NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 8, 2014 9:01:47 GMT -5
Back to the OP, everyone has parts of their jobs that suck. I don't think teachers in general really have it that much harder than anyone else right now.
I have no assurances of a job every year as funding gets more and more convoluted and the pot gets smaller. I deal with crappy collaborators, stupid students, bad technicians, and endless bureaucrats whose sole purpose in life is to create more work for me. I joke I haven't done my job right if I haven't committed at least one violation, that's how complicated the set of rules I am expected to follow is getting.
Right now my favorite is I am in federal EPA compliance with waste disposal but our safety director has decided he has his own preferences which creates twice as much work for me and sucks up valuable lab space.
I've been in the lab till 6 pm every night getting stuff done because my collaborators expect it done yesterday. I piss them off, there goes my paycheck.
At least two times a year the campus is on high alert because of the Animal Liberation Front. They've killed/freed thousands of lab animals and destroyed labs on several campuses. This costs researchers thousands of dollars and can set back research for years.
Then on a fairly regular basis I get accused of being part of a giant government/pharmaceutical industry plot to keep people sick and that's why we "haven't cured cancer". I don't get a chance to explain how research actually works because nobody wants to hear it . There was an entire thread devoted to this topic on the boards not too long ago.
And I am expected to put up with all this for $30k a year. No bonuses EVER and no raises unless a state bean counter in Lincoln decides the university is allowed to give raises and I'm only allowed what the bean counter approves. Highest has been 3%.
But I chose to do take this job. I choose to keep this job for now. I also have to admit that I get quite a few non-salary perks that compensate for the lower pay. Part of the reason I haven't jumped ship yet is I haven't found a private job that compares or offers enough to make up for what I lose in non-salary benefits.
I can either whine about how nobody understands or values what I do or I can suck it up or I can look for another job. Nobody is holding a gun to my head making me choose this profession.
Same goes for every other job out there for the most part. I don't think the majority of us have it as hard as we like to spin it sometimes.
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Blonde Granny
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Post by Blonde Granny on Jul 8, 2014 9:34:44 GMT -5
We're wandering off the original topic with the detailed discussions of Common Core. Perhaps it would be better as a stand alone thread.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2014 9:45:28 GMT -5
What does lesson planning entail?
Assessing prior knowledge. Designing an intro to access prior knowledge, introduce new concepts, practice new concepts in manners consistent with classes major modality preferences, taking into account range of potential and achievement as well as any specific deficiency, language or behavior needs. Enrichment and remediation components to extend and reinforce for those who need it, ie. Ways in which to differentiate the instruction. An assessment component to evaluate if instruction was successful. Efforts to generalize knowledge and skills..
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2014 9:46:05 GMT -5
I'll start a new thread after lunch. Sorry! Then can someone move those posts from here to there?
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Blonde Granny
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Post by Blonde Granny on Jul 8, 2014 9:48:51 GMT -5
I'll start a new thread after lunch. Sorry! Not a problem. I know from what I've been seeing about CC that it is becoming a real issue around the country. I thought it might be much better interest if it was as a stand alone.
Yes I can do that after you start a new thread. I do have to be gone for awhile after lunch, so if I'm not here I'll ask mmhmm to do it.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jul 8, 2014 10:09:05 GMT -5
![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/yeahthat.gif) Every job has good and bad aspects. I personally wouldn't want to teach because of all the political BS and pain in the ass parents. Teachers get paid decent where I live though (can't speak for other areas) so I get a bit peeved when I hear teachers complaining about salaries. They get paid the same as many other professionals that only get 2 weeks off per year, have to travel, work OT, etc. Teachers work hard - there is no debate from me about that but I don't believe they work any harder than a lot of other professions. Just like with any other job, if you don't like it then leave. In general, it annoys me when people sit around complaining about their job but would rather stay and complain than move on to something else. There is a teacher in my neighborhood. We are not friends, just acquaintances but every time I see her she complains non-stop. I want to tell her to do the kids a favor and leave!! And just for the record she arrives home before me most days and is spending most of the summer sitting around the pool.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jul 8, 2014 10:23:00 GMT -5
I'll start a new thread after lunch. Sorry! Once the new thread is started, I'll move the CC related posts into that thread from this one. Blonde Granny is gonna get her hair done! ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/smiley.png) mmhmm, Administrator
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2014 11:23:07 GMT -5
I absolutely agree with you that the teacher should have never failed him for a disability, should have asked questions and researched.
That said, lets look at that expectation. Is it not one of the many expectations which people don't list when they talk about the 8-3/180 job of a teacher? ... Knowing all of your, could be hundreds of kids, how they function, what accomodations they might need... calling home, research, etc.
