zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:16:36 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:16:36 GMT -5
Then they go on to commit other crimes.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:20:46 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:20:46 GMT -5
Wait a sec. This entire thread has been about the ability of PRIVATE CITIZENS/storeowners to shoot whomever they view as looting. I have zero problem with law enforcement enforcing the laws. That is their role. It is not yours or mine. cops can't shoot looters.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:29:29 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:29:29 GMT -5
Really? Then what good are they? Writing tickets? I'd be pissed if some cop stood there while I was being robbed and did nothing.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:29:53 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:29:53 GMT -5
No wonder people arm themselves.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:30:54 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:30:54 GMT -5
Really? Then what good are they? Writing tickets? I'd be pissed if some cop stood there while I was being robbed and did nothing. they can arrest them, but cops can't shoot people committing property crimes.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:41:02 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:41:02 GMT -5
Too bad. Well, I can so I guess I'm the lucky one. It isn't the tv, it's the idea that someone thinks they can commit crimes with no repercussions. Considering that more people are arming themselves, this will hopefully deter some criminals. After all, you only have to rob the wrong person one time to pay the penalty.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:42:08 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:42:08 GMT -5
and a person who shoot someone who has no right to do so is also going to pay a penalty.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:44:26 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:44:26 GMT -5
Not in my state. You're on my property without permission, you can be in trouble, big time.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:45:26 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:45:26 GMT -5
I would, of course, be dialing 911 while I was warning you to leave immediately. Unless I felt threatened.
|
|
tskeeter
Junior Associate
Joined: Mar 20, 2011 19:37:45 GMT -5
Posts: 6,831
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:46:17 GMT -5
Post by tskeeter on Oct 31, 2012 11:46:17 GMT -5
I shook my head in dismay when I read about residents of South Central LA complaining about lack of grocery stores and other merchants in their neighborhood about a year after the Rodney Kings riots. Apparently they didn't connect the fact that they and their neighbors had looted the businesses of local merchants with the merchants decision to quit providing goods and services in South Central. Many of the merchants were recent immigrants who did not have insurance. The looting destroyed the finances and dreams of many immigrant families.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:46:17 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:46:17 GMT -5
Not in my state. You're on my property without permission, you can be in trouble, big time. I'm pretty sure that's now how stand your ground works.........
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:47:10 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:47:10 GMT -5
I would, of course, be dialing 911 while I was warning you to leave immediately. Unless I felt threatened. that's a little different than just putting a cap in someone for just being on your property. let's keep the facts consistent. and you still can't shoot anyone for taking your stuff.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:47:45 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:47:45 GMT -5
I won't shoot anyone just for the fun of it but I wouldn't have gotten a weapon, taken classes, gotten a permit, if I didn't intend to use it if necessary.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:48:24 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:48:24 GMT -5
I won't shoot anyone just for the fun of it but I wouldn't have gotten a weapon, taken classes, gotten a permit, if I didn't intend to use it if necessary. necessary doens't include someone just coming on your property,. or taking your tv.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:49:20 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:49:20 GMT -5
Uh, yeah, I can shoot someone for taking my stuff. What or who is to say they weren't threatening me? Breaking in my house is a huge no-no. Not worth your life so hopefully no one will try.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:50:21 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:50:21 GMT -5
Uh, yeah, I can shoot someone for taking my stuff. What or who is to say they weren't threatening me? Breaking in my house is a huge no-no. Not worth your life so hopefully no one will try. you do that and let me know how it turns out for you.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:50:48 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:50:48 GMT -5
Not in my state. You're on my property without permission, you can be in trouble, big time. Just make sure that after you shoot them, and before you call the cops, that you drag them off of your front step and into your house. I understand that a shot gun full of rock salt works wonders as a deterrent. never mind that blood trail, officer............
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:52:30 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:52:30 GMT -5
Thank GOD for my state. I'd hate to live in one that didn't have the laws that they do.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,326
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:54:14 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Oct 31, 2012 11:54:14 GMT -5
yup, and the investigation will never show that a certain area was just cleaned............
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:55:04 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 11:55:04 GMT -5
Listen, if they are outside, so be it, but if they come on my property or inside, they're leaving in a body bag. Pick someone who is touchy feely to commit crimes against.
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 11:55:23 GMT -5
Post by milee on Oct 31, 2012 11:55:23 GMT -5
Uh, yeah, I can shoot someone for taking my stuff. What or who is to say they weren't threatening me? Breaking in my house is a huge no-no. Not worth your life so hopefully no one will try. Well, from reading the first page and OP's subsequent posts, the situation described is of a looter carrying a TV from a business. So that's what scenario I've been responding to. Shades of grey, but here are the variations for me: Looter stealing TV from my business - sucks, but I wouldn't shoot at him/her. Looter stealing TV from my house - sucks, but if he's big enough to carry that monster by himself, he's got his hands full and isn't threatening me or my family, so I'd let him continue to flee. Assuming he's already got the TV and is running away. Looter breaking into house to ____? - no way to know if he wants the TV or me. Shoot him. Some of us may not be as far apart as initially thought on this issue, we may be simply addressing different scenarios.
