trevorw2539
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Post by trevorw2539 on Dec 29, 2012 11:36:14 GMT -5
Yes. And, i don't deny the biological and nature. I was not understanding how that correlates with evil? From what I can see the correlation could be that 'evil' is biologically present: because an extremely evil deed by an ancestor could be passed down through generations. As in four generations as spoken of in the Old Testament. Since I'm very bad at finding specifics in scripture, I'll rely on those who are better versed than i am to find the exact verse. I can paraphrase any scripture, but am unable to find them when I need to. I've read the Bible 4 times front to back. And, in my own pathetic way try to learn what things mean. Each time I find new things that bounce out at me. Exodus 20 verse 5 |
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Dec 29, 2012 11:37:50 GMT -5
Hi Roy! How have you been? Nice to see you again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 11:42:46 GMT -5
I separate the natural/biological from the moral/spiritual. In my understanding, animals act on instinct, in the natural and the question of morality is not relevant as animals are were not made in the "image of God" as i believe we were and thus possessed with the unique qualities and properties bestowed on us to ponder and/or engage in acts of both good or evil of our own choosing. You're certainly entitled to your opinion. Tell me where i am going wrong in your opinion welts. ;D |
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Dec 29, 2012 11:48:54 GMT -5
You're certainly entitled to your opinion. Tell me where i am going wrong in your opinion welts. ;D Please don't put words in my mouth. Your opinion is your opinion. It's not right or wrong. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 11:52:29 GMT -5
Tell me where i am going wrong in your opinion welts. ;D Please don't put words in my mouth. Your opinion is your opinion. It's not right or wrong. I am not welts i just wanted hear your opinion and take on it. I understand what you are saying. But, i have no issue or problem with someone thinking I am wrong one way or the other. But, i am not trying to say those are you words. |
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Dec 29, 2012 11:56:57 GMT -5
I am not welts i just wanted hear your opinion and take on it. I understand what you are saying. But, i have no issue or problem with someone thinking I am wrong one way or the other. But, i am not trying to say those are you words.
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You know my opinion. We've done this dance more than once. I'm an atheist, and I don't believe we were made in God's image. We're just a more evolved animal, with bigger brains.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 11:58:06 GMT -5
Agreed. I do know your opinions and you know mine. But, i am just developing the topic and trying to respond to explain my thinking.  And, you know that is a dance that can go on for pages and pages. ;D |
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trevorw2539
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Post by trevorw2539 on Dec 29, 2012 12:15:37 GMT -5
Yes. And, i don't deny the biological and nature. I was not understanding how that correlates with evil? From what I can see the correlation could be that 'evil' is biologically present: because an extremely evil deed by an ancestor could be passed down through generations. As in four generations as spoken of in the Old Testament. Since I'm very bad at finding specifics in scripture, I'll rely on those who are better versed than i am to find the exact verse. I can paraphrase any scripture, but am unable to find them when I need to. I've read the Bible 4 times front to back. And, in my own pathetic way try to learn what things mean. Each time I find new things that bounce out at me. May I offer my interpretation of the above in Exodus 20 v 5. Children are inclined to follow their fathers, particularly in the days of the Patriarchal society. The 'sinful' father, or idolatrous father will pass on his 'sins' to his children. Similar to today when sincere Christians try to pass on their faith to their children. But there is a way out of this. For the child to acknowledge 'God' and turn from his fathers ways. Leviticus 26 verses 39-40. Daniel 9. Isaiah 65 verse 7. Matthew 23 verses 29-32 is the ultimate example of this. Christ condemns the Rulers because down the ages God has sent prophets to prepare his way but their forefathers have persecuted and destroyed them. Now, in an effort to disassociate themselves from their fathers actions, they decorate and honour the prophets tombs. They say they would not have done it. But Jesus knows their hearts and what they are going to do to him. Their outward show. But their hearts were wrong. Had they accepted him they would have been forgiven. v37 The interesting phrase is 'Fill up then, the measure of the sin of your fathers'. Think of a glass. It had, down the ages, gradually been filled with the sins of their fathers. Now they were going to kill their Messiah and that glass would overflow'. Verse 37 was Christs wish for his people. To gather them. But they rejected him and their sins, and that of their fathers, separated them from God. |
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cranberry49
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'Sometimes the simple things are the prettiest'
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Post by cranberry49 on Dec 29, 2012 12:25:28 GMT -5
Ouick hello to Beags, Cran, Weltz, ISA, Shoobs, and any and everyone else I missed. Been gone, I'll stay outta this  Hey, sweetie! Missed ya!  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 12:26:22 GMT -5
Ouick hello to Beags, Cran, Weltz, ISA, Shoobs, and any and everyone else I missed. Been gone, I'll stay outta this Hey, sweetie! Missed ya!  |
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mrsdutt
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Post by mrsdutt on Dec 29, 2012 12:33:12 GMT -5
From what I can see the correlation could be that 'evil' is biologically present: because an extremely evil deed by an ancestor could be passed down through generations. As in four generations as spoken of in the Old Testament. Since I'm very bad at finding specifics in scripture, I'll rely on those who are better versed than i am to find the exact verse. I can paraphrase any scripture, but am unable to find them when I need to. I've read the Bible 4 times front to back. And, in my own pathetic way try to learn what things mean. Each time I find new things that bounce out at me. Exodus 20 verse 5 Thank you TREV |
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Virgil Showlion
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[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Dec 29, 2012 16:09:01 GMT -5
