More Moms Staying at Home

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

At least this time you won't have to drive thru snowmaggedon to get there.

[Deleted]

Edit to Add: we currently already have a live in housekeeper/dog sitter with my MIL living with us and the arrangement is working for all parties involved.

And she is only 64 and in great health! Fingers crossed will be here for many many years!

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 13:57:39 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

At least this time you won't have to drive thru snowmaggedon to get there.

Thank GOD no, 5 hours of my life I do not care to live through again!

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 13:52:36 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Apr 9, 2014 13:28:15 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Well, it is great to talk about. But you don't KNOW until you actually have kids. So you can plan but you can't honestly weigh the pros and cons UNTIL you are holding that baby in your arms. I was/am a career gal. I have a professional degree and planned to keep working. And, I did. But, after I had our second child, I WANTED to be home more so we opted for me getting a more flexible arrangement. All the plans go out the window when those little eyes are looking up at you. It has a way of turning your world upside down.

Now when you spend over 100k on the degree and still paying it back!

Sorry, mama got to work!

Then sorry papa has to give up his dream job...

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 14:12:09 GMT -5 oped said:

Apr 9, 2014 13:52:36 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Now when you spend over 100k on the degree and still paying it back!

Sorry, mama got to work!

Then sorry papa has to give up his dream job...

Nope

[Deleted]

Eventually I think it stops being fair to say that she MUST pay back her own loans... But yet she can't get herself established at my one spot enough to bring in the income which would make it easier... 

I dont know Mrs C, but eventually that sh1t would start to piss me off...

We make decisions that are best for the family... And if every decision benefited ones income potential and the others debt liability... Wouldn't work with me. 

[yogiii]

Apr 9, 2014 14:22:54 GMT -5 oped said:

Eventually I think it stops being fair to say that she MUST pay back her own loans... But yet she can't get herself established at my one spot enough to bring in the income which would make it easier... 

I dont know Mrs C, but eventually that sh1t would start to piss me off...

We make decisions that are best for the family... And if every decision benefited ones income potential and the others debt liability... Wouldn't work with me. 

He seems fairly reasonable.  I think he's saying "Don't count on staying home" but that he realizes circumstances change things.

[swasat]

Apr 9, 2014 14:22:54 GMT -5 oped said:

Eventually I think it stops being fair to say that she MUST pay back her own loans... But yet she can't get herself established at my one spot enough to bring in the income which would make it easier... 

I dont know Mrs C, but eventually that sh1t would start to piss me off...

We make decisions that are best for the family... And if every decision benefited ones income potential and the others debt liability... Wouldn't work with me. 

It works for them. And thats all that matters 

Moreover, it isn't like she is not getiing anything that she wants. Despite having 100K in SLs, Mrs C gets to live a princess's life. So maybe she is not unhappy about her situation.

[Deleted]

I didn't say it didn't work for them. I said it wouldn't work for me... following around a husband who gets to pursue his dream job while relegating me constantly to the bottom of the ladder because I have to work to pay off my own loans... Would not work for me. 

But maybe that's why I'm a common potter? ... 

Yeah, hm I think its smug to suggest that mamma gotta work... But papa ain't giving up his dream job...

IF she had stayed put... Would she have had more of her loans paid off by now? 

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 14:22:54 GMT -5 oped said:

Eventually I think it stops being fair to say that she MUST pay back her own loans... But yet she can't get herself established at my one spot enough to bring in the income which would make it easier... 

I dont know Mrs C, but eventually that sh1t would start to piss me off...

We make decisions that are best for the family... And if every decision benefited ones income potential and the others debt liability... Wouldn't work with me. 

My wife was unemployed for 9 months the previous year because she followed me; I was ok with that and fully supported her and paid the loans.

She then took a 7k pay cut so she can take a job in Academia doing her current research which she loves: I supported that also and am ok with it.

I am ok with supporting my wife doing a job hunt, circumstances changing, her mom needing assistance maybe in her old age: but I am not signing up for a full time stay a home wife and/or mom.

Also she is not following me, I am the one going for now so she can finish her current research and advance her career to the next step. We figure 1 year or 2; then I will figure out how to get relocated back here through my job or she will try to find jobs there.

And you make it sound like she is the one that is always giving things up. 5 years ago I dropped everything and followed her to NY, took 7 months to find a job and blowing through all my savings.

We make it work!

