mollyanna58
Junior Associate
Joined: Jan 5, 2011 13:20:45 GMT -5
Posts: 6,668
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Post by mollyanna58 on Aug 15, 2015 2:40:05 GMT -5
There is no way to get an accurate theory on all the damage, death and suffering that America has caused in the Middle East and elsewhere with our relentless war mongering. I'm sure if you tried hard enough you could find some stats on all the damage, death, and suffering we have caused in the Middle East. What in the world does that have to do with North Korea? I have no idea what your point is, other than "Kim Jung-Un must be nice because I think we messed up in the middle east."
I believe the point is that the USA is not the world's policeman, and it's not our business to interfere with the internal operations of other countries.
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mroped
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 17, 2014 17:36:56 GMT -5
Posts: 3,453
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Post by mroped on Aug 15, 2015 6:35:29 GMT -5
Yes Ratchets, we do trade with pretty much everybody in the world including with China and with them in really big quantities more so then thought or known. But somehow we don't end up invading China every time their glorious leaders or some asshat in the mountains decides to kill people and erase villages. There we apply the "not my monkey, not my circus!" Because we have the understanding that it could be messi. On the other hand when we hear about some other little country or even bigger ones that we know we could possibly control we are all up in arms and ready to send somebody in fully loaded.
In the nineties, when the conflict broke out in former Yugoslavia, U.S. Got in just to save face and after numerous requests from the European community. Why? Because there is nothing there that we can take! Nothing that could make us money at the end.
Invading NK would be the same: there is nothing we can take so we have no interest in going in. On one hand that's good because they should be let to deal with their own problems. They are a sovereign nation after all recognized by the international community. So is their leader like it or not. On the other hand, we should go in and end once and for all this circus with tyrannical dynasties and so on. The people would get their freedom and reunite as a country, maybe bring about absolute peace and stability in the region. However, there is a big difference between say Yugoslavia and NK: the former, didn't have China as a neighbor! It is just my supposition but if we were to compare the number of victims resulted from the way the NK government is running business and the Chinese one, we would probably end with a higher number in China. But again, that's to big of a dog to poke it with a stick!
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Deleted
Joined: May 5, 2024 4:28:04 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2015 8:31:25 GMT -5
There is no way to get an accurate theory on all the damage, death and suffering that America has caused in the Middle East and elsewhere with our relentless war mongering. I'm sure if you tried hard enough you could find some stats on all the damage, death, and suffering we have caused in the Middle East. What in the world does that have to do with North Korea? I have no idea what your point is, other than "Kim Jung-Un must be nice because I think we messed up in the middle east."
My point was that if we want to stop bad things happening, we dont need to look to North Korea to find a place to start.
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weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
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Post by weltschmerz on Aug 15, 2015 14:56:31 GMT -5
It's only been a few days since sanctions were lifted from Cuba. Kerry was already over there, pushing American democracy on them. Maybe they don't want democracy. Maybe they want another kind of system But no. "We're here and this is what you should do!!"
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Robert not Bobby
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jan 29, 2013 17:45:55 GMT -5
Posts: 1,392
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Post by Robert not Bobby on Aug 15, 2015 15:05:31 GMT -5
It's only been a few days since sanctions were lifted from Cuba. Kerry was already over there, pushing American democracy on them. Maybe they don't want democracy. Maybe they want another kind of system But no. "We're here and this is what you should do!!" Welts are you this frantic, this much of a drama queen, in real life? Kerry wasn't being some American overlord, he was just saying...it would be nice if the Cuban people actually had a voice in who their masters are. It is still, sort of, communist, it is still dirt poor and you Canadians can still go down for cheap vacations... So its all good.
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weltschmerz
Community Leader
Joined: Jul 25, 2011 13:37:39 GMT -5
Posts: 38,962
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Post by weltschmerz on Aug 15, 2015 15:34:59 GMT -5
It's only been a few days since sanctions were lifted from Cuba. Kerry was already over there, pushing American democracy on them. Maybe they don't want democracy. Maybe they want another kind of system But no. "We're here and this is what you should do!!" Welts are you this frantic, this much of a drama queen, in real life? Kerry wasn't being some American overlord, he was just saying...it would be nice if the Cuban people actually had a voice in who their masters are. It is still, sort of, communist, it is still dirt poor and you Canadians can still go down for cheap vacations... So its all good. Frantic? Where do you see frantic?
