djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:09:02 GMT -5
And the answer, ceteris paribus, is that ten (say) other people can have premiums $35.60 lower in January. that is one possible answer. another is that a 60YO is expected to need at least $356/mo more care than a 50YO. it is called "actuarial bracketing", folks.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:10:50 GMT -5
I don't concede the point that healthcare is special and cannot exist in a free market, consumer driven environment. that's nice. but nobody else did, either. what we are arguing is whether it SHOULD exist that way. btw- even France has a "free market" for healthcare, Paul- so you are really arguing a red herring, here. they just have a socialized system that exists along side it.
|
|
bimetalaupt
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 9, 2011 20:29:23 GMT -5
Posts: 2,325
|
Post by bimetalaupt on Oct 30, 2013 9:11:32 GMT -5
I love it. Now that Obamacare is crashing and burning right out of the gate, it's suddenly "GOPcare". Sorry, it doesn't work like that. But nice try. If the GOP actually had any decent ideas at this point, the tide would be turning. Too bad they have no decent ideas of their own. Management..Like we had in our Home Care Unit..saved money and keep many out of the hospital..Omamacare is more about open the beds up.... . Just a thought ... Principal in Home Health and Health Care President BiMetalAuPt finance.yahoo.com/news/top-college-pharmacy-uses-ibm-133000841.htmlPharmacist are the most underutilized asset of health care. Just keep a patient on the medications as correctly used; 35% of the hospital stay days could be reduced. OUR home care insured medications were delivered and taken correctly. My study proved Clinical Pharmacist will save $4.00 for ever $1.00 spent. Just my thoughts, BiMetalAuPt
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:12:57 GMT -5
Well, we had to pass it to find out what was in it, right? My sole prediction that was wrong about the 2012 elections was that I missed the fact that America had reached a critical mass of stupid. I figured there was simply no way there were enough people this stupid as to re-elect this lying dirtbag. That's what I was wrong about. Hopefully, we now have the average fucking idiot's attention. no. you were wrong about a lot of races, including Allen West. do i need to dredge up the threads?
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:16:10 GMT -5
Just don't lump me in with "you realists" there. We're in agreement. Catastrophic care can't even theoretically be free - you can socialize risk through insurance to an extent but there are limits to either coverage or cost or both. Subsidiary markets in healthcare can be free. Take a good long hard look at the concept of 'intellectual copyright' for example, and you have scope to dramatically alter the price points in the pharmaceutical market. A market with fewer drugs on it, and ever fewer players in it, may not be less free or fair than the current one, because the current one is a rigged game in the worst way. So part of the problem is in insisting that everything we think of as 'healthcare' is to be tackled the same way. Why isn't the Department of Agriculture a mere agency of HHS? Is not nutrition a basic component of healthcare? an excellent question. food for thought.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 38,227
Member is Online
|
Post by billisonboard on Oct 30, 2013 9:18:25 GMT -5
for those who havent seen anything about it, or heard about it HR 3121.....republican answer to the health care issues ... beta.congress.gov/bill/113th/house-bill/3121/texti dont think there is a perfect answer for our healthcare problems this looks like it takes care of a lot of them......but i am no expert Good that something positive is proposed. Let's see how it goes getting through the House process.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:21:28 GMT -5
Interesting. I haven't heard a word about what our insurnace will be like next year. Our HR portal already has open enrollment up and running, but no announcements or info has been provided. So I'm waiting anxiously. All I know is my share of the cost has gone up $30/month. You know, mistakes and dumb decisions have always rolled of Obama like water off a duck's back. But this time around, he really seems to be getting his feet held to the fire by the media. It's about time. yeah- i have been speculating for several years that he will be to Democrats what Reagan was to Republicans. there are many parallels.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:23:04 GMT -5
for those who havent seen anything about it, or heard about it HR 3121.....republican answer to the health care issues ... beta.congress.gov/bill/113th/house-bill/3121/texti dont think there is a perfect answer for our healthcare problems this looks like it takes care of a lot of them......but i am no expert Good that something positive is proposed. Let's see how it goes getting through the House process. TITLE I--REPEAL OF OBAMACARE Sec. 101. Repeal of PPACA and health care-related provisions in the Health Care and Education Reconciliation Act of 2010. non-starter.......
