Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Apr 15, 2014 18:24:28 GMT -5
So what are you doing in the black sea......and how did you even get in there?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 15, 2014 18:27:21 GMT -5
Oh, and of course Hillary and Obama set the RESET button....er...overcharged or errr whatever that was supposed to be. DOH!!! ok, my turn: wtf are you talking about? "Some things are still a mystery to me while others are much too clear"
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Apr 15, 2014 18:27:47 GMT -5
The cold war? Obama and Hillary. Pretty dense today or what?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:28:01 GMT -5
Wow. Seriously? Obama lectured Romney in the debates that " the cold war has been over for 20 years". Wow. Try to keep up with your lying Potus. from Wikipedia: The Cold War was a sustained state of political and military tension between powers in the Western Bloc (the United States with NATO and others) and powers in the Eastern Bloc (the Soviet Union and its allies in Warsaw Pact). Historians have not fully agreed on the dates, but 1947–1991 is common. the Cold War was not between the US and Russia, Shooby. it was between the US and the USSR. sorry, but Obama is right. the Cold War IS over, and has been for decades. what we are seeing now is something new, with shades of the old Cold War.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:28:39 GMT -5
The cold war? Obama and Hillary. Pretty dense today or what? well, i didn't want to say it, but yes. you're pretty dense today.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Apr 15, 2014 18:31:16 GMT -5
So what are you doing in the black sea......and how did you even get in there? Via Istanbul and the Bosphorus/ Sea of Marmara.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 15, 2014 18:31:43 GMT -5
So what are you doing in the black sea......and how did you even get in there? lol. I had the same question. Apparently there is a waterway through Turkey.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:32:18 GMT -5
So what are you doing in the black sea......and how did you even get in there? the Turkish Straits @ Istanbul. it is so critical to trade in that part of the world that they are governed by an accord that was signed in something like 1939?
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Apr 15, 2014 18:33:44 GMT -5
I think we should make friends with Russia.....They are Europeans after all. Maybe they would like to join the EU
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:36:17 GMT -5
I think we should make friends with Russia.....They are Europeans after all. Maybe they would like to join the EU until this administration Russia was considered an ally of the US, i believe. please correct me if i am wrong.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 15, 2014 18:39:05 GMT -5
I think we should make friends with Russia.....They are Europeans after all. Maybe they would like to join the EU until this administration Russia was considered an ally of the US, i believe. please correct me if i am wrong. Subtle but significant disagreement. Until certain more recent actions by Russia, the relationship between the US and Russia wasn't too bad.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:41:22 GMT -5
until this administration Russia was considered an ally of the US, i believe. please correct me if i am wrong. Subtle but significant disagreement. Until certain more recent actions by Russia, the relationship between the US and Russia wasn't too bad. i guess. they were never let into NATO, so i guess if that is how you measure things......
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 15, 2014 18:42:57 GMT -5
Subtle but significant disagreement. Until certain more recent actions by Russia, the relationship between the US and Russia wasn't too bad. i guess. they were never let into NATO, so i guess if that is how you measure things...... Shooby, is that you?
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Apr 15, 2014 18:45:27 GMT -5
Sending ships...especially missile destroyers up the bosphorus straight may be seen as a bit provocative. Its only a narrow channel and Putin may have thought the US was coming to get him..... seeing as the Black Sea fleet are on the other side. Don't get me wrong I think that Russian forces on the border with Ukraine is a bit of a worry...but lets not start a war if we can help it
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:45:40 GMT -5
i guess. they were never let into NATO, so i guess if that is how you measure things...... Shooby, is that you? hey, i really DO try to see things from other perspectives, bills. but i guess you are right. after the USSR collapse, i always kinda considered our relations with Russia "friendly", but we have done plenty over the years since to antagonize them (and vice versa). i guess that some of that tension has continued to be there, i just never took them as much of a threat since 1991. but Romney is probably way sharper on this stuff than me.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 15, 2014 18:49:25 GMT -5
Shooby, is that you? hey, i really DO try to see things from other perspectives, bills. but i guess you are right. after the USSR collapse, i always kinda considered our relations with Russia "friendly", but we have done plenty over the years since to antagonize them (and vice versa). i guess that some of that tension has continued to be there, i just never took them as much of a threat since 1991. but Romney is probably way sharper on this stuff than me. My comment was simply to shift the responsibility for the cooling of relationship from "this administration" to "actions by Russia".
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 18:51:05 GMT -5
hey, i really DO try to see things from other perspectives, bills. but i guess you are right. after the USSR collapse, i always kinda considered our relations with Russia "friendly", but we have done plenty over the years since to antagonize them (and vice versa). i guess that some of that tension has continued to be there, i just never took them as much of a threat since 1991. but Romney is probably way sharper on this stuff than me. My comment was simply to shift the responsibility for the cooling of relationship from "this administration" to "actions by Russia". sure. we have done our share of antagonizing, but not a lot during this admin. fer sher.
