The Landlord Thread

[resolution]

Using a management company works well for me too, so you aren't the only slacker here.

[debthaven]

The new tenant signed the lease yesterday. DH was off today, so he went to the RE agency, signed the paperwork for them to manage the studio, and then went to the bank to deposit the April rent and the security deposit. 

The security deposit is basically what we owe the agency for finding the tenant, but hey, the studio is rented again!  The tenant signed a standard 3-year lease. SHE can break the lease before then (with 3 months' notice), but we can't. Which is fine.

Resolution, thanks for reminding me that we're not the only slackers around here! 

[Bonny]

Got an e-mail from the condo tenant this a.m. they want to renew in spite of the $200 increase. That raises their rent to $3,300/mth but I still will have some negative cash flow. It's somewhat of a mixed blessings. I think rents have really gone up and could probably rent it for closer to $3500 and still be a little under market.

But hopefully I get to enjoy my summer this year instead of needing to turn a rental!

[Bonny]

I'm going to title this entry: How to Deal with the OCD Tenant?

My tenant in the Oceanside house is becoming a PITA and I could use some suggestions on how best to respond to her. I've been under the weather so haven't been in a great mood. It just makes me stew longer!

Sad part is I knew it as soon as I met her. Single, older lady who is very put together. Honest to God the first thought I had was she's going to be a PITA.

Good things are she pays the rent on time and the house looks very good.

What I'm dealing with is a long list of never ending items which need attention. I need help with parsing through the never ending list and responding to the requests without blowing my stack. Yes, she's the one who pissed off the gardener!

My first incident was when she claimed that several lightbulbs were burnt out. I knew of one and it was disclosed. I missed checking the motion detector lamp and we replaced that. But then I heard from my handyman that she also wanted the lightbulbs in the dining room fixture replaced because "they hurt her eyes". The dining room fixture is on a f*cking dimmer switch! My handyman replaced them and I didn't say anything to her because he assured me he did not make a special trip to Home Depot. He just charged me 15 minutes of his time and the lightbulbs which he buys in bulk. I told him that he needs to clear any additional or questionable work with me because she's apparently going to keep pushing the envelope. He realized that because she tried to get him to replace the existing thermostat to a programmable one at my expense. She said she'd pay for it if I didn't. I told my handyman that I made it clear (in writing) I was not changing the thermostat but if she wanted one she could replace it at her expense. And that when she left I needed my thermostat re-installed.

Last month she wanted a new spa cover. I didn't recall anything being wrong with it when I saw the property in November but the spa guy says that there was a rip in it and it fills up with water. Thinks the PITA prior tenant may have damaged it by filling spa too high and using it every day during their 3 months of occupancy. I just paid the bill @$425. The spa guy told me that she mentioned that I should take care of all these kinds of things because "Bonny can take these off her taxes"

Last week she claimed the spa needs to be painted. I saw it last week and there's one smaller say (quarter sized) chip and it's a little faded. Her daughter who was at the house and uses it all the time never noticed it. She also wants me to repair some vinyl which is curling at the edge. I was set to have it repaired when I replaced some of the bathroom flooring back in December. When the bathroom flooring was repaired she advised the guy that it was inconvenient to have the curling vinyl repaired in the breakfast room. To get him back involves another special trip and small job premium which will cost me an extra $400.

The main on-going issue has been her constant complaining about the water bill. I gave her the utility information my prior tenant gave me. But honestly there are three large lawns. What did you think? She wants me to come up with a long term plan to "deal with the lawn problem". Arggggggh!

I will deal with some of the minor stuff like the front door lock and replacing the tub stopper. Although if she's worried about her water bill she shouldn't be taking baths in that huge Roman tub!

So advise me how you would handle a tenant like this. At this point in time I'm leaning towards telling her that we plan on selling the house at the end of her term 6/30/16 and that I will only make repairs involving health or safety or the potential for gross property damage.

[Peace77]

Bonny,

What does your lease say about the lawn?  Is she required to water it?
Could the tenant convert part of the lawn to desert or rock garden at her expense?

From this point on, I would refuse to change any lightbulbs.  I would given her a written notice that you aren't changing any more light bubs.  Light bulbs should be the responsibility of the tenant.

[zibazinski]

I had a tenant like that. When I renewed their lease, I put in that anything under $20 was on them. They actually called me to replace burnt out light bulbs. . After the second year I didn't renew their lease again. They loved the house, so it was very painful for them but they brought it on themselves and I told them so. Pitas

[Deleted]

Did you do a condition check in list before she moved in? What state is the property in - AZ, OR? You need to review land lord tenant law for that state.

