Working more hours not the same as doing more work

[Deleted]

I was told today by another department manager that I am not working as hard as him since it seems I am always able to get out of work on time while he usually work 10-12 hours shift. I just smiled and said have a good night.

Our jobs are somewhat similar and each department is about the same size personnel wise. When I just got promoted I was also easily working 10-15 hours shift (many time went as far as 18 hrs shift) trying to get everything under control and it took me 6 months to get to a point where I can just work 8-9 hours and go home.

But in the past 6 months I did the following:
-> Instead of filling all my paper work on actual paper and using a calculator (like my predecessor and other manager is doing), I put everything on excel. It takes him 6-8 hours a week to do that paperwork while it takes me max 2 and that is because I am currently doing some of it with my assistant and going at it slow so he can keep up.

-> Like I said above I am training my assistant to be able to do the paperwork in case I am on vacation or something and he nows can do 75% of the paperwork, I review it from time to time to make sure it's correct (I am actually trying to see if I can help him get promoted to run his own department because he is capable of it)

-> The remaining 25% I am not sure I can show him yet since it has confidential information (ex how much everyone in the department is making for scheduling and budget purposes) and waiting on a response from HR.

-> Delegate and make sure to follow thru later on.

-> I refuse to postpone for tomorrow what should have been done yesterday and today.

-> I may leave early but when I get some down time at home I am checking my e-mails, checking on reports, etc.

A couple of weeks ago he was on vacation and his assistant did not know how to file out the paperwork and I showed her how to do it quicker on excel that could save them time.

When he came back she was eager to show him and his answer to her was: When you have your own department you can do it this way, but now that I am back we are going back to paper.

But to the other department managers I am just lucky to be able to to leave work so early or I am not working as hard/many hours as them.

On another side I feel they do it on purpose. As department managers we are expected to work 45 hours (but get paid for 40) but when you go over 45 you get paid over time... and I feel alot of them are working those 50-60 hours a week when its not necessary just for the OT.

I might have smiled leaving work but it really pissed me off

[MN-Investor]

I had a boss who used to tick off his fellow workers when he was an auditor at a CPA firm because he would also work efficiently and go home on time. BTW, he was the most brilliant man I ever met, had a photographic memory.

If you're working efficiently, great for you! As for that other manager who won't make use of Excel, it's probably because he doesn't feel comfortable with it, and he certainly doesn't want his admin showing him up. Shame on him! Maybe when your admin applies for a different job, you can hire the admin of the manager who doesn't appreciate her. You sound like a good mentor.

[Deleted]

Jan 29, 2011 10:03:03 GMT -5 MN-Investor said:

As for that other manager who won't make use of Excel, it's probably because he doesn't feel comfortable with it, and he certainly doesn't want his admin showing him up. Shame on him! Maybe when your admin applies for a different job, you can hire the admin of the manager who doesn't appreciate her. You sound like a good mentor.

Thanks and yes I would definitely consider it if my assistant get promoted. I am working hard with him so that when a opening opens up he is definitely able to get it.

I mean the guy is one of the best workers I've ever had on my team during my 2 years with this company and I mean. I will give him a reference any day of the week.

[MN-Investor]

I had two fantastic mentors when I was working. Both of those individuals were widely respected within the company too. I think those qualities go hand-in-hand.

[stantonjane]

I agree, it's not how 'hard' you work, it's how 'smart' you work. I remember the days when the best and brightest secretaries were the ones who could operate the 10-key machine and the typewriter the fastest. Now with programs like Excel which are a one-time entering and auto-summing, it saves hours and is more accurate. Instead of retyping manuals and documents, we now run it through the scanning function on the copier machine, which pdf's it and converts to Word. A little reformatting, and a job which would have taken days 10 years ago is done in about an hour's time. Why would one not take advantage of this?

[dcmetrocrab]

I would be careful not to flaunt your knowledge and remain humble in this situation. It sounds like you're surrounded by people who do not want change nor do they want their overtime taken away. Unless they are specifically looking for ways to increase efficiency, do not offer advice and especially do not make your superiors feel stupid. If the yardstick for performance at your workplace is to pull long hours, it would bode well for you to do the same, especially since you had another manager "warn" you of it.

My SO pulled something similar, only the people he pissed off were under him and upper management was happy with the resulting efficiency. SO automated away some manual aspects of the job, but his team wanted to do it the old fashioned way for the extra overtime pay. They were NOT happy.

In the office place, if a process is mysteriously inefficient, the root cause is usually political. Tread lightly.

[Deleted]

Jan 29, 2011 6:40:00 GMT -5 Lady Gaga Gaga Snerd said:

It used to be that if you couldn't complete your work in a day without staying late that you were "inefficient" or slacking off. Now, it is the badge of honor and sacrifice to "prove" your dedication to stay there for hours and hours, to call into the office, to come and work on the weekends or whatever. Work is part of life but shouldn't be life itself.

I must exalt you for that. I have a specific coworker that believes this. I have often said that I feel if I can't get my job done in normal work hours I am doing something wrong.

[MN-Investor]

I would worry less about what your peers have to think about you than what your own manager thinks. Does he look at time spent, or does he look at the job performed? Is he encouraging you? Is this a company that you want to advance in?

You sound like you want to do your job as efficiently as possible. If that is not appreciated within your company, you would do well to start looking outside the company for other opportunities where you can grow. There is nothing more frustrating than having to just get along to get a job done, rather than grow and improve your job so that the whole company improves. And it's fun to have a job evolve, where you can hand off to subordinates the mundane tasks while you take on the tasks which both challenge you and show upper management your capabilities.

[dragonfly7]

"I would be careful not to flaunt your knowledge and remain humble in this situation."

Ditto, as well as most of what the previous three posters have said. DH and I have repeatedly learned that being the most knowledgeable, or even being efficient, hard-working, or ethical, is seldom positively rewarded even if it is the just thing to do or be.

[TD2K]

I have often said that I feel if I can't get my job done in normal work hours I am doing something wrong.


Yes and no. One can have to work a lot of hours because you aren't efficient but you can also work in a place that simply adds more and more work onto you.

[dcmetrocrab]

"I have often said that I feel if I can't get my job done in normal work hours I am doing something wrong."

"Yes and no. One can have to work a lot of hours because you aren't efficient but you can also work in a place that simply adds more and more work onto you."

And this is why some people end up in a no win situation if the powers that be and their influencers are not on the same page with expectations. The people who work long hours shake their heads at the 40hr/weekers and vice versa. Know your organization, your manager, and their influencers, shift your style accordingly, forget everyone else. For the position I am looking to hire, I asked HR to screen out people not used to working "start up" hours aka pull all nighters if that's what it takes to get the job done. Everyone up to the CEO at my company expects the office to routinely be bustling after hours and over the weekend.

[Deleted]

Jan 30, 2011 18:29:12 GMT -5 TD2K said:

I have often said that I feel if I can't get my job done in normal work hours I am doing something wrong.


Yes and no. One can have to work a lot of hours because you aren't efficient but you can also work in a place that simply adds more and more work onto you.

That could be true for others but it has never been the case where I work. The powers that be are interested in the job being done. It is just some of the coworkers that think lots of overtime proves something. When you waste 2 hours of my time during the day complaining about how busy you are, staying after work doesn't impress me even a bit.

[alabamagal]

In the long run, things will usually work out if you can work "better" than others and get your job done faster. I have had this happen in the past, where those who worked longer were thought to be harder workers. I had this told directly to me by a manager once. But eventually the person who worked longer hours was found out to just take longer to do things. The key to this is "eventually", just hang in there and point out that you are doing all your work and are dedicated to getting in done, and it will usually work out in the long run.

[Urban Chicago]

It seems like you are in HR, so you should be able to figure out how much the overtime is costing the company. Armed with this info, I wouldn't be too shy about pointing out inefficiencies.

However, I would avoid saying anything that smacks of "we could do this job without you here at all" or "we only need 75% of the staff we currently have" or whatever, if only to protect your karma.

[startsmart]

December 2009 I had a conversation with my manager about my position. Told I was "too efficient" and didn't make mistakes my predecessors did,I had my hours (and pay) cut by 20%. that was how one company 'rewarded' efficiency.

So I used my day off every week to learn how to freelance, work leads and in August had enough business 'on the side' to put in my notice. Because I work for more clients at a higher rate, I now make four times what I did for the manager who punished efficiency.

Sometimes it works to do the work smarter and go home early. Sometimes you'll lose a huge chunk of pay. Depends on the company and the position.