From what I can see the correlation could be that 'evil' is biologically present: because an extremely evil deed by an ancestor could be passed down through generations. As in four generations as spoken of in the Old Testament. Since I'm very bad at finding specifics in scripture, I'll rely on those who are better versed than i am to find the exact verse. I can paraphrase any scripture, but am unable to find them when I need to. I've read the Bible 4 times front to back. And, in my own pathetic way try to learn what things mean. Each time I find new things that bounce out at me. May I offer my interpretation of the above in Exodus 20 v 5. Children are inclined to follow their fathers, particularly in the days of the Patriarchal society. The 'sinful' father, or idolatrous father will pass on his 'sins' to his children. Similar to today when sincere Christians try to pass on their faith to their children. But there is a way out of this. For the child to acknowledge 'God' and turn from his fathers ways. Leviticus 26 verses 39-40. Daniel 9. Isaiah 65 verse 7. Matthew 23 verses 29-32 is the ultimate example of this. Christ condemns the Rulers because down the ages God has sent prophets to prepare his way but their forefathers have persecuted and destroyed them. Now, in an effort to disassociate themselves from their fathers actions, they decorate and honour the prophets tombs. They say they would not have done it. But Jesus knows their hearts and what they are going to do to him. Their outward show. But their hearts were wrong. Had they accepted him they would have been forgiven. v37 The interesting phrase is 'Fill up then, the measure of the sin of your fathers'. Think of a glass. It had, down the ages, gradually been filled with the sins of their fathers. Now they were going to kill their Messiah and that glass would overflow'. Verse 37 was Christs wish for his people. To gather them. But they rejected him and their sins, and that of their fathers, separated them from God. I think that's a very sound interpretation.   |
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trevorw2539
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Post by trevorw2539 on Dec 29, 2012 18:09:53 GMT -5
The Bible can only be 'understood' if you understand the language it was written in. I don't mean Hebrew. The Bible was written by scribes of nation who had the belief that God had chosen them as his people. They were therefore, to them, special to God. This inevitably leads to a thinking that puts them in a special place. This is evident throughout the Old Testament. They were superior. Whether you believe that or not, it colours the way the OT was written, and it has to be part of our thinking to understand them. On top of that it was written to Hebrews, for Hebrews, with language coloured by their culture, the time, land and civilisations they were living amongst. If we can understand some of the above we get some understanding of what the Bible is saying. It's rather like reading a science book. Until we have some understanding of the basics we will never know the rest. You can look at the OT as a History of the Jewish nation, and their understanding of God and his dealings with them. Or you can take it as the Inspired word of God. If you study it you cannot ignore its relationship to the nations around it, or the inter-reaction culturally and religiously between them. I could give instances but will leave it there. In the NT Jesus leans heavily on the OT in his teachings. We do not recognise this as much as the Jews would. Some of his parables are based on the OT writings. Paul leans on the OT, as does the writer to the Hebrews. To understand Hebrews properly you need to know the actions, rites and reasons for, the High priest on the Day of Atonement for instance. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 18:34:23 GMT -5
How did this turn into a religious thread? Might I suggest you move this to the religion section of the board or merge it with another religious thread?  |
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Dec 29, 2012 19:40:10 GMT -5
It is on the Religious Discussions sub-board, Apple. |
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Dec 29, 2012 19:46:27 GMT -5
It is on the Religious Discussions sub-board, Apple. *lol* ONE OF US. ONE OF US. |
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roygrip
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he he he heeeee!
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Post by roygrip on Dec 29, 2012 20:22:24 GMT -5
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 20:34:09 GMT -5
How did this turn into a religious thread? Might I suggest you move this to the religion section of the board or merge it with another religious thread?   |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 22:18:25 GMT -5
;D ;D ;D
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 22:19:00 GMT -5
It is on the Religious Discussions sub-board, Apple. *lol* ONE OF US. ONE OF US. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 23:02:37 GMT -5
To Be or Not to Be, that is the question! ;D
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Dec 29, 2012 23:03:51 GMT -5
To Be or Not to Be, that is the question! ;D ...that would need its own thread, though... right?  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 23:05:27 GMT -5
I dunno? Doesn't everything? Is there ANY topic we haven't yet beat into the ground?  |
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Dec 29, 2012 23:06:53 GMT -5
I dunno? Doesn't everything? Is there ANY topic we haven't yet beat into the ground? ...wearing holsters in public again... or a return of public hangings...  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 23:09:36 GMT -5
I dunno. Do you consider either of those "evil"? That is the question at hand! Sorry but the Steelers have been some kind of evil this year! Ugh! |
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Dec 29, 2012 23:11:22 GMT -5
...ugh... don't remind me...  |
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Dec 29, 2012 23:13:28 GMT -5
...oh, and no... holsters are not evil... but hangings are debatable... so that could make for a long thread on EE or P&tM...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 23:17:33 GMT -5
...ugh... don't remind me... I know! A totally USELESS game tomorrow!! Now THAT is EVIL!! |
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Dec 29, 2012 23:20:03 GMT -5
...lol... we'll be watching the NFC scramble for that last wildcard spot... we might turn the channel to peek in on the 2nd stringers getting a workout, though... and I'll ascribe no theological importance to the NFL games, whatsoever... |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2012 23:21:22 GMT -5
Well, of course not! But i must admit, that sometimes when i watch Polumalu play it IS a religious experience!
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