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Post by marjar on Mar 2, 2011 19:17:08 GMT -5
NBC/WSJ poll: Voters deficit-worried but wary of cuts Americans adamantly opposed to cuts in Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, K-12 education WASHINGTON — As politicians in Washington — and across the country — seek to cut spending to reduce their budget deficits, the latest NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll finds that the American public is divided about how far they should go. In the poll, eight in 10 respondents say they are concerned about the growing federal deficit and the national debt, but more than 60 percent — including key swing-voter groups — are concerned that major cuts from Congress could impact their lives and their families. What’s more, while Americans find some budget cuts acceptable, they are adamantly opposed to cuts in Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security and K-12 education. And although a combined 22 percent of poll-takers name the deficit/government spending as the top issue the federal government should address, 37 percent believe job creation/economic growth is the No. 1 issue. Republican pollster Bill McInturff, who conducted the survey with Democratic pollster Peter D. Hart, says these results are a “cautionary sign” for a Republican Party pursuing deep budget cuts. www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41876558/ns/politics/
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 19:24:42 GMT -5
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Mar 2, 2011 19:31:10 GMT -5
I wonder if one asks a young kid if he wants to eat a good balanced meal, or feast on hamburgers, fries, soda...and have unlimited amounts of candy to eat.
There is not even enough wealth in the US to cover what all levels of govt have committed themselves to. 100s of trillions of unfunded liabilities face us as a country in the coming decades.
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Loopdilou
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Post by Loopdilou on Mar 2, 2011 19:53:53 GMT -5
I wonder if one asks a young kid if he wants to eat a good balanced meal, or feast on hamburgers, fries, soda...and have unlimited amounts of candy to eat.There is not even enough wealth in the US to cover what all levels of govt have committed themselves to. 100s of trillions of unfunded liabilities face us as a country in the coming decades. 100s of trillions... really.
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safeharbor37
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Post by safeharbor37 on Mar 2, 2011 19:56:12 GMT -5
In order to address the current deficit [and the projected ones] it will be necessary for virtually everyone to share the pain. I believe that the problem is that people don't want to give up their benefits for fear that others won't give up theirs and, as a result, they'll be stuck paying the whole bill ~ and because some won't do their share, the job won't get done. What we need is some mutual trust and a sense of unified action ~ unfortunately, our experience leads us not to trust our fellows, particularly the likes of labor unions which have a history of abusing the system for their own benefit and failing to pull their weight. Not many of us expect to see the local banker volunteering for painful sacrifice. The last time we had a real sense of unity that lasted more than momentarily was WWII and that lasted [for us] only about three and a half years [and there were profiteers even then]. Americans aren't very patient. Maybe a war would do it. Looks like we may have an opportunity.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Mar 2, 2011 20:00:43 GMT -5
I wonder if one asks a young kid if he wants to eat a good balanced meal, or feast on hamburgers, fries, soda...and have unlimited amounts of candy to eat.... Interesting analogy! IM(not so)HO, we have a choice. Stay aboard the bus called "The American Experiment" as it (potentially) goes off the cliff or have the bus driver tell the "children" in the bus to sit down, shut up, and let him drive.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 20:37:09 GMT -5
I wonder, if one asks a young kid if he wants to eat... if he'd say yes... (should we ask him now? Or after we cut WIC ?)...
Yes we need to make INTELLIGENT cuts...
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Mar 3, 2011 0:29:32 GMT -5
www.usdebtclock.org/$113 Trillion of unfunded liabilities right now and growing. Liability per tax payer of over $1m. Sentiment will quickly change as Gen Y becomes the primary voting block and don't benefit from these programs, with potentially the exception of education [of their children]. Cuts to these programs will be their way to vote themselves money; like the boomers did in setting up these promises to themselves over the past few decades. Just the circle of life. [/size]
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pappyjohn99
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Post by pappyjohn99 on Mar 3, 2011 1:28:25 GMT -5
IM(not so)HO, we have a choice. Stay aboard the bus called "The American Experiment" as it (potentially) goes off the cliff or have the bus driver tell the "children" in the bus to sit down, shut up, and let him drive. [/quote] May I intoduce some of you to Governor Scott Walker?
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Post by ed1066 on Mar 3, 2011 1:33:08 GMT -5
This is assuming the Republicans are sitting in the back where Obama put them, right?
