AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 28, 2015 10:54:21 GMT -5
I pointed out that we'd regret tolerating Bush's abuse of executive orders- we did. I said it would be orders of magnitude worse with the next president- it has been. I'm saying now that we will NEVER put the toothpaste back in the tube. We won't. We now effectively have a sloppy-assed dictatorship that is for the most part tolerable. It will get much, much worse- and by the time we realize it-- it will be far too late.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 28, 2015 10:54:35 GMT -5
Well, again djAdvocate and lynnerself -- the political environment is not the same as it once was. It is personally very gratifying to me- just fun to watch- so many who could not explain what Obama meant by hope and change. What were the details and the substance of his actual proposals? Who was this man, and what qualified him to be president?-- to now all of the sudden have to wrap their heads around people supporting someone mainly because they get a sense that he's different, he's an outsider, and they're just ready for "change". I said at the time- in 2008, that this was a mistake. That we would all live to regret the superstar presidential campaign, and the celebrity presidency. And here we are. i actually like this analogy, so i am not going to debate it. however, i think that Obama was far more substantive in his positions than Trump is. the VENEER is the same, but the wood is different.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 28, 2015 10:57:50 GMT -5
I pointed out that we'd regret tolerating Bush's abuse of executive orders- we did. I said it would be orders of magnitude worse with the next president- it has been. no, it hasn't. the use of executive orders has been on the steady decline since FDR. only Carter interrupted the trend. i think it is very doubtful that Obama will beat Bush in terms of issuing EO's.'m saying now that we will NEVER put the toothpaste back in the tube. We won't. We now effectively have a sloppy-assed dictatorship that is for the most part tolerable. It will get much, much worse- and by the time we realize it-- it will be far too late. FDR issued thousands of EO's. THOUSANDS. nobody will ever touch that record. ever.
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Post by billisonboard on Sept 28, 2015 11:02:21 GMT -5
I pointed out that we'd regret tolerating Bush's abuse of executive orders- we did. I said it would be orders of magnitude worse with the next president- it has been. I'm saying now that we will NEVER put the toothpaste back in the tube. We won't. We now effectively have a sloppy-assed dictatorship that is for the most part tolerable. It will get much, much worse- and by the time we realize it-- it will be far too late. Something I have been posting since the Bush Administration was in office: "On January 20th, 2009, if George Bush and Dick Cheney are not appropriately held to account this Administration will hand off a toolbox with more powers than any President has ever had, more powers than the founders could have imagined. And that box may be handed to Hillary Clinton or it may be handed to Mitt Romney or Barack Obama or someone else. But whoever gets it, one of the things we know about power is that people don't give away the tools." — John Nichols www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/profile.html
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 28, 2015 14:15:43 GMT -5
i woke up this morning thinking about Herman Cain.
after first considering that this might be the onset of mental illness, i started to figure it out. Trump is a lot like Herman Cain. like Herman Cain, Trump has contempt for the press, for liberals, for anyone questioning him and his credentials. like Herman Cain, Trump is a business guy, who thinks that being a business guy qualifies him to be CEO of the United States. like Herman Cain, Trump is on top of the polls, with the press following him around in a hallucinogenic fog that precludes them from questioning his legitimacy. and, like Herman Cain, i think Trump is doomed, because when it comes right down to it, he has no clue about what he is aspiring to do.
Democrats are fantasizing about Trump making it all the way, just like they did with Herman Cain. Republicans are fantasizing about Trump making it all the way, just like they did with Herman Cain. i don't think he is making it all the way, folks.....LIKE HERMAN CAIN.
if Trump is still leading in January, i will be shocked. but the GOP says they want someone "outside of Washington" to run. they say they want that really badly. do they want it badly enough to run a guy with no political experience, and a bag full of empty promises?
again: if Trump can actually articulate his positions, and those positions agree with mine, i will vote for him. but he is not even getting past square one. and i sure as hell am not going to vote for a guy who yells about walls but can't explain the first thing about how he would build one.