And why didn't he tell YOU about it? Why did your kid not let you know before pt conferences that he was failed on a test for his disability? Why didn't you send a sheet for his records with the info and accomodations on them, so his teachers would know? Is the teacher responsible for everything?
If that was one of the better teachers, i'm not sure why you kept him in school?
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Jul 8, 2014 11:56:24 GMT -5
And sometimes it's the opposite. A friend of mine teaches fourth grade. A couple years ago she approached a parent because a student was struggling with writing. His fine motor skills weren't developing as the ought to be. She suggested some testing and possibly a check up with the doctor. Parents told her that it was her job to teach the child and she just wasn't doing her job. I remember her bitching about it at the time, though she wouldn't tell me who the kid was. Fast forward. The kid has been diagnosed with something awful (can't remember what) and he it would be easier to treat had it been caught earlier. After I heard, I asked her if it was him. Poor kid. I sat there one evening listening to the parent complain about his teachers never noticing.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2014 14:36:33 GMT -5
Parents can be really resistant to being told their kid has a problem. They also might not be able to pay for the treatments needed. I know our insurance has a $65 copay for OT and PT and only allows 30 treatments a year. It doesn't take many weeks of two or three OT appointments a week to totally be out of someone's ability to pay.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2014 14:45:54 GMT -5
Anne I agree that 30 sessions isn't much. That is what our insurance will pay though. I don't think ours would even pay for dyslexia. I thought I read that as an example of what they consider the school's responsibility not theirs.
I just don't think the average family making $50K a year is going to be able to absorb $130 bucks a week in PT sessions for very long. Most people I have known would do it if they could. But I could see someone getting defensive if they couldn't afford the treatment and someone was just telling them to do it like it was nothing.
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Jul 8, 2014 15:41:49 GMT -5
Parents can be really resistant to being told their kid has a problem. They also might not be able to pay for the treatments needed. I know our insurance has a $65 copay for OT and PT and only allows 30 treatments a year. It doesn't take many weeks of two or three OT appointments a week to totally be out of someone's ability to pay. Both statements are true. But you don't then turn around and blame the teachers for not noticing when they did, they talked to you, and you chose not to pursue it.
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jul 8, 2014 18:52:27 GMT -5
I absolutely agree with you that the teacher should have never failed him for a disability, should have asked questions and researched. That said, lets look at that expectation. Is it not one of the many expectations which people don't list when they talk about the 8-3/180 job of a teacher? ... Knowing all of your, could be hundreds of kids, how they function, what accomodations they might need... calling home, research, etc. And why didn't he tell YOU about it? Why did your kid not let you know before pt conferences that he was failed on a test for his disability? Why didn't you send a sheet for his records with the info and accomodations on them, so his teachers would know? Is the teacher responsible for everything? If that was one of the better teachers, i'm not sure why you kept him in school?What would you suggest as an alternative? I'm honestly not intending this as a snark, but not everyone has the ability or means to home-school their children or pay for private schools. I personally know I would be woefully unqualified to teach DD. So far she's had excellent teachers, but I suspect even if she were to get a "poor" teacher they would still do a better job than would I.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2014 19:10:04 GMT -5
I think you underestimate yourself Captain!
But there are options. I think school and education are too big to just let go if the kids are getting stuck in a poor school with poor teachers. Homeschool, move to change schools, private school, some combination of the above, coordinate with others who want some combination of above.
I dont ont think anyone should say I'm stuck in this shitty school with bad teachers, but I can't do anything...
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2014 20:11:55 GMT -5
I think you underestimate yourself Captain! But there are options. I think school and education are too big to just let go if the kids are getting stuck in a poor school with poor teachers. Homeschool, move to change schools, private school, some combination of the above, coordinate with others who want some combination of above. I dont ont think anyone should say I'm stuck in this shitty school with bad teachers, but I can't do anything... I think the problem is that the people with any resources do actually do as much as possible to get their kids out of the bad districts. The problems are what about the kids who are left. Two of the districts that come to mind are Camden, NJ and Pleasantville, NJ. The students left in those districts come from the poorest of the poor or literally have no one that can help them. So the people with the least ability to help themselves are literally given the worst set of set circumstances to try and get through.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2014 20:17:35 GMT -5
Then I think as a community we need to do something about areas like that.
It's a hard issue though. I've been trying to get my evaluator to homeschool. She is on the Fence for that reason...'if we take all the good kids out of the schools, what are we left with'... But in the end, I'm not willing to sacrifice mine to the greater good in that way...
