Another Rant Against Airlines.

[Phoenix84]

If I could drive anywhere in a day, I'll probably choose that over flying.  If it's more than a day, it depends.  Since I work FT, I have to weigh my inconvenience of flying with taking additional annual leave to drive.  With work, I don't have a choice.  If it's more than 8 hours away, I have to fly.  I have to fly to even relatively close destinations, like Kansas City. 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

I will go back to an over booked flight. When there are no volunteers, the ones usually bumped are the passengers who paid the lowest ticket fare. It is possible that the author's flight was highly overbooked and the gate advised the ticket counter no more passengers regardless of ticket price. The thread author states the counter told him he was two minutes past the check-in time. But is that the real reason? He/we don't know.

I don't know if this is the case because I have been on some really cheap tickets on an overbooked flight and never gotten bumped. The last time, they were looking for volunteers and kept raising the ante. They started at a $200 voucher and by the time they got to a $600 voucher, I finally threw my hat into the ring. However, they could not get me out to my destination in 24 hours, so turned me down.

[movingforward]

I will never forget flying  2 days before Christmas one year.  The lines at the airport were outrageous.  I assumed they would be so I was at the airport 2 hrs early.  Some lady came running in asking everyone if she could go ahead of them because she was afraid she was going to miss her flight. Hmmmm... no... yeah, I am bitchy like that.  I managed to get my ass out of bed and get here 2 hrs early... so sorry you couldn't do the same.  Many other people let her go ahead of them though.  Maybe she had a good reason - I don't know, but it has happened once more since then.  Seriously, even people who have never flown before realize the holidays are crazy and you need to allow yourself plenty of time.

[whoami]

Nov 16, 2013 17:24:11 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

I will go back to an over booked flight. When there are no volunteers, the ones usually bumped are the passengers who paid the lowest ticket fare. It is possible that the author's flight was highly overbooked and the gate advised the ticket counter no more passengers regardless of ticket price. The thread author states the counter told him he was two minutes past the check-in time. But is that the real reason? He/we don't know.

The gate agent and ticket counters do not conspire with each other at all, nevermind 45 minutes in advance of a scheduled departure. The ticket counter couldnt care less if a flight is overbooked. It is no more their problem, than the pilots or the flight attendants problem.

 He was not allowed to check in for his flight because he was late. Even the kiosk locks you out if you do not check in on time. 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Nov 16, 2013 17:35:39 GMT -5 movingforward said:

I will never forget flying  2 days before Christmas one year.  The lines at the airport were outrageous.  I assumed they would be so I was at the airport 2 hrs early.  Some lady came running in asking everyone if she could go ahead of them because she was afraid she was going to miss her flight. Hmmmm... no... yeah, I am bitchy like that.  I managed to get my ass out of bed and get here 2 hrs early... so sorry you couldn't do the same.  Many other people let her go ahead of them though.  Maybe she had a good reason - I don't know, but it has happened once more since then.  Seriously, even people who have never flown before realize the holidays are crazy and you need to allow yourself plenty of time.

How is this for a good reason?

I was flying through Houston and there was a horrible rain storm that shut the airport down for a couple hours.  We sat on the runway in San Antonio until Houston opened back up.  I had a 3 hour layover, but sitting on the runway ate through just about all of my layover and I wanted to catch the last connecting flight home.

I needed to change terminals and the tram was stuck on the track and no one was going anywhere.  I waited a few minutes and realized that I needed to find another way to change terminals or I was going to miss my connection.  There was, but I had to break security and go through the basement of a hotel, then go through security again.  Fortunately, many in the line were willing to let me go ahead of them, and I was able to make my connection with very little spare time.

So it's not always someone getting there early enough.

[Deleted]

Nov 16, 2013 13:37:35 GMT -5 Phoenix84 said:

Nov 16, 2013 9:49:46 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

I hate flying and may never do it again.
The cost of tickets, the long security lines, the hassle of getting through security, the early check-in times, the delays, the waiting, getting bumped, the seats getting smaller and smaller, the lack of a pillow and free meals...You can have it!

You wouldn't even fly to see your grandchildren? 

No. The next time I think we will drive.

[movingforward]

Nov 16, 2013 18:03:18 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Nov 16, 2013 17:35:39 GMT -5 movingforward said:

I will never forget flying  2 days before Christmas one year.  The lines at the airport were outrageous.  I assumed they would be so I was at the airport 2 hrs early.  Some lady came running in asking everyone if she could go ahead of them because she was afraid she was going to miss her flight. Hmmmm... no... yeah, I am bitchy like that.  I managed to get my ass out of bed and get here 2 hrs early... so sorry you couldn't do the same.  Many other people let her go ahead of them though.  Maybe she had a good reason - I don't know, but it has happened once more since then.  Seriously, even people who have never flown before realize the holidays are crazy and you need to allow yourself plenty of time.

