Studying Marine Biology

[Deleted]

I'm very sorry that I can't remember who it is, but I know there is a poster here whose DD is studying Marine Biology. Maybe GeorgiaGal? 

We live in France. My DS3 (my youngest of 4) will be 16 next month, he's in 10th grade. He wants to study Marine Biology. 

I'm American, my H is British, we live in France. Going to university in the UK is MUCH MUCH MUCH cheaper than in the US. While I was initially against DS3 doing his undergrad in the US (because of the costs) I'm now reconsidering. DS3 is in the US Section of a prestigious International Lycee here. Apparently some students get 90%-95% scholarships in the US so I am reconsidering, or at least trying to learn more about his options. DS3 has always wanted to go to college in the US, but we have always discouraged it because of the costs. But again, I'm reconsidering that, or at least trying to learn more about his options. 

Would that person (or anybody else) have any advice? I'm quite knowledgeable about the Marine Biology schools / programs in the UK, but I need to be better informed about the schools / programs in the US before we make any decisions. 

One other thing: because of the costs of university in the US, most of the kids in the US Section of his Lycee go to school either in the UK or in France. In any case, his school STRONGLY discourages students from applying to college in both the US and the UK, because there are a lot of different requisites. 

We have one year before we need to make that decision (applying to the US or UK) so for now I'm just trying to get more info. 

Thanks.

[alabamagal]

Yes it was me who had the daughter studying Marine Biology.  She graduated August 2012.  She went to a school out of state but got a full scholarship.  I will PM you the name.  She took here core courses and regular biology classes at the main campuses and spent two summers in school at an awesome site on the Gulf of Mexico.  The normal time period is 3 1/2 years, but she completed at the end of her 3rd year summer.  She really enjoyed the program and she had a pretty decent gpa, despite some bad influences from a bf....

She came home without a job, but got an internship in Texas the next summer.  After that she stayed in Texas and works at a book store.  She is now assistant manager and will be in store management program at the end of the year.  Obviously not in her field, but having a degree helps a lot.

It's pretty hard to get a job in the field without Masters or PhD.  She may go that route, or she may go into teaching.  Or she might not.

[lazysundays]

I started off going to study marine biology. I ultimately just left it as a minor in undergraduate. I did undergraduate research under the supervision of a grad student helping him with his experiments. What my grad level professors said- if you want to do marine bio for a living, pick an undergrad science that isn't marine bio. Marine bio is too broad of a topic. They are looking for specialized applicants for the graduate program. They liked that my major was biochemistry. They would have liked physics, geology, biology, chemistry, genetics. They want someone with enough detailed education that they will be a unique asset to the team.

[greenstone]

In the US, as it is probably in the UK, a marine biology is usually offered through the Department of Biology, Marine Sciences, or Environmental Sciences. The student picks a marine biology track, emphasis, specialty, etc. that tailors the classes to that area of study.

Some schools with strong programs are (in no particular order): U. of Rhode Island, VIMS, U. of N. Carolina-Wilmington, Coastal Carolina, Duke U., U. of Miami, Florida, Florida State, U. of Texas-Austin, Texas A&M, UCSD/Scripps, Oregon State, U. of Washington. Don't you have family in California? There are a number of good marine science schools there.

That said, I agree with the above posters that marine biology is a difficult field to find a job in, with or without an advanced degree. Schools are producing far, far more graduates than there are jobs available. There is little demand in the private sector, and research grants and government funding shrinks every year for academia and public sector jobs. My Master's is actually in marine science (different focus, non-biology) and I would be very hesitant to encourage students to pursue a marine biology major as an undergrad. For 20 years I've worked with countless marine biology students from local universities who are passionate about their studies but end up working careers outside of the science field due to the lack of jobs opportunities. It's not just marine biology, a lot of fields in the natural sciences have limited employment opportunities. I do know several people who have gone on to a science teaching career at the middle or high school level, although it wasn't their original intent to teach they do seem to like it.

[Deleted]

This is really great (if disappointing) info. Thank you! 