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Apr 15, 2014 19:00:14 GMT -5
Putin is a very dangerous man....the situation is somewhat delicate. the ship didn't go to battle stations and rightly so.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Apr 15, 2014 19:13:51 GMT -5
So what are you doing in the black sea......and how did you even get in there? lol. I had the same question. Apparently there is a waterway through Turkey. One theory about 'Moses and the great flood' ìs the thin land mass separating the higher Mediterranian Sea from the lower Black Sea collapsed and the Med. Sea rushed into the Black Sea, flooding and raising the Black Sea water level higher up onto existing lands. Ancient town(s) have been found underwater along the coasts of the Black Sea and I believe artifacts carbon-dated back four-five thousand years ago.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Apr 15, 2014 19:20:31 GMT -5
Putin is a very dangerous man....the situation is somewhat delicate. the ship didn't go to battle stations and rightly so. Merkel thinks he is off his rocker. and she used to be one of his closest allies.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Apr 15, 2014 20:56:00 GMT -5
isn't the black sea in the soviet sphere of influence? what are we doing over there? we never think twice about it, wp. but here is a good analogy: what if Russia sent destroyers to cruise around off Miami Beach? you think maybe one of our fly boys might take issue with that, and do some provocative flyovers? Just a little bit. Think Cuba, circa early 60's and Kennedy Administration Granted they were placing ICBM'S in Cuba, and we were flying manned spy planes over the island. God, knows what else we were doing around and over that piece of real estate at the time.... And let's not forget the invasion....... That is when the cold war heated up a little
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2014 12:02:42 GMT -5
A better, more relevant question would be, why is it restarting now ? Or is it that your question provides a less inconvenient answer? Do you have evidence it ever stopped? Humorous that you think I worry about inconvenient answers. When does the "why are you posting inflammatory statements" going to come up ? As an aside, I have a niece who's a fifth grade school teacher in a Chicago suburb. Often at family holiday gatherings she will talk down to people like she probably talks to her students. It gets to be a habit I guess, funny though. I see it often with medical doctors and APN's also. On topic ; There was a marked drop in the military game playing with the collapse of the USSR. Is this new report of a plane buzzing one of our ships a new beginning ? Is our Apologist in Chief one of the reasons why ? Should we give a second reset button to the top military commanders of the Russian Federation so they don't do that any more ? Maybe someone should go over there and help organize their community so they're not so aggressive.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 18, 2014 12:10:40 GMT -5
... Is our Apologist in Chief one of the reasons why ? ... Very doubtful since it was happening under many other presidents including the one that you refuse to name.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2014 12:35:03 GMT -5
... Is our Apologist in Chief one of the reasons why ? ... Very doubtful since it was happening under many other presidents including the one that you refuse to name. Which one am I supposed to name ?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 18, 2014 13:49:23 GMT -5
Very doubtful since it was happening under many other presidents including the one that you refuse to name. Which one am I supposed to name ? You indicated that you had first hand knowledge of similar actions in the past that did not draw a reaction from those directly present nor from the President of the United States. I simply asked who the president was at that time.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2014 14:03:29 GMT -5
Which one am I supposed to name ? You indicated that you had first hand knowledge of similar actions in the past that did not draw a reaction from those directly present nor from the President of the United States. I simply asked who the president was at that time. Any president that was in office since our respective military's (US, USSR) have been using jet aircraft. Why did you think is was just during one administration ?
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workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Apr 18, 2014 14:05:54 GMT -5
Kennedy the appeaser?
Removed nukes from turkey to end the CMC
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 18, 2014 14:47:46 GMT -5
You indicated that you had first hand knowledge of similar actions in the past that did not draw a reaction from those directly present nor from the President of the United States. I simply asked who the president was at that time. Any president that was in office since our respective military's (US, USSR) had been using jet aircraft. Why did you think is was just during one administration ? First off an apology. I thought you had indicated that you were personally on the ships when it happened. I reread and see that I miss interrupted your statement. Secondly, you are stating that this is behavior that took place under every president when there was an adversarial relationship between the two countries. So why is it of special note that it is taking place under the current president?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2014 15:09:53 GMT -5
Any president that was in office since our respective military's (US, USSR) had been using jet aircraft. Why did you think is was just during one administration ? First off an apology. I thought you had indicated that you were personally on the ships when it happened. I reread and see that I miss interrupted your statement. Secondly, you are stating that this is behavior that took place under every president when there was an adversarial relationship between the two countries. So why is it of special note that it is taking place under the current president? The coming in at high speed below the horizon and "buzzing" our naval groups had pretty much reduced to almost never with the collapse of the USSR. I was somewhat surprised that a Russian federation plane did it. I was prodding for information from anyone that might possibly know more, or if there has been any other occurrences recently, or not so recently.
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