I hate tax season, but for a different reason....

[KaraBoo]

Well, actually, I don't have an issue with it, but DH's ex does. When DH and her first split, he would claim the kids on his return and then give her half of the money - but that was because she didn't work the last 2 years they were together. Once she started working, she refused to let him claim any of the kids from that point forward. This issue is not spelled out in the divorce decree nor in our custody papers - and currently not worth going back to court for.

Their 3 kids live with us full time (my 1 make 4 kids total). Ex asked DH recently if she could claim one of the kids on her return to help her out some since she's STILL unemployed. She has another child living with her, so she wants to up her claim to 2. She hasn't worked or collected any money since March of 2010. Honestly, I don't know how much more money she thinks she's going to get extra with only working 3 months at a dollar store job.

One of many problem with this is she owes DH back CS. She only owes $150 per month on 3 kids, but is behind somewhere between $1300-$1800 dollars (I quite keeping track, that's what the CS agency is there for). Last year, her entire refund check was seized and sent to DH for back arrears and that was around $2200.

When DH pointed out to her that any refund money would just go back to him, her response was, "I was hoping to get enough back to pay CS off and still have some money left over."

So, she wants to use our tax benefit to pay us back? Rrrriiiggghhttt......

I'm sure there's another reason she wants to do this (like showing someone that she's claiming 2 kids on taxes to get more in benefits somewhere else - like housing or food stamps for example). GGGRRRHHH!!!!!

Feel free to flame away - I'm a stepmom - nothing you could say would make me more evil.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

A deadbeat mom? Oh the inhumanity.... one would be surprised how many men have residential custody of their children, and how many women are compelled to provide support for the children and are behind or in jail.

[vonnie6200]

Is she getting food stamps or other public assistance? If so, showing 2 dependents vs 1 might up her assistance benefits

[alabamagal]

I don't understand, if she doesn't have any income, what good does it do to claim the kids on her taxes, since she won't have any taxes to offset.

If you can't agree, just claim the child. The rules would indicate that you guys are eligible, both in residency and in income.

"If two or more taxpayers claim a dependent as a qualifying child in the same year, the IRS will use the following tie-breaker tests to determine which taxpayer is eligible to claim the dependent. The tie-breaker tests are listed in order of priority.
The child will be the qualifying child of:

•the parent,
•the parent with whom the child lived for the longest time during the year,
•if the time was equal, the parent with the highest adjusted gross income,
•if no taxpayer is the child's parent, the taxpayer with the highest adjusted gross income."

[lynnerself]

If she made enough in those 3 months working, she may qualify for the EITC and a refund. And it would be significantly more with 2 dependants than with one.

[KaraBoo]

Jan 28, 2011 15:19:56 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

I don't understand, if she doesn't have any income, what good does it do to claim the kids on her taxes, since she won't have any taxes to offset.

This is what I thought at first as well. I think she's grasping for straws - anything - to get some money from somewhere.

There is no question DH/we will claim the kids on our income. It was just surprising to me that she thought claiming one of them on her return would bring a greater return to her when the state seized what she did get last year (when she had worked the entire year).

[KaraBoo]

Jan 28, 2011 15:25:36 GMT -5 lynnerself said:

If she made enough in those 3 months working, she may qualify for the EITC and a refund. And it would be significantly more with 2 dependants than with one.

I don't know how much she was making, but she was telling us in the months before she was fired/laid off/quit (we're not sure as she's never given the same response twice when it's brought up) that she needed to find a new job as they were cutting her down to less than 20 hours per week.

She's also not been receiving UE benefits this entire time either as she didn't know if she qualified for them. When asked why she didn't apply, she stated her mom was too busy to help her (her mom lives several states away!).

[Deleted]

Jan 28, 2011 15:27:01 GMT -5 KaraBoo said:

Jan 28, 2011 15:19:56 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

I don't understand, if she doesn't have any income, what good does it do to claim the kids on her taxes, since she won't have any taxes to offset.

