Self-Help Couple Commits Suicide:

[Peace Of Mind]

For some reason this made me laugh.      Do as I say and not as I do?  Would you ever hire somebody to teach you how to be happy or to live your life?  And what if you hired people who did this?  What if their advice and teachings worked.  Would you then doubt your happiness? 

I hope nobody took their advice and if they did they stopped now that they've offed themselves. 

NY authorities: Self-help couple commits suicide:

"NEW YORK (AP) - On a radio show they hosted called "The Pursuit of Happiness," John Littig and Lynne Rosen urged listeners to embrace spontaneity.

"So much about life is about impulse," Littig said on a broadcast this year on an FM station in New York, WBAI. "It's about doing it right now."

A shocking decision the couple made together appeared more methodical: Police say they killed themselves side by side as part of a suicide pact.

Autopsies found that both Littig, 47, and Rosen, 45, died from asphyxiation after inhaling helium, a spokeswoman for medical examiner's office said Thursday.

The bodies were discovered Wednesday on a couch in the couple's brownstone in Brooklyn.

In separate suicide notes, Lettig indicated that they were determined to die together, while Rosen apologized to her family, police said. But beyond that, why two people who made a living giving advice on how to lead more fulfilling lives decided to cut short their own wasn't clear.

There was no immediate response to a message left."


link

[NancysSummerSip]

"So much about life is about impulse," Littig said on a broadcast this year on an FM station in New York, WBAI. "It's about doing it right now."

This.

But I'm guessing there's more to the story. Like maybe financial issues. Either they were broke, or they were stealing from others, and they did not want to be around when they were found out.

[Virgil Showlion]

Many of Sigmund Freud's close relatives (nieces, etc.) went on to pioneer "effective techniques" for parenting children in the 50's, 60's, and 70's. They were widely followed in psychological circles until their labours started bearing fruits.

You could look for a thousand years and never find another family tree with that many suicides.

[toomuchreality]

Talk about ironic, huh?

[Tennesseer]

A very bizarre story.  I read somewhere that the guy's suicide note stated the woman was in "great pain".  Curious minds want to know what "great pain".

[Cookies Galore]

My immediate assumption was a (terminal) illness.

[Tennesseer]

That's what I am thinking.  But why not help their listeners by talking about that too.  

[toomuchreality]

Jun 7, 2013 17:05:42 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

A very bizarre story.  I read somewhere that the guy's suicide note stated the woman was in "great pain".  Curious minds want to know what "great pain".

Agreed, it may have been helpful to either them, or others, to talk about it.

Sad that their lives weren't worth living, to them any more.

[Deleted]

Maybe listening to depressed people all day long makes you despondent?

[Shooby]

    I have never heard of someone committing suicide with helium?  I thought it was relatively safe.  So, maybe they had suicide type writings pondering death but is it really a suicide?  Just seems odd.

[Shooby]

Jun 7, 2013 17:05:42 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

A very bizarre story.  I read somewhere that the guy's suicide note stated the woman was in "great pain".  Curious minds want to know what "great pain".

Well, people can be in great emotional or spiritual pain or mental anguish.

[Deleted]

It makes a lot of sense to me.  Many people who go into the helping, self-help, or find your happiness type professions come from a troubled background themselves. 

In a 1993 study, James Guy, Ph.D., dean of the School of Psychology at Fuller Theological Seminary, compared the early childhood experiences of female psychotherapists to those of other professional women. The therapists reported higher rates of family dysfunction, parental alcoholism, sexual and physical abuse, and parental death or psychiatric hospitalization than did their professional counterparts. And a 1992 survey of male and female therapists found that more than two-thirds of the women and one-third of the men reported having experienced some form of sexual or physical abuse in early life. Freud seems to have been right about this one: The mental health professions attract people who have suffered.

www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200909/why-shrinks-have-problems

I feel very sorry for this couple and their families.  Their "product" was happiness and how to achieve it.  It may have been difficult for them to ask for help given what they did as a living. They must have felt like failures on many levels when they got to this point.

[Deleted]

I wonder if this couple thought their last act was one of happiness? Sad ending if that was their case. 

[Tennesseer]

Jun 8, 2013 12:55:40 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Jun 8, 2013 9:14:10 GMT -5 Shooby said:

    I have never heard of someone committing suicide with helium?  I thought it was relatively safe.  So, maybe they had suicide type writings pondering death but is it really a suicide?  Just seems odd.