I would send her a strongly worded letter about her sending away the linoleum repair person when he was there to do that repair and that she is responsible for the extra trip charge she is caused (so long as you gave her the required advance notice of the repair visit). Interior light bulbs are not landlord responsibility (fixture is, but bulbs are not). I think exterior lighting can vary on who's responsible. 

I think I would read the law for the state of the rental & list what things are/are not your responsibility. A chip on the spa paint isn't . . . in fact I might suggest that if she caused the chip, that is her responsibility to repair.

If nothing she is contacting you about is significant, I would send her a simple email that says you are ill and will respond in a week. That way she is not ignored and you have time to compose an appropriate response.

How long does she have left on the lease? I would not advise her that you are not renewing her until you get to the mandatory notice period.

[Bonny]

@rockit,

I have a 5 page Move-In/Move Out checklist. Property is in San Diego County.

We've had another round of e-mails since my post in which I stated I would only be repairing health and safety items. She's a little pissy about the vinyl but too bad so sad. Otherwise the e-mail was accepting of everything else. I think her daughter has been helpful in toning down her expectations.

I've really debated telling her that we are seriously thinking about putting the house on the market. I want to hold off until I know if the AZ tenants want to buy the house. We will be asking them next month. Their lease is up 1/31/16. The San Diego County lease is up 6/30/16.

ETA: I've been very concerned about the effects of the drought on the yard. I think I'm going to have to replace the front yard which based on the estimate we have here is going to be around $6k. It's frustrating because the payback in water savings is going to be something like 5 or 6 years. Not a sound financial investment. But I think I will have to do it anyway to maintain curb appeal.

[zibazinski]

One more year. One more year. Then I'm done with tenants!!

[Bonny]

May 19, 2015 8:38:53 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

One more year. One more year. Then I'm done with tenants!!

And fingers crossed that you're selling at a market high!

[DagnyT]

How do you guys deal with prospective tenants who want to pay grossly less than the asking price? I have a rental unit that rents for $550 per month. It is a singlewide manufactured home on a private lot. It has rented for $525 per month for the last six years, so a $25 increase for the new tenants. 

I had someone call and wanted to only pay $400. I told him that we could not rent it for that amount and that by researching similar rentals in the area, we felt it was a fair price. His response was that he rents a three bedroom cabin two miles away for $250 per month. I told him that was a bargain, and maybe he should consider staying there. He then asked what year the home was built. I told him it is a 1990 model, and he rudely replied, "And this is what, 2015?" I just responded, "Yes, it is." I usually do well dealing with the prospective tenants, but I almost lost my cool with him.

[zibazinski]

Yup, karma bit me. Tenant called. Garage door not working. Considering she never parks her car in there and garage is full of crap, I don't see how it matters that the door doesn't open and close except manually but I'll call someone today to get it fixed.

[Bonny]

May 19, 2015 23:03:38 GMT -5 DagnyT said:

How do you guys deal with prospective tenants who want to pay grossly less than the asking price? I have a rental unit that rents for $550 per month. It is a singlewide manufactured home on a private lot. It has rented for $525 per month for the last six years, so a $25 increase for the new tenants. 

I had someone call and wanted to only pay $400. I told him that we could not rent it for that amount and that by researching similar rentals in the area, we felt it was a fair price. His response was that he rents a three bedroom cabin two miles away for $250 per month. I told him that was a bargain, and maybe he should consider staying there. He then asked what year the home was built. I told him it is a 1990 model, and he rudely replied, "And this is what, 2015?" I just responded, "Yes, it is." I usually do well dealing with the prospective tenants, but I almost lost my cool with him.

Be thankful that he's not your current tenant and that you're smart enough to avoid renting to an unreasonable jerk!

[Peace77]

May 20, 2015 11:28:42 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

and finally (i hope). I just got the letter and complied with the new seattle law that you have to register every rental unit. You'd think the law was written by the apartment owners.

Fee: $175 every 5 years for first unit

AND THEN $2/every 5 years for each additional unit.

Huh? sounds like another great stab at the middle class trying to build investments. (the guy with ONE or two rental houses, not 40)

There is a mandatory inspection every 10 years too. I don't really care that much, but it does grate on me. they could stop being politically correct and just say they're going to inspect rentals with "south" in the street address and save half the work.

