Expensive Karma - Dang.

[milee]

The Short Version - Who has good recipes for gluten free bread (or anything else) and where do you buy GF stuff that isn't priced like gold?

The Long Version - In the past three years, after never having broken a bone in my life, I've broken a suspiciously high number of bones. Right heel, left metatarsal (mid-foot), two fingers and a rib. Since they happened during activities ranging from jumping off boats to boxing to Rip-Sticking, the doc wasn't too worried at first, but finally decided maybe something was up given how many breaks had happened. After all sorts of testing, she now thinks I have some major food allergies, which cause inflammation and are preventing me from absorbing nutrients.

Although I already eat fairly healthily, the idea of cutting all these things out of my diet is really overwhelming.

So I'm starting out with eliminating the one that produced the highest allergic reaction - gluten. Only to find that gluten is in, well, everyfreakingthing.

To add insult to injury, the little bit of GF stuff I've tried so far tastes like dirt and is ungodly expensive. I make a lot of our food from scratch already, so I'm not afraid to cook, but the ingredients in the GF recipes read like Klingon.

Help me.

[milee]

Oh, and the Karma comes in because I've always been fairly intolerant of people who insist others eat as they do. You know - the ones who make a huge deal out of not having peanuts in the room because their child is allergic or have to make everybody at the party eat the gluten-free brick brownies because they don't eat gluten.

One of my best friends has a son that hasn't even been diagnosed with gluten sensitivity, she just buys into the idea that it's a healthy way of eating, and is constantly boring everybody withing listening distance about it and making them eat the awful stuff she makes.

So my crappy attitude is almost certainly why I myself may now have allergies and gluten intolerance. Just like my second son was a huge drooler because I was so disgusted by how juicy my sister's baby was.

[Wisconsin Beth]

DH does the GF shopping, for the most part. He's the GF and DF free member of my family.

Bread - he likes the Katz brand. And there's an English muffin we both like but I can't think of the brand right now.

He shops at 3 stores - Health Hut, Outpost and Woodman's. I'm not sure if you have any of those around you. But Woodman's has the cheapest GF stuff, for the most part. The Whole Foods in town is fun to shop at but expensive.

[milee]

Is the Katz bread a mix or is it already baked?

And do you do any baking?

[Wisconsin Beth]

Already baked. It's available fresh and frozen at our Woodman's. We're still scared of trying to make our own bread and all those different types of flours, although DH is thinking about it more and more.

[saveinla]

Here's a thread for GF recipes - www.notmsnmoney.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=reciperequests&action=display&thread=9005

[Wisconsin Beth]

DH has made a gluten free/dairy free cheesecake. The filling is cashews, soaked for 5-8 hours and blended up fine, with some other stuff. And he's done a couple of raw cookie things. The current ones are really good and our 2.5 DS likes them too. I didn't pay much attention to his ingredients list for them, beyond dates and cashews.

DH killed our blender making a cheesecake earlier this year. So we sprang for a Vitamix. It's very noisy but doing the job. But it was pricey. And he'd like some of the add-ons like the dry mixer blade for baking but it's not in the budget right now and we both know it.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

A friend of mine has found an excellent gluten free bakery near where she lives. When we go out, she brings her own bread.

She says it goes stale quickly, so she keeps it frozen until she plans on eating it.

Bakery is in Seattle. I could get the name and see if they do mail order, if you want.

[milee]

I have a Vitamix, but have only used it for smoothies. DH thought it was a little over the top to buy something that expensive for making smoothies, so maybe that's where I'm getting this bad karma. Buy a super expensive blender and the universe will give you a reason to use it.

[milee]

Mich, you're very kind to offer the name of the bakery, but I live in Florida so anything shipped from Seattle will either by stale by the time it gets here or the shipping will make it $30 a loaf bread.

[Wisconsin Beth]

DH spends a lot of time online looking for GF stuff near us - both food and restaurants. There's about 8 GF beers out, if you're a beer drinker. They're expensive and several are just icky, in our opinion. But one strips the gluten out of the wheat and still uses the wheat. The name is somelike like DAMA and it's a red label. I don't think it says GF on the label though. That's DH's biggest complaint right now. Labeling that doesn't say GF or the cross contamination notes about processed in a facility that handles wheat/nuts/soy/whatever.

Bob's Red Mill stuff is really good about GF.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

May 31, 2012 10:49:25 GMT -5 milee said:

Mich, you're very kind to offer the name of the bakery, but I live in Florida so anything shipped from Seattle will either by stale by the time it gets here or the shipping will make it $30 a loaf bread.