Yeah, I thought all helium did was make you giggle.

Not directly related to the case but just about helium poisoning and suicide.  From a 2006 article:

On June 3, the bodies of two college students were found in a giant helium balloon in Florida. The week before, a 10-year-old in New Jersey collapsed at a birthday party after sucking helium from a balloon. Is helium really that dangerous?

It can be. Breathing in pure helium deprives the body of oxygen, as if you were holding your breath. If you couldn't breathe at all, you'd start to die in minutes—as soon as your body exhausted the supply of oxygen stored in the blood. But helium speeds up this process: When the gas fills your lungs, it creates a diffusion gradient that washes out the oxygen. In other words, each breath of helium you take sucks more oxygen out of your system. After inhaling helium, the body's oxygen level can plummet to a hazardous level in a matter of seconds.

More:  Stay Out of That Balloon! The dangers of helium inhalation.

[toomuchreality]

Jun 8, 2013 17:29:05 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jun 8, 2013 12:55:40 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Yeah, I thought all helium did was make you giggle.

Not directly related to the case but just about helium poisoning and suicide.  From a 2006 article:

On June 3, the bodies of two college students were found in a giant helium balloon in Florida. The week before, a 10-year-old in New Jersey collapsed at a birthday party after sucking helium from a balloon. Is helium really that dangerous?

It can be. Breathing in pure helium deprives the body of oxygen, as if you were holding your breath. If you couldn't breathe at all, you'd start to die in minutes—as soon as your body exhausted the supply of oxygen stored in the blood. But helium speeds up this process: When the gas fills your lungs, it creates a diffusion gradient that washes out the oxygen. In other words, each breath of helium you take sucks more oxygen out of your system. After inhaling helium, the body's oxygen level can plummet to a hazardous level in a matter of seconds.

More:  Stay Out of That Balloon! The dangers of helium inhalation.

Dang!  I was gonna go balloon bouncing tonight....   Way to ruin my plans 'T'!

Thanks a lot!

[Tennesseer]

Jun 8, 2013 18:22:45 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

Jun 8, 2013 17:29:05 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Not directly related to the case but just about helium poisoning and suicide.  From a 2006 article:


More:  Stay Out of That Balloon! The dangers of helium inhalation.

Dang!  I was gonna go balloon bouncing tonight....   Way to ruin my plans 'T'!

As long as they're giant soap bubbles you're okay.

Thanks a lot!

[toomuchreality]

Jun 8, 2013 18:26:34 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jun 8, 2013 18:22:45 GMT -5 toomuchreality said:

Dang!  I was gonna go balloon bouncing tonight....   Way to ruin my plans 'T'!

As long as they're giant soap bubbles you're okay.

Thanks a lot!

   Oh, my! It's a BIG one!

[toomuchreality]

heh. heh...

[Shooby]

Jun 8, 2013 17:29:05 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jun 8, 2013 12:55:40 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Yeah, I thought all helium did was make you giggle.

Not directly related to the case but just about helium poisoning and suicide.  From a 2006 article:

On June 3, the bodies of two college students were found in a giant helium balloon in Florida. The week before, a 10-year-old in New Jersey collapsed at a birthday party after sucking helium from a balloon. Is helium really that dangerous?

It can be. Breathing in pure helium deprives the body of oxygen, as if you were holding your breath. If you couldn't breathe at all, you'd start to die in minutes—as soon as your body exhausted the supply of oxygen stored in the blood. But helium speeds up this process: When the gas fills your lungs, it creates a diffusion gradient that washes out the oxygen. In other words, each breath of helium you take sucks more oxygen out of your system. After inhaling helium, the body's oxygen level can plummet to a hazardous level in a matter of seconds.

More:  Stay Out of That Balloon! The dangers of helium inhalation.

   Well, it isn't known to be a reliable method of suicide.  And, for most people breathing it 100% would pass out from oxygen deprivation and then drop the helium and begin to breathe again.  Unless they set up some elaborate mechanism to continue insufflating the helium, i think it would be very difficult to kill oneself in that manner.  That is why i am not so sure they should be so quick to rule it a suicide.