How is this for a good reason?

I was flying through Houston and there was a horrible rain storm that shut the airport down for a couple hours.  We sat on the runway in San Antonio until Houston opened back up.  I had a 3 hour layover, but sitting on the runway ate through just about all of my layover and I wanted to catch the last connecting flight home.

I needed to change terminals and the tram was stuck on the track and no one was going anywhere.  I waited a few minutes and realized that I needed to find another way to change terminals or I was going to miss my connection.  There was, but I had to break security and go through the basement of a hotel, then go through security again.  Fortunately, many in the line were willing to let me go ahead of them, and I was able to make my connection with very little spare time.

So it's not always someone getting there early enough.

I am not talking about connecting flights - been there more than once.  There is a huge difference.  I am referring to people walking into the airport at 6am in the morning.  

[movingforward]

In general I am not sure I understand all the complaints about air travel (though I might feel differently when I get older).  Considering I can get across the country in just a few hours while I sit and read a book or watch a movie on my Kindle it is still the best way to travel IMO.  Yes delays can be a pain and you might have to stand in a few lines but I will deal with it in order to travel to the places I enjoy visiting.

[Tennesseer]

Nov 16, 2013 17:54:07 GMT -5 whoami said:

Nov 16, 2013 17:24:11 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

I will go back to an over booked flight. When there are no volunteers, the ones usually bumped are the passengers who paid the lowest ticket fare. It is possible that the author's flight was highly overbooked and the gate advised the ticket counter no more passengers regardless of ticket price. The thread author states the counter told him he was two minutes past the check-in time. But is that the real reason? He/we don't know.

The gate agent and ticket counters do not conspire with each other at all, nevermind 45 minutes in advance of a scheduled departure. The ticket counter couldnt care less if a flight is overbooked. It is no more their problem, than the pilots or the flight attendants problem.

 He was not allowed to check in for his flight because he was late. Even the kiosk locks you out if you do not check in on time. 

So be ìt then.  Let that be a lesson to get your rear end to the airport ahead of schedule. 

[TheOtherMe]

I hope you learned your lesson and will arrive earlier at the airport as it has been the rule for a long time.

As for Frontier being "draconion" about the carry on policy, I traveled Frontier recently and was thrilled the gate agents were enforcing the carry-on bag rules.  I'm tired of people coming on board with a too many carry on items.  Loved the looks on people's faces when they had to pay the baggage fee that others have to pay.  People think if they have to gate check, they got away with something. 

[Deleted]

the recommendation is to get to the airport 2 hours before your flight.  you never know what security will be like.  At BWI if I get there 2 hours before I usually spend an hour sitting at my gate.  At Denver if I get there 2 hours before my flight, I'm lucky if I get to my gate before they start boarding - I hate that airport.  And for international flights I think you have to check in even more than 45 minutes before the flight.  I don't understand why everyone doesn't check in online.

[zibazinski]

Well, I have always loved flying frontier and was an ascent member. Free bags, free movies, the works. Now I get nothing and they are going under.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Nov 17, 2013 8:01:49 GMT -5 @singlemominmd said:

the recommendation is to get to the airport 2 hours before your flight.  you never know what security will be like.  At BWI if I get there 2 hours before I usually spend an hour sitting at my gate.  At Denver if I get there 2 hours before my flight, I'm lucky if I get to my gate before they start boarding - I hate that airport.  And for international flights I think you have to check in even more than 45 minutes before the flight.  I don't understand why everyone doesn't check in online.

A lot of it depends upon airports.  I could show up for a flight in Lexington at the last minute.  Living there 13 years, I don't ever remember anything more than about a 5 min wait.  I won't do that flying out of Cincinnati.  Louisville, it's pretty much between those 2. 

Seatac and Vanvouver are way different animals than any of those.

Next weekend, we are flying Vancouver to Montreal.  It has been a long time since I've flown into or out of Montreal so have no idea.  Flying with a Nexus card will help though.

[Gardening Grandma]

Nov 17, 2013 8:01:49 GMT -5 @singlemominmd said:

the recommendation is to get to the airport 2 hours before your flight.  you never know what security will be like.  At BWI if I get there 2 hours before I usually spend an hour sitting at my gate.  At Denver if I get there 2 hours before my flight, I'm lucky if I get to my gate before they start boarding - I hate that airport.  And for international flights I think you have to check in even more than 45 minutes before the flight.  I don't understand why everyone doesn't check in online.

We fly out of Seattle and consider 2 hrs a minimum...  Recently it took me 45 minutes to get through security (generally it doesn't take that long).

