Anyone have experience negotiating used cars?

[jk70]

I am trying to get the best value on a 2008 Honda Odyssey. Dealer is asking 24,799. I plan to bid 18,908 as my first price (based on some rough trade in data and other factors).

That's 24% off of dealer price. Although, I know I won't get that price I am trying to figure out if there is a "norm" first bid that people use? I do have a top and the walk away factor but wonder if anyone is in the auto world as a dealer or someone with a lot of experience.

FWIW: I do love this sight but I do not want to get into "you should buy a car less, etc. etc. etc.". YM may have me buying a $25 Flintstones car if the conversation goes the wrong way

Oh, and yes I have been researching for 3 weeks, test drove 9 odysseys so far and been to 6 dealerships.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

When buying a previously owned vehicle a good place to start is the Blue Book, which you should be able to find in your library, or just visit a local bookstore and look it up.
The MSN site has an auto section.
A used auto's price can be affected by numerous variables, some of which are mileage, interior/exterior condition, maint history, etc.

As a starting point, what is the mileage on this vehicle?

[alabamagal]

If 18,908 is the "trade in" price, you are going to have to bid more than that. The dealer is going to need to get something out of it, not 0.

The best advice is to just be prepared to walk away from it. If you are in the mind set that "I need a car today" you will pay more. Make an offer, wait for counter offer. If they say "this is the best price" then leave, they may call you back with lower price.

[zibazinski]

For sure. I waited 3 days but they called me and sold me the car at the price I wanted. Walk once you get the right amount in your mind. Do the research.

[jk70]

car has 50k miles on it.

georgiagal: my $18,908 is above NADA and KBB's "rough" trade in by $433. And i know I will need to go higher. I am just wondering how low to start...as my post said, this is my first bid.

[Clever Username]

I'm confused, it sounds like you are buying, but you're basing your offer on selling price guides.
The only time your comparison would work is if you see a couple shopping at a dealership and overhear them dissapointed in what they are being offered on their trade-in.

Be warned, this is a tough season to haggle on car purchases. W2 Joe is flush with his tax refund.

Driven 9 Odysseys? Wow, you've got time on your hands. How do the prices compare between all of these?

[schildi]

Why not get a new one? You should be able to get a brand new 2010 model (if you can locate one) for around $24,000. That's not much more for a full warranty, 0 miles and brand new. There seems to be always more room for negotiations on new cars. A 2006 model would be somewhere between $25K - $26K, it may still be worth it.

A $4,000 - $5,000 discount for 3 years and 50,000 miles does not sound like such a great deal to me. Those Hondas and Toyotas are way overprices when used.

Now I am just leaning back and waiting for some Karma for suggesting a new car purchase on YM, lol. ;D

[jk70]

I'm confused, it sounds like you are buying, but you're basing your offer on selling price guides.
The only time your comparison would work is if you see a couple shopping at a dealership and overhear them dissapointed in what they are being offered on their trade-in.

confused at your comment. I am basing my buying prices on the trade in values (what a dealer pays) and the actual price the dealer wants to sell at. Now, of course I do not know exactly what price the dealer paid but using trade in values, other dealerships, any problems with the car. etc. i have formulated a bunch of prices and where this car's max price from the dealer's perspective should be priced at.

My 18,908 came from being above the rough trade in price but lower than the average trade in price. And, it is a starting price....I do not expect them to go for it but I do expect a counter offer. I have 5 other counters to their counters with the 5th being my top.

2010 Odysseys for 24k..please tell me where?

[illinicheme]

Feb 23, 2011 11:46:51 GMT -5 jk70 said:

2010 Odysseys for 24k..please tell me where?

We did a brief fact-finding mission on some cars last year, and Odysseys were one of the vehicles we looked at. IIRC, there was a HUGE price variation between the base model and the top of the line. I don't remember exactly what the base price was, but it was something like $25k. Fully-loaded broke $40k.

