Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2013 7:36:29 GMT -5
So, I have this employee. From a getting stuff done perspective, she is awesome. But she also is very methodical and pretty set in her ways. If you go from a to b to c, she is fine. But if you need to go to b first, all heck is going to break loose. She's been a great complement to me, as I'm a bit more, lets do what we have to do to get it done, and she's forced some more process orientation onto me. While I'm her boss, she's been with me since I started this group a few years ago and we have really worked together to build it.
the problem is her communication. I was on the phone with one of my other employees the other day and she came over to their desk and was really, really rude. Basically told this other employee that, if she was already talking to me about here question that she didn't need to be involved and then walked away.
i struggle with giving bad feedback in general. But I need to make sure that she understands that the tone and words that she said to a fellow employee are not acceptable. When I give her feedback, she's going to get b!tchy with me. She does a lot of the time anyway. I'm not sure how to get across to her that a) I'm her boss and, while she may not like it, it's the way it is and she should be careful in how she communicates with me (its been raised to me by other leaders that she speaks to me disrespectfully, etc) but more importantly b) that her tone with other people and her general snark is not acceptable.
Part of me fears that shell bail and it would be hard to replace her, but the other part thinks that it might be better for the group.
Any advice on how I can best handle would be great.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Sept 20, 2013 8:00:37 GMT -5
She must be older than you
Whatever you do or say, don't let your fear show
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2013 8:39:24 GMT -5
Her knowing and acting like you are her boss is more important than her productivity. You can always find someone else who has the same working style that she does, and her bad attitude is bad for you. Especially if the higher ups have noticed it.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Sept 20, 2013 9:04:11 GMT -5
monkey - you position it as an issue for both of you - which it is if others are mentioning it. You say that you feel things have gotten a little lax in communication and other leaders have mentioned it to you. That that doesn't look good for either of you. There's also a team morale issue. So better to give her your thoughts now.
That's how I would position anyway.
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moneymaven
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Post by moneymaven on Sept 20, 2013 9:38:07 GMT -5
You should read "Crucial Conversations, Tools for Talking When The Stakes Are High".
It will help you have these conversations. They're not fun, but need to be had. Focus on making the environment safe and make it clear you want to help her develop her communication skills, that will otherwise be a detriment to her professionally with this company. Further, you must promptly address the issue. Managing the person and ongoing issue will help reinstate your authority with her and others.
Once other company leadership sees you loosing control over a situation, you're jeopardizing your career.
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jkapp
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Post by jkapp on Sept 20, 2013 11:31:14 GMT -5
You can try throwing it back on her...if she starts acting bitchy/disrespectful, tell her something like:
"You know, when you speak to me in that way (or that tone), I find it very disrepectful. Is that they way you want to come across to people?" (keep your words level and calm)
And during the whole meeting, just keep reminding yourself: supervisor (pointing to yourself), employee (pointing to her). That is the dynamic of the relationship and it must be adhered to. Keep a calm and level toned with your words no matter how off the handle she gets. And keep repeating the above phrase regarding her being disrespectful when she flies off the handle.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Sept 20, 2013 11:36:47 GMT -5
I think you need to call her on it when she gets bitchy with you, at the time. It sounds like you have let it slide for so long that this has become the norm for her and it's entirely possible she does not realize how it sounds to the observer. The fact that she is doing it to others and your superiors have noticed is not good.
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Sept 20, 2013 13:21:05 GMT -5
Wherever you have the talk with her, office, conference room, whatever, set the stage. Adjust the chairs so that you are on a higher level then she is. Place yourself in the "power position" in the room (behind the desk, at the head of the table, whatever). Do not let her take control of the conversation. State the problem and make it clear that the solution is up to her; you will not be adjusting your behavior or asking her coworkers to walk on eggshells around her. In the end, if she does leave over this, what have you lost? The departure of a rude, disrespectful, disruptive person an only benefit the organization. She sounds like a real pill.
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Sept 20, 2013 14:33:44 GMT -5
Ask her if you can borrow $200.
Anything you say after that will seem reasonable.
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Peace Of Mind
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Post by Peace Of Mind on Sept 20, 2013 15:51:27 GMT -5
Ask her if you can borrow $200. Anything you say after that will seem reasonable. LOL!! I was going to say almost the exact same thing but change it to: Tell her she is fired. Anything you say after that won't seem so bad.
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svwashout
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Post by svwashout on Sept 21, 2013 12:53:40 GMT -5
Where I work we rely on trust and teamwork, especially as we've taken on a burst of new hires. So a prickly prima donna type (like me) who doesn't play well with others needs to be handled right away and not allowed to corrode. The direct approach may be to deliver the feedback, expect a confrontation, and prepare her walking papers.
But since this person has some valuable talent and experience, maybe an alternative path, for example reassignment into a position that requires little supervision or interaction with others? We have a research projects team that does independent work and is staffed mainly by "graduate student" types who seem to be happy narrowly focused on their own topic.
