Having 99.9% of your co-workers hating you

[Deleted]

And not giving a damn!

Oh well, I guess it is a good thing I am not getting paid to make friends! I hate stores like this, where they send you to pick up after other people's slack and it is a freaking mess!

Now everyone hates you because they haven't been doing their job for so long that it has become the "norm".

Great, now I get to be the bad guy once again! Where is my damn coffee?

[Blonde Granny]

I mentioned to you once before that my Dh never made friends with co-workers. It made no difference if they were equal to him or not. He was not hired to be friendly and nice to them, he was hired to do his job. His personal life was just that, personal and private.

It's a hard lesson to learn Carl, but I think you're beginning to understand.

[mollyanna58]

You don't have to be friends with them; just treat them fairly.

[achelois]

C'mon, Carl, you were born to be a badass

You're our new Shotcaller. 

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Sorry you're having a crappy start to your day. 

Did something in particular happen?
is the crazy boss who threatened to kill you the slacker boss also?
how fat are you into the original six months that someone said you would not make?

[JustLurkin]

Mar 30, 2014 10:08:07 GMT -5 Blonde Granny said:

I mentioned to you once before that my Dh never made friends with co-workers. It made no difference if they were equal to him or not. He was not hired to be friendly and nice to them, he was hired to do his job. His personal life was just that, personal and private.

It's a hard lesson to learn Carl, but I think you're beginning to understand.

Learned hard lessons at my last job, and rarely if ever share anything on my new job.  I like the people I work with, and the atmosphere, but would never open myself to the BS I left. 

Even now, I see them make comments to and about others "Oh, you can't do overtime, thought you were saving for a house".  Recently, there were two loudly discussing the use of psychiatric medications by other employees.  For the life of me I don't know why anyone would give the office gossips that sort of information.  And, there is a manager many treat with such distain--I don't get it, he's always been nice to me and tries very hard although he knows ahead of time there will be pushback no matter what he's trying to do.

Just be fair and maintain professionalism.

ETA:  The people I use as examples work in my vicinity, but not directly with me, they are not who I am referring to when I discuss happiness on the job.

[Deleted]

Mar 30, 2014 10:26:48 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Sorry you're having a crappy start to your day. 

Did something in particular happen?
is the crazy boss who threatened to kill you the slacker boss also?
how fat are you into the original six months that someone said you would not make?

New store new manager!

I like the new manager and she is new to the company so not used to our ways/policies/standards.

She was being mislead and I am still pissed that the SOB that was here before me was getting paid 15k/more a year to do a crappy job. But he has been with the company since 88.

Anyway it is a matter of them getting complacent in their job and seriously slacking. They know what is expected but just wouldn't do it because:
A) the guy I replaced was from grocery and only new grocery so did not bother with the other departments
B) the guy my boss replaced was a gamer. Heard he would come in, lock his office, play games all day, 5 PM open his door and left to go home.

So they are used to getting away with not getting their job done or doing what they are supposed to do... So they are hating me right now.

Oh well!

[tskeeter]

Mar 30, 2014 10:03:47 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

And not giving a damn!

Oh well, I guess it is a good thing I am not getting paid to make friends! I hate stores like this, where they send you to pick up after other people's slack and it is a freaking mess!

Now everyone hates you because they haven't been doing their job for so long that it has become the "norm".

Great, now I get to be the bad guy once again! Where is my damn coffee?

Carl, it can often be a question of whether you are leading from the rear (pushing and firing people who are not doing their jobs), or leading from the front (setting high standards, but selling people on the vision that they can be/are superstars, working in the best store in the company).  I've had better success with the superstar approach than with the bad guy approach.  Everybody wants to be part of a winning team and to be recognized for their accomplishments.  


I once worked in a manfacturing plant that had really lousy performance.  We decided that we weren't sure that people even understood what constituted good performance.  So we started to recognize and give token awards (coffee cups, t-shirts, and the like) to people who did things that we wanted them to do more of.  Within six months, plant performance statistics were more than twice as good as they had been and some groups of employees had created their own recognition processes to let their co-workers know what behaviors they valued.