Really the inspection checklist has items like "bedrooms can't have dirt floors, but must be constructed of timber, concrete or other approved building material". Umm, that's already against the law... I don't think my renters are paying 4 large every month for dirt floors, but let's go ahead and make everyone follow some crazy process instead of just going after the violators (there was already tenant protection and the ability to notify the city if they were living in unsafe, unsanitary or substandard conditions.

OK done venting, but it's another thing to complicate my life that will provide zero safety or comfort to my tenants.

They want to make sure that nobody is renting out tents with an outhouse.    

[DagnyT]

May 20, 2015 10:31:55 GMT -5 Bonny said:

May 19, 2015 23:03:38 GMT -5 DagnyT said:

How do you guys deal with prospective tenants who want to pay grossly less than the asking price? I have a rental unit that rents for $550 per month. It is a singlewide manufactured home on a private lot. It has rented for $525 per month for the last six years, so a $25 increase for the new tenants. 

I had someone call and wanted to only pay $400. I told him that we could not rent it for that amount and that by researching similar rentals in the area, we felt it was a fair price. His response was that he rents a three bedroom cabin two miles away for $250 per month. I told him that was a bargain, and maybe he should consider staying there. He then asked what year the home was built. I told him it is a 1990 model, and he rudely replied, "And this is what, 2015?" I just responded, "Yes, it is." I usually do well dealing with the prospective tenants, but I almost lost my cool with him.

Be thankful that he's not your current tenant and that you're smart enough to avoid renting to an unreasonable jerk!

Thanks, Bonny. We have just put in new countertops in the kitchen, new countertops and china sinks (not the yucky plastic stuff that came with the home) in the bathroom, painted the home, new flooring in the kitchen and laundry room, new flooring in one bedroom and professionally cleaned the carpet in the other two bedrooms, new dishwasher, stained both decks, painted the storage building, put in new inside storm windows, and today I ordered the materials to put up new vinyl skirting. We are going to landscape around the vinyl so that there will be no need to weed eat next to the vinyl so it doesn't get cut to pieces like the current vinyl. I so wish the original owner had used brick or block underpinning, but alas, he did not and it wouldn't really be worth the investment to go that route now. This home looks nothing like it did when new. It is  better looking than the day they set it up.

We have worked extremely hard to make this a really nice rental because I refuse to be a slumlord, and therefore, I can't accept slumlord prices. I agree he was being a jerk, and I shouldn't have responded at all. If I ever receive a similar call, I will just say, "Well, thanks for inquiring," and promptly end the call.

Thanks for letting me vent!

[Peace77]

May 19, 2015 23:03:38 GMT -5 DagnyT said:

How do you guys deal with prospective tenants who want to pay grossly less than the asking price? I have a rental unit that rents for $550 per month. It is a singlewide manufactured home on a private lot. It has rented for $525 per month for the last six years, so a $25 increase for the new tenants. 

I had someone call and wanted to only pay $400. I told him that we could not rent it for that amount and that by researching similar rentals in the area, we felt it was a fair price. His response was that he rents a three bedroom cabin two miles away for $250 per month. I told him that was a bargain, and maybe he should consider staying there. He then asked what year the home was built. I told him it is a 1990 model, and he rudely replied, "And this is what, 2015?" I just responded, "Yes, it is." I usually do well dealing with the prospective tenants, but I almost lost my cool with him.

Just say the rent is not negotiable.  No need to explain.

[Deleted]

May 20, 2015 12:44:49 GMT -5 Peace77 said:

May 20, 2015 11:28:42 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

and finally (i hope). I just got the letter and complied with the new seattle law that you have to register every rental unit. You'd think the law was written by the apartment owners.

Fee: $175 every 5 years for first unit

AND THEN $2/every 5 years for each additional unit.

Huh? sounds like another great stab at the middle class trying to build investments. (the guy with ONE or two rental houses, not 40)

There is a mandatory inspection every 10 years too. I don't really care that much, but it does grate on me. they could stop being politically correct and just say they're going to inspect rentals with "south" in the street address and save half the work.

Really the inspection checklist has items like "bedrooms can't have dirt floors, but must be constructed of timber, concrete or other approved building material". Umm, that's already against the law... I don't think my renters are paying 4 large every month for dirt floors, but let's go ahead and make everyone follow some crazy process instead of just going after the violators (there was already tenant protection and the ability to notify the city if they were living in unsafe, unsanitary or substandard conditions.