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mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
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Post by mmhmm on Aug 15, 2015 15:39:10 GMT -5
Robert not Bobby, will you please be kind enough to speak to the topic under discussion instead of about the other posters? Much appreciated. Thanks. mmhmm, Administrator
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Robert not Bobby
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jan 29, 2013 17:45:55 GMT -5
Posts: 1,392
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Post by Robert not Bobby on Aug 15, 2015 15:45:10 GMT -5
OK mmhmm
Thanks for reminding me.
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mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
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Post by mmhmm on Aug 15, 2015 15:48:26 GMT -5
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deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
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Post by deziloooooo on Aug 15, 2015 18:20:26 GMT -5
It's only been a few days since sanctions were lifted from Cuba. Kerry was already over there, pushing American democracy on them. Maybe they don't want democracy. Maybe they want another kind of system But no. "We're here and this is what you should do!!" Funny but I don't have a problem with say a Kerry saying what ever and still we have normal relations with a country rather what we had for 54 years..a antagonistic attitude..adverserial ...They too, their foreign secretary or what ever also brought up our own problems here..the racial problems ..the problems of police shootings...He is correct..difference is we publicly acknowledge these problems and it seems much is being tried to get a handle on these things...where as in Cuba..they, at least now..don't want to acknowledge they may have some problems..Personally , over time..and it will take time..but by having open normal relations..even with the differences..I believe it will to open the country up a bit...even though I wouldn't be surprised if they clamp down even harder for a while just because they can..then we just might slow down and relax curbs...but in time it will become more normal...After 54 years..it is time...
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fishy999
Familiar Member
Joined: Aug 9, 2015 20:40:43 GMT -5
Posts: 629
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Post by fishy999 on Aug 16, 2015 20:04:33 GMT -5
Yes Ratchets, we do trade with pretty much everybody in the world including with China and with them in really big quantities more so then thought or known. But somehow we don't end up invading China every time their glorious leaders or some asshat in the mountains decides to kill people and erase villages. There we apply the "not my monkey, not my circus!" Because we have the understanding that it could be messi. On the other hand when we hear about some other little country or even bigger ones that we know we could possibly control we are all up in arms and ready to send somebody in fully loaded. In the nineties, when the conflict broke out in former Yugoslavia, U.S. Got in just to save face and after numerous requests from the European community. Why? Because there is nothing there that we can take! Nothing that could make us money at the end. Invading NK would be the same: there is nothing we can take so we have no interest in going in. On one hand that's good because they should be let to deal with their own problems. They are a sovereign nation after all recognized by the international community. So is their leader like it or not. On the other hand, we should go in and end once and for all this circus with tyrannical dynasties and so on. The people would get their freedom and reunite as a country, maybe bring about absolute peace and stability in the region. However, there is a big difference between say Yugoslavia and NK: the former, didn't have China as a neighbor! It is just my supposition but if we were to compare the number of victims resulted from the way the NK government is running business and the Chinese one, we would probably end with a higher number in China. But again, that's to big of a dog to poke it with a stick! It will solve itself at some point. I Just hope it happens before the lunatic uses his nukes- he uses one on SK and the very few lights at night are going to go out in short order- we would destroy their military and China wouldn't do a damn thing IMO. The only issue would be whether their destruction happened at 12 or 12:30 local time.
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Deleted
Joined: May 5, 2024 4:28:04 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2015 22:28:42 GMT -5
North Korea is a cult. Apply cult rules and logic, and the situation makes more sense. Apply non-cult rules and logic, and it all seems quite crazy. Cultish, but not a cult. This is an old article but still applicable.
www.skepticaldoctor.com/2010/01/15/classic-dalrymple-the-wilder-shores-of-marx-excerpt-1991/ But the most sombre reflection occasioned by Department Store Number 1 is that concerning the nature of the power that can command thousands of citizens to take part in a huge and deceitful performance, not once but day after day, without any of the performers ever indicating by even the faintest sign that he is aware of its deceitfulness, though it is impossible that he should not be aware of it.
But this is no joke, and the humiliation it visits upon the people who take part in it, far from being a drawback, is an essential benefit to the power; for slaves who must participate in their own enslavement by signalling to others the happiness of their condition are so humiliated that they are unlikely to rebel.
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