Even if you do check in online, you still have to drop off your luggage - if you have luggage.  With so many people carrying on so much, I prefer to check in my bag than worry about finding space in the overhead bin...

I like to get there early, get through security and go have a drink (a double) before boarding.  Much less stressful than cutting it close.  It's a pain though, because it takes us 2-3 hours just to get TO the airport...  If our flight is very early, we'll spend the night at a hotel near the airport.

I do remind myself (as almost40 reminded us all) that with all of that, we are rocketing through the air, sitting in a chair, taking hours to complete a journey that took days or weeks not that many years ago...

[justme]

At best you were 34 minutes early because the doors to the airplane close 10 minutes before the scheduled departure time - as the departure time isn't from the gate, it's from the ground. Everyone I've flown starts boarding 30 minutes early - I've seen it 30 minutes before departure time and 30 minutes before the gates closed. Depending upon which one it was you were either 4 or 14 minutes before boarding was starting. That's ridiculously close unless it's a really empty flight - they start assigning stand by before boarding, or at least I've seen it...I'm guessing based on people that hadn't checked in yet.

[cronewitch]

I have only had two trips by air and none for at least 13 years, I don't think I ever will again. Since I haven't flown I don't have a clue how to go about things like security and how big a carry on is. I heard you can't bring things like liquids that are full size and miniatures need to be in Ziploc bags and they take things if you don't know they aren't allowed so you might lose something like nail clippers just for not checking your purse yourself.

I would like to go to Mexico someday but don't know if I will since air travel isn't fun. My brother and his wife are going in January to visit our brother and his wife. But fly to Mexico city then drive a couple hours just doesn't seem that fun. I hear the seats are too small, no meals or snacks. I hated flying to Boston and back so maybe just not go.

[chiver78]

Nov 17, 2013 14:01:02 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Nov 17, 2013 8:01:49 GMT -5 @singlemominmd said:

the recommendation is to get to the airport 2 hours before your flight.  you never know what security will be like.  At BWI if I get there 2 hours before I usually spend an hour sitting at my gate.  At Denver if I get there 2 hours before my flight, I'm lucky if I get to my gate before they start boarding - I hate that airport.  And for international flights I think you have to check in even more than 45 minutes before the flight.  I don't understand why everyone doesn't check in online.

A lot of it depends upon airports.  I could show up for a flight in Lexington at the last minute.  Living there 13 years, I don't ever remember anything more than about a 5 min wait.  I won't do that flying out of Cincinnati.  Louisville, it's pretty much between those 2. 

Seatac and Vanvouver are way different animals than any of those.

Next weekend, we are flying Vancouver to Montreal.  It has been a long time since I've flown into or out of Montreal so have no idea.  Flying with a Nexus card will help though.

ya know, that's a pretty good point. doesn't Phoenix live in the middle of nowhere? he might be used to a quick security line, and think nothing of showing up with minimal time to spare. my home airport is Boston Logan, and the only time I have ever sailed through security was earlier this month when my flight was on the side of Terminal C that only has 3 gates and I got there way early b/c that's when my ride was able to take me. I always plan for at least a half hour for the security screening alone.

[NastyWoman]

Unless I significantly increase myswimming abilities airplanes it is for me to visit my family. BTW I know that I what need to get some shark repellent for the Pacific, but are there also (dangerous) sharks in the atlantic? I like to be prepared... I better find those swim armbands I must still have from when the kids were little as well

[Deleted]

Nov 17, 2013 17:27:30 GMT -5 cronewitch said:

Since I haven't flown I don't have a clue how to go about things like security and how big a carry on is. I heard you can't bring things like liquids that are full size and miniatures need to be in Ziploc bags and they take things if you don't know they aren't allowed so you might lose something like nail clippers just for not checking your purse yourself.

Yeah, the rules do change so you definitely have to keep up with them and I've occasionally had something confiscated at one airport after it's been in my carry-ons through others for years. (Yes, that's you, people in Madrid. I want my corkscrew back!)

The saddest incident I've witnessed was a nice 70-something lady in line ahead of me who had an old-fashioned cosmetic case full of liquids and gels over 3.5 ounces, complete with a couple of foil sheets of Preparation H suppositories on top of it all. I have no idea if they took those or not but I felt so bad for her.

[steph08]

Nov 16, 2013 21:30:44 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

I hope you learned your lesson and will arrive earlier at the airport as it has been the rule for a long time.

As for Frontier being "draconion" about the carry on policy, I traveled Frontier recently and was thrilled the gate agents were enforcing the carry-on bag rules.  I'm tired of people coming on board with a too many carry on items.  Loved the looks on people's faces when they had to pay the baggage fee that others have to pay.  People think if they have to gate check, they got away with something. 

