Happy International Womens Day

[el1504]

Happy International Womens Day everyone.

In Australia (where I am) we have a female Govenor General (the highest office in the country)and a female Prime Minister (the second highest ofice in the country) but we still don't have pay equity.

This from the Australian Government's Equal Opportunity for Women in the Workforce Agency -



The principle of Equal Pay was established in the 1969 and 1972 Australian Federal equal pay cases, yet equality in men's and women's wages is still far from being achieved.

The gender pay gap is measured as the difference between male and female earnings expressed as a percentage of male earnings.1

ABS statistics released in November 2010 show that across Australia, women's average full-time weekly earnings are now 16.9% less than men’s.2 This is only slightly lower than the 17.3% gap for the previous quarter (statistics released in August). Women's earnings have remained between 80-85% of men's since 1980.

When part-time and casual work is taken into consideration, the total earnings gap between men and women is 35.3%.3

If current earning patterns continue, the average 25 year old male would earn $2.4 million over the next 40 years while the average 25 year old female would earn $1.5 million.4

The gender pay gap has a significant impact on women's lifetime earnings. Women are two and half times more likely to live in poverty in their old age than men, and by 2019 - on average - women will have half the amount of superannuation that men have.5

A large component of the gap in earnings remains "unexplained". Some of the key causes of the gender pay gap include:

* The segregated types of work that women do

* The low value placed on the work women do

* The unequal distribution of overtime, discretionary pay and allowances; and promotional opportunities

* The impact of caring responsibilities on women's patterns of work

* The lack of investment in women through training and development

* Stereotypical views about women's abilities and roles



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1 OECD, Family database: Definitions and methodology, available at;

www.oecd.org/dataoecd/29/63/38752746.pdf

2 ABS, Category 6302.0, Average Weekly Earnings, available at; www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/mf/6302.0

3 Ibid

4 AMP NATSEM (2009), ‘She works hard for the money: Australian women and the gender divide,” Income and Wealth Report, Issue 22

5 Ibid

[el1504]

I think the thing that bothers me the most is that women are two and a half times more likely to end up living in poverty in their old age.

[mizbear]

What bothers me is this isn't just happening in Australia.

[Clever Username]

What bothers me is the sexist skewing of the data here:
Many of the items listed are related to employee choices and not gender.

* The segregated types of work that women do
So if men choose the same field they'll get the same lower pay.

* The impact of caring responsibilities on women's patterns of work
A couple working needs to choose one to "take it for the team." Are they claiming that the one who stays home, working less, should be paid the same as the one who worked more?
The works on both a macro and micro level also, if you choose to be a stay at home parent, your competition in gaining job experience while you are building skills not relevant to your job.

Until the figures are adjusted for these variables, its conclusions are skeptical.

[mizbear]

clever- There is some skewing of the data- for instance, in the US, it is a well known fact that most males do not get the benefits that most women do when it comes to sick children, spouses, and parents- and I know some women who have NO bedside manner. However, when you get into these fields, men actually do make more for even what are considered the most base level positions. No, if you work at a fast food joint, Dick and Jane will most likely make the same unless one or the other has more experience in the same position- but put them both in traditional housekeeping/janitorial- Dick will make more. Do I think it is right that Dick can not stay home with Baby Jane when she is sick without penalty, but Mary can stay home with Sam, pretend he is sick and get away with it- no questions asked- of course I have a problem with it- it's not right. But, unfortunately, it is a known- and proven- fact that men make better money than women do in equal (and sometimes lesser) positions. I thoroughly agree that there are other variables to consider- but that doesn't negate the pay gap- which in other countries can be wose than the one here in the US. Just like it's a known fact that male guardians, non-traditional guardians and single parents get shafted when it comes to certain benefits. The system isn't perfect.

On that note- being female, I would more be concerned about the benefits than the pay as long as my bills are getting paid. Not because I don't think I'm worth the same money as someone else if I'm doing the as good a job, but my work speaks just as loud as the numbers on that paycheck. And that's why I have a budget. Maybe I feel that way because I have never really had money.

Btw- Karma for being willing to step into the discussion with points that aren't always welcome, even if they are true.

[el1504]

I agree that often times when looking at these issues we don't compare apples with apples. Much of the debte here centres on comparing womens work in an area like childcare to a mans work in some other area and saying well they should be paid equally which I don't agree with.

What I notice in my workplace is when the workplace releases stats on the workforce it shows that 60% of the all employees are female and 75% of the managers are male. And I wonder about the affect that has on young girls do they think they can never become a manager becuase they are not male? Is it because women are more likely to have caring responsibilities so they don't want to step up to the manager level? Just things I think about.

Also a statistic which is being thrown around a lot here is that there are only 8.4% women holding positions on Boards of companies in Australia. Again is that because women don't think they can do that role, don't want to do that role or are not encouraged to go for that role...? I don't know but I think its interesting to talk about

[dragon2008]

I was once told that I didn't need to make the same starting salary as the person hired just 6 months ahead of me because I wasn't supporting a family (in 1987). Same job, same work, less money. Because I started lower on the salary scale, equal percent raises yielded less money. When I switched jobs, my new salary was a percentage higher than my old salary. I was the one expected to work late because I didn't have a family to go home to (apparently the cat didn't count). It didn't help that this was my first job out of school and I was much more of a pushover back then. Still, after 24 years in my profession, after being known for negotiating great rates for vendors, I have a difficult time speaking up at my reviews and asking for more money (because I am worth it).

It will be decades before we'll see even representation in the upper business levels. Like prefers to work with like, and they will only hire tokens when forced to.