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Post by billisonboard on Sept 28, 2015 14:34:56 GMT -5
I think that an interesting thing with Trump is that he does offer very specific ideas, i.e. building a wall on the Southern Border. Now there are some questions of the logistical and financial possibility for the building of such a wall that have already been identified. When asked how he would deal with those issues, he has no answer. Well, no answer other than, "I will build a wall."
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Post by Value Buy on Sept 28, 2015 14:50:55 GMT -5
Any bets or estimates of when Huckabee drops out. It is already WAAAAY past time for him & Cruz to go and probably several others. Voters need to concentrate on the possible not their personal wish lists. Of course I am probably just as guilty because I have a line in the sand issue. This question is not necessarily addressed to you in particular: Why do pro Democratic backers worry so much about whether certain Republicans drop out? Republicans are energized with the influx of the ethical spectrum here. Trump-Cruz-Huckabee-Christie-Paul.....we got all the bases covered here. Most people here are not pro Republican, so just worry about Hillary. She needs your prayers and money
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 28, 2015 15:02:25 GMT -5
I pointed out that we'd regret tolerating Bush's abuse of executive orders- we did. I said it would be orders of magnitude worse with the next president- it has been. no, it hasn't. the use of executive orders has been on the steady decline since FDR. only Carter interrupted the trend. i think it is very doubtful that Obama will beat Bush in terms of issuing EO's.'m saying now that we will NEVER put the toothpaste back in the tube. We won't. We now effectively have a sloppy-assed dictatorship that is for the most part tolerable. It will get much, much worse- and by the time we realize it-- it will be far too late. FDR issued thousands of EO's. THOUSANDS. nobody will ever touch that record. ever. I think the flaw in your reasoning is that you are comparing executive orders by numbers issued, and not by the substantive changes made by them. I don't think FDR altered immigration law by executive order, for example.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 28, 2015 15:05:03 GMT -5
FDR issued thousands of EO's. THOUSANDS. nobody will ever touch that record. ever. I think the flaw in your reasoning is that you are comparing executive orders by numbers issued, and not by the substantive changes made by them. I don't think FDR altered immigration law by executive order, for example. no, but Reagan did. and he also issued a LOT more EO's than Obama.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 28, 2015 21:56:46 GMT -5
I think the flaw in your reasoning is that you are comparing executive orders by numbers issued, and not by the substantive changes made by them. I don't think FDR altered immigration law by executive order, for example. no, but Reagan did. and he also issued a LOT more EO's than Obama. No, Reagan did not. Reagan signed a bill- Simpson - Mazolli - into law.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 28, 2015 21:59:35 GMT -5
i woke up this morning thinking about Herman Cain. after first considering that this might be the onset of mental illness, i started to figure it out. Trump is a lot like Herman Cain. like Herman Cain, Trump has contempt for the press, for liberals, for anyone questioning him and his credentials. like Herman Cain, Trump is a business guy, who thinks that being a business guy qualifies him to be CEO of the United States. like Herman Cain, Trump is on top of the polls, with the press following him around in a hallucinogenic fog that precludes them from questioning his legitimacy. and, like Herman Cain, i think Trump is doomed, because when it comes right down to it, he has no clue about what he is aspiring to do. Democrats are fantasizing about Trump making it all the way, just like they did with Herman Cain. Republicans are fantasizing about Trump making it all the way, just like they did with Herman Cain. i don't think he is making it all the way, folks.....LIKE HERMAN CAIN. if Trump is still leading in January, i will be shocked. but the GOP says they want someone "outside of Washington" to run. they say they want that really badly. do they want it badly enough to run a guy with no political experience, and a bag full of empty promises? again: if Trump can actually articulate his positions, and those positions agree with mine, i will vote for him. but he is not even getting past square one. and i sure as hell am not going to vote for a guy who yells about walls but can't explain the first thing about how he would build one. I've been shocked for two months. N ow, I'm just rolling with it. It's interesting how Ted Cruz absolutely f***ed over Boehner this week. Planning to retire a year ago, my arse. Now, he and his team have McConnell in their sights and they're going to get him. Again, Trump is not my guy-- but I love having him on their radar sweating them while the grassroots conservatives make it very well known the stranglehold they are slowly gaining on the leadership. In my mind, Trump is the spoiler for the GOPe Splitter Strategy