[Jaguar]

So what then, some strange sex game gone bad ? A large number of people have died from sex games gone awry.

This is the thing with high powered couples, when they get bored it's not enough to do what everyone else does.

[Shooby]

Yes.  I mean it just seems like a strange choice if for a method to successfully commit suicide.  I would wonder if that was indeed the case and that perhaps they are jumping to conclusions from finding them dead.  It didn't say that there was a suicide note with the body but it sounded like more general writings.  One could hold the other one down but it isn't all that easy to asphyxiate yourself through inhalents.  Yes, it can be done but for a more educated couple it just doesn't sound like it fits.  I dunno.  Anyone else of that same mind?

[Tennesseer]

Jun 8, 2013 19:42:49 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Jun 8, 2013 17:29:05 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Not directly related to the case but just about helium poisoning and suicide.  From a 2006 article:


More:  Stay Out of That Balloon! The dangers of helium inhalation.

   Well, it isn't known to be a reliable method of suicide.  And, for most people breathing it 100% would pass out from oxygen deprivation and then drop the helium and begin to breathe again.  Unless they set up some elaborate mechanism to continue insufflating the helium, i think it would be very difficult to kill oneself in that manner.  That is why i am not so sure they should be so quick to rule it a suicide.

POM's link states the two died from asphyxiation after inhaling helium.  What POM's link doesn't state is that the couple were found with plastic bags over their heads as this link does.  

Brooklyn Couple Who Hosted Self-Help Radio Show Commit Double Suicide Read more: www.businessinsider.com/lynne-rosen-and-john-littig-suicide-2013-6#ixzz2Vg3isLaj


What I didn't want to post are some links that I guess I have to since you seem to think it's not a reliable method of suicide.  From a 2010 medical article:

Abstract: Suicide by asphyxiation using helium is the most widely promoted
method of “self-deliverance” by right-to-die advocates. However, little is
known about persons committing such suicides or the circumstances and
manner in which they are completed. Prior reports of suicides by asphyxiation involving helium were reviewed and deaths determined by the North
Carolina Office of the Chief Medical Examiner to be helium-associated
asphyxial suicides occurring between January 1, 2000 and December 31,
2008 were included in a new case series examined in this article. The 10
asphyxial suicides involving helium identified in North Carolina tended to
occur almost exclusively in non-Hispanic, white men who were relatively
young (M age
41.1  11.6). In 6 of 10 cases, decedents suffered from
significant psychiatric dysfunction; in 3 of these 6 cases, psychiatric disorders were present comorbidly with substance abuse. In none these cases were
decedents suffering from terminal illness. Most persons committing suicide
with helium were free of terminal illness but suffered from psychiatric and/or
substance use disorders.
Key Words: asphyxia, helium, suicide, right-to-life
(Am J Forensic Med Pathol 2010;XX: 000–000)

Suicide By Asphyxiation Due to Helium Inhalation


And this:

The Suicide Project: The Peaceful Gass


And this:

The Vancouver Sun reported on 8 Dec 07 that the helium in an ‘exit bag’ is new choice for assisted suicide for patients who are dying or suffering from an end-stage incurable illness.

Criminologist Russel Ogden said that at least 19 people
in B.C. have committed suicide by using helium since 1999, according to
statistics compiled for him by the Coroner’s Service of B.C.

Ogden acknowledged that he has no way of knowing whether these people
committed suicide because they had a terminal or progressively
debilitating illness — or because they were mentally ill.

But the figures, Ogden said, reflect a trend in the underground
right-to-die community — which he calls the “death counterculture” –
toward asphyxiation with helium for people ravaged by incurable suffering.  

Ogden said the technique of asphyxiation by helium inhalation first
gained public exposure in the assisted-suicide community with the
release in 2002 of the third edition of ‘Final Exit,‘ the landmark book
written by Hemlock Society founder Derek Humphry, a primer on suicide
and assisted suicide.

Information about the helium option has since been disseminated through
the Internet, including YouTube, and various handbooks, he added.

The helium method basically involves a person placing an “exit bag” over
his head with the helium entering the bag through a tube.

Helium is seen as a swift, highly lethal and painless way to die without
involving physicians or drugs. Helium is also nearly undetectable in
toxicological probes, which is important for people assisting a suicide
because of the potential of criminal charges.