This is what I thought at first as well. I think she's grasping for straws - anything - to get some money from somewhere.

There is no question DH/we will claim the kids on our income. It was just surprising to me that she thought claiming one of them on her return would bring a greater return to her when the state seized what she did get last year (when she had worked the entire year).

Because with working less she will probably will get more.

A cousin that only worked part of the year and made 18K got about 4K back while my aunt that made 45K only got 2K back since she did not qualify for the EIC (have to make below 40K to qualify for it).

And that does not include the state refund...

Modify to add:

And I bet that with 2 kids (dependents + EIC) my cousin could have easily boost her refund from 4K into 6K.
So maybe that is what your husband ex wife is going for.

[❤ mollymouser ❤]

Is your DH going to let her claim one of the children, or is he going to tell her, "I already filed and claimed all 3 since they live with me and I'm supporting them?"

[KaraBoo]

Well....I'm going to be generous and give these numbers to what I think she was actually working at that time:

$10 per hour, 40 hours a week, for 16 weeks (4 months) = $6400.00 before taxes.

What kind of return would that give her assuming she claimed 0 withholding during the year?

I'm almost 99.99% positive that she did not work enough or get paid enough to pull down even that much last year to claim.

[The J]

I hate tax season because of all the people handing out liberty tax flyers on the sidewalk. Apparently it's "rude" to point and laugh.

[KaraBoo]

Molly - DH has said he doesn't intend to let her claim any of them (although one year, she claimed one of them anyway and we had to file our claim manually and send in our court papers for proof). We got a nasty letter from the IRS that year for our troubles. If she gets her tax documents before we do (which always seems to happen), H&R Block isn't going to ask her to prove the kids live with her.

Chef - same as above - she's claimed them before without any immediate consequences. I'm pretty sure that if she continues to try to claim them and is found to be committing fraud (by gaining more in services than allowed), she'll have to explain that and possibly pay restitution.

[DVM gone riding]

If no one said it already child is a "credit" so you get money for having kids even if you don't pay taxes-hence the IRS wants to give the money to the one that DID pay taxes bec then they are giving you a refund vs paying money you didn't put in. Makes sense to me. I would just file first and tell her tough luck!!

[Deleted]

Jan 28, 2011 16:19:42 GMT -5 DVM gone riding said:

I would just file first and tell her tough luck!!

the op answered that already... it seems she always get her w2 and other papers before the OP.

[dividend]

Jan 28, 2011 16:03:58 GMT -5 The J said:

I hate tax season because of all the people handing out liberty tax flyers on the sidewalk. Apparently it's "rude" to point and laugh.

It's kind of like blasphemy, isn't it? Using the image of Columbia, symbol of freedom, to advertise tax services?

[KaraBoo]

On a related subject - if she files with H&R Block, gets their rapid refund and then the state seizes her check due to unpaid childsupport - what happens with that money she received from H&R Block?

[constanz22]

Ugh...I see this crap all the time at tax time in my field (social work)....
Let me say, first of all, that I DO NOT think you should LET her claim one of the kids.
Having said that...
The only way it will get "red flagged" by the IRS is if two people attempt to claim the same child. I thought I read somewhere that they have reduced the number of children to 2 that you will get any type of EIC/Child Tax credit for, so, I would guess that her logic is that if you let her claim one of her 3 children (that you and your DH care for) it will help her, but will not hurt you/him, as you then would still have 3 children to claim but only get credit for 2. Maybe it would be a back handed way for him to get some of the support owed to him, if they take her refund for back support!

[KaraBoo]

Maybe it would be a back handed way for him to get some of the support owed to him, if they take her refund for back support!


We earn too much to qualify for EITC, so we do not get this at all. What I'm understanding would happen is this:

If we claim all of the kids (she doesn't sneak in and claim one), the money would be direct deposited as soon as we file/IRS approves our amount - approximately 14-21 days. Any money she receives as a refund is seized and sent to us after 180 day waiting period.