In her field not working 3-5 years is basically kissing the 150k she spent on her education goodbye. Part time and freelance is better than no work at all.

[swasat]

Coming back to OP, there is also this thing that some of us have, called ambition.

Yeah I love my children, yeah I adore them to pieces, yeah I love my husband and my family life, but at the same time I am my own person too. A person who believes in herself and wants to make something of her life, a person who feels happy and proud of her accomplishments, a person who wants to achieve her dreams. That person in me wants to keep working. That person tells me that I have equal right to stand on my own two feet as any other person.

So mothers like me try to make the best of the situation. I don't work only for money, my husband makes enough of that and I stand to inherit a load too. I work for myself, to nourish my soul and my individuality.

I understand not everyone is as ambitious, and thats totally fine. I am just stating that there are people like me in this world too, who don't love their children less because they choose to keep working full time. We keep working because we truly love working and being independent.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

In her field not working 3-5 years is basically kissing the 150k she spent on her education goodbye. Part time and freelance is better than no work at all

And Carl has mentioned as long as she has the data she can telecommute.  Which I am SUPER jealous of by the way!   My expiration date is a lot shorter than Mrs C's since I need to be physically in a lab.

[Deleted]

Lmao. I have no ambition. Awesome... 

I don't believe in myself, I don't want to make anything of my life, I don't want to be equal...

do you hear yourself? 

I have NEVER said anything bad about mothers/families who choose two working spouses? What gives you the right to suggest my life has no meaning or ambition because I didn't choose your path?

[swasat]

Apr 9, 2014 14:45:40 GMT -5 oped said:

Lmao. I have no ambition. Awesome... 

I don't believe in myself, I don't want to make anything of my life, I don't want to be equal...

do you hear yourself? 

I have NEVER said anything bad about mothers/families who choose two working spouses? What gives you the right to suggest my life has no meaning or ambition because I didn't choose your path?

Where did say it was about you ??       

It was a general reply to OP. Go back and read the first line of the post 

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 14:36:23 GMT -5 swasat said:

Coming back to OP, there is also this thing that some of us have, called ambition.

Yeah I love my children, yeah I adore them to pieces, yeah I love my husband and my family life, but at the same time I am my own person too. A person who believes in herself and wants to make something of her life, a person who feels happy and proud of her accomplishments, a person who wants to achieve her dreams. That person in me wants to keep working. That person tells me that I have equal right to stand on my own two feet as any other person.

So mothers like me try to make the best of the situation. I don't work only for money, my husband makes enough of that and I stand to inherit a load too. I work for myself, to nourish my soul and my individuality.

I understand not everyone is as ambitious, and thats totally fine. I am just stating that there are people like me in this world too, who don't love their children less because they choose to keep working full time. We keep working because we truly love working and being independent.

Lol. Did you read what you wrote? If you SAH you aren't ambitious, I mean, that's fine and all... For 'those people'... But I love myself... I can't imagine... 

[swasat]

Apr 9, 2014 14:53:03 GMT -5 oped said:

Apr 9, 2014 14:36:23 GMT -5 swasat said:

Coming back to OP, there is also this thing that some of us have, called ambition.

Yeah I love my children, yeah I adore them to pieces, yeah I love my husband and my family life, but at the same time I am my own person too. A person who believes in herself and wants to make something of her life, a person who feels happy and proud of her accomplishments, a person who wants to achieve her dreams. That person in me wants to keep working. That person tells me that I have equal right to stand on my own two feet as any other person.

So mothers like me try to make the best of the situation. I don't work only for money, my husband makes enough of that and I stand to inherit a load too. I work for myself, to nourish my soul and my individuality.

I understand not everyone is as ambitious, and thats totally fine. I am just stating that there are people like me in this world too, who don't love their children less because they choose to keep working full time. We keep working because we truly love working and being independent.

Lol. Did you read what you wrote? If you SAH you aren't ambitious, I mean, that's fine and all... For 'those people'... But I love myself... I can't imagine... 

Whatever......  Holy moly over reaction!!

None of that was aimed at you. As I said before it was a general post. If you want to make it about yourself, please go staright ahead.

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 14:37:29 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

In her field not working 3-5 years is basically kissing the 150k she spent on her education goodbye. Part time and freelance is better than no work at all

And Carl has mentioned as long as she has the data she can telecommute.  Which I am SUPER jealous of by the way!   My expiration date is a lot shorter than Mrs C's since I need to be physically in a lab.

Thank God for that with winters here...