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Mar 3, 2011 2:07:17 GMT -5
In order to address the current deficit [and the projected ones] it will be necessary for virtually everyone to share the pain. I believe that the problem is that people don't want to give up their benefits for fear that others won't give up theirs and, as a result, they'll be stuck paying the whole bill ~ and because some won't do their share, the job won't get done. What we need is some mutual trust and a sense of unified action ~ unfortunately, our experience leads us not to trust our fellows, particularly the likes of labor unions which have a history of abusing the system for their own benefit and failing to pull their weight. Not many of us expect to see the local banker volunteering for painful sacrifice. The last time we had a real sense of unity that lasted more than momentarily was WWII and that lasted [for us] only about three and a half years [and there were profiteers even then]. Americans aren't very patient. Maybe a war would do it. Looks like we may have an opportunity. You do post well Safe, and make sense from one from the almost opposite side that I am on., remember middle left, and I think I have a partial answer that would never happen, but just might work. Your correct about the pain, and also the jealousy and wondering who is suffering more. There were so many who sacrificed themselves in WW2, in fact all our wars and possible that is what is needed. The sacrifice would not be so much the populace however. If you take something away from some one, if they don't voluntarily give it up, you just take it away, no sacrifice, just pain and hurt from having something they had taken away.. We are in such financial straits, 14 Trillion and counting, just look at that interest load per year, unsustainable. Get enough same thinking politicians into office , they are the ones who make the decisions, and have them all forget their constituencies back home, their wants and desires, and from the political stand point , they, political, are the ones who will be doing the sacrifice. In fact they can even pass legislation that cuts them a decoration, a medal, with ribbon as well as lapel pin, a medal for service that only they can wear, for service to the country by giving up any thought of being reelected. They look at the entitlements, they stop the squabbling, they are not going to be coming back here again except on vacation when their tour ends anyway, and they make the changes that have to be made to survive, sacrificing themselves in the process, because once the folks back home see what they have done to their little pet wants and desires , these politico's are toast. As a post above says, the populace really don't want to give up much, actually they are coping out and with all the platitudes they are lying through their teeth. They will leave their burden on their children's and their children's and even their shoulders, as they sheepishly , with out looking the kids in the face just continue as they have been doing, if left to their own desires and if politicos allow them to do that, but not if enough of them , politicos , are ready to sacrifice and pay the price and really tackle those entitlements. Spread them out a bit on some so won't come all at once but cut they must to save the nation , the Republic, our great country, and if they do that, then they can put that lapel pin in their coats button hole and when they meet from time to time, nothing has to be said, just a look at the pin, a look into the eyes of their fellows and a little smile as they go about their life.
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Politically_Incorrect12
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Post by Politically_Incorrect12 on Mar 3, 2011 6:54:21 GMT -5
In order to address the current deficit [and the projected ones] it will be necessary for virtually everyone to share the pain. I believe that the problem is that people don't want to give up their benefits for fear that others won't give up theirs and, as a result, they'll be stuck paying the whole bill ~ and because some won't do their share, the job won't get done. What we need is some mutual trust and a sense of unified action ~ unfortunately, our experience leads us not to trust our fellows, particularly the likes of labor unions which have a history of abusing the system for their own benefit and failing to pull their weight. Not many of us expect to see the local banker volunteering for painful sacrifice. The last time we had a real sense of unity that lasted more than momentarily was WWII and that lasted [for us] only about three and a half years [and there were profiteers even then]. Americans aren't very patient. Maybe a war would do it. Looks like we may have an opportunity. I'm pretty sure that is why the concept of Communism doesn't work when you apply it people.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Mar 3, 2011 9:06:07 GMT -5
This is assuming the Republicans are sitting in the back where Obama put them, right? I was thinking Savoir Faire, Junior Contributor as the bus driver. The topic of the thread is: "Americans adamantly opposed to cuts in Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, K-12 education" I wonder if one asks a young kid if he wants to eat a good balanced meal, or feast on hamburgers, fries, soda...and have unlimited amounts of candy to eat..... S.F. implies in reply #2 that they are children who should not be asked. If the American people are placed in the role of "children", then it is only logical that someone must be the "parent" to make decisions for them. Children do not pick their parents, so elected officials (from any or no political party) would not be the appropriate leaders if "The American Experiment" were to be pitched into the scrap pile of history.
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Mar 3, 2011 9:19:40 GMT -5
100s of trillions... reallyYes, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid alone are nearly $150 trillion. SS and Medicare Unfunded Liabilities, 2008 www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27725258/page/2/ Even when all that debt is paid off, your generation will likely face another big debt problem. Remember the money that the government has set aside for Social Security and Medicare benefits? It’s not going to be nearly enough to pay the bills for those of us who will be relying on Social Security to pay for retirement and on Medicare to take care of us when we get old and sick. There are various estimates out there. The government’s own accountants at the GAO figure it will take another $40 trillion.