One thing to consider....

If they ship it frozen overnight, it won't be stale. Expensive, yes. Also, they may have a bakery closer to where you live and this bakery would likely know who would make a competitive product.

FWIW, a local pizza place makes a gluten free crust that is supposed to be excellent. While we were waiting for our pizza one night, I was reading the list. Where a basic pizza crust only has ~4 ingredients, this crust had about 20! If all gluten free products are this way, it explains the high cost.

[Wisconsin Beth]

But is the oven it's baked in a dedicated GF oven? Because you CAN get cross-contamination that way. DH isn't actually allergic to gluten but his doctor recommended this and it IS helping with DH's tummy issues. But he's not actually allergic. So for us, cross contamination is a decision DH gets to make. If you're highly allergic to gluten, you may need to be more aware of cross contamination that we are/do.

[Wisconsin Beth]

If they ship it frozen overnight, it won't be stale. Expensive, yes. Also, they may have a bakery closer to where you live and this bakery would likely know who would make a competitive product.

FWIW, a local pizza place makes a gluten free crust that is supposed to be excellent. While we were waiting for our pizza one night, I was reading the list. Where a basic pizza crust only has ~4 ingredients, this crust had about 20! If all gluten free products are this way, it explains the high cost.

Yeah, you can't just replace wheat flour with, say, amaranth flour. You need a mixture of amaranth flour and 2-3 other flours. I don't know/remember why.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

May 31, 2012 10:59:01 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

But is the oven it's baked in a dedicated GF oven? Because you CAN get cross-contamination that way. DH isn't actually allergic to gluten but his doctor recommended this and it IS helping with DH's tummy issues. But he's not actually allergic. So for us, cross contamination is a decision DH gets to make. If you're highly allergic to gluten, you may need to be more aware of cross contamination that we are/do.

From what I understand, the bakery is a gluten free bakery, so no cross contamination. My friend gave me a muffin from there and it was very good.

Not sure about the pizza place though....but know that they sell frozen, gluten free dough.

[milee]

May 31, 2012 10:59:01 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

But is the oven it's baked in a dedicated GF oven? Because you CAN get cross-contamination that way. DH isn't actually allergic to gluten but his doctor recommended this and it IS helping with DH's tummy issues. But he's not actually allergic. So for us, cross contamination is a decision DH gets to make. If you're highly allergic to gluten, you may need to be more aware of cross contamination that we are/do.

I'm so overwhelmed right now I don't think I can carry being GF out to that level of perfection. Right now, I'm just trying to take it in steps - eliminate obvious gluten first. Once that seems to be working and things are more comfy, I'll decide if I want to work on eliminating the next most allergic stuff - eggs and dairy or move into thinking about hidden gluten (still can't bear to think of giving up soy sauce!) and cross contamination.

If I think too much about this right now, it makes me want to cry.

I already eat healthily, but this whole eliminate certain key foods thing seems so so so restrictive and socially isolating.

[milee]

Honestly, I'm still not entirely sure I'm going to give up gluten... or eggs... or dairy.

Just thinking about it makes me feel a little panicky.

More karma - I may end up being like those people I never understood who, when diagnosed with lung cancer are still smoking.

[dividend]

Let me ask a (potentially) ignorant question. Why not just focus more on cooking things that don't contain gluten anyway?
I understand that some things are more complicated, like some brand of soy sauce are gluten free and some aren't, and restaurant food poses it's own set of challenges, but if gluten free bread is expensive and not very good, maybe don't eat bread? To me, this is in the same category as vegetarians eating fake meat.
Again, I haven't been through it, but I've thought about it enough that I think that's what I'd do. And it'd probably be a very healthy diet, being based on fruits, vegetables, beans/rice/legumes, etc. I already eat tons of variations on a dinner plate of meat/fish + brown/white rice + some roasted/sauteed/raw green thing. Another good combo is dinner salads - bed of some interesting greens/herbs, meat/fish, fruit/avocado/onions + tiny bits of cheese with a homemade vinaigrette. You cook from scratch mostly anyway, so maybe just some tweaking to how you approach putting a plate together?
I do know that Bob's Red Mill makes some gluten free mixes for things that are pretty good (at least, I've heard that second hand), and most of the normal non-ghetto grocery stores around here have a section for that in the baking aisle, so maybe something like that could satisfy a craving for pancakes or the occasional piece of bread?
Good luck.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

May 31, 2012 11:09:35 GMT -5 milee said:

May 31, 2012 10:59:01 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

But is the oven it's baked in a dedicated GF oven? Because you CAN get cross-contamination that way. DH isn't actually allergic to gluten but his doctor recommended this and it IS helping with DH's tummy issues. But he's not actually allergic. So for us, cross contamination is a decision DH gets to make. If you're highly allergic to gluten, you may need to be more aware of cross contamination that we are/do.