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 28, 2015 22:05:03 GMT -5
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 28, 2015 22:09:40 GMT -5
theconservativetreehouse.com/2015/09/28/latest-national-polling-donald-trump-30-with-updates-on-gop-race/Morning Consult has updated their latest national polling results utilizing 1,543 registered voters Sept 24th – Sept 27th. Consult has, over time, shown to be one of the few consistently accurate polling organizations when compared to regional and state level polls of similar scope. MC also, over time, has reflected the overall social media sentiment with accuracy. The latest poll shows Donald Trump maintaining 30% electorate support with Ben Carson coming in second at 15%. If this were Jeb Bush maintaining 30% (over two months) the GOPe would be demanding that all other candidates coalesce and give Jeb their immediate loyal support. Alas, because this is not “their guy” the establishment continue to fight to tear Trump down:
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 10:24:27 GMT -5
i woke up this morning thinking about Herman Cain. after first considering that this might be the onset of mental illness, i started to figure it out. Trump is a lot like Herman Cain. like Herman Cain, Trump has contempt for the press, for liberals, for anyone questioning him and his credentials. like Herman Cain, Trump is a business guy, who thinks that being a business guy qualifies him to be CEO of the United States. like Herman Cain, Trump is on top of the polls, with the press following him around in a hallucinogenic fog that precludes them from questioning his legitimacy. and, like Herman Cain, i think Trump is doomed, because when it comes right down to it, he has no clue about what he is aspiring to do. Democrats are fantasizing about Trump making it all the way, just like they did with Herman Cain. Republicans are fantasizing about Trump making it all the way, just like they did with Herman Cain. i don't think he is making it all the way, folks.....LIKE HERMAN CAIN. if Trump is still leading in January, i will be shocked. but the GOP says they want someone "outside of Washington" to run. they say they want that really badly. do they want it badly enough to run a guy with no political experience, and a bag full of empty promises? again: if Trump can actually articulate his positions, and those positions agree with mine, i will vote for him. but he is not even getting past square one. and i sure as hell am not going to vote for a guy who yells about walls but can't explain the first thing about how he would build one. I've been shocked for two months. N ow, I'm just rolling with it. why? walker was in either 1st or 2nd place for FIVE MONTHS. with the exception of a couple weeks when Walker was beating him, Bush was in 1st place for EIGHT MONTHS. The Donald can last FIVE MONTHS, too.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 10:27:11 GMT -5
the past PPP poll had Trump up 10%. i would be surprised if he were still up 10%.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 10:28:03 GMT -5
theconservativetreehouse.com/2015/09/28/latest-national-polling-donald-trump-30-with-updates-on-gop-race/Morning Consult has updated their latest national polling results utilizing 1,543 registered voters Sept 24th – Sept 27th. Consult has, over time, shown to be one of the few consistently accurate polling organizations when compared to regional and state level polls of similar scope. MC also, over time, has reflected the overall social media sentiment with accuracy. The latest poll shows Donald Trump maintaining 30% electorate support with Ben Carson coming in second at 15%. If this were Jeb Bush maintaining 30% (over two months) the GOPe would be demanding that all other candidates coalesce and give Jeb their immediate loyal support. Alas, because this is not “their guy” the establishment continue to fight to tear Trump down: at least two candidates are polling worse than Jindal.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 10:46:56 GMT -5
no, but Reagan did. and he also issued a LOT more EO's than Obama. No, Reagan did not. Reagan signed a bill- Simpson - Mazolli - into law. yes he did. so did Poppy: www.businessinsider.com/reagan-and-bush-made-immigration-executive-orders-2014-11edit- dude, you really need to stop doing this. 99.9% of the time, i am going to be able to back my shit up. if you want to keep shooting for the moon, be my guest, but you can use Google BEFORE you post, and save me the trouble, as well.