OK done venting, but it's another thing to complicate my life that will provide zero safety or comfort to my tenants.

They want to make sure that nobody is renting out tents with an outhouse.    

Yeah, because the folks that do dodgy stuff like that are actually going to register their rentals?

[Deleted]

rental agent said I could rent a mobile home for ~$600 a month.  I have place to put it with septic.  I would need to get water service for ~$1000 and electric hook up.  Agent said I could  get a good mobile home for less then $15k.   The spot to put it is 8 acres with a house I already rent out.

Would you do that?

[Bonny]

May 23, 2015 18:19:08 GMT -5 @hickle said:

rental agent said I could rent a mobile home for ~$600 a month.  I have place to put it with septic.  I would need to get water service for ~$1000 and electric hook up.  Agent said I could  get a good mobile home for less then $15k.   The spot to put it is 8 acres with a house I already rent out.

Would you do that?

To clarify; you are proposing to buy a mobile home, do site prep and rent it out as an investment?

If so, I think you may be under estimating the site costs. Is there a pad, driveway and has the septic been tested to meet the additional load and current code?

How old is a mobile home that you can buy for $15k?

Doing a WAG at $20k and your gross return of $600/mth puts you at nearly 3 years for pay-back of your investment. What would property taxes and insurance be? You also will want to do a set aside for maintenance and capital improvements.

[tskeeter]

May 16, 2015 23:13:10 GMT -5 Bonny said:

@rockit,

I have a 5 page Move-In/Move Out checklist. Property is in San Diego County.

We've had another round of e-mails since my post in which I stated I would only be repairing health and safety items. She's a little pissy about the vinyl but too bad so sad. Otherwise the e-mail was accepting of everything else. I think her daughter has been helpful in toning down her expectations.

I've really debated telling her that we are seriously thinking about putting the house on the market. I want to hold off until I know if the AZ tenants want to buy the house. We will be asking them next month. Their lease is up 1/31/16. The San Diego County lease is up 6/30/16.

ETA: I've been very concerned about the effects of the drought on the yard. I think I'm going to have to replace the front yard which based on the estimate we have here is going to be around $6k. It's frustrating because the payback in water savings is going to be something like 5 or 6 years. Not a sound financial investment. But I think I will have to do it anyway to maintain curb appeal.

You'll want to be a little careful about replacing the turf around your rental with xeriscaping.  That's been the push here, too.  

Most HOA's won't let you just in rock.  So you'll still have the water required to keep any plantings alive.  I suspect that many folks find their water bill doesn't go down as much as they expected.

Local newspaper had a letter to the editor from a reader who had removed turf at a home in the Phoenix area.  He reported that while his water bill went down, the absence of cooling turf made his A/C bill go up so much that his total utility bill increased by about 50%.  While I view this report with some skepticism, it would appear that from a strictly financial perspective, xeriscaping can sometimes be a sketchy decision.

To me, it seems like xeriscaping isn't a financial decision as much as it is a reduce water consumption decision.  In that case, the lack of a financial return isn't relevant. 

However, there are some things that I have done to try to reduce our water consumption without removing turf.  I'll rely more on fertilizer and less on water to keep the lawn looking good.  I've top dressed the grass with peat moss to help prevent irrigation water from running off or soaking through the root zone too quickly.  I've shifted watering schedules so that the watering is done early in the morning.   This way, the water will have a chance to soak in a bit before it gets hot and the evaporation rate increases.   

[Bonny]

tskeeter,

I agree with you that both the xeriscaping and even the gray water use probably don't make sense from a financial point of view, at least at today's water prices. And I've already warned the tenant in my SD County house that I didn't think her water bill would change that much. My concern is that the City is limiting watering to 3x per week 10min per day and I'm afraid that at that rate all three lawns will die. Logically it makes sense to sacrifice the front lawn in order to keep the lower back yard lawn alive. I'm just not sure I'm going to be able to make that work.

[tskeeter]

May 26, 2015 11:58:14 GMT -5 Bonny said:

tskeeter,

I agree with you that both the xeriscaping and even the gray water use probably don't make sense from a financial point of view, at least at today's water prices. And I've already warned the tenant in my SD County house that I didn't think her water bill would change that much. My concern is that the City is limiting watering to 3x per week 10min per day and I'm afraid that at that rate all three lawns will die. Logically it makes sense to sacrifice the front lawn in order to keep the lower back yard lawn alive. I'm just not sure I'm going to be able to make that work.