I'm so overwhelmed right now I don't think I can carry being GF out to that level of perfection. Right now, I'm just trying to take it in steps - eliminate obvious gluten first. Once that seems to be working and things are more comfy, I'll decide if I want to work on eliminating the next most allergic stuff - eggs and dairy or move into thinking about hidden gluten (still can't bear to think of giving up soy sauce!) and cross contamination.

If I think too much about this right now, it makes me want to cry.

I already eat healthily, but this whole eliminate certain key foods thing seems so so so restrictive and socially isolating.

Don't assume that.

We go out to eat with my gluten free friend regularly. Last time was to a Chinese place that had half a page of the menu of gluten free selections.[shadow=red,left,300][/shadow]

[Wisconsin Beth]

Sorry, didn't mean to pile on. Spend some time on google looking for GF in your area. Start checking out non-traditional grocery stores and look at their bulletin boards/please patronize section. There's a couple of stores here with meeting rooms that often have topics of interest. It's time consuming at first to figure out where/how to shop. Farmer's Markets can be helpful too.

When you're ready to look for restaurants, try places that are vegan and/or African. Some traditional African meal is gluten free because wheat is expensive or non-native/hard to grow. Obviously Africa is a big continent and contains many cultures and agricultural zones so not all African stuff is going to be GF. DH is just starting to look into this.

[milee]

May 31, 2012 11:15:18 GMT -5 dividend said:

Let me ask a (potentially) ignorant question. Why not just focus more on cooking things that don't contain gluten anyway?
I understand that some things are more complicated, like some brand of soy sauce are gluten free and some aren't, and restaurant food poses it's own set of challenges, but if gluten free bread is expensive and not very good, maybe don't eat bread? To me, this is in the same category as vegetarians eating fake meat.
Again, I haven't been through it, but I've thought about it enough that I think that's what I'd do. And it'd probably be a very healthy diet, being based on fruits, vegetables, beans/rice/legumes, etc. I already eat tons of variations on a dinner plate of meat/fish + brown/white rice + some roasted/sauteed/raw green thing. Another good combo is dinner salads - bed of some interesting greens/herbs, meat/fish, fruit/avocado/onions + tiny bits of cheese with a homemade vinaigrette. You cook from scratch mostly anyway, so maybe just some tweaking to how you approach putting a plate together?
I do know that Bob's Red Mill makes some gluten free mixes for things that are pretty good (at least, I've heard that second hand), and most of the normal non-ghetto grocery stores around here have a section for that in the baking aisle, so maybe something like that could satisfy a craving for pancakes or the occasional piece of bread?
Good luck.

That's a good question. If I lived alone, that's probably the approach I'd take. I don't eat much bread now, so losing it wouldn't be a huge deal.

Unfortunately, I carry the gene that makes celiac likely and another gene that makes gluten sensitivity likely, so we're now in the process of testing my kids to see if they also have these food allergies. Honestly, it's pretty likely with my oldest, who is incredily small for his age, has asthma and is highly irritable. Those sound like an odd combo, but is actually common for children who have celiac; they don't get the nutrients they need.

The kids do eat bread... and pizza... and homemade cookies... etc. So I'm trying to figure some of this out so if we have to do the whole GF thing as a family, it won't seem so awful for the boys.

They don't know yet and I'm not going to tell them unless the tests come back positive.

[Formerly SK]

After all sorts of testing, she now thinks I have some major food allergies, which cause inflammation and are preventing me from absorbing nutrients.

I think this is much more common than we think. I've been mostly gluten/dairy free for two years now because I feel sick when I eat it. But before I changed my diet I was tested and was Vit D deficient. I took 10,000 IU/day for six months and got retested...my levels were even lower. I took a high quality brand - I just didn't absorb it.

As to your question, I mostly just cut out carbs. I'll eat rice/potatoes/quinoa at dinner, but I don't do any "fake" GF/CF foods. They don't taste as good as the real thing. Also, after many many failed attempts at baking from scratch, I'm done with the whole spend-a-day-in-the-kitchen thing. Fruits/veggies/meat with occasional carbs has worked out well for me.