She started a couple of weeks ago and she loves it more than she thought she would since she was against it at first.

She is only doing it 1 day a week now vs her co-worker doing it 5 days because my wife still want to physically be in the office /need the human connection for some reason.

But she calls Fridays her catch up day: she gets to do twice the amount of work in the same amount of time because she doesn't have people dropping in here and there or her officemate needing to pick her brains on something (she shares an office with another researcher).

She is already planning how she can work half a day Thursday and head to VT afterwards and spend 3 days with me (if I get the job).

Another thing I hate with academia: low pay and high expectations. I bring more than 60% of our household income and don't have to get as many certifications, attend as many conferences, travel as much as my wife. They want great talent yet don't want to pay for it.

One of our friends (PhD in geology) led academia for that: too much expectations, now enough pay. He is in private now and enjoys it more and is getting paid more.

ETA: but my wife keeps reminding me you don't go into academia for the money. No shit sherlocks... My wife is way smarter, way more educated and spent way more on her education than I did.

[yogiii]

I think all moms are the worst

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Another thing I hate with academia: low pay and high expectations

Yeah I dislike it too. On the plus side you can't beat my benefits package with a stick and I do have a lot of flexibility which is handy when you have small children.

But I am considering making the move to private after Thing 2 is born. Right now my sights are set on the food industry since there are so many parallels between it and pharmacy/drug research.

Hopefully I can break out b/c after seven years I DO NOT love academia. I want to be paid more and I'd like my experience to count for something.

[Deleted]

Apr 9, 2014 14:36:23 GMT -5 swasat said:

Back to the OP, the reason that more moms are staying home is that some of us have this thing, called ambition.

We have a strong desire to achieve something beyond the monotony of drudging for others for meager pay and no satisfaction. 

I love my children, and husband and family life, and at the same time am my own person who believes in herself and wants to make something of her life, a person who feels happy and proud of her accomplishments, a person who wants to achieve her dreams. That person in me doesn't want to slave away the majority of her life working for others. She wants to spend each day balancing and meeting the complex challenges of whatever I choose to make a priority. 

That person tells me that I have equal right to stand on my own two feet as any other person, at work or at home.

So mothers like me try to make the best of the situation. I don't work for money, my husband makes enough of that and I stand to inherit a load too. I work for myself, to nourish my soul and my individuality.

[Peace Of Mind]

Apr 9, 2014 14:57:40 GMT -5 yogiii said:

I think all moms are the worst

LMAO!!  You are feeling brave today. 

[quince]

I'm staying home because one of us needed some flexibility with my husband working a full time job and on his PhD....

Except I came back to work part-time. But only until December.  I mean, April.  And then accepted the idea of taking a shot at continuing to juggle the part time work after we relocate, with NO daycare.  (Nap time and waking before baby?)  Because I'm scared- I'm good at what I do for my job. It feels nice to do what you're good at.  I feel like a mediocre mother, at best. Kind of depressing.  So let me squeeze in some hours of doing something well, so I can get through the rest of my time being a waste of oxygen.

[Deleted]

I wasn't good staying home with babies and toddlers... even if we could have made it work then. 

I think everyone should do what is best for themselves and their families, and I think that is often fluid, changing from stage to stage. 

I dont think anyone can or should make any inherent judgements about any person based on their label, and that includes SAH or Working parent...

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I dont ont think anyone can or should make any inherent judgements about any person based on their label, and that includes SAH or Working parent...

So marks the end of YM.

[yogiii]

Apr 9, 2014 15:24:01 GMT -5 quince said:

I'm staying home because one of us needed some flexibility with my husband working a full time job and on his PhD....

Except I came back to work part-time. But only until December.  I mean, April.  And then accepted the idea of taking a shot at continuing to juggle the part time work after we relocate, with NO daycare.  (Nap time and waking before baby?)  Because I'm scared- I'm good at what I do for my job. It feels nice to do what you're good at.  I feel like a mediocre mother, at best. Kind of depressing.  So let me squeeze in some hours of doing something well, so I can get through the rest of my time being a waste of oxygen.

It seems like people who worry about their parenting are usually doing a pretty good job

[muttleynfelix]

Apr 9, 2014 15:24:01 GMT -5 quince said:

I'm staying home because one of us needed some flexibility with my husband working a full time job and on his PhD....