Helium hood method now the way for assisted suicide

There is plenty more on the Internet about helium and suicide.

ETA:  Google helium and "Exit bags" and look at the images.  I have no desire to post of picture of one of them here.

[Tennesseer]

Jun 8, 2013 19:57:18 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Yes.  I mean it just seems like a strange choice if for a method to successfully commit suicide.  I would wonder if that was indeed the case and that perhaps they are jumping to conclusions from finding them dead.  It didn't say that there was a suicide note with the body but it sounded like more general writings.  One could hold the other one down but it isn't all that easy to asphyxiate yourself through inhalents.  Yes, it can be done but for a more educated couple it just doesn't sound like it fits.  I dunno.  Anyone else of that same mind?

POM's opening post states suicide notes were found.  My aunt offed herself and left no suicide note.  Many don't leave suicide notes or notes that state "I am killing myself because..."

[Shooby]

Jun 8, 2013 20:33:07 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jun 8, 2013 19:57:18 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Yes.  I mean it just seems like a strange choice if for a method to successfully commit suicide.  I would wonder if that was indeed the case and that perhaps they are jumping to conclusions from finding them dead.  It didn't say that there was a suicide note with the body but it sounded like more general writings.  One could hold the other one down but it isn't all that easy to asphyxiate yourself through inhalents.  Yes, it can be done but for a more educated couple it just doesn't sound like it fits.  I dunno.  Anyone else of that same mind?

POM's opening post states suicide notes were found.  My aunt offed herself and left no suicide note.  Many don't leave suicide notes or notes that state "I am killing myself because..."

I know.  I understand that.  I am well acquainted with suicide.  Most people committing a suicide don't leave a note behind.   But, i am saying that they should consider that perhaps it is an accident as well.

[Tennesseer]

Jun 9, 2013 8:29:29 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Jun 8, 2013 20:33:07 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

POM's opening post states suicide notes were found.  My aunt offed herself and left no suicide note.  Many don't leave suicide notes or notes that state "I am killing myself because..."

I know.  I understand that.  I am well acquainted with suicide.  Most people committing a suicide don't leave a note behind.   But, i am saying that they should consider that perhaps it is an accident as well.

Seriously? An accident with exit bags over their heads?

[Tennesseer]

"They used what’s described on the FDNY web site as “exit bags” to kill themselves.

“They are said to provide a fast, peaceful, undetectable death to those wishing to commit suicide,” the site says."

www.nydailynews.com/new-york/brooklyn/brooklyn-couple-committed-suicide-co-hosted-radio-show-article-1.1363804

Will this convince Shooby they weren't just inhaling helium for fun and the Micky Muse voice?

"Autopsies found that John Littig, 47, and Lynne Rosen, 45, died from asphyxiation after inhaling helium, a spokeswoman for medical examiner's office said Thursday.

The bodies were discovered Wednesday in the couple's home, with so-called "exit bags" over their heads. The suicide method — using plastic bags with draw strings and a hose attached to helium canister — is becoming more common because of it provides "a fast, peaceful, undetectable death" compared with suffocation by carbon dioxide, according to a recent fire department memo prepared for paramedics. The method, however, is not foolproof.

In separate notes, Lettig indicated that they were determined to die together, while Rosen apologized to her family, police said."

news.yahoo.com/nyc-authorities-pursuit-happiness-radio-self-help-couple-210704695.html

[Shooby]

  I am not saying it wasn't a suicide.  But, that from the article i didn't really think there was enough info reported to say that absolutely.   I assume the authorities at the scene took note of everything.  I would have liked to see more info in reported in the story.

[Tennesseer]

Jun 9, 2013 10:07:51 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  I am not saying it wasn't a suicide.  But, that from the article i didn't really think there was enough info reported to say that absolutely.   I assume the authorities at the scene took note of everything.  I would have liked to see more info in reported in the story.

Google it like I did. You might learn something.

[Shooby]

Well, you don't have to be snarky.  I am just discussing it.  I read one of the articles online and it had limited info.  You seem to be intent to argue with me no matter what the topic.

[Tennesseer]

Jun 9, 2013 10:25:44 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Well, you don't have to be snarky.  I am just discussing it.  I read one of the articles online and it had limited info.  You seem to be intent to argue with me no matter what the topic.

Yea. I live to do that.