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Post by swamp on Sept 29, 2015 11:48:56 GMT -5
Does he truly believe the President has the power to do this? He's going to enforce it with trade sanctions. Probably my favorite part of the interview: Scott Pelley: The constitution is going to tell you no.
Donald Trump: We'll see.
Scott Pelley: The Congress is going to tell you no.
Donald Trump: We'll see.
Scott Pelley: The Supreme Court is gonna tell you no.
Donald Trump: Well, we'll see.
Scott Pelley: And you're not used to working in an environment like that.
Donald Trump: Look--I do it all the time.
Scott Pelley: Who tells you no?
Donald Trump: I do it all the time. I especially liked the part where he was going to ignore NAFTA and other treaties and laws he thought were a bad idea.
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Sept 29, 2015 16:25:38 GMT -5
He's going to enforce it with trade sanctions. Probably my favorite part of the interview: Scott Pelley: The constitution is going to tell you no.
Donald Trump: We'll see.
Scott Pelley: The Congress is going to tell you no.
Donald Trump: We'll see.
Scott Pelley: The Supreme Court is gonna tell you no.
Donald Trump: Well, we'll see.
Scott Pelley: And you're not used to working in an environment like that.
Donald Trump: Look--I do it all the time.
Scott Pelley: Who tells you no?
Donald Trump: I do it all the time. I especially liked the part where he was going to ignore NAFTA and other treaties and laws he thought were a bad idea. If you can ignore immigration laws you don't like, Geneva convention treaties you don't like, domestic spying laws you don't like, no-preemptive-wars-without-congressional-approval laws you don't like, and you can very nearly backdoor in the abomination that is the TPP, you can probably ignore NAFTA at your leisure too. The joke's on America, here. Not Trump.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 29, 2015 16:31:26 GMT -5
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 16:49:04 GMT -5
i never said amnesty. you said immigration. i am still in the 99.9%, Paul: www.pensitoreview.com/2014/11/17/impeachable-18-immigration-executive-orders-by-republican-presidents/i also never claimed that Reagan did anything of the sweeping scope that Obama did. i never said that there was "attached legislation". in other words, all of your adjunct claims are not part of the argument here, and are not being debated. your claim is that Reagan didn't do any EO's involving immigration, and that is false. thank you for playing.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 16:49:53 GMT -5
I especially liked the part where he was going to ignore NAFTA and other treaties and laws he thought were a bad idea. If you can ignore immigration laws you don't like, Geneva convention treaties you don't like, domestic spying laws you don't like, no-preemptive-wars-without-congressional-approval laws you don't like, and you can very nearly backdoor in the abomination that is the TPP, you can probably ignore NAFTA at your leisure too. The joke's on America, here. Not Trump. why not both?