Re something a pp said - be careful about eating wheat but not gluten. Or goat cheese instead of cow cheese. Yes there are degrees of protein levels and variability to how it could affect you, but until you know what your issues specifically are I'd cut out the entire food group rather than pick and choose.

Good luck. I know it is overwhelming in the beginning but you do get used to it. I'm a convert too - I used to think it was hogwash when autism parents would blame gluten/casein for their kids' behavior. I've seen it with my own eyes now a few times (not my son though) so I totally believe it. I think there is so much to our body that we just don't understand yet. The GI seems to be the final frontier in terms of research.

[sheilaincali]

Check Walmart's GF section. DH and I tried the Gulten Free thing for a while (just on a whim- didn't take) and found that Walmart had the lowest prices on GF things and a surprisingly decent sized selection.
We had a gluten free pizza once from Godfathers. It is tiny (like the size of a small) and the crust was really thin. I think it cost around $15-$20. It tasted fine and didn't leave you feeling very full after you ate it.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Pizza's doable. DH buys GF/DF crusts, paints them oil olive, heats crust and adds his toppings and bakes. He just found a vegan cheese substitute that's working nicely for him. Bread might be more problematic. First off, as you pointed out, its' expensive, loaves are small and the consistency is very different regular bread. The Katz stuff is the best DH has found that GF and DF. He uses it for sandwiches but mainly french toast (with organic, cage free eggs and almond milk I think it is) and it's tasty. He sprinkles ground hemp on it to add flavor and additional nutrients.

We've been adding tacos to his diet since we found a taco seasoning packet and shells he can use. But he's decided that kale leaves work better so it's more of a taco wrap. But he made nachos last weekend too.

[Formerly SK]

Unfortunately, I carry the gene that makes celiac likely and another gene that makes gluten sensitivity likely, so we're now in the process of testing my kids to see if they also have these food allergies. Honestly, it's pretty likely with my oldest, who is incredily small for his age, has asthma and is highly irritable. Those sound like an odd combo, but is actually common for children who have celiac; they don't get the nutrients they need.

Not odd at all. We've tested DD twice for celiac because of failure to thrive. Both kids were GF for 3-4 years - we reintroduced it about a year ago. Yes, it is very hard and overwhelming at first but I promise it gets easier.

[milee]

Why why why would you do GF on a whim?!?

Do you like to burn yourself with matches for fun as well?

[Labcat]

I had heard that gluten/wheat can result in inflammatory responses so I didn't eat any grains for about 2 weeks. The first thing I noticed was that I was no longer bloated. I hadn't even realized how badly I was until I stopped. I had heard of people talk about "oh that ... makes me blow up" and I could never relate- well duh, I was constantly like that!

After the two weeks were over I reintroduced grains and OMG did I hurt! Bloated, stomach cramps, vomiting in some cases. I haven't had any test done but that was enough for me to not eat it anymore. I freaked out at first too because I wasn't sure how to eat anything because wheat/gluten is in so much stuff. Some research brought me to Primal/Paleo lifestyle. In a nutshell: eat only real food. Don't eat anything processed/man made. I've been eating this way for a few months now and as long as I don't stray and eat something with grain in it I feel great. ;D

[8 Bit WWBG]

...:::"Buy a super expensive blender and the universe will give you a reason to use it.":::...

We have one, and I think the main reason DW wanted me to buy it was so we would have "the best blender".

I don't think she respects its power though... she always goes right to high, and that doesn't work because then the blade just spins and pushes everything away.

Me, I start off slow on low power. I let things start to mix around, I get some motion going on the bottom layer. I start to increase the power a little bit and make sure that the ingredients are getting mixed. Sometimes I work from the top using the plunge tool. If I sense I'm going too hard, I dial it back a little and get a good rhythm going again. Then when I sense its time to bring it home, I increase the power bit by bit until I get that nice swirl going. It starts off slowly at first, but I pay attention to the movement and when the time is just right I kick into high gear and bring it home.

Smoothies!

[8 Bit WWBG]

Oh yeah, and eventually I might get the dry-mix blade, next time they have them at costco or something. The idea of grinding our own flour sounds cool, but is also a bit overkill.

Of course if I keep popping out fictional children with YM posters, eventually one of them will have some kind of allergy that will require home made flour.

[Wisconsin Beth]

There's also something called "Leaky gut syndrome" where you stop eating a food for a month, to get all traces out of your body. Then your body treats it as a new food. You may be allergic, you may not be. But it's supposed to help with the bloating or something.