Earlier this year, Richard Fisher, the president of the Dallas Federal Reserve, gave a speech in which he figured Social Security will need another $13.6 trillion to cover retirement checks to people like me. Medicare will need something like $85.6 trillion to pay our medical bills.Public pension are unfunded to the tune of $100s of billions as noted in this article in Forbes: www.forbes.com/2010/01/20/united-states-debt-10-business-wall-street-united-states-debt.html?feed=rss_popstoriesI have not even tossed in the prescription drug program.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Mar 3, 2011 9:21:39 GMT -5
Sometimes, you have to spend a bit to make a lot. I see a huge amount of waste. The welfare system needs watchdogging in the worst way. Those who are leaching the system dry need to be eliminated. That will take a concerted effort to weed out the abusers. At the moment, we're not very good at that ... not very good, at all. That's not the only program that's rife with fraud, laziness, and general innui. Then again, those who are supposed to police these things are too few in number to do the job correctly.
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Mar 3, 2011 9:22:22 GMT -5
S.F. implies in reply #2 that they are children who should not be asked. If the American people are placed in the role of "children", then it is only logical that someone must be the "parent" to make decisions for them. Children do not pick their parents, so elected officials (from any or no political party) would not be the appropriate leaders if "The American Experiment" were to be pitched into the scrap pile of history.
Actually it is not the American Experiment, it is the failed liberal experiment.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Mar 3, 2011 9:24:26 GMT -5
100s of trillions... reallyYes, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid alone are nearly $150 trillion. SS and Medicare Unfunded Liabilities, 2008 www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27725258/page/2/ Even when all that debt is paid off, your generation will likely face another big debt problem. Remember the money that the government has set aside for Social Security and Medicare benefits? It’s not going to be nearly enough to pay the bills for those of us who will be relying on Social Security to pay for retirement and on Medicare to take care of us when we get old and sick. There are various estimates out there. The government’s own accountants at the GAO figure it will take another $40 trillion.
Earlier this year, Richard Fisher, the president of the Dallas Federal Reserve, gave a speech in which he figured Social Security will need another $13.6 trillion to cover retirement checks to people like me. Medicare will need something like $85.6 trillion to pay our medical bills.Public pension are unfunded to the tune of $100s of billions as noted in this article in Forbes: www.forbes.com/2010/01/20/united-states-debt-10-business-wall-street-united-states-debt.html?feed=rss_popstoriesI have not even tossed in the prescription drug program. Looks like the babyboomers might have to migrate to Mexico, Panama, Canada, and Nicaraugua, take as much monetarily possible with them, and renounce citizenship to survive. That would leave a few liberals here to support the welfare class and illegal immigrants here in America........
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Mar 3, 2011 9:37:50 GMT -5
In order to address the current deficit [and the projected ones] it will be necessary for virtually everyone to share the pain. I believe that the problem is that people don't want to give up their benefits for fear that others won't give up theirs and, as a result, they'll be stuck paying the whole bill ~ and because some won't do their share, the job won't get done. What we need is some mutual trust and a sense of unified action ~ unfortunately, our experience leads us not to trust our fellows, particularly the likes of labor unions which have a history of abusing the system for their own benefit and failing to pull their weight. Not many of us expect to see the local banker volunteering for painful sacrifice. The last time we had a real sense of unity that lasted more than momentarily was WWII and that lasted [for us] only about three and a half years [and there were profiteers even then]. Americans aren't very patient. Maybe a war would do it. Looks like we may have an opportunity. You do post well Safe, and make sense from one from the almost opposite side that I am on., remember middle left, and I think I have a partial answer that would never happen, but just might work. Your correct about the pain, and also the jealousy and wondering who is suffering more. There were so many who sacrificed themselves in WW2, in fact all our wars and possible that is what is needed. The sacrifice would not be so much the populace however. If you take something away from some one, if they don't voluntarily give it up, you just take it away, no sacrifice, just pain and hurt from having something they had taken away.. We are in such financial straits, 14 Trillion and counting, just look at that interest load per year, unsustainable. Get enough same thinking politicians into office , they are the ones who make the decisions, and have them all forget their constituencies back home, their wants and desires, and from the political stand point , they, political, are the ones who will be doing the sacrifice. In fact they can even pass legislation that cuts them a decoration, a medal, with ribbon as well as lapel pin, a medal for service that only they can wear, for service to the country by giving up any thought of being reelected. They look at the entitlements, they stop the squabbling, they are not going to be coming back here again except on vacation when their tour ends anyway, and they make the changes that have to be made to survive, sacrificing themselves in the process, because once the folks back home see what they have done to their little pet wants and desires , these politico's are toast. As a post above says, the populace really don't want to give up much, actually they are coping out and with all the platitudes they are lying through their teeth. They will leave their burden on their children's and their children's and even their shoulders, as they sheepishly , with out looking the kids in the face just continue as they have been doing, if left to their own desires and if politicos allow them to do that, but not if enough of them , politicos , are ready to sacrifice and pay the price and really tackle those entitlements. Spread them out a bit on some so won't come all at once but cut they must to save the nation , the Republic, our great country, and if they do that, then they can put that lapel pin in their coats button hole and when they meet from time to time, nothing has to be said, just a look at the pin, a look into the eyes of their fellows and a little smile as they go about their life. In my family's case, my wife has retired from the workforce, but does 32 hours a week of volunteering,even though she is younger than me. I am basically four years from retirement. I could possibly put off retiring and collecting social security for up to a year, as a sacrifice, but the bottom line is, my company, although they would never admit it, does manage to weed out the older workers over productivity issues, etc. As one gets a little older, you do not want to put up with the work politics, etc, and would rather just move on in life. Economics usually prohibit most people from doing it. I would say there are millions of baby boomers who fall into this situation right now, but cannot afford the sacrifice of no income while postponing SS for a year or so. Even if I postpone retirement for a year, then my SS check will increase, exasperating the deficit, so unless the Government stops progressive increases over later retirement dates, it will not help the deficit, unless we keel over dead earlier then insurance company estimates.