Except I came back to work part-time. But only until December.  I mean, April.  And then accepted the idea of taking a shot at continuing to juggle the part time work after we relocate, with NO daycare.  (Nap time and waking before baby?)  Because I'm scared- I'm good at what I do for my job. It feels nice to do what you're good at.  I feel like a mediocre mother, at best. Kind of depressing.  So let me squeeze in some hours of doing something well, so I can get through the rest of my time being a waste of oxygen.

How old is your LO?  I felt like a horrible mom to DS until he was 1. Then it got better.  I did have some undiagnosed/untreated PPD until he was 2.  And getting that treated help. I didn't feel like a good mom until I had my DD when DS was 3. I'm weird and having 2 is a better fit for me mentally.  I felt like I was such a bad mom to DS that I was scared to have #2 even though we really wanted to 2 kids.  It turned out to be the best thing for me.  My kids are just starting to really play together. It usually isn't nicely. They aren't lovey dovey siblings (in fact DS repeats over and over again that he just wants him and dad to do things during the day and no DD), but my interaction with 2 is better than it was with just DS.  Don't get me wrong, I love one on one time with both kids.  But I love having a family with 2 kids. 

[Pants]

I haven't seen anyone mention this, but the root story off which I assume the OP's link is based is actually about how more mothers are staying home - but many aren't staying home out of choice, and few of them are the type of moms we reference here - professionals, well educated, etc.

"More mothers have been staying home with their children since the recession ended, but a growing number of them say that’s primarily because they can’t find a job, according to a new study... The shift is most noticeable among women who are immigrants and who do not have college educations." www.washingtonpost.com/local/more-moms-stay-at-home/2014/04/07/feb1f8bc-be91-11e3-b195-dd0c1174052c_story.html

[econstudent]

I haven't seen anyone mention this, but the root story off which I assume the OP's link is based is actually about how more mothers are staying home - but many aren't staying home out of choice, and few of them are the type of moms we reference here - professionals, well educated, etc.

 Most of the SAHMs I know didn't have an established career. They may have been working a job, but usually their husbands carry the benefits (if any) so it seems like a pretty simple paycheck vs. daycare bill equation. In lower-level jobs, you don't worry quite as much about being able to get back into the work force because you were never in it at the same level as a professional anyway. 



Until I was pregnant with my daughter and looking for daycares, I never realized how hard it would be to leave her every day. I always thought I would want to work, use my brain, get away from the kids, etc., but it turns out that it sucks every day to drop my kid off at daycare. She likes it there and I get to go see her at lunch a couple times a week, so it's actually a pretty good setup for our family, but I still don't like it. I'm on the fence about having another kid because I really don't know if I can send a baby to daycare FT. My daughter went PT and that was hard enough. We can afford to live on my income, but DH doesn't want to stay home and I respect that. In a few years, after he finishes his master's and has a better income, we may be able to talk about other options. 

[murphath]

Whether you SAH or not is not really a difference maker.  It truly is how you are as parents when you are with your kids.  We have 3 of our own and 1 stepson.  We both worked--DH many, many hours as he owned his own business.  But he didn't have to leave as early as I, so he took the early a.m. shift getting them ready in the morning for either daycare or school.  He was also able to volunteer in their classrooms for an hour or two every morning.  Let me tell you, that made a huge difference.  While dads volunteered in other ways, our kids thought it was so awesome that Dad came to their classroom.  He's such a big kid himself and loved working with the kids.  I did the after work pick up, activity driving, dinner cooking, homework help, get ready for bed stuff.  Just writing that makes me tired.   But you do what you have to do to make it work.  Our free time totally revolved around the kids.  Nothing fancy: going to the park for picnics, hikes, camping etc.  Birthday parties were pin the tail on the donkey, water relay races, hot potato, musical chairs, drop the clothespin in the milk bottle, etc.  You get the drift.  Those kids knew we worked hard because we needed to but also because we loved them.  My oldest sister thought I was a horrible mother because I worked and my kids would suffer.  Well, one has a doctorate in physical therapy, one is a doctor, an electrician, and, just for fun, an actor!  They turned out just fine, thank you.

My point is this: there really should be no debate about which way is better.  If you're a good parent that works full time, your kids will probably be fine.  And if you're a good SAH parent, your kids will probably be fine.  It's the parenting that matters.

[Shooby]

What is best is what you decide what is best for YOUR family. You don't have to explain, justify or convince other people. Do what works for you and your family. And, no matter what you do, others for whom it isn't their business will find something to complain about.