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2014 20:26:18 GMT -5
Make no mistake I'm not either. We moved and our old district isn't any where near as bad as Camden! But what about the people who can't afford to sell their house and buy one in a pricier district?
They just changed the choice laws in NJ to allow students to move outside of counties if they want. The good part is the student who lives just in the next county has the ability to get driven to a better district if they get picked. The rub is the student has to be driven. So a family living on public transportation or with only one car that has to take someone to work and that isn't an option.
I sometimes get bored in the of milk toast and white bread, but I never worried about my kids schools. The fight for teachers here is between good and great not good and bad.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 10, 2014 4:32:28 GMT -5
Make no mistake I'm not either. We moved and our old district isn't any where near as bad as Camden! But what about the people who can't afford to sell their house and buy one in a pricier district? They just changed the choice laws in NJ to allow students to move outside of counties if they want. The good part is the student who lives just in the next county has the ability to get driven to a better district if they get picked. The rub is the student has to be driven. So a family living on public transportation or with only one car that has to take someone to work and that isn't an option. I sometimes get bored in the of milk toast and white bread, but I never worried about my kids schools. The fight for teachers here is between good and great not good and bad. And this is where I have an issue. Why do people keep popping out babies when they can't afford to give their children a decent life? If I lived in the hell hope known as Camden and couldn't afford to get out, the last thing I would do is have children.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 10, 2014 7:14:13 GMT -5
I don't think teachers in general really have it that much harder than anyone else right now.
I think everyone thinks their cross is the heaviest to bear. I read an article yesterday that was this whole "When you are a teacher there is never enough time - there are never enough resources" blah, blah. I just wanted to put in a comment that said "Same with every job." Everyone at my work feels like they have too much to do. Everyone at my work is putting in extra hours. Everyone at my work has to deal with the fact that our staff was cut by 40% and the person that used to do X, Y and Z is no longer here. Every day is like this for just about every employee. That is why they call it work.
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jul 10, 2014 7:17:57 GMT -5
I think you underestimate yourself Captain! But there are options. I think school and education are too big to just let go if the kids are getting stuck in a poor school with poor teachers. Homeschool, move to change schools, private school, some combination of the above, coordinate with others who want some combination of above. I dont ont think anyone should say I'm stuck in this shitty school with bad teachers, but I can't do anything... It's kind of you to think so, but I'm just being realistic. The "new" math stumps me and I haven't been able to help her with that since 4th grade. I know my limits. As others have mentioned, until now we put her in private schools. Just two weeks ago we just moved to get her into a better school district. In some ways we are part of the problem because we've taken a pretty good student out of a poorly performing school district. And honestly, I used to care, but seeing the downward spiral because too many parents don't give a damn, I don't care anymore. My first responsibility is to DD. We have the means to pay private tuition or move. Most people don't. In my old area it's not a question of money, it's that a lot of people expect the school to take care of their kids, instead of being a partner as working together. In order to homeschool you have to have (usually) at least one working parent who can support the household. Many in this area cannot have a decent life on one income. Which sucks for the parents who do care, because who do you think the teachers are going to spend the most time on? The ones who are getting help at home or the ones who aren't?
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Jul 10, 2014 9:02:43 GMT -5
My wife has been a teacher for about 11 years in an upper middle class district with very high performance standards. They used to automatically tenure teachers who made it to 5 years, but now they fire them if they don’t want to be stuck with them. Lots of testing, data analysis, and all that and very high expectations from administration and parents.
Having said all that, my wife generally works from about 7:30 to 3:45 or so and work at home is pretty much limited to catching up on a weekend for a couple hours. We’re a month into summer and my wife hasn’t done any work at all and, from the looks of it, it doesn’t look like she intends on doing work at any time soon.
When my wife first started teaching, she used to work at nights and on weekends but that all stopped when we had a family. I think since teachers have always been able to “work from home”, it naturally spilled over into their personal time. Whereas me, I’ve never really had network access at any of my jobs until recently so I never even thought about working from home.
It’s all about Parkinsons Law; work expands to fit the time available. If teachers didn’t do work at home, they’d find ways to be more efficient during the day and the job would probably get done anyways.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2014 9:14:13 GMT -5
Or they stop being as efficient/effective. I don't mean anything about your wife. I know I stopped being as effective once I had kids.
The emotional overload was actually what I handled least well once I had kids. Yes, the paperwork, etc was stressful. But it was the sometimes heartbreaking situations of kids, I had to harden to some of that or not make it, and if you are hardened to some of that, you don't do as good of a job, etc...
Realistically, the issues with teaching are being a good teacher/mentor/advocate to everyone at all times. And if not, it's a person you fail... And I don't mean give an F to... I taught 8 years. I'd say 2 I was hardly effective on a global scale, 2 I was widely effective on a global scale and 4 I was helping some and failing others. Not that it's all the teachers responsibility, I know... But it's hard when your failures are people...