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 29, 2015 16:59:21 GMT -5
Well, again djAdvocate and lynnerself -- the political environment is not the same as it once was. It is personally very gratifying to me- just fun to watch- so many who could not explain what Obama meant by hope and change. What were the details and the substance of his actual proposals? Who was this man, and what qualified him to be president?-- to now all of the sudden have to wrap their heads around people supporting someone mainly because they get a sense that he's different, he's an outsider, and they're just ready for "change". I said at the time- in 2008, that this was a mistake. That we would all live to regret the superstar presidential campaign, and the celebrity presidency. And here we are. i actually like this analogy, so i am not going to debate it. however, i think that Obama was far more substantive in his positions than Trump is. the VENEER is the same, but the wood is different. Donald Trump has introduced detailed proposals on immigration and tax reform. I have my issues with each, though I think he's on the right track on immigration. I think if he become POTUS, and all the dust settles from trying to label an international businessman a "nativist" and a "xenophobe", Trump's actual immigration regime will be the kind of moderate, common sense reform that's long overdue. Everyone debating this issue in good faith wants to weed out the criminals, and make it easier, shorter, and less costly for good people to come the US to live and work, and if they desire- to become citizens. Even the gang of 8 bill which failed proposed go home, get in line, pay a fine plus back taxes and then come back. That bill failed because enough voters are wise to the fact that they never intended to follow through on border security. Trump is really just giving teeth to the border security provisions. If Rubio, McCain and the rest of the gang of 8 were honest, they'd be touting Trump's moderate plan. I have issues with the tax proposal. It is basically Reagan 1981. What we learned from Ronald Reagan is that we cannot have meaningful tax reform that leaves the tax code fundamentally in tact and keeps the IRS. The whole thing has to go.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 17:05:22 GMT -5
i actually like this analogy, so i am not going to debate it. however, i think that Obama was far more substantive in his positions than Trump is. the VENEER is the same, but the wood is different. Donald Trump has introduced detailed proposals on immigration and tax reform. . link, please. tyia.
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Post by billisonboard on Sept 29, 2015 17:23:30 GMT -5
... I have issues with the tax proposal. It is basically Reagan 1981. ... I have issues also with another round of Voodoo Economics: Amount Added to the Debt for Each Fiscal Year Since 1960:
Barack Obama: Added $6.167 trillion, a 53% increase to the $11.657 trillion debt level attributable to President Bush at the end of his last budget, FY 2009. ...
George W. Bush: Added $5.849 trillion, a 101% increase to the $5.8 trillion debt level at the end of Clinton's last budget, FY 2001. ...
Bill Clinton: Added $1.396 trillion, a 32% increase to the $4.4 trillion debt level at the end of Bush's last budget, FY 1993. ...
George H.W. Bush: Added $1.554 trillion, a 54% increase to the $2.8 trillion debt level at the end of Reagan's last budget, FY 1989. ...
Ronald Reagan: Added $1.86 trillion, 186% increase to the $998 billion debt level at the end of Carter's last budget, FY 1981. Also see Did Reaganomics Work? ...
Jimmy Carter: Added $299 billion, a 43% increase to the $699 billion debt level at the end of Ford's last budget, FY 1977. ....
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 17:24:33 GMT -5
the past PPP poll had Trump up 10%. i would be surprised if he were still up 10%. the expanding lead part is wrong. his lead has SHRUNK by 5% since the past PPP survey. he was ahead of Carson 24-14 = 10% in the last survey. he is now ahead of Carson 26-21 = 5%. as i said before, i think Carson is going to catch him.
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 29, 2015 19:22:48 GMT -5
Donald Trump has introduced detailed proposals on immigration and tax reform. . link, please. tyia. C'mon. Seriously? www.donaldjtrump.com/
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Sept 29, 2015 19:25:03 GMT -5
the past PPP poll had Trump up 10%. i would be surprised if he were still up 10%. the expanding lead part is wrong. his lead has SHRUNK by 5% since the past PPP survey. he was ahead of Carson 24-14 = 10% in the last survey. he is now ahead of Carson 26-21 = 5%. as i said before, i think Carson is going to catch him. Carson is gaining for sure. Gee, I wonder why?
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 19:43:44 GMT -5
it is not just for MY benefit, Paul. yes, seriously.
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Post by djAdvocate on Sept 29, 2015 19:45:21 GMT -5
the expanding lead part is wrong. his lead has SHRUNK by 5% since the past PPP survey. he was ahead of Carson 24-14 = 10% in the last survey. he is now ahead of Carson 26-21 = 5%. as i said before, i think Carson is going to catch him. Carson is gaining for sure. Gee, I wonder why? he never said that. he said that ISLAM is incompatible with the constitution, which is a bit different. edit: to his credit, he also said Christianity is incompatible with the constitution.
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