One of the easiest and silliest motivational things I every did was handing out gold stars to employees with 10 and 20 years of experience on the job.  Started out as kind of a joke, but those silly stars quickly appeared on cubicle name tags.  People annoucing to the entire plant that they'd gotten an attaboy.

Lead from the front.  Ask your folks to look out for your back, and each others.  And, I think, you'll have find your troubled store will become a leading store.    

[violagirl]

Positive reinforcement doesn't just work with dogs.

[Regis]

Mar 30, 2014 12:02:15 GMT -5 tskeeter said:

Mar 30, 2014 10:03:47 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

And not giving a damn!

Oh well, I guess it is a good thing I am not getting paid to make friends! I hate stores like this, where they send you to pick up after other people's slack and it is a freaking mess!

Now everyone hates you because they haven't been doing their job for so long that it has become the "norm".

Great, now I get to be the bad guy once again! Where is my damn coffee?

Carl, it can often be a question of whether you are leading from the rear (pushing and firing people who are not doing their jobs), or leading from the front (setting high standards, but selling people on the vision that they can be/are superstars, working in the best store in the company).  I've had better success with the superstar approach than with the bad guy approach.  Everybody wants to be part of a wining team and to be recognized for their accomplishments.  


I once worked in a manfacturing plant that had really lousy performance.  We decided that we weren't sure that people even understood what constituted good performance.  So we started to recognize and give token awards (coffee cups, t-shirts, and the like) to people who did things that we wanted them to do more of.  Within six months, plant performance statistics were more than twice as good as they had been and some groups of employees had created their own recognition processes to let their co-workers know what behaviors they valued.

One of the easiest and silliest motivational things I every did was handing out gold stars to employees with 10 and 20 years of experience on the job.  Started out as kind of a joke, but those silly stars quickly appeared on cubicle name tags.  People annoucing to the entire plant that they'd gotten an attaboy.

Lead from the front.  Ask your folks to look out for your back, and each others.  And, I think, you'll have find your troubled store will become a leading store.    

Exactly what I was going to post.  Remember that you can't push a rope.  And very few people want to work in fear for their job.  Expectations for each employee must be communicated and evaluations are given continuously.  

[Deleted]

Mar 30, 2014 10:03:47 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Great, now I get to be the bad guy once again! Where is my damn coffee?

You have not trained them to be brown-nosers yet? Shame on you!

[Deleted]

Mar 30, 2014 12:02:15 GMT -5 tskeeter said:

Mar 30, 2014 10:03:47 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

And not giving a damn!

Oh well, I guess it is a good thing I am not getting paid to make friends! I hate stores like this, where they send you to pick up after other people's slack and it is a freaking mess!

Now everyone hates you because they haven't been doing their job for so long that it has become the "norm".

Great, now I get to be the bad guy once again! Where is my damn coffee?

Carl, it can often be a question of whether you are leading from the rear (pushing and firing people who are not doing their jobs), or leading from the front (setting high standards, but selling people on the vision that they can be/are superstars, working in the best store in the company).  I've had better success with the superstar approach than with the bad guy approach.  Everybody wants to be part of a wining team and to be recognized for their accomplishments.  


I once worked in a manfacturing plant that had really lousy performance.  We decided that we weren't sure that people even understood what constituted good performance.  So we started to recognize and give token awards (coffee cups, t-shirts, and the like) to people who did things that we wanted them to do more of.  Within six months, plant performance statistics were more than twice as good as they had been and some groups of employees had created their own recognition processes to let their co-workers know what behaviors they valued.

One of the easiest and silliest motivational things I every did was handing out gold stars to employees with 10 and 20 years of experience on the job.  Started out as kind of a joke, but those silly stars quickly appeared on cubicle name tags.  People annoucing to the entire plant that they'd gotten an attaboy.

Lead from the front.  Ask your folks to look out for your back, and each others.  And, I think, you'll have find your troubled store will become a leading store.    

I am trying, believe me I am trying...

[Deleted]

The issue mostly is that for so long expectation was a 4 and now you come in wanting a 10; everyone is screaming bloody murder!

[tskeeter]

Mar 30, 2014 12:33:23 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

The issue mostly is that for so long expectation was a 4 and now you come in wanting a 10; everyone is screaming bloody murder!