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jul 10, 2014 9:29:04 GMT -5
All I know is the happier people on earth I know besides empty nesters are former school teachers! I miss the kids but I don't miss anything else. I've been retired 7 years now and they've gone though 5 teachers in my former job. Those poor kids.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 10, 2014 9:30:47 GMT -5
read an article yesterday that was this whole "When you are a teacher there is never enough time - there are never enough resources" blah, blah
They should come work in an academia lab sometime if they want to see "never enough resources". I've got equipment that is pretty much held together with duct tape and prayers. Since there is only so much money to go around if you can get it to turn it on. ..you're expected to use it.
We just replaced a scale that hasn't been calibrated since 1995. Only reason it was replaced is because another lab shut down and we called dibs on one of the scales.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jul 10, 2014 9:46:36 GMT -5
read an article yesterday that was this whole "When you are a teacher there is never enough time - there are never enough resources" blah, blahThey should come work in an academia lab sometime if they want to see "never enough resources". I've got equipment that is pretty much held together with duct tape and prayers. Since there is only so much money to go around if you can get it to turn it on. ..you're expected to use it. We just replaced a scale that hasn't been calibrated since 1995. Only reason it was replaced is because another lab shut down and we called dibs on one of the scales. I can top this..... A few months before I left, we got chairs. Oh, we had chairs but you had to sit on them very carefully or fall on your butt or off the back. A new med school was being built and we salvaged the student's chairs from the lab. They were old, but not broken like our's were. Research labs descended upon those chairs like a herd of devouring locusts. There were 40 chairs, we grabbed 6 and since we got there first, we got 6 that were not broken or ripped.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 10, 2014 9:52:34 GMT -5
Oh, we had chairs but you had to sit on them very carefully or fall on your butt or off the backWe have a chair that balances on three legs. Oh it has all four legs, just one likes to hover above the ground. Sit in it wrong and you'll topple to your death. I stand a good majority of the time. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png)
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Ryan
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Post by Ryan on Jul 10, 2014 9:58:36 GMT -5
Or they stop being as efficient/effective. I don't mean anything about your wife. I know I stopped being as effective once I had kids. The emotional overload was actually what I handled least well once I had kids. Yes, the paperwork, etc was stressful. But it was the sometimes heartbreaking situations of kids, I had to harden to some of that or not make it, and if you are hardened to some of that, you don't do as good of a job, etc... Realistically, the issues with teaching are being a good teacher/mentor/advocate to everyone at all times. And if not, it's a person you fail... And I don't mean give an F to... I taught 8 years. I'd say 2 I was hardly effective on a global scale, 2 I was widely effective on a global scale and 4 I was helping some and failing others. Not that it's all the teachers responsibility, I know... But it's hard when your failures are people... My wife can get away with that because she's kind of a workhorse when she's working. No breaks, no lunches, no chit-chat, etc. Part of being able to do this is knowing what is important and what isn't all that important. She works with teachers that are middle aged and have a bit more time to spend on things, so they'll take a lunch and chat with people, stay after school, and spend a couple hours on a task that you wouldn't complete if you were limited on time.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jul 10, 2014 10:37:42 GMT -5
Some people, I am not referring to teachers but people in all professions, tend to over glorify their work. All jobs can be stressful at times but I know I am no brain surgeon. In my mind I just have an average job. It can be trying every once in a while but it is not rocket science. Sometimes I hear people in my industry talking about hard the job is - no, it really isn't. We are not saving lives or preforming medical miracles. I am not saying what we do doesn't matter or contribute to society but people tend to make things seem a lot more important than they really are. That being said, I DO think teachers have an extremely important job but I don't know anyone that doesn't work from home sometimes or put in some extra hours on some weekends so when they complain about those things they don't get a lot of sympathy from me.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2014 10:45:55 GMT -5
I can only speak for myself. It was more than I could do well when I stopped, and I am hesitant when I consider if I want to return to it.
If I do, I will probably not work elementary/ middle school special Ed for any longer than I'd have to, if it was the only thing I could get.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jul 10, 2014 10:49:35 GMT -5
I can only speak for myself. It was more than I could do well when I stopped, and I am hesitant when I consider if I want to return to it. If I do, I will probably not work elementary/ middle school special Ed for any longer than I'd have to, if it was the only thing I could get. Honestly, it is not something I could do and I am not referring to the long hours or bringing work home, etc. but I think working with kids all day would completely drain me on an emotion level, not to mention all the political BS...
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