Hmmmm - 30 minutes of watering per week.  Certainly not much.  To me, sounds like the water authority is encouraging people to shift to flood irrigation, rather than spray.  If a person installed concrete curb around the turf areas, you might be able to make flood irrigation work in flat areas.  Use your 10 minutes to on an inch of water, then let it sit and soak in.  We had curb installed around the turf areas in our yard to keep the grass from growing into the shrubbery beds.  Cost about $400 for about 800 lineal feet of slipformed curb.

Remember seeing an idea that I always thought was kind of interesting.  A FL home improvement show demonstrated irrigation using buried soaker hose.  Seems to me it could be pretty effective, from an evaporation standpoint.  Delivery right to the root zone.  I think the obstacle to this approach is that it required a lot of closely spaced irrigation line.  Kind of looked like the lines for a radiant floor heating system, with lines looping back and forth about 18 - 24 inches apart.  And installed pretty shallow, so might be higher risk of someone digging and cutting the lines.  But, might work pretty well for smaller areas.  Especially if lawns are installed like they are around here.  Basically, the lawn is constructed on top of the finish graded lot.  Soil is almost impossible to dig (you plant bushes with a jack hammer), so about 4 inches of topsoil goes down on top of the clay and rock, then sod goes on top of the topsoil.  If you laid irrigation lines on the finished grade, then put down the topsoil, I'd think a soaker system would be easy to install and pretty effective.  And you avoid the cost of trenching for a standard irrigation system, which is installed several inches below the lawn, and the cost of close together, shallow trenching for a soaker system.       

[The Captain]

Well Crap.  One of our tenants was getting chronically late with the rental payments so we gave them a warning, then a 30 day notice.

Today they text us to tell us they haven't found a new place yet and intend to live out the rest of their deposit.

Under IL code I have to give them a written notification of the termination violation.  They are then subject to two times the rental rate.

So that will buy them 15 days.  Which they'll then probably still go past and I'll have to start eviction proceedings.;

DH is starting to get a bit burnt out so I'm looking into management companies.

[The Captain]

May 20, 2015 11:28:42 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

and finally (i hope). I just got the letter and complied with the new seattle law that you have to register every rental unit. You'd think the law was written by the apartment owners.

Fee: $175 every 5 years for first unit

AND THEN $2/every 5 years for each additional unit.

Huh? sounds like another great stab at the middle class trying to build investments. (the guy with ONE or two rental houses, not 40)

There is a mandatory inspection every 10 years too. I don't really care that much, but it does grate on me. they could stop being politically correct and just say they're going to inspect rentals with "south" in the street address and save half the work.

Really the inspection checklist has items like "bedrooms can't have dirt floors, but must be constructed of timber, concrete or other approved building material". Umm, that's already against the law... I don't think my renters are paying 4 large every month for dirt floors, but let's go ahead and make everyone follow some crazy process instead of just going after the violators (there was already tenant protection and the ability to notify the city if they were living in unsafe, unsanitary or substandard conditions.

OK done venting, but it's another thing to complicate my life that will provide zero safety or comfort to my tenants.

Count your blessings.

Where I have rentals every unit has to be licensed and is inspected every year until there is a zero code violation inspection.  Units are also inspected any time a unit is sold or the rental license is transferred.

I failed inspections at both properties last year.  Spent thousands of dollars in remediations to get the licenses renewed.

With a licensed contractor on hand I did get one property renewed this year with zero violations.  That puts me on a three year schedule.  I have my fingers crossed for the other unit as well.

I've also spent thousands of dollars in unit refreshes.  We'll see if that helps.

[The Captain]

Well Shit.  It was only a matter of time.

We gave the 30 day notice to our late to pay/problem tenants.  One week before they were supposed to vacate we called to set up the move out inspection.

The didn't return calls or texts and on the day DH was going to show up for final inspection they texted him saying they haven't found a place yet and were going to live out the rest of their deposit.

Ummm, no.

We served them a notice to vacate and informed them that 5 days after receipt of that notice rent would be doubled to 2X's the contractual amount (as is allowed by IL rental law).

In the meantime the called the city for code violations (umm we just had another unit on the same property pass with flying colors - something that is not easy to do) and we received a three page letter from the city.