I totally agree with you. I hate seeing people waddle up with their oversized "carry-on" bags but then get to check them because the "overhead bins are full." They get out of paying the $25-$35 that the rest of us with checked bags have to pay.

[flamingo]

I just don't understand people who get to the airport that close to boarding time. I travel for my job, and for fun, A LOT. And my philosophy has always been, I can kill time in the airport as easily as I can at home. Therefore, why not just get to the airport a bit earlier and save all that stress/worrying. Especially now with iPads, laptops, smartphones. There is no reason to not be on time or early, because if I have work to be doing, I can do it at the airport remotely. Seriously, you couldn't have left home 5 minutes earlier?? 

*i freely admit I'm neurotically early. I was on time for a meeting last week and was hyperventilating because I wasn't the first one there. I know, I'm weird. But this has kept me from missing things like flights and important deadlines!

[TheOtherMe]

I am a bit neurotic about getting to the airport early myself.  I might hit a traffic jam, etc.  One never knows.  When I fly, I am often one of the first ones for my flight, but I can kill time on some electronic device or a newspaper.  

I don't want to miss my flight.  If it's my fault, it's my money that has to pay the new fare.  

I usually fly out of a small airport.  Last time I flew out, I got easily through security.  As flight time neared, people were rushing to the gate (last one, of course).  They said security line was unusally long for that airport.  Who knows what happened.  

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

As much as we try to avoid high traffic times, there are times where I-5 comes to a total standstill. If you get caught in the middle of it, there is nothing you can do. So it's not a matter of leaving 5 minutes early, we are already on the road nearly 4 hours early to go 100 miles, and unfortunately I have managed to miss a plane due to an accident.

[lynnerself]

1. We always check in on line the night before and print our boarding passes.
That way, if we are not checking luggage we can go straight to the gate, by-passing long lines at the ticket counter. (Or if checking luggage, do it curb side.

2. For morning flights, we go early and plan on having breakfast once we get past security.

3. I don't mind flying. I'd rather the discomfort of 2 hours to a 10-12 hr. drive.

4. I like Southwest Airlines.  Thank God for free luggage. The cost of checking bags and the resulting increase in carrying-on
baggage has made boarding on other airlines a giant pain.

Gardening Grandma
"We fly out of Seattle and consider 2 hrs a minimum... Recently it took me 45 minutes to get through security (generally it doesn't take that long)."

You can imagine how freaked out we were when we called DS and he was just arriving at SeaTac 45 mins before his flight!
(He had missed his light rail connection).
But he had his boarding pass and carryon luggage and was fine.

[HoneyBBQ]

That's the weird thing about Seattle. Normal traffic jam times are normal - it's the 11pm at night in the middle of nowhere that traffic comes to a screeching halt that is so odd!

[Deleted]

DH and I have been known to start our trip early by hanging out in an airport hotel the night before an early AM flight. That's mostly me worrying about running into traffic on the way to the airport although our area rarely has problems. I used to fly out of Newark (and occasionally JFK and LGA) so the people in major metro areas have my sympathy. Sometimes you just get very unlucky. You used ot be able to get good "park and fly" deals with the airport hotels but they've jacked up the rates for that so much that we typically just go the few miles to off-airport parking in the morning and park there.

Nov 18, 2013 14:11:53 GMT -5 lynnerself said:

I don't mind flying. I'd rather the discomfort of 2 hours to a 10-12 hr. drive.

DH would rather drive. Provided I can spare the vacation time, we do road trips even when they include an overnight or two each way. The deal is that he happily does all the driving, and when we get off the road he puts his feet up and turns on the TV and I go find food for dinner after I get in a workout. We've really cut back on flying in recent years.

[Tennesseer]

Nov 17, 2013 15:30:28 GMT -5 justme said:

At best you were 34 minutes early because the doors to the airplane close 10 minutes before the scheduled departure time - as the departure time isn't from the gate, it's from the ground. Everyone I've flown starts boarding 30 minutes early - I've seen it 30 minutes before departure time and 30 minutes before the gates closed. Depending upon which one it was you were either 4 or 14 minutes before boarding was starting. That's ridiculously close unless it's a really empty flight - they start assigning stand by before boarding, or at least I've seen it...I'm guessing based on people that hadn't checked in yet.

What you are describing is Actual Air Time ("as the departure time isn't from the gate, it's from the ground") which is different than schedule departure and arrival times.  Departure and arrival times are when the blocks are removed from the wheels and the brake released to allow the push back to begin and when the blocks are placed by the wheels (to stop the a/c from moving) and the brake set upon arrival at the gate.