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 6, 2024 13:26:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2013 9:26:37 GMT -5
WCP--The only reason Obamacare needs to be replaced with "something" is that there are now a lot of people suddenly relying on it. Even if that "something" is a temporary measure to get from here to there, it still needs to be something. As far as better ideas, the GOP may have them, but they don't talk about them. Even Jeb Bush the other day was saying that they need to put some ideas out there.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 9:33:22 GMT -5
WCP--The only reason Obamacare needs to be replaced with "something" is that there are now a lot of people suddenly relying on it. Even if that "something" is a temporary measure to get from here to there, it still needs to be something. As far as better ideas, the GOP may have them, but they don't talk about them. Even Jeb Bush the other day was saying that they need to put some ideas out there. yeah, it doesn't really mean much if we have ideas which we are too afraid to promote. that is pretty much the same as not having ideas.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 6, 2024 13:26:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2013 9:41:19 GMT -5
Good that something positive is proposed. Let's see how it goes getting through the House process. TITLE I--REPEAL OF OBAMACARE Sec. 101. Repeal of PPACA and health care-related provisions in the Health Care and Education Reconciliation Act of 2010. non-starter....... Angel and others have been asking for some alternative this is what is out there..... and yes...part 1 is to dismantle obamacare but most of the ACA good stuff is in this bill..... so again i wonder.....is change what is wanted, or the ACA in particular?
|
|
OldCoyote
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 10:34:48 GMT -5
Posts: 13,449
|
Post by OldCoyote on Oct 30, 2013 10:48:41 GMT -5
|
|
bimetalaupt
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 9, 2011 20:29:23 GMT -5
Posts: 2,325
|
Post by bimetalaupt on Oct 30, 2013 10:59:20 GMT -5
It is funny how well one payer system works in Japan. Doctor for care and Pharmacist get paid instantaneously with pass of card when service is given,, Cost of system is about 7% of GDP V. 15% FOR THE USA!!!! No cost to see the Doctor or limit in number of visits!!! Doctor also supply medications under Japanese Laws!!!! Just a thought, BiMetalAuPt
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 12:02:17 GMT -5
TITLE I--REPEAL OF OBAMACARE Sec. 101. Repeal of PPACA and health care-related provisions in the Health Care and Education Reconciliation Act of 2010. non-starter....... Angel and others have been asking for some alternative this is what is out there..... and yes...part 1 is to dismantle obamacare but most of the ACA good stuff is in this bill..... so again i wonder.....is change what is wanted, or the ACA in particular? wonder away. here is something else to wonder: if this proposal contains most beneficial features of the ACA, why not delete the non-beneficial features from the ACA rather than repealing and replacing it?
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 12:03:28 GMT -5
most businesses that i have talked to couldn't care less. but then again, most business i talk to have less than 50 employees.
|
|
usaone
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 9:10:23 GMT -5
Posts: 3,429
|
Post by usaone on Oct 30, 2013 12:37:10 GMT -5
Most small business's in America are under 50 employees.
|
|
usaone
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 9:10:23 GMT -5
Posts: 3,429
|
Post by usaone on Oct 30, 2013 12:39:46 GMT -5
Few %? It's the majority of people with insurance not provided by employers or gov't. Do you have any stats on that Bob? Not discrediting you, I just have not seen it.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 6, 2024 13:26:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2013 15:44:53 GMT -5
Not off hand, but I think I read that the current administration was expecting something like 40-60% of policies to be cancelled and replaced.
|
|
resolution
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:09:56 GMT -5
Posts: 7,244
Mini-Profile Name Color: 305b2b
|
Post by resolution on Oct 30, 2013 15:51:05 GMT -5
Looks like the system problems are getting stranger and stranger.
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Oct 30, 2013 16:42:28 GMT -5
It is funny how well one payer system works in Japan. Doctor for care and Pharmacist get paid instantaneously with pass of card when service is given,, Cost of system is about 7% of GDP V. 15% FOR THE USA!!!! No cost to see the Doctor or limit in number of visits!!! Doctor also supply medications under Japanese Laws!!!! Just a thought, BiMetalAuPt Yes, and there is another "cost" to their system that is not in dollars: www.disabled-world.com/news/asia/japan/doctors-japan-4289.phpHowever, lately an acute shortage of doctors in Japan are leaving hospitals unable to treat even emergency cases. Some small private hospitals now have only 1 doctor on staff, when they used to have 3 or 4. Larger hospitals are dropping entire departments because they can't get the required specialists to staff them. Long work hours and uncompetitive pay are deterring people from entering the medical profession and Japan's strict immigration laws mean foreign doctors cannot work in the country, although it took the landmark step in 2006 of allowing in a limited number of nurses from the Philippines. Many doctors are working 36-hour days, and if this routine continues, doctors' abilities during surgery will drop and could increase the likelihood of medical errors. Because of this Japan is suffering from a current severe shortage of doctors, which is leaving some hospitals struggling to cope. "The risk of being hauled to court by patients for medical malpractice suits is a reason why many doctors today are seeking to go into less taxing fields rather than surgery", a doctor explained. In Japan's health care system, the government regulates the fees charged by all hospitals both public and private. Employers buy insurance for workers; those without stable jobs can buy coverage through local governments. Because of this many doctors have complained to Japanese officials that their salaries are stagnant and Japanese health specialists could earn lucrative incomes overseas ===So, yes, their system is much less expensive, but they also don't have enough doctors to treat everyone. You may become bankrupt in our system, but at least you're ALIVE to deal with it
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Oct 30, 2013 16:43:43 GMT -5
Angel and others have been asking for some alternative this is what is out there..... and yes...part 1 is to dismantle obamacare but most of the ACA good stuff is in this bill..... so again i wonder.....is change what is wanted, or the ACA in particular? wonder away. here is something else to wonder: if this proposal contains most beneficial features of the ACA, why not delete the non-beneficial features from the ACA rather than repealing and replacing it? For the same reason they had to "vote on it to see what was in it." Because no one wants to scan through 2000 f'ing pages to figure out what needs to go...