[zibazinski]

Thank you to the poster who told the truth. I went to college decades ago and there were no jobs for marine majors even then. Because at tht time you could get a job by just being a college grad, it worked out for a lot f them. Now that college grads have trouble unless you have chosen majors wisely, it seems foolish even if you can go to college cheaply, to major in a field for which there are no jobs. 

[Bonny]

Debt,

My alma mater is UCSD. It's much, much harder to get into that school than when I applied 35 years ago. I think Berkeley is still the hardest but UCSD may be number 2. The CA University system does essentially guarantee that a CA high school graduate with a B+ GPA and decent SAT scores can get into a UC school.

CA resident tuition is about 10k/yr. The easiest school to get into is UC Merced. I think it's about 10 years old and is the newest school in the system. Housing in Merced is much, much cheaper than La Jolla.  And while we like to tease folks who come from these farming towns, Merced is the gateway to Yosemite and the Sierras.

You will need to read up on residency requirements if you choose to go that route. In the old days some out of State parents would send a kid to do the last year of H.S. in CA. Some kids would also do a gap year and work. But like any system that gets abused they change the rules. They may now require 2 years of residency.

And don't forget we also have State Universities which are a different system than the UC system. San Diego State University (SDSU) has an excellent reputation as a top business school.

BTW our friend may have done some research on this same scenario given her kids are in a similar situation as yours.

Good luck!

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

May 1, 2014 5:27:57 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Thank you to the poster who told the truth. I went to college decades ago and there were no jobs for marine majors even then. Because at tht time you could get a job by just being a college grad, it worked out for a lot f them. Now that college grads have trouble unless you have chosen majors wisely, it seems foolish even if you can go to college cheaply, to major in a field for which there are no jobs. 

There were no jobs for marine biologists when I graduated from college in 1981.  My degree is in biology, and I have done fairly well with it.  However, I would NEVER recommend it today.  Research funding has been slashed, getting a job is difficult AND it is at the whims of the political party in power.  This goes for marine biology as well.

Not only that, to make any money you have to have advanced degrees and even then, you may not get a job.

The only way I'd recommend any sort of biology field is if you had a secondary career in mind and you needed the education.  That would be for medical school, dental school, pharmacy, PT, etc.  Even then, you need some sort of fall back position because if you are not accepted into school, you still wind up in the same place.

I just had this discussion with my nephew.  I don't think he listened to me though.

[zibazinski]

I graduated in 1976.  No jobs for them then either but you could get a job with any kind of college degree then. I worked for a bank because there were no teaching jobs.

[steph08]

I think there are a huge amount of marine biology degree holders out there, which is why it is so hard to get a job. Plus you do need advanced education to advance.

That said, a friend from high school always wanted to work with sharks. He studied marine biology. He interned in Florida, after graduation, he moved there for a job. Then he got a job in Texas, so moved there (and I think got his master's). Then he got a great offer in Seattle, so that is where he has been for several years. You have to be willing to work your way up and move a lot to get what you want.

[zibazinski]

I get that you want to major in something fun and interesting to you. I wanted to be an archeologist with emphasis on Egyptology. Fact is, I needed to work after college and also eat/have a life. Something people with useless degrees are now realizing. But we still have parents out there paying for FUN majors that lead to no careers. DF did the same for his stepkids. DSD is an interior decorator and needs mumsy to help her pay bills and even DF just cut her a check for 2k so she could pay for something. DSS married a woman who works so he's set as long as he stays married to her. He got bio DD a good paying job but she doesn't LIKE working. Good lord, what a bunch. 

[lazysundays]

I think going into marine biology is still doable. It's just a very pro-active field. I did my marine bio research in sophomore and junior year. I was guaranteed the grad level spot if I wanted it because my preceptor was one of the grad professors and she would offer a high recommendation since she wanted me to take over when the other grad student graduated. I was an oddball overachiever because I was willing to go door to door in the marine bio department and apply individually for each project. I did piss another professor off because she thought she was interviewing me and didn't realize I was interviewing her too and I chose another project. All on all I had 2 choices- analyzing miles upon miles of earth's core samples for signs of microbe life or injecting killifish with radioactive steroids to prove the effects of drug dumping in marine life. I killed a lot of fish, and extracted their livers and analyzed their proteins. Standard biochemistry work. I still didn't like it. That was a great lesson. Doing the research gave me a foot in the door but more importantly, it showed me that marine bio isn't all about playing with dolphins.
And I didn't just get lucky. I believe in proactive. When I graduated w biochemistry degree, I applied for a job with top research companies. Ended up getting a job at a prestigious university genetics center doing more biochem DNA/ protein analysis. Again I was being urged to to the doctorate with them since my boss the professor wanted me on his research team. It's good to create opportunities. Did I mention I hate the idea of doing research for the rest of my life?