[Lex Luthor]

I have helped several people negotiate a used car, as well as purchased a couple myself. Kbb is a good place to start to understand both what the dealer likely purchased the car for (trade-in/NADA) and what the retail value of the vehicle is.

Since you already seem to have the value of the car covered, here are a couple other items I always advise:

- If you are financing, get pre-approved through a lender before you go to a dealer. This way the financing is not really a negotiating point unless they can offer you something better, and they usually can't.

- Items like "paint warranty" and "window etching" are NOT mandatory as part of the contract - no matter what the finance guy says. If you are able to negotiate a great price on the vehicle, I can almost guarantee that one or both of these items will show up on the final contract. Walk away if they don't remove them. If they tell you they can't take them off the contract, tell them to take it off the price of the vehicle, but you won't pay the fee. Walk away if they won't remove them and magically you'll find that those fees are no longer "mandatory". I have even negotiated and asked about these things up front, and they still manage to find their way into the contract. It's tax, title, license and doc fee....no other fees should be added to the price.

- Decide on whether or not you are going to purchase an extended warranty or gap insurance before you make your final purchase. If you think you want either of these items, do some online shopping for the best deals before you go to the dealer. The lender you get pre-approved from likely offers both extended warranties and gap insurance and is a good place to start. Note - that I have never purchased gap insurance, and don't recommend it for a used vehicle, but I also understand that some people really just need the "peace of mind".

With these items said...I have actually recently negotiated the purchase of a Kia Sedona for a friend. The Kia Sedona is usually ranked right behind the Odyssey. What was interesting was that the Kia Sedona hadn't been majorly updated since 2006, so we primarily focused our research on any vehicle after 2006 that has less than X miles. The vehicle purchased was a 2006 Kia Sedona LX with 45k miles that still had 14 mos left on a 60k mile bumper to bumper warranty (which means it wasn't really driven until 2007). The price was $10.7k. They could have purchased a 2008/2009 vehicle with similar mileage, but it would have been $14k or more. It really didn't make sense to do that because the vehicle hadn't really changed much between 2006 and 2008/2009. So, my point is really to be aware about why you are buying a 2008 version with 50k miles versus an older version with similar miles - perhaps they made some change you value that you are already aware of - I just wanted to bring it up. Also, if you haven't considered the Kia Sedona, you should, it has similar rankings on safety, reliability, interior and exterior design to the Odyssey - the only major difference is usually the performance, where a Kia usually rates good to very good and an Odyssey ranks excellent.

Good Luck!

ETA: Plus a Kia comes with a 5-year/60k mile bumper to bumper transferrable warranty.

[jk70]

We did a brief fact-finding mission on some cars last year, and Odysseys were one of the vehicles we looked at. IIRC, there was a HUGE price variation between the base model and the top of the line. I don't remember exactly what the base price was, but it was something like $25k. Fully-loaded broke $40k.

I agree but my unfortunate situation was that I decided what car and my SO gets to decide what she wants in it..she wants leather so it is above the base model (I know, against YM's code of conduct).

I am very particular to Hondas (but drove Siennas also) and have tested the 2005-2008 models...I am working on a 2007 that's a bit less but doesn't drive as well. Researched each year and talked to consumers around here who have them. I am not set on the 2008 but this one in particular happened to be the best ride so far.

[jeffreymo]

I would think that a used Honday Oddysey would be one of the more difficult vehicles to haggle price on. In the past I've tried to haggle on Toyota's and Honda's and alot of times the salesman don't budge much. When we were looking at used Pilots 2 years ago we'd find a fairly priced one, haggle a little bit and get nowhere, and the car would be sold the same day/week. This happened 3 times. We ended up buying at Carmax.

It could be that I'm a terrible haggler, but I would try to negotiate and even walk expecting a call back or email saying they'd come down more. Every time it was to inform me that the vehicle was sold and they had a few others for me to look at.