Carl, sometimes it's not about what your aspirations are, but what aspirations you can create in other people.  You want to be a 10.  How can you help other people want to be a 10, too?

[Deleted]

An offbeat story about leading from the front but I'll post it anyway-

my SIL is a born leader and a great athlete and got her start as a swim coach by volunteering to coach the kids' team at their country club. It was a ragtag group of kids not used to being challenged. She told them that if they won some championship at the end of the season, she'd dress up in her Sunday best, jump into the pool and swim 2 lengths. They won, and she did. It made the local paper.

Is there any group objective (say, an increase in sales, higher customer ratings, whatever) with a reward that would get them all behind it? It could even be something as simple as a flat cash bonus, provided you know you can come through with it (and for heaven's sake, make sure they're prepared if the amount you promise is before taxes).

[Otto the Orange]

How many co-workers do you have?

I am trying to figure out the 0.1% that like you.....is it like half of one of your co-workers?  or a quarter of one of your co-workers?

and how scientific was the poll? What kind of variance and parameters did you use?

[Deleted]

Just interjecting here that I've been watching Raising Hope on Netflix and trying not to picture Cawiau as Barney...

[NastyWoman]

Mar 30, 2014 10:26:48 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Sorry you're having a crappy start to your day. 

Don't use that word around Carl. Since his post about the old guy and biddy, I imagine him walking behind certain customers with a shovel! 

[Deleted]

I can top the poop story. A friend just posted on facebook that they were at the Chinese buffet today and looked up to see a man with his pants down and a pile of poo on the floor... 

[Deleted]

Carl, there really is a difference between management and those they manage.  I loved two out of three managers that I had doing retail at Macy's, and I would have done anything for them.  I think those two would also have done anything to help me as well (one did by giving me better hours when buying a house).  But they were still my bosses.

But we weren't "friends."  Nor am I "friends" with the administrators I work with.  One of them comes close--she was a colleague until two years ago when she moved into administration.  When DH was in a car wreck and had to go to the ER, she came to tell me, covered my classes, and called me at the ER to see how he was doing.  But our relationship predates her move into administration. 

You can't be friends with those you have to supervise.  The balance of power is uneven.  That's why sexual harassment suits are never about underlings harassing their bosses although there are probably situations where that happens.  It is all about who has the power.

So give up that pipe dream.  Find some friends outside of work.  It's harder, but it's better in the long run.

[zibazinski]

I'm still amazed that guy was not banned or arrested.

[Pants]

I ditto what everyone else has said about leading from the front.

Also, I disagree that you shouldn't be "friends" with your coworkers. I had that impression when moving here to a big company - I thought I could get my work done, work to make improvements, etc. It turns out though, in our department how you work is just as important as what you work at. I'm not friends outside of work with coworkers, but I have attended social gatherings with some of them, and I do know now how important all that bullshit is in this particular culture. Every company is different, so consider yours carefully before going Rambo on the situation.

[Works4me]

Carl - Of course they are screaming! But so what? It'll pass and they will be all the better for it. You are the XO there and it is your job to execute the maneuvers necessary to bring the store up to par.

Ever consider the idea that they sent you in to clean the place up? That is your real job there!

And never again walk into that store with an empty coffee up - just not a good idea.

[Shooby]

Fruck em all.

[MN-Investor]

Unfortunately, if this problem has been going on for a while, that makes fixing it all the more difficult.

When I first thought about your problem, I thought about the fact that surely there must be some good employees who have been frustrated at working with folks who don't pull their weight. But, the longer the problem exists, the greater the chance that the motivated workers have left for other jobs.

So... you may have a larger percentage of slackers at your store.

Some may quit when you start expecting a good job from them. Good. You don't need them, and it opens up the job for motivated folks looking for a job.

And some of your workers will welcome the changes you make. But they won't be the ones griping right now, so you may not be noticing them.

Hang in there. You know what it takes to make a good store. But it does take time.

[Deleted]

Mar 30, 2014 23:29:52 GMT -5 MN-Investor said:

So... you may have a larger percentage of slackers at your store.

Some may quit when you start expecting a good job from them. Good. You don't need them, and it opens up the job for motivated folks looking for a job.