I have a friend who wanted to be a zoologist. Another hard to find job. He is now living the dream. His parents invested a lot of $ into getting him to attend summer internships in college that they had to pay for. He was also very proactive. He recently graduated and is happy as a clam

[genericname]

I have a BS in Marine Biology and Marine Fisheries Management and an MS in Oceanography. I live and work in Wyoming, pretty much as far from the ocean as you can get in the U.S.

I knew many a person in undergrad who wanted to "train Shamu" or "work with the dolphins" but had no real idea what a science program was about. Science is highly specialized and a great deal of education in a specific subject is required for success. There are also a ton of politics in science, which is what turned me off and sent me away from the field. I was actually a working biologist for 5 years, but securing funding streams depends on publishing and that wasn't what I wanted to do. I can't speak to medical research or the social sciences, but I would imagine it isn't much different. 

As a scientist, if it isn't published it didn't happen. You have to produce measurable results that you can share with the community, so that they can use your results to build answers to larger questions. I just wanted to be a lab assistant and fish a lot. Which I did, but I quickly figured out you don't need a marine biology degree to do that, and making $6.50 and hour putting satellite tags on sharks is fun, but won't pay the bills.

I would never discourage anyone from pursuing a dream, I would just encourage them to realistically evaluate the expected outcomes. Which I didn't do, but I got lucky and landed on my feet.

[Bob Ross]

Tell your son to study naval architecture instead, so he can design stuff that will wail on marine biology.

And the job outlook's much better.

[achelois]

Yes, at the rate we are killing off life in the oceans, there will be no marine life to study. 

[Phoenix84]

Well, I think a lot of people would discourage anyone from going into Marine Biology, since it's a narrow field without a lot of jobs and therefore very competative.

But maybe job opportunities are better in the EU.

I don't really know any more than that.

[Bob Ross]

Back when I was in high school, it seemed that like 80% of the female (yes, for some reason it was female) graduating class wanted to major in marine biology when they went to college.

Pretty sure most ended up majoring in tequila and babymaking.

[Deleted]

Like I said, it's early days yet. He's also considering engineering (but that's his second choice). But he IS planning on doing a Masters as well. 

Thanks again for the comments / advice. 

[973beachbum]

Has he thought about environmental engineering?  It isn't as fun as playing with Shamu , but it is as close an intersection between marine biology and engineering as I can think of.

I know a lycee is like our version of a Prep HS, but is going to college in the US from there really a big deal?  I remember people from all over the world in college and I doubt most of them had the exact same things in HS as I did, but we all seemed to do okay.

The scholarships really depend.  I know lots of people who got scholarships from colleges but that was mostly from private schools not public.  The avg cost of a private college on the East coast seems to be $35K and that doesn't include R&B.  My DD got a 75% scholarship from the private school she is going to.  The kicker is it is only for tuition and not room and board.  Once you add that in it isn't quite so much of a giggle.

Someone mentioned Coastal Carolina U.  We did a southern school run and it was one of the schools we looked at.  It is a public school so even out of state tuition is pretty reasonable, maybe $11K a year.   Most southern schools have cheaper R&B than schools in the NE.  So that is probably another $8k.  Just a thought.  Good luck!

[Bonny]

Someone mentioned Coastal Carolina U. We did a southern school run and it was one of the schools we looked at. It is a public school so even out of state tuition is pretty reasonable, maybe $11K a year. Most southern schools have cheaper R&B than schools in the NE. So that is probably another $8k. Just a thought. Good luck!

Yeah, it might be a great school but can you imagine the mess of an accent the kid will wind up with if he goes there? He would have Debt's NY American, DH's English, his French and then Southern?