[Lex Luthor]

One more item - most dealers now offer "discounted" internet pricing. And some even offer coupons through email or printed from their website if you use their internet department. It's a bit late in the game to be making first contact by internet, but what you could do is make the contact through their website/your email and find out what their "internet price" might be - just so you have as much info as possible about the price of the vehicle.

Last week I actually got a $500 off any car "coupon", where the dealer said that I didn't have to announce that I had it, that I could negotiate the entire price and present the coupon just before signing the contract and they would take the $500 off no matter what. Now, I'm not looking for a vehicle and didn't try it out so I can't tell you if it would be successful or not, it's just one more piece of information for you - sign up for their email alerts and you may get an additional discount.

[schildi]

Feb 23, 2011 11:46:51 GMT -5 jk70 said:

2010 Odysseys for 24k..please tell me where?

I would start at a dealership. When I purchased my Toyota, I ended up paying about a thousand below invoice, after a little over a week of negotiations with two dealers. That was about $6,000 (> 20%) below sticker price.
I would cut back on the options also if that meant getting a new one, vs. an old one loaded, but that's just me maybe ....
kbb lists the 2010 model (brand new) at a fair market price of $24,100, and I am sure I could get one for less. Yes, I am pretty sure it's possible. No way would I buy a 3 year old one that just ran out of warranty and with 50K miles at only $3K-$4K discount. If you want to really save money and go the used route, buy something domestic for under $10K. Don't get a 3 year old Honda or Toyota, they are waayyyy overpriced. One of my neighbors just recently bought a Toyota that is just about a copy of mine. He paid $6K less than I paid > 5 years ago brand new. Not much of a bargain, I think.

[kittycat]

If you are an AAA member, they can do the negotiations for you.

[Taxman10]

Feb 23, 2011 11:31:30 GMT -5 schildi said:

Why not get a new one? You should be able to get a brand new 2010 model (if you can locate one) for around $24,000. That's not much more for a full warranty, 0 miles and brand new. There seems to be always more room for negotiations on new cars. A 2006 model would be somewhere between $25K - $26K, it may still be worth it.

A $4,000 - $5,000 discount for 3 years and 50,000 miles does not sound like such a great deal to me. Those Hondas and Toyotas are way overprices when used.

Now I am just leaning back and waiting for some Karma for suggesting a new car purchase on YM, lol. ;D

i gave it to you!

[8 Bit WWBG]

I've only bought one car, but read these boards long enough to know that some brands and models (pretty much any Honda) is not going to be that much cheaper used than new. Its come up time and time again with Civics and the like. Even 5+ years old, the discounts don't get large until the mileage is high.

So unless you get the right dealer in the right mood on the right day, expect that there is only so much wiggle room you can get.

[wackyaunt]

2 favorite car research sites for car shopping are kbb.com (kelley blue book) and autotrader.com...use them...read the reviews on the cars be open minded about make/model and keep your eyes open. Was able to get a brand new (less than 2500 miles) on it car because a retired doctor bought without his wife and she hated it and refused to drive it...saved me $10k to have him drive it off the lot and then bring it back a month later. Sometimes the small town car dealers have these jewels, so you have to keep your eyes open if you are not in a super rush to buy.

[schildi]

Feb 25, 2011 17:19:23 GMT -5 Taxman10 said:

Feb 23, 2011 11:31:30 GMT -5 schildi said:

Why not get a new one? You should be able to get a brand new 2010 model (if you can locate one) for around $24,000. That's not much more for a full warranty, 0 miles and brand new. There seems to be always more room for negotiations on new cars. A 2006 model would be somewhere between $25K - $26K, it may still be worth it.

A $4,000 - $5,000 discount for 3 years and 50,000 miles does not sound like such a great deal to me. Those Hondas and Toyotas are way overprices when used.

Now I am just leaning back and waiting for some Karma for suggesting a new car purchase on YM, lol. ;D

i gave it to you!

Thanks, taxman!