If we claim all of the kids, but she sneaks in a claims for one or more kids first - the IRS flags our on-line account as being wrong, we manually have to send in all of our paperwork, with documentation and wait the standard 6-8 weeks for our refund. Any money she receives as a refund is seized and sent to us after 180 day waiting period.


If we allow her to claim one of the kids - our refund amount is lowered, hers goes up. The state then seizes her increased refund and sends us what we would have received anyway after 180 day waiting period, but her CS is no longer in arrears because she paid part or all of it using our taxable deduction.

Either way, we have to wait 180 days for her to pay (if she files). I'd just rather not pay her CS bill off by using money that we essentially gave her.

[Plain Old Petunia]

She's not entitled to claim them, so there's no reason you and dh should "let" her. The kid isn't up for grabs to whomever files first. You and dh are supporting the kids, so you and dh get to claim them.

Basically, she is attempting to fraudulently get some EITC. If she gets caught doing that, no more EITC for her for 10 years. You might want to mention that to her. Personally, I would not hesitate to turn her in.

[midjd]

nqty, I don't have any wise advice, but I just want to tell you that you must have the patience of a saint to be dealing with this woman on a fairly regular basis (I followed your stories on the old YM board). Bless you for making sure your stepkids have one positive female figure in their lives.

It's probably too late to do anything this year, but you may consider going back to court and having this arrangement put into writing. My mom was in a similar situation and claimed all 3 of us the year after they divorced, while my dad claimed 2 of us (despite contributing no CS and never seeing us...) It caused her quite a bit of angst and I know it took her a while to straighten things out with the IRS (because of course, my dad filed first). Having a court order stating you can claim all 3 kids won't necessarily stop her from claiming 1 if she wants to, but at least you'll have something legal backing you up.

[TheOtherMe]

Jan 28, 2011 17:12:41 GMT -5 KaraBoo said:

On a related subject - if she files with H&R Block, gets their rapid refund and then the state seizes her check due to unpaid childsupport - what happens with that money she received from H&R Block?

I don't think Block is allowed to do the instant refund this year--the kind where you walk out the door with money. If she would get her refund from them and it is not funded by the IRS, she will then owe whatever bank they use at an astronomical interest rate.

Also, if the IRS determines she is making a fraudulent claim for EITC, she will not be allowed to claim the credit for 2 years. That is one of the questions on the form--has IRS disallowed your claim in the previous two years.

[❤ mollymouser ❤]

I'd suggest that your DH TELL HER that you've already filed, and that if she attempts to fraudulently claim one or more of the kids on her tax return, he will report her to the IRS and your state for TAX FRAUD.

(That may keep her from making a mess of things)

[Deleted]

Jan 28, 2011 20:46:06 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

Jan 28, 2011 17:12:41 GMT -5 KaraBoo said:

On a related subject - if she files with H&R Block, gets their rapid refund and then the state seizes her check due to unpaid childsupport - what happens with that money she received from H&R Block?

I don't think Block is allowed to do the instant refund this year--the kind where you walk out the door with money. .

H&R Block is indeed out of the game this year since HSBC announced it wouldn't fund the company's Instant Money program this year.

[Taxman10]

To the OP: it's not a willy-nilly, who gets to claim them as far as the IRS is concerned. Whoever provided the support gets to claim.

[Deleted]

Jan 29, 2011 11:08:45 GMT -5 Taxman10 said:

To the OP: it's not a willy-nilly, who gets to claim them as far as the IRS is concerned. Whoever provided the support gets to claim.

That is the way it should be but it doesn't always work that way.

In college when I worked for Jackson Hewitt I saw many cases where filings were being rejected because someone already filed with the child and 95% of the times it's when parents are not together and did not agree before hand on whom can file with the child.