That's what I was thinking.  If you have a large % of people whose ideal job is showing up, pretending to work, and collecting their pay, there may be no way to make them happy and productive.  They don't want to be.  The previous manager set the tone there.  Why should I work when the boss hides in his office and plays video games?

There are good people out there who want to work, and if you lose some of the slackers you create a job for some of them.

[toomuchreality]

Change is rarely the easiest, most wanted thing. There is always some resistance, even when it's a change from within yourself and something that you really want.



  GO CARL, GO!  GO CARL, GO!


Hang in there, you'll be okay.
They would not have placed you in this position, if they didn't think you could do it.

[Deleted]

I can't count the plant managers we've had come in to "clean this place up". Many of them came in with the attitudes that they were going to put their foot on our necks (yes, I've heard that phrase at work before) and lay down the law. All of those types got run out of there before any good changes were made. The workers WANT someone to deal with the slackers, but the hard-ass managers raise everybody's hackles because they don't know what's going on and everybody suffers. Heck, the lower level management and support teams are filled with slackers. How can we employees function properly? lol

We did have one plant manager come in that had never held that position before. He addressed many of the (valid) complaints that employees brought to him. We had a lot of changes under his watch and he got more things done in the short time he was there than I've seen before or after. If nothing else, he'll always be remembered as the guy that got the 10+ years of leaks fixed that rained down brown water everywhere all the time. It's not pleasant to have to constantly dodge dripping brown mystery liquid while you work. He didn't hide out in his office until there was a problem, we saw him almost every day. He was friendly, but didn't chat us up. That was fine, some managers would pass employees and not speak if they made eye contact. This is the south, that's considered rude. Because he was friendly and actually listened when we'd tell him something wasn't working right and/or why, and his employees felt that he was looking out for them, so they wanted to make him look good in return and not disappoint him. Even the slacker employees respected him. Unfortunately, it was only a temporary position for him and he eventually left.


Where I work is kind of the black sheep of the company. People that come from other places say it's unlike anything they've ever seen. I kind of understand why our managers come in with a hard-ass attitude, but that's a guarantee for failure there. All my coworkers want is to be treated like adult human beings, some acknowledgement and a sincere "thank you" for a job well done. That almost never happens, even when we exceed expectations. You set the tone. Come in swinging and you start a battle. Come in and say "hey, we're in this together, we have to make this work, we can't fail. I'm going to do my part and I need each of you to do your parts" and it's received much better. The first one is you against them. The second makes it sound like you're on their team, but you're the leader and you call the shots. Then be firm, but fair. That's what works best at my crazy workplace. YMMV

[Shooby]

You won't be hated if you make positive changes. If you get everyone working as a team the morale will improve. Change is difficult and people will grumble. But you need to make sure everyone pulls their own weight and does their job and not make excuses for the slackers. And, I think MOST people want to go to work and do a good job. A lot of people get discouraged and then they dont' try as hard when they see the idiots getting away with all kinds of crap. I have worked places where there were a few who pretty much did whatever the heck they pleased and nothing was done about them. It was a miserable place to work. And, I have moved on and so did most of my coworkers but the cancers are still in those places. I have also worked in places where everyone knew their jobs and did their jobs. And, the place functioned well and efficiently.
But, these people cannot and are not your friends. You have to just take a business approach. And, elicit their cooperation and get the place running and in the long run, everyone will be happier.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Mar 30, 2014 12:33:23 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

The issue mostly is that for so long expectation was a 4 and now you come in wanting a 10; everyone is screaming bloody murder!

Carl, my older brother used to work for a national chain.  He started at 18 as a stocker and worked his way up to manager.  The first 10 years or so as manager, he was the ax man.  He was sent to troubled stores.  He once told me that the first thing he did when he got to a new store was to start interviews for new hires.  He didn't know how many he'd be hiring, but he knew he'd be hiring some.  Then he'd fire people who weren't performing up to standard.  His name is still feared around here, I'm told.  But the good workers, while a bit anxious at first, were happy to see him come in because it meant the store was being fixed. 

He no longer works for them, in part because they wanted managers to sit in an office all day.  And that's not his style.  He's out on the floor.  He could do just about anything in the store (except dispense drugs in the pharmacy) and would if necessary.