their airframe license. I think its very important to recognize that not everyone wants to or can work at a desk. The problem is..........our education system has embraced that fact that one must have a high tech desk job to make good money. And its NOT true! But because of it, I see very competent and intelligent young people stop their education at high school as 'I like to work with my hands', 'my family can't afford college', 'I don't want to sit at a desk all day'.
I do a lot of mentoring of young people. Sometimes, I think the school regrets their decision to have me come in. But my kids typically go on to jobs they love!
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violagirl
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Post by violagirl on Sept 22, 2015 7:02:35 GMT -5
I think a BA is the new Grade 12. In my experience it was only when I got to my Masters that I started learning things that are directly related to my everyday job. People who view learning that stops at school are going to be left behind. The new employment environment means you always need to think several years ahead about what will differentiate you. If I had stopped at community college, I would have a lot less options. People are increasingly going to have to be versatile. I'm not a computer programmer but I can do some basic programming. I'm not afraid when new interface or technology is thrown at me. I worked at an office where they amalgamated and didn't want to lay off all of the admin assistants who were close to retirement. I worked in the accounting department with a woman who would use a calculator to add a row of numbers - then write the answer in Excel. So take accounting - it is becoming more automated. The real future is in analysis and in higher level whole business perspectives. So if your aspiration is to work only as a tax preparer, don't be surprised when those positions start to disappear. I consider myself to be reasonably intelligent and educated. I think about what people who are not similarly blessed will do. I think it will be harder for them to get work. On the other hand, they can't convince people around here to work in the assembly plants. People show up for one day and don't go back because it is hard work. They are desperate for truck drivers but can't find anyone who consistently passes the drug tests. I think people will need to be creative and necessity is the mother of invention. I see evidence of this in my current location. Traditionally - not a lot of jobs. That spawns two types of people: the ones who give up and become content with welfare as a "job" and the entrepreneurs. They may not make a billion dollars but they can make enough money to support their families. There are a lot of extremely creative people here not entirely by choice. Maybe our Western ideas of success will have to change. Smaller houses, less stuff, shorter work week and job sharing.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Sept 22, 2015 10:16:31 GMT -5
And yet they do it every year - and have for many millenniums.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Sept 22, 2015 14:47:07 GMT -5
Look, reading Shakespeare is cool and all, he's one of the most influential authors in human history, but how many employers want a well written literary analysis of Hamlet? How many would much rather have a person with some hands on experience with autoCAD software? Here is from our local CC: CAD Technology Basic Certificate (BC) Details: Basic Certificate (BC) Credit Hours (CH) 16 Program/Plan Number 139 Open For Enrollment Yes Career Possibilities Architectural and Civil Drafter Courses Printable Brochure + - Program Core Requirements 16 CH CAD Technology CAD TEC 130 CAD Technology I 3 CAD TEC 170 CAD Technology II 3 CAD TEC 171 CAD Technology III 3 Engineering ENGR 190 Computer Applications In Engineering 3 Mathematics MATH 140 College Algebra 4 Total Minimum Credit Hours 16 No need for a degree, total cost likely not more than 2k. It's there is you want it, so I don't know what the issue is. I'm going through a program that contains a lot of these classes. Only difference is that it is a 2 year program, not a one year. It also encompasses way more CAD software than this apparently has (by the time the program is over, I should be fluent in about 5 different programs). So far, along with this I gotten a basic understanding of electronics, material science, piping and process design and drafting (which REALLY makes you appreciate how much easier it is to do on a computer). The one thing that is important, but isn't stressed here is that you MUST have strong math skills, particularly algebra and trig. If you don't, you can't do it....period.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 22, 2015 14:51:40 GMT -5
Welding is a field that is expanding rapidly. There are more people retiring than starting. A welder with a few years experience can make $25 to $30 per hour in our area. Another area is aviation maintenance. We can't find enough people fast enough and more people are retiring faster than young people are taking the classes. This is a good, high paying field that people don't think about. Really, 2 year or vo-tech degrees are great for most people. But so many people don't know what is out there and how good the money is in what category. Esp as the colleges aren't always honest about this (personally, I think this is due to not having teachers who were in the industry for a while). The trades in general are this way- the trend is called the "graying of the trades". Lots of opportunities. They can make whatever they want in China and India, and you can call there for support. But if you need it serviced, you will be calling a local technician. The robots are not coming to fix the AC anytime soon.
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