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Oct 30, 2013 16:46:10 GMT -5
Few %? It's the majority of people with insurance not provided by employers or gov't. Do you have any stats on that Bob? Not discrediting you, I just have not seen it. If you can find my thread that was added to this one, it states it in there. I believe they are predicting something like 50-75%, up to a possible 80%, of folks with independent coverage. That's a pretty absurd amount of people...and a huge lie to the American public.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 6, 2024 13:26:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2013 16:49:17 GMT -5
The friend who told me they haven't had a paycheck in months... but are just living on the cash the business brings in, has been lighting up facebook with posts on how horrible it is that their plan for their three employees is being dropped and their poor employees and the plan they offered is going up 40%...
She is the one who has been linking to tons of fox and heritage items.
I want to ask, have you shopped other plans? Have you shopped the exchange? Have you had your people shop the exchange? It may take a bit to get firm numbers back, but have you started the process anyway?
The answer is no anyway. She is gleeful at any prospect that this might fail... she has no time for potential solutions or alternatives.
Actually, i most just end up asking, why are these people my friends again? ....
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 17:06:46 GMT -5
wonder away. here is something else to wonder: if this proposal contains most beneficial features of the ACA, why not delete the non-beneficial features from the ACA rather than repealing and replacing it? For the same reason they had to "vote on it to see what was in it." Because no one wants to scan through 2000 f'ing pages to figure out what needs to go... i don't buy that argument. nobody has to vote for anything. but you can keep repeating it if you wish.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 17:09:41 GMT -5
Do you have any stats on that Bob? Not discrediting you, I just have not seen it. If you can find my thread that was added to this one, it states it in there. I believe they are predicting something like 50-75%, up to a possible 80%, of folks with independent coverage. That's a pretty absurd amount of people...and a huge lie to the American public. not to argue- but i am wondering what these plans are that are getting "cancelled". are they catastrophic-only policies? and if they are cancelled and replaced, is the replacement at lower cost? is it a better plan? and if so, why are people bitching so much? because "Obama Lied"? are we all such children to think that politicians never lie? or that Obama is some kind of saint? or that he even knew what he was saying?
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 17:16:28 GMT -5
It is funny how well one payer system works in Japan. Doctor for care and Pharmacist get paid instantaneously with pass of card when service is given,, Cost of system is about 7% of GDP V. 15% FOR THE USA!!!! No cost to see the Doctor or limit in number of visits!!! Doctor also supply medications under Japanese Laws!!!! Just a thought, BiMetalAuPt Yes, and there is another "cost" to their system that is not in dollars: www.disabled-world.com/news/asia/japan/doctors-japan-4289.phpHowever, lately an acute shortage of doctors in Japan are leaving hospitals unable to treat even emergency cases. bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt Japan ranks 55th in the world in physicians per capita. the US is 53rd. canada is 57th. Japan has 50% more physicians per capita than the global average. there is no doctor shortage in Japan. i don't know what else this article got wrong, but they got off to a bad start.
|
|
bimetalaupt
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 9, 2011 20:29:23 GMT -5
Posts: 2,325
|
Post by bimetalaupt on Oct 30, 2013 18:34:07 GMT -5
MANPOWER IN HEALTHCARE...
I: THE USA ESP WEST TEXAS HAVE IMPORTED PHYSICIAN FOR YEARS. MANY SPEAK ENGLISH WELL ARE FROM ENGLAND,SCOTLAND, IRELAND OR INDIA.