So assuming that this person doesn't actually enjoy attacking her teammates, maybe deliver the negative feedback in the context of an offer to give her her own domain? This would protect the team and perhaps reduce what she may perceive to be job stress. OTOH if she really likes being part of the group (like me), she may elect to take the feedback and make the necessary adjustments. For me the problem was that new/young people were intimidated by my communication style so were very reluctant to ask me for input, and once I became aware of the problem I found a way to lighten up. It wasn't so much overt rudeness on my part, just that the asker had best be prepared to be grilled on their inquiry.
Anyway given the visibility of this problem, this may be an opportunity to pull a hat-trick. Issues outside of work may be at the root of this though, and you can't expect to be able to fix those.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2013 14:04:48 GMT -5
What Sroo said. You have to do this and now. It is a formal sit down discussion. Tell her that this is the only time the coaching will be delivered verbally. Any further incidences and it will be written warnings.
How long have you been managing this person and tolerating the disrespectful behavior? If year/years, then you will have to do a lot of documentation on every incident from now on because in the end you will need to fire this person. Due to it being tolerated behavior in the past, you need to give her a longer runway to change her behavior.
Are you supervising hourly or salaried staff?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2013 6:59:47 GMT -5
Well, we are in different locations, so it won't be a sit down, but over the phone. I have it scheduled for later this week. Thanks for all of the suggestions on how to handle.
To answer a few questions.... A. It is difficult to reassign someone. We are a fairly small group and have a defined set of responsibilities. I can't just hand her to another group....it doesn't work that way at my particular (large) company B. firing people is very difficult here. Effectively, you have to manage them out by giving bad ratings, etc. or hope there is a reorganization that you can use. C. I manage salaried employees, not hourly. These are pretty highly skilled professionals making over 6 figures.
Again, thanks for all of the ideas. I will come up with something, I'm sure.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Sept 23, 2013 16:53:03 GMT -5
I've dealt with this type of situation a couple of times. Not fun, but needs to be done. This type of coaching is how you help people get better at their jobs
I had good success with a candid conversation about the behavior being exhibited, people's immediate reaction to the behavior, and the longer term consequences of the behavior. It might be difficult, given that you are not at the same work location as the employee you are counseling, but in one of the cases I dealt with, a couple of weeks after the initial discussion, I was able to observe the undesirable behavior being exhibited. I was able to follow up immediately, while the event was fresh in the employee's mind, and discuss what they had done and the ramifications. This allowed the employee to understand exactly what behavior I had originally been talking about, the type of situation they were in when they engaged in the undesirable behavior, and the reaction they elicited from the person they were dealing with. I never saw that behavior exhibited again.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 23, 2013 17:49:57 GMT -5
We have anew president of our women's group. So far she has managed to piss just about everyone off. She speaks disrespectfully and down to people. They don't like it. But they grumble about it and say nothing to her because they're afraid they will be accused of being anti-Semitic. I've been dying to say she isn't a bitch because she is Jewish, she's just a bitch, period. Religion has nothing to do with it other than making people afraid to say anything. Which is why she has gotten away with it probably for many years now.
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happyscooter
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Post by happyscooter on Sept 24, 2013 6:21:27 GMT -5
Wow, I can't imagine having a job where I was disrespectful to my boss. Not one time. I worked as a temp for many years at many different companies. Ranging from medical offices, to banks, to attorneys offices to warehouses. If I had even thought about raising my voice and going against the management, I wouldn't have had a job. Not there or anywhere else the temp agency would have sent me to.
If I had complaints, I waited until I got home and used my DH as my sounding board.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Sept 24, 2013 6:24:34 GMT -5
We have anew president of our women's group. So far she has managed to piss just about everyone off. She speaks disrespectfully and down to people. They don't like it. But they grumble about it and say nothing to her because they're afraid they will be accused of being anti-Semitic. I've been dying to say she isn't a bitch because she is Jewish, she's just a bitch, period. Religion has nothing to do with it other than making people afraid to say anything. Which is why she has gotten away with it probably for many years now. Wait, what? Jewish people are stereotypically bitchy? How did I miss this memo?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 24, 2013 6:37:41 GMT -5
There is that stereotype and it gets going again with someone who acts bitchy and demanding and rude. She's is all of these things but I think it's just her nature. Others are not so understanding so it's easier to fall back on a stereotype.