Light bulbs were removed from fixtures (so they are now "non working") one fixture was actually torn out of the ceiling and was hanging from wires.  Dirt everywhere (mice and cockroaches - one of the reasons we choose to cut them loose - they were not keeping the unit clean) a cracked window and a small leak in the roof.  No working smoke or Co2 detectors (all missing) and even the fire extinguisher was gone. 

We knew the unit was filthy but didn't know about anything else.  The roof I'm not putting on them, but the other damage was clearly done by them. 

Remember folks, this is the unit we JUST DID the bathroom and kitchen refresh on.  Their kitchen is was nicer than mine.

So now we have to go through eviction proceedings.  I'm worried about more property damage and they have told us they will not allow workmen in the unit unless DH or I are present (knowing we both have jobs).  This is bullshit. They don't have the right to make that demand and they know it, but I'm not going to put a workman in a bad situation.

So DH and I are probably going to get a management company.  It will cost us 8% of gross rentals a month plus we'll probably pay a premium for repairs, etc. 

Unfortunately when things are going ok we can handle it, but we can't take a lot of time off work to deal with the bullshit.  Which kinda sucks for the other tenants because I've decided I'm going to raise rents to near market levels to offset the management fee.

Ugg.

[zibazinski]

Yup, this is why I firmly believe that tenants who trash properties should be arrested. Just because you're a tenant should not give you the right to destroy someone else's home Being arrested would go a long way in stopping houses being destroyed. There's never enough security deposit to cover what they do. I put in an entire new floor. A year and a half later, I had to do it again. That bitch actually thought I'd return her deposit. I told her I'd see her in hell first and I know she knew I meant it. A brand new frickin floor!!

[Bonny]

The Captain,

Uggggh! I've had two tenants try the "habitability" clause on me and I just laughed at them and told them to go ahead. One tenant was having a problem with mice. Well, duh pick up the food your kid throws and don't leave dog food out all day. Fortunately the CAR (California Assoc of Realtor's lease) discusses pest control responsibility. But I've learned and on our walk-through sheet I specifically call out securing food sources including pet food. I haven't had the same problem again.

However I did have another tenant at the same house try the habitability thing. He was a licensed real estate agent who wasn't making it. And the longer I dealt with him I realized why. He'd just make up stuff because he didn't know what he was talking about. Again my walk-through sheet saved me as I had disclosed up front the issues he was complaining about.

Some people are just jerks. And it's hard not to take it personally when it's happening.

And just wait until these folks use you as a reference!

[The Captain]

Thanks Bonny and zibazinski!!!  It really helps to be able to come here and vent, knowing that even with all the planning and researching, that others have to deal with the same nonsense as well.  Not that I'm wishing it on you, but I think you get what I mean.

The guy I shadowed for a few months warned be about the habitability clause.  The city inspectors (while acknowledging that tenants usually cause the problems) don't really care what is the cause of the infestation - they expect the landlord to fix it.  If you as a landlord don't want to deal with it, then you have to evict the tenants (which we're going to do anyway).

The only good thing going in our case is there is no minor living in the unit, so the eviction proceeding should go quickly.  It's not unknown for a judge to slow down, or put a stay, on an eviction if there is a minor that will be made homeless. 

Ugg, just ugg.

[zibazinski]

This is why I always sue even if they're judgment proof. I run checks, all landlords should. It shows up, only a fool would rent to them. If there that stupid, they deserve their place trashed. Plus, I even collected $800 years later because they wanted to buy a car and couldn't because they owed me! I wouldn't write them a letter to loan company until they paid it.  Plus, interest!!

[Bonny]

Jun 20, 2015 9:14:36 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

This is why I always sue even if they're judgment proof. I run checks, all landlords should. It shows up, only a fool would rent to them. If there that stupid, they deserve their place trashed. Plus, I even collected $800 years later because they wanted to buy a car and couldn't because they owed me! I wouldn't write them a letter to loan company until they paid it.  Plus, interest!!

Hmmm, I know you've told this story before but I guess I'm rethinking it.

My "new' tenant in the condo (2 years) was visited by a collections person looking for my deadbeat tenant that I had to evict. This was the jerk who thought he could go on disability based on breaking an ankle in the Coast guard.

I wonder if I should just follow through. These guys didn't do any direct damage but left me a huge mess including a week's worth dirty diapers and bags of dog feces on the balcony. You just gotta wonder about  how people live like this.  And he was a physician's assistant. 

Although it's been over two years since they left I do have up to four years in which to sue them.

BTW and head's up Zib. It looks like they may have split up and he may have moved back to FL!