II: MANY AMERICANS HAVE STUDIED IN MEXICO, ENGLAND,FRANCE,THE ISLAND ETC.. LEAVING THEM WITH SOME HUGE IOU'S.... WE NOW HAVE MORE MEDICAL AND PHARMACY SCHOOLS. TOTAL COST FOR FOUR MORE YEARS OF SCHOOLS COULD BE IN TOTAL ALMOST $250,000...
III:HOSPITALS WILL NOT HAVE FUNDS NEEDED FOR ADVANCED TRAINING FOR OTHER FIELD NEEDED FOR OUR FUTURE TRAINING AND MANPOWER. WHERE WILL WE FIND MEDICAL TECHS, EMT OR RT'S?
IV:WE WILL NEED TO IMPROVE WAGES FROM TOP PERFORMERS WITH GOOD SKILLS TO KEEP THE OVERWORKED AND OVER STRESSED...ESP RN'S, PHARMACIST AND PHYSICIANS. MANY OF MY FRIENDS ARE TAKEN EARLY RETIREMENT..LIKE MYSELF. This alone will be a trillion dollar cost.Just a thoughts. BiMetalAuPt
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Oct 30, 2013 22:24:56 GMT -5
For the same reason they had to "vote on it to see what was in it." Because no one wants to scan through 2000 f'ing pages to figure out what needs to go... i don't buy that argument. nobody has to vote for anything. but you can keep repeating it if you wish. And the ones trying to repeal it DIDN'T vote for it....
|
|
jkapp
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 12:05:08 GMT -5
Posts: 5,416
|
Post by jkapp on Oct 30, 2013 22:34:35 GMT -5
bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt Japan ranks 55th in the world in physicians per capita. the US is 53rd. canada is 57th. Japan has 50% more physicians per capita than the global average. there is no doctor shortage in Japan. i don't know what else this article got wrong, but they got off to a bad start. I can find several articles mentioning their shortages... Here's another (that shows they have a slightly less doctor-per-capita ratio than the U.S. to agree with your post, but it still states they have shortage problems): jcu.export-japan.com/index.php?page=is-there-a-doctor-in-townAccording to statistics from the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development, Japan has only 2.1 doctors per 1,000 people. This is the same figure as Canada, but it is well below the average of 3.1 for the OECD's group of 30 economically developed nations. Only Mexico, South Korea and Turkey have lower figures. Greece leads the group with 5 doctors per 1,000 people, while Germany has 3.5, France has 3.4, Australia has 2.8, Britain has 2.5 and the United States has 2.4. What does the doctor shortage mean for Japan’s future? ...Nightmarish tales of ambulances searching for a hospital that will accept their patients have become familiar news items. In October of 2008, a pregnant woman died of a brain hemorrhage in Tokyo after being rejected by eight hospitals. In December of that year, another woman died of injuries she had received in a traffic accident after being rejected by six hospitals in Fukushima and Ibaraki prefectures north of Tokyo, and a premature baby born in Sapporo died in November of 2007 after being rejected by seven hospitals in Hokkaido’s largest city. More than 14,000 seriously ill patients in ambulances that year were turned away by hospitals at least three times each. There are bound to be many contributing factors in such shocking incidents, but a big one is this: Japan, despite being a wealthy and technologically advanced nation, is suffering from a shortage of doctors. According to statistics from the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development, Japan has only 2.1 doctors per 1,000 people. This is the same figure as Canada, but it is well below the average of 3.1 for the OECD’s group of 30 economically developed nations. Only Mexico, South Korea and Turkey have lower figures. Greece leads the group with 5 doctors per 1,000 people, while Germany has 3.5, France has 3.4, Australia has 2.8, Britain has 2.5 and the United States has 2.4. Narumi Eguchi, chief researcher at the Japan Medical Associat ion Research Institute, told Japan Close-up in an interview the 2.1 figure may be even lower than it looks because it includes a significant number of doctors who are semi-retired: “In other countries, physicians tend to retire in their 60s or 70s, but lots of doctors in Japan stay in practice into their 70s or 80s, and this number includes those aged physicians. They work less than other, younger physicians.” Meanwhile, the general population is also aging as well, which increases the demand for many categories of medical care.
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,482
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Oct 30, 2013 22:48:52 GMT -5
i don't buy that argument. nobody has to vote for anything. but you can keep repeating it if you wish. And the ones trying to repeal it DIDN'T vote for it.... the same can be said of ANY law. that doesn't give the minority the right to sabotage their government. surely you must realize how insane governing on that basis is. please tell me you understand that.
|
|