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michelyn8
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Post by michelyn8 on Sept 24, 2013 7:22:29 GMT -5
Well, we are in different locations, so it won't be a sit down, but over the phone. I have it scheduled for later this week. Thanks for all of the suggestions on how to handle. To answer a few questions.... A. It is difficult to reassign someone. We are a fairly small group and have a defined set of responsibilities. I can't just hand her to another group....it doesn't work that way at my particular (large) company B. firing people is very difficult here. Effectively, you have to manage them out by giving bad ratings, etc. or hope there is a reorganization that you can use. C. I manage salaried employees, not hourly. These are pretty highly skilled professionals making over 6 figures. Again, thanks for all of the ideas. I will come up with something, I'm sure. By different locations do you mean across town or across the state/country? This is something that really should be handled face to face so you can gauge her reactions. Facial expressions and body language can say the opposite of what you hear over the phone and provide you with a true indicator of her attitude towards you and your position of authority over her. I can understand her frustration at someone asking for her help and then going to someone else before I can do anything. Its one of my pet peeves and a surefire way for me to not put a lot of effort into helping you down the road. Her reaction to this however, needs work and should definately be discussed. If its a recurring theme with the other co-worker, then it should also be addressed with them. Time spent "helping" someone who just goes on to do it themselves or seek an answer elsewhere before you can give them one, is time lost on another project. And I can definately relate to her need to follow a process. I like to get certain things done a certain way and correctly the first time around if at all possible. I hate rework and resent when others create it for me. BUT its also one of the reasons I make a point to learn what is involved in other's work. By understanding their side, I can more easily make adjustments on my side of things to prevent having to redo anything once I'm done. I do have one "supplier" though that is a stickler for her routine and while its great to know I can count on her always meeting my deadlines, her being unflexible with her schedule sometimes causes her to have come back with some unnecessary questions to clarify things she missed. That said, I think one of the issues your co-worker needs to address is that she is letting disruptions to her process frustrate her to much and she needs to start understanding what is involved in the processes of others that may cause these disruptions. Processes and routine are important but flexibility is just as important.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2013 7:25:45 GMT -5
Michelyn, it's across the country..so no way to have the discussion in person anytime soon.
I am going to speak to the other person re:asking multiple people for help as well, but I want this particular employee to work on her tone and delivery.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 24, 2013 7:31:36 GMT -5
It isn't going to be easy and she's going to be offended. You mean to help smooth her path and yours since the people she offends complain to you. But she isn't going to take it well. Or even remember to tone it down. These people have this behavior ingrained in them. I hope you can help her. People can and do lose their jobs over this. Companies want people to get along.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Sept 24, 2013 8:10:14 GMT -5
We have anew president of our women's group. So far she has managed to piss just about everyone off. She speaks disrespectfully and down to people. They don't like it. But they grumble about it and say nothing to her because they're afraid they will be accused of being anti-Semitic. I've been dying to say she isn't a bitch because she is Jewish, she's just a bitch, period. Religion has nothing to do with it other than making people afraid to say anything. Which is why she has gotten away with it probably for many years now. Wait, what? Jewish people are stereotypically bitchy? How did I miss this memo? She probably says "oy" a lot. Racist.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2013 9:58:44 GMT -5
There is that stereotype and it gets going again with someone who acts bitchy and demanding and rude. She's is all of these things but I think it's just her nature. Others are not so understanding so it's easier to fall back on a stereotype. I am probably the only evil person here that finds this HILARIOUS!!!!!
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PK Bucko
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Post by PK Bucko on Sept 24, 2013 10:03:18 GMT -5
The only way to deal with this is head on. Tell it to her straight and do not pull punches.
If she gets bitchy, so what. That's not your problem and you do not have to deal with it. Unprofessional conduct in the work place should not be tolerated.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 24, 2013 12:23:35 GMT -5
Trouble is that she may not see it as unprofessional but as getting the job done or maybe even acting like a man, like that's something to aspire to. This woman I have mentioned says she used to be a lawyer in another state. If that's the case, she may even be more of a ball buster type just trying to make it in what she may think was/is a mans world and that translates down to us peon women. Trouble is, we are just a social club not the board room and we don't need to be ruled with an iron fist. Nor do we like it. Turning it off may be very hard. She may see herself as being professional whereas others see her as a bitch. Is she being perceived as a bitch because she is a woman or because she really is a bitch? Would she be taken the same way if she were a man? Or would she be perceived as direct and authoritative?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2013 12:26:13 GMT -5
Does it matter? The higher ups want her attitude adjusted and that is what really matters.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 24, 2013 13:36:09 GMT -5
The OP is her boss. The offender is a valuable employee. I believe the OP is trying to keep the employee while smoothing out her manner.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 24, 2013 13:37:14 GMT -5
But is she really being bitchy or is she just perceived as bitchy because she's a woman and not a man?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Sept 24, 2013 14:46:23 GMT -5
Good. That is good news.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Sept 24, 2013 15:09:10 GMT -5
But is she really being bitchy or is she just perceived as bitchy because she's a woman and not a man? I have to be honest, I don't really 'get' that women are perceived as bitchy if they are assertive. Personally I deal with both on a daily basis and can tell the difference. Maybe it's just me, but I guess I don't see the double standard as much if at all anymore. I'm fully aware that it existed at some point, but with the proliferation of women in the workforce it's more or less boiled down to personality. I disagree, at least at the company I'm at now. Men and women can and do act very differently, with wildly different results here. It may vary by geography, company, industry?
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