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:03:56 GMT -5
Post by milee on Oct 31, 2012 12:03:56 GMT -5
Thank GOD for my state. I'd hate to live in one that didn't have the laws that they do. Not sure which state your referring to, but if it's Florida, we have very different understanding of what the law allows. Florida law does not allow you to shoot someone to get your TV back or to stop looting. And yes, if someone breaks into your house while you're there, then there's no real way to know why they're breaking in and shooting them would probably be covered under the stand your ground law, but the OP isn't really talking about unknown home invasion - it's specifically addressing looters. So if you assume that you know this person is a looter not a home invader (because they're already carrying the TV), it would be tough to argue that you'd be covered shooting them under Florida law.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 3, 2024 11:15:18 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:12:50 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2012 12:12:50 GMT -5
When I was 20 I worked with a woman who lived out in the country with her first husband. She said he used to beat her but no one could hear her screams. It was after I heard that story that I decided that I would rather live in the 'burbs.
Your story makes me feel the same way LW -- I'd rather live in a place where the cops DO know what Luminol is.
|
|
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:30:33 GMT -5
Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Oct 31, 2012 12:30:33 GMT -5
I won't shoot anyone just for the fun of it but I wouldn't have gotten a weapon, taken classes, gotten a permit, if I didn't intend to use it if necessary. necessary doens't include someone just coming on your property,. or taking your tv. How about your generator?
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:36:29 GMT -5
Post by milee on Oct 31, 2012 12:36:29 GMT -5
necessary doens't include someone just coming on your property,. or taking your tv. How about your generator? Don't know how that would be viewed under Florida law. We are pretty fond of our generators down here, so you could get a favorable jury on that one. Guess in the situation you described, your best bet would be to shoot the guy while he was in your driveway still coming towards the garage. Then it would be a matter of if people believed you were defending your own life vs. just protecting a piece of electronics. Once he had the generator and was fleeing, shooting him in the back would be a tough one to justify under even FL law, IMHO.
|
|
hoops902
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 13:21:29 GMT -5
Posts: 11,978
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:39:35 GMT -5
Post by hoops902 on Oct 31, 2012 12:39:35 GMT -5
::Guess in the situation you described, your best bet would be to shoot the guy while he was in your driveway still coming towards the garage.::
Under Florida law are you allowed to shoot people for walking up your driveway? That seems like a pretty liberal interpretation of "defending your own life", and I'm all for shooting people!
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:41:23 GMT -5
Post by milee on Oct 31, 2012 12:41:23 GMT -5
::Guess in the situation you described, your best bet would be to shoot the guy while he was in your driveway still coming towards the garage.:: Under Florida law are you allowed to shoot people for walking up your driveway? That seems like a pretty liberal interpretation of "defending your own life", and I'm all for shooting people! No, you're not allowed to shoot them for just walking up the driveway... I'm assuming there would be the standard amount of dramatizing here so the story would be "I was afraid for my life!!! He was coming to kill me!" You know, like the mean coworker.
|
|
hoops902
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 13:21:29 GMT -5
Posts: 11,978
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:46:46 GMT -5
Post by hoops902 on Oct 31, 2012 12:46:46 GMT -5
::Guess in the situation you described, your best bet would be to shoot the guy while he was in your driveway still coming towards the garage.:: Under Florida law are you allowed to shoot people for walking up your driveway? That seems like a pretty liberal interpretation of "defending your own life", and I'm all for shooting people! No, you're not allowed to shoot them for just walking up the driveway... I'm assuming there would be the standard amount of dramatizing here so the story would be "I was afraid for my life!!! He was coming to kill me!" You know, like the mean coworker. Right, I guess I was more focused on the driveway part. I assumed you'd have to dramatize it more than just a random walking up the driveway. Even if a crazy person who wants to kill you is walking up your driveway, are you allowed to shoot them in Florida. It's not like they're in your home, and we're not necessarily presuming they have a weapon. In terms of looters, seems a little premature to shoot someone walking up your driveway after a disaster because you think they might be thinking about stealing your generator. I understand the reasons for doing it then as opposed to after they've got it and shooting them in the back, but unless you're a psychic how do you know they're coming after the generator. It's completely possible it's just some fly-by-night contractor trying to get you to agree to let him fix your roof or cut down your trees. Hmmm contractor? Maybe it should be ok to shoot people coming up your driveway.
|
|
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:57:09 GMT -5
Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Oct 31, 2012 12:57:09 GMT -5
but unless you're a psychic how do you know they're coming after the generator. It's completely possible it's just some fly-by-night contractor trying to get you to agree to let him fix your roof or cut down your trees.
Then they'd be coming up the front sidewalk to speak to you at your front door, not the driveway to the garage (in this case, the driveway leads to the garage that's behind the house).
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,866
|
Looting
Oct 31, 2012 12:59:25 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Oct 31, 2012 12:59:25 GMT -5
Someone did get shot being in someone's driveway. I'd warn them to leave, they'd probably take a look at me and start laughing but I'd have the last laugh.
|
|