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Mar 3, 2011 9:46:50 GMT -5
In the poll, eight in 10 respondents say they are concerned about the growing federal deficit and the national debt, but more than 60 percent — including key swing-voter groups — are concerned that major cuts from Congress could impact their lives and their families. Every single cut made will impact somebody's life and/or somebody's family. A possible future collapse of a worthless US dollar will impact everybody's life and everybody's family and likely in a whole lot worse way. The choice is ours...choose now and choose wisely. Sure...lets leave the biggest drains on government dollars alone and continue token cuts. Yes, the senate is, I believe. Apparently a $2.5 billion deficit for '10-'11 isn't enough for the state to realize that we cannot afford this. Maybe we're trying to catch up with CA. Assuming our current bus driver knows the way back to the road. Seems to me like he's just shifting gears and mashing the gas.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Mar 3, 2011 9:48:33 GMT -5
S.F. implies in reply #2 that they are children who should not be asked. If the American people are placed in the role of "children", then it is only logical that someone must be the "parent" to make decisions for them. Children do not pick their parents, so elected officials (from any or no political party) would not be the appropriate leaders if "The American Experiment" were to be pitched into the scrap pile of history. Actually it is not the American Experiment, it is the failed liberal experiment. It has been the American people who have elected the individuals who have taken the country on the path it has been on. That is meaning of "The American Experiment", that the people make the decisions instead of an elite.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Mar 3, 2011 9:54:32 GMT -5
... IM(not so)HO, we have a choice. Stay aboard the bus called "The American Experiment" as it (potentially) goes off the cliff or have the bus driver tell the "children" in the bus to sit down, shut up, and let him drive. Assuming our current bus driver knows the way back to the road. Seems to me like he's just shifting gears and mashing the gas. My reply #12 addresses how this is a misunderstanding of what I posted.
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Mar 3, 2011 10:36:13 GMT -5
My reply #12 addresses how this is a misunderstanding of what I posted. Ok....maybe you need to be a little more subtle next time. Is it Friday yet?
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Mar 3, 2011 15:23:49 GMT -5
More: 79% say the best way to deal with deficit is to raise taxes on those with income over a million dollars...
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Post by ed1066 on Mar 3, 2011 15:25:01 GMT -5
Fixed it for you:
79% of welfare junkies say the best way to deal with deficit is to raise taxes on those with income over a million dollars...
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Mar 3, 2011 15:29:43 GMT -5
More: 79% say the best way to deal with deficit is to raise taxes on those with income over a million dollars...
This would be akin to a few of us urinating in the Atlantic Ocean to raise the water level.
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Mar 3, 2011 15:39:39 GMT -5
What the bill proves is that 21% of the US are Ugly 'Merican (racist?) loudmouth dittohead MORONS.
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Post by ed1066 on Mar 3, 2011 15:45:26 GMT -5
Once again, thank God this Demtroll is not on our side...
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Mar 3, 2011 16:04:51 GMT -5
Ditto, Pubtroll. Start some more racist anti Muslim threads. Trolls don't argue politics, just make STUPID lying personal insults- see #23
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Mar 3, 2011 16:25:21 GMT -5
Trolls don't argue politics, just make STUPID lying personal insults- see #23
Actually that post was quite accurate. A couple of weeks ago there was some sort of hearing in NYC about cutting some welfare benefits or something or other. I forget, but it was in the evening news. Some activists in the crowd started to chant "tax the rich, tax the rich", etc..
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Mar 3, 2011 16:31:23 GMT -5
So they're like everyone else. Did you know that white welfare recipients are the same politically as non welfare whites? No one WANTS to be on welfare.
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