Atlas Shrugged Part II

[Deleted]

Who saw Part I and who is going to see Part II? What are your thoughts on the book?

[Deleted]

Oct 12, 2012 22:18:34 GMT -5 @shooby said:

Who saw Part I and who is going to see Part II? What are your thoughts on the book?

shooby,

I saw, part 1. That was pretty good. I will see part two.

I try to read the book but it was too long for me to finishes..
But , I understood the message of the book.

And, I was so surprised, main character of the book was so much like me. only difference was I have a such a big old stupid heart.

[kgb18]

I won't see the movies. I read the book. I thought it was a great story. It took a long time to pick up, but once it did, it was intriguing. It was good food for thought, but I completely disagree with Ayn Rand's politics and how she lived her life.

[Deleted]

Terrific story. Will always be one of my favorite fairy tales...

[Deleted]

Didn't see the movies, maybe when they are all out?

[Deleted]

Oct 18, 2012 20:24:22 GMT -5 oped said:

Didn't see the movies, maybe when they are all out?

oped,

I saw through Netflix. It was worth watching for me. Even if your view is little different than mine.

I think, a lot of her thinking is came from her childhood experiences.

[Deleted]

Honestly, i am not a huge fan of Ayn Rand. I think she makes some great points regarding govt and striving on one's own abilities and so forth. But, i think she misses the boat on a lot of issues such as humanity and our obligations to one another and our own moral failings and strivings. There is a balance that needs to happen on both sides of that. I don't think she found it. I think she worships the dollar and success to the exclusion of the simple, quiet and uncelebrated success of everyday human beings from your teacher to your mom to the coach or friend or whomever helped you along the way in life.

[Deleted]

I saw the 1st one. I thought it was ok.
I enjoyed the book when I read it years ago but remember skipping a lot of the wordy philosophical stuff.

[Deleted]

Oct 21, 2012 17:56:19 GMT -5 @shooby said:

Honestly, i am not a huge fan of Ayn Rand. I think she makes some great points regarding govt and striving on one's own abilities and so forth. But, i think she misses the boat on a lot of issues such as humanity and our obligations to one another and our own moral failings and strivings. There is a balance that needs to happen on both sides of that. I don't think she found it. I think she worships the dollar and success to the exclusion of the simple, quiet and uncelebrated success of everyday human beings from your teacher to your mom to the coach or friend or whomever helped you along the way in life.

shooby,

If the one does not have those support system that you are talking about. And Order to survive in young ages and came from "Russian born Jew" in those time in Germany. I can easily sympathize with her and understood where she was coming from..
That does not mean, I agree with her hundred percent of her thinking.

I have had similar experience when I left my home country. Might be, degree of ones experience is different. I understood very well, where, she was coming from.....

Only thing stands between her and my thinking was compassion to others. She never learn to have empathy of other human being and was too stubborn to yield way of her thinking or her belief was too strong and I have noway of knowing it.

I really don't think, there is nothing wrong with her basic message. This country is found of capitalism.

I would never judge her one way or other. But one has to protect one self to able to help others or even your love ones....

And I think she was brilliant and way a head her time.

If there is no, you. And there is no, others. Self preservation is human inciting.

[Deleted]

There are portions of the book that are absolutely brilliant. And, pages upon pages of philosophy and deep insight. And, i am all for capitalism. in fact, it is the best system on earth in my opinion. But capitalism that is not backed up by moral JudeoChristian principles or other such moral underpinnings is as corrupt as any other system. There certainly needs to be reward for the fruit of one's labor. And, i absolutely believe in private property ownership and using one's skills, talents, and intellect . However, i do think that there is a balance there between using one's God given talentsm, recognizing those talents and also using them for the betterment of oneself, one's family and also thinking of one's fellow man. i find her characters very cold and selfish.

[Deleted]

I personally don't believe in the need for JudeoChristian tenets. However, there is a need for morality/ethics/social contracts. The thing is that Rand actually thinks so as well. All of her characters are moral creatures who understand implicitly that self preservation INCLUDES a component greater than self... that it requires being fair and honest and ethical.

The fairy tale is in believing that, given a choice, all people will behave in this manner. That we will have no child labor, unsafe working conditions, payment in scrip, Bernie Madoff, etc. etc. etc. down the line. Laissez faire capitalism is just as unrealistic/unattainable/unsustainable as communism...

There are many other examples of her lack of realism in her characters actions as well... but then, even Ayn couldn't live up to her own ideals.

I wanted to be Dagney Taggart as a teenager.... then I grew up and realized, without the government, we never would have had a railroad in this country...

[Deleted]

After all that, my prior comment of Ayn Rand. My love for others come before any reasoning.
What do you make of me.... And I also believes in one's freedom to choose their own religion.

[Deleted]

I said "Judeochristian principles or OTHER such moral underpinnings". I didn't exclude other moral systems or religions. But, my point is capitalism can be corrupted as well.
As for Dagney, i found her a pretty cold fish. She seemed pretty stuck on herself not in a confident way but of arrogance and dismissal of other people.

[Deleted]

Oct 22, 2012 5:59:53 GMT -5 @shooby said:

I said "Judeochristian principles or OTHER such moral underpinnings". I didn't exclude other moral systems or religions. But, my point is capitalism can be corrupted as well.
As for Dagney, i found her a pretty cold fish. She seemed pretty stuck on herself not in a confident way but of arrogance and dismissal of other people.

So, what. That is ones fantasy. Each's own.And I don't like her way of thinking , either.
Everyone has freedom to choose their own path in life. whatever fits in their own circumstances.
As long as you don't hurt no one in the process.

That is my philosophy in life.

[Deleted]

You are right shoob, you did say or.

As far as Dagney being a cold fish, well, Dagney is, like all of Atlas Shrugged, merely a construct to give living form to Rand's ideas of objectivism, etc. Dagney must ultimately appear cold, because Rand bases her framework on logic, devoid of human emotion and entanglements which lead people to make decisions at odds with the ideal.

This leads to other examples of unrealistic choices/situations I was referring to earlier. First, sorry, but in reality, most women choose Francisco D'Anconia over John Galt. Or at least Hank Reardon. John Galt is the pure intellectual embodyment of the ideal... but in the end we don't just want the 50 page monologue, we want the passion and power. And even if a few might choose Galt... people are not devoid enough of emotion to then sit on a planning committee that consists of three men and the women that was the love of all of their lives who is now with the third pick.... let alone choose to spend free time together and be each others best friends. It is just not realistic. You would have to be all logic and no emotion to pull it off.

To be fair, Rand herself tried. For years she had a longstanding affair with both her husband's and her lover's wife's consent... because everyone tried to live by the convictions of logic and objectivism which considered it to be not just acceptable but natural. Ultimately, however, it did not work out that way. We are not purely logical beings. Perhaps on Vulcan she would have pulled it off.

I actually should re-read Atlas Shrugged, haven't read it in years. I remember what i felt about the characters in my youth, and as i became disillusioned to the fantasy... but I wonder how i'd view them now?

[zibazinski]

The govt is the reason we have railroads? Silly me, I thought it was bad capitalists!

[Deleted]

Actually, WHY don't we have more railroads? Seems the logical way to transport stuff and then have local truckers pick up goods and deliver rather than long distance trucking? Seems like it would be a great investment but maybe not.

[biglin]

Ayn Rand
planned
to write a book
that would hook
people into believing
through her deceiving
propaganda
to make them wander
from the path of righteousness
into the path of selfishness!

[Deleted]

biglin,

"into the path of selfishness!"

We are all selfish creature as humans. And we need others to feed our ego...... And not a thing wrong with that concept.

As long as we don't hurt others on the process....