So it's whoever file with the child first get the cash. Now if the parent that supported the child all thru out the year got shafted, then they have to go thru all the steps mentioned above by the OP to actually get credit for the child (proof of support, etc) and the IRS now have to go after the other parent that shouldn't have gotten the credit

Basically it's easier to just decide before hands, but I have seen many cases during my 3 years where it was a race between the two parents on who would get to file first.

[justwhoever]

I worked for JH too and it's amazing what people do to get money.

Had the OP said kid and not kids I would have thought she was talking about my sister. She tries every year to get her ex to let her claim her daughter so she can get caught up.

Hope you all get it taken care of.

[Taxman10]

Jan 29, 2011 11:58:20 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Jan 29, 2011 11:08:45 GMT -5 Taxman10 said:

To the OP: it's not a willy-nilly, who gets to claim them as far as the IRS is concerned. Whoever provided the support gets to claim.

That is the way it should be but it doesn't always work that way.

In college when I worked for Jackson Hewitt I saw many cases where filings were being rejected because someone already filed with the child and 95% of the times it's when parents are not together and did not agree before hand on whom can file with the child.

So it's whoever file with the child first get the cash. Now if the parent that supported the child all thru out the year got shafted, then they have to go thru all the steps mentioned above by the OP to actually get credit for the child (proof of support, etc) and the IRS now have to go after the other parent that shouldn't have gotten the credit

Basically it's easier to just decide before hands, but I have seen many cases during my 3 years where it was a race between the two parents on who would get to file first.

right I agree it's first come, first serve, but it's easy enough for the correct parent to file a paper return and show proof of support. Especially if you know it's going to be an issue, keep track during the year.

[Frappuccino]

How much less will your refund be or how much more will you have to pay by claiming one less child?

Maybe it will result in more cash in your own household if she claims the other child and gets caught up on her child support obligations.

I think everyone including the kids will be better off if you look at this from purely a financial standpoint.

How old is his youngest child with her? When will this no longer be an issue? I just would not be able to deal with any ex-wife drama at all. Good luck

[KaraBoo]

Jan 29, 2011 16:23:20 GMT -5 Frappuccino said:

How much less will your refund be or how much more will you have to pay by claiming one less child?

Maybe it will result in more cash in your own household if she claims the other child and gets caught up on her child support obligations.

I think everyone including the kids will be better off if you look at this from purely a financial standpoint.

How old is his youngest child with her? When will this no longer be an issue? I just would not be able to deal with any ex-wife drama at all. Good luck

Sorry for the delay in responding. I'm usually only on here M-F.

I'm not sure how much it will affect our income by claiming 3 vs 4. We haven't received all of our tax documents yet to figure that out.

Their youngest is now 10, so we have at least 8 more years of dealing with this (it's been an issue every year since we got custody of the kids - 3 years now). Only one year did she actually claim any of the kids, so maybe she received the nasty letter from the IRS as well and that's at least causing her to ask this year as oppossed to last year's mess.

I guess I'm just irritated that she wants to use this credit (our credit) to pay her CS. It would be like her asking us to give her $1000.00 so that she could pay one of her bills - and then finding out the bill she paid is the one owed to us! It just grates me the wrong way I guess....

DH has decided (with my approval - we discussed this for a long time the other day) that we will help her out with one of her vehicle repairs. She's claiming she needs the money to fix the brakes on her car. DH can do this for around $100 (brakes, rotors and flushing the lines) and his time. We'd rather give her that help so the kids can be safe while riding in her vehicle instead of just handing the money over through taxes. This is assuming of course that she agrees to allow him to make this repair. DH plans to explain to her that this is a one time occurance and that the only reason he's doing it is because of the safety issue regarding his kids. DH and I both agree that we do not want to set up a precedence of helping her too much as she will take advantage of it if allowed.

[Urban Chicago]

Good decision, just make it crystal clear to her that you are claiming the children, and will do so every year that they live with you. You are fixing her car out of the goodness of your heart and she does not want to